What a waste of time trying to find support on line.<p>[This message has been edited by Curufinwe (edited August 24, 2001).]

Hi there,<P>Being the sister of a guy in about the same position as you, I can say that it's going to take your W quite a while before she believes you have stopped drinking. I know your intentions are good, so it was with my brother, but he just kept slipping off that wagon....if this has been your pattern, she may well believe that you will never stop.<P>I'm glad you feel so well right now and that you feel on top of things. You need to keep this frame of mind up, no matter WHAT happens to you. My brother was using the bad events in his life as an excuse to go back on the bottle. You say you are going to counselling...how about Al Anon? From what I hear, it's a terrific support for you in this time.<P>I wish you well. My brother lost the struggle last year, progressed from booze to drugs, and died of a heroin overdose....told you that for a reason, you know!!!<P>TAKE CARE!!!

<p>[This message has been edited by Curufinwe (edited August 14, 2001).]

Here is a thought for you to ponder...since you've got tons of time to do that...the things you say are all prefaced with...if it is over....then I must X.<P>The truth of the matter is that your marriage, as you know it...is over. All of the I must do X...you must do anyway. The thing about your life as an alcoholic is that...that is all that your life really was, so...rather than talk about changing yourself...talk about starting a new life sans alcohol. This is for you, and her. Do it...change some things radically, and invite her to join you in a new life. A fresh start, so to speak.<P>I have little experience with the standard treatments for alcoholsim, but others here do. I do know that we all want a new, and better life here...so we are at the beginning of a journey together...WELCOME TO MARRIAGE BUILDERS! The Welcome Wagon lady (Nyneve) has been lurking about, snd she will be by directly, I am sure of it...plus, she's better at this than I am....Oh, Sheryl?<P>I am sorry for your situation...please do yourself a favor, and quit beating yourself up...look, <I>all of that is in the past</I>. If you can defeat your demons, then you will be a very attractive man to her. I'd say her actions were more consistent with someone who DID NOT WANT TO HARDEN HER HEART against you. She is hurt, friend...give her that space she is asking for...its important. Yes, you will second guess her motives...but her motives will not change because you want them to...that is all on HER.<P>BTW...please clarify...you <B>host</B> a website there? DO YOU HAVE NAMESERVERS? I may be in the market to have a domain hosted REALLY SOON...can you provide that? -Mike

...I'm confused...were you offended by that post, or do you just defend yourself by default these days? -Mike

(((((((((((((((((Curufinwe))))))))))))))))<P>I am truly sorry that I obviously offended you with my comments. I meant that you sounded physically good, your unfogged brain, etc, not emotionally; none of us here are emotionally "good". We here all KNOW you are in great pain, because we are too, and we are here to help in any way we can. It hurts me to think I caused you any additional pain at this bad time in your life. I am really sorry!!!<P>You did, however begin the whole thing with the statement that the big issue was your alcoholism, and I responded to that with my heart, because I loved my brother, and can't bear the thought of it happening to anyone else. BTW, NONE of us knew he was getting into drugs. He got so good at hiding things, that we never knew until he died.<P>You are hurting, but you DO have an advantage over a lot of us here about having some idea why your wife left. Most of us don't have any clue at all, just the wishy washy standard answers that just don't say anything. Your alcoholism is known as a "Love Buster" she doesn't like it, so you shouldn't do it, be the best person you can and do it for YOU as Mike says.<P>I hope you can see my good intentions behind my poorly phrased previous post. Sorry again!<P>Nina<P><BR>

If there is no one in 'real life' interested in my problems, what made me think on-line strangers would care?<p>[This message has been edited by Curufinwe (edited August 24, 2001).]

Thanks for easing my heart, Curufinwe, <P>I think that it is a really good sign that your wife is communicating with you at all! My h moved residences this week, and if I hadn't asked if he was still at the old place, I wouldn't have known.<P>You seem to be doing the right things as I understand them, but I am new to this, too. My h left just over a month ago, too. And it is frustrating being a mushroom, but as Mike once said to me, try to be a happy mushroom. That is, we must look after OURSELVES. Second guessing everything drives me crazy, so I TRY not to do it...fail a lot though! <P>As to learning what is in her heart, well this depends on whether you can ask her or not without creating friction. If you can't, then don't, and try to think on it yourself, based on what you know about her. Make a list of LB's you know you have, and work to get rid of them. And that sounds so trite; it's a LOT of hard work. Without guarantees. But you know, someone said to me here that even if it doesn't work with her, you take those concepts with you, and you also take your self respect. One of my big problems was that I mouthed off when something upset me. I have only done that once in the month, and immediately apologised. Funny thing, he was nice to me after that for a week. Now he's back to the wall!!! <P>I love dogs, I once had a beautiful intelligent collie. Circumstances here mean we can't have a dog, but I'm sure yours bring you enormous comfort. Like my kids do for me. Give them lots of hugs, walks and treats!!! They're worth it.<P>Wishing you well,<P>Nina<P>

You didn't mention whether your wife seemed to really love you before she left or if she was just hanging around, waiting for a good time to leave. If she loves you, I think she probably is waiting to see if the drinking is over for good. She may be doing exactly the same thing with her correspondence that you are doing - keeping it light, not putting on pressure. She may be afraid to believe that you are really a changed man because if she believes you and you let her down, the pain will be devastating.<P>I have to admit that I know nothing about the power of alcohol. I've never had a drink in my life. However, I also have a brother who is an alcoholic and I know that when he drinks, he is not a nice person. He curses, becomes verbally abusive, obstinate and angry. He has lost every wife, girlfriend, job and home he has ever had. His health is gone also. I'm wondering if you also became a "not very nice" person when you were drinking? Your wife could be afraid that you will turn into that person again.<P>Keep doing what you're doing. If she loves you, she will probably communicate more as time goes by. Give her every reason to believe that you want to stay sober and stay married more than anything in the world. If the years of drinking have killed any love she has for you, maybe she will tell you this also. I know you don't want to hear it, but at least you will know what you're dealing with.<P>Stay strong! You are in for two of the hardest battles of your life. I admire your willingness to fight for a better life.<p>[This message has been edited by fighting_spirit (edited August 11, 2001).]

I don't want this personal info out on the internet forever. The only reason I posted <BR>here was an attempt to reach out to other people in the same situation. If there is no dialogue, there is not reason to keep this <BR>stuff here, so I'm deleting it.<p>[This message has been edited by Curufinwe (edited August 24, 2001).]

The reason that I say that she may be trying no to harden her heart is that your marriage was obviously doing that to her. There are at least two tways to view everything, and as the BS, we tend to take the most negative of views, which doesn't help too much, even when we are right.<P>Actually, the things that you do <B>now</B> have no bearing on you marriage. You are still saying, if it is over, then I will A...but, if it is not, then I will B. This is not helping you get to a place where you can help both of you. It is causing you internal struggle, which keeps you in your box, like she assumes, and is takes the form of a LB...annoying behavior. She does not see it, which is good, but you do, which is not good. I am simply saying that I am doing what I need to do...it has no bearing on my XW at all. Now, moving is pretty major...that decision needs to be forestalled for now, IMHO...but the personality issues need to be addressed anyway. How about doing all of the things that don't require that sort of finality for now?<P>Yes, you are defensive about the alcoholism, but please be careful there. The reason you state for drinking is the same sort of thing you get hurt by when alcoholism is mentioned. You give what others think/say dominion over you. That process can be reversed if you read up on it, and practice it enough. Like I said, I don't know the AA program, and it really doesn't seem like the option you want anyway, so try NLP...analyze your interactions, look for alternative meanings, and find other ways to respond...don't just react. I think that we all here are excellent candidates for NLP work. It has helped me in the short time that I have been applying it. Not to say that it is necessarily for everyone, but in doing it, you dicover a new reality for yourself...which is good in any case.<P>I'm pressed for time somewhat right now, I will be back later. I'm going to take your posts, and apply some NLP to them, and I will post those results later so that you can get an idea of what I mean. In the meantime, relax a little, and take some time off from this. Its hard, I know...but you've got to get good at it...especially considering how remote you are. Take care. -Mike