Brief background due to so many new faces.....<P>STBX WS gave me the love you but not in love with you speech Feb2001 moved out March2001. He recontacted OW#1 with whom he had a 1yr EA five years ago (she very young and lived overseas). They have since spent two weeks together in June. I also found evidence of about 6 other EA that he has been involved in over the past 2.5 years. Three are still active but there is one favorite as the other two have boyfriends.<P>So you all understand the emotional hell. Well, this summer I finally felt like I was beginning to crawl out of the cave a bit, then BAM....for the past two weeks emotions have cycled between anger and exreme sadness with little else in between. Thought my nights of obsessing were over, not so.<P>I have done a lot to move on and let got of the old marriage. Got a job, started classes, just enjoying my kids etc....<P>So now I find myself searching for a way to get myself out of this slump. I'm just so sick and tired of feeling this way. What I determined was that what keeps me down is the fact that my stbx still has all the power. He maintains the control in our current relationship as he did in our marriage. How?<P>He filed in June and since then has done nothing since. He was unemployed for 2 months after that so he had plenty of time to get to work on it. This situation only keeps my oh so dim hope of reconciliation alive.<P>Stbx only sees kids when convienent for him....and yes I let him.<P>We had one major fight recently after which he called and apologized. Major thing for him as he rarely apologizes because as we all know he is always right. <P>Finally he just knows what to do to upset me and he meters these things out every 2 weeks or so (ie calling me to tell me that he is making his own plans for Christmas which translated from WS speak is I'm going to visit one of the OW and spend Christmas with her).<P>I talked to friends a lot yesterday and they pretty much said the same thing when I asked if they thought I should go to my lawyer and get the D rolling again. YES! They also said that I need to get out and start having fun. No dates just out dancing, flirting, talking.<P>Okay, sounds good but, I stood firmly when he tried to get me to file and said that if he wanted the D he would have to do all the work. OTOH it <B>would</B> send him message if I went ahead with it. But perhaps the wrong one? BTW this behavior is so typical of him....big ideas no follow through.<P>Getting out sounds good as well but I still feel like I'm being unfaithful even just thinking about it! BLECH<P>I would appreciate some feedback from those of you here. My friends are wonderful people but they are all in intact marriages. What I am getting at is they see the hurt I'm going through and want that to end so D and "moving on" is the answer. They don't have personal knowledge of the inner conflict and emotions. And to be honest, right now I have doubts that a D and 'moving on" will do much to ease the pain of all this mess.<P>Thanks for allowing me this pity party and Take Care.<P>

Hi Hopeless!! (((((((((((((((((((Hugs)))))))))))))))))))))))<P>I was just wondering about you the other day.<P>You know what I think? I think that you push that D forward IF and WHEN you are ready to do it and not a moment sooner.<P>Friends are uncomfortable with other friends in long term crisis. Most of my friends stuck with me for awhile, but disappeared when I didn't divorce when they thought I should....or even worse, now that we are supposedly in recovery...no one wants to listen to any of my trials and tribulations!!<P>So, time to not new friends...but find support groups. But thats why you are here, right? This is the most promarriage divorce groups I've ever seen!! <P>I can't imagine anyone here telling you that you are doing anything wrong by deciding that you can't go on like this anymore. It's ok to learn how to live for yourself.<P>So go have fun <P>Push that D through when YOU are ready - I'll bet your H will be shocked and won't that just be fun to see on his face!<P>------------------<BR><I>Pain is a given, misery is optional.</I>

Well Hello Hope,<P>You know what, I just wrote a post last week wondering where everyone went. Lot of new faces around for sure, as usual, seem like a lot of really top notch folks. But just about everyone has posted something in the last couple weeks, so they aren't too far away.<P>Regards your post, it doesn't really sound like a pity party, it sounds more like the dilemma we all face. Most of us just can't put in that many years so close to another human being, and then just end it and walk away without some feelings. That isn't a pity party, that is a welcome to the human race.<P>At the time our marriage was breaking up, my ex was telling her family and friends about her infidelity. They all knew before I did. By the time I found out, it was too late to keep it a secret. Her closest girlfriend's husband was involved in a hot and heavy affair at work. Anyway, I started talking to her, and we started comparing notes. Then we started sharing feelings, and a month later, we started ...... well, you get the idea. <P>I think we had experience similar to you with friends and family. Every time a marriage starts to slide down hill, there are plenty of people around to make sure everything is greased for the occasion. The first thing folks do is start taking sides. They just put more pressure on an already shaky situation.<P>Given that you still have hope of reconcillation, is there any way you can let your self enjoy the comfort of their friendship, while taking their advice with a grain of salt? You noted that your ex still seems to have some control. well your hope of reconcillation is a big reason why. And in my book, that doesn't make you a bad person. There is a lot to admire there. <P>The Harleys write well on the his needs, her needs concept. There is another concept, I don't know if they use the exact words, but most of us have to consider what the marriage needs too. Seems like that is what your post is trying to get at. Please correct me if I'm wrong.<P>Well, you already know the bottom line. I don't think any here is going to tell you to give up. Only you can take a decision about if and when it is time to move on. In the meantime, be really, really good to you!<P>Prayers and stuff,<P>Bumper

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BrambleRose:<BR><B>I was just wondering about you the other day. </B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>BR,<P>Speak of the devil! CJ and I were just talking about you and wonder how you are too. Good to see you.<P>Prayers and stuff,<P>Bumper<P>

BR and Bumperii,<P>Oh so good to hear from the both of you. I welcome the comments of the new people here but having some old friends right now is what I needed.<P>In regards to my friends they have been really great but this last round of anger and sadness was really intense and they reacted. Yes, i can take their advice with a grain of salt. And I guess the fact that I am even posting about this says that I am not ready to push anything right now. I don't want to do anything in a moment of anger that is more about revenge than self preservation.<P>For right now I think I will start with the going out part. I need the break and the distraction. I just need to go out and lose myself for awhile.<P>

Howdy doody, Hopeless in AZ (and Bramble and Bumper too)! Darn, it's like an oldies convention in here <P>Anyway, I have a suggestion for you. Our marriages are in sort of similar situations--not recovered yet, but not ready to give up yet--and you know what I have rediscovered? The joy of going out where I want to go! Now, I am not much of a "bar-scene" kind of chick, so there's little or no worrying or jealousy when I go out, because I'm not usually heading into a temptation filled flesh factory (haha). <P>BUT, all my life I have enjoyed and wanted to go to concerts in the park, museums, plays, and art shows. I love the smooth calmness of rich cultural events. Guess what--my H doesn't. He finds them boring and falls asleep. On Thursday nights, I take a blanket, go to the park and have a picnic at the concerts in the park--every week is a different style of music: Irish/Gaelic, easy-listening blues, bluegrass, cajun, classical, choral...the list goes on and on. And even if I don't happen to like that kind/style of music, it's still fun to hear something new. On Saturdays, its free day at the Denver Art Museum, and they have six floors of "standard" exhibits and then one floor of a special exhibit for $2. For example right now the special exhibit is "The European Masters" and it looks FABULOUS. The city I live in has a Cultural Center that has a huge variety of art exhibits of local artists--everything from paintings to sculptures to weaving--and also offers a huge variety of performing arts--from ballets and dances to play and "Broadway shows". I LOVE (let me say that again...LOVE, LOVE, LOVE) to go, and since my H finds all that stuff so boring, and I love it SO, I go out by myself and enjoy it. Sometimes I bring my kids (or one of my kids to practice good manners and dating), and sometimes I take myself out to dinner first. <P>So, Hopeless, just because you decide to go out and have some fun, it doesn't necessarily mean you will be unfaithful or have to go to bars. There are LOTS of things to do that are just fun, that you can do by yourself and just get out a little. Consider bungy jumping. Now THAT will get your heart bumping! <P>Regarding whether or not to get the D going, I like Bramble's advice and have to second that emotion. Listen to your own heart and get the ball rolling when YOU are ready--not when your married friends pressure you. I know exactly how you feel...like you are on perpetual "hold"...but if you are not ready to divorce for yourself, then I say don't do it. I would also like to point out to you that your H is doing a very typical passive/aggressive maneuver, so you might want to read up on passive/aggressive behavior and see if the "traits" fit him and if there's some helpful suggestions out there for you.<P>BTW, it's SO GOOD to hear from you again. Wish it was for better news, but any time I hear from an "oldie" again is a good thing for me! {{{{{HopelessinAZ}}}}}<P>CJ<P>------------------<BR>Judge your success by what you had to give up in order to get it.

Hopeless ~<P>Your friends don't want to see you hurting. They care about you, and think that you'll heal once you make a decision. One thing I found out about friends was that every one of them says "If my spouse ever cheated on me, I'd be out of there!" I don't even listen to that kind of attitude anymore. They haven't been there, and I'll bet like everyone else, that is NOT what they'll do when and if faced with that kind of scenario. They don't know, and can't. They just want you to be happy. Your situation may also make them uncomfortable. No one likes to have to think about their own fears even if its about someone else.<P>You do it on your time table when you are ready. And find people who have been where you are at and can offer constructive advice about healing, acceptance, letting go...<P>And then go with the friends and have a good time finding yourself and what you like to do, just like CJ suggested!!<P><BR><B>Hi Bumper!!</B> I'm never too far away ~ I usually pop over here every day to see if any of my old friends are posting. I'm lurking in the background even if I am quiet!<P>I've been posting some over on GQ and once in awhile on Recovery. In fact I have a lovely thread over on recovery right now, because I finally saw a picture of the OW and it really brought all my insecurities and problems roaring to the front. Thank goodness for all the people over there that went and looked at her pic and came back to the boards to make fun of her!! Actually, CJ wrote a fantastic response to me on that thread...we really are twins!!<P>Anyway, I'm doing OK actually. I've had a few rocky bumps with recovery, but over all its going well. The booze is flowing freely in my house - but all in all, my H is really walking the walk on doing what he said he was going to do. We even have scheduled relationship talks every Saturday!! <P>And Sunday I make it to my Al-Anon meetings <P>Anyway, sorry for interrupting your thread Hopeless!! <P>------------------<BR><I>Pain is a given, misery is optional.</I>