For six years I have been in a relationship. The first two years were fantastic but then the last four have been a gradual watering down of what we had originally. She now says that she loves me like a brother and has done so for a while. <BR>There has been very little intimacy or closeness for such a long time now and she feels she can't even kiss me or hold me now. I still love her very deeply and feel that she is my soul mate but I have ceased to be hers anymore.<BR>There has never been any wrongdoing between us and we rarely fight, I have tried many times to fix this problem of the brother sister thing but have been unsuccessful. She is becoming very tired of the discussions and says she feels dead inside. I have tried searching the net for answers and luckily found your page. <BR>Her parents have now said that once your love turns to brotherly love there is no way back and as such I'm destined to lose her. Obviously she now feels that we would never be able to work things out and has given up. <BR>Please, please, please has anyone an answer to this one. Obviously I selfishly want her to be in my life for I love her so much and it would devistate me to loose her but if for her sake she has to leave then I would rather it be that way than to hurt her constantly with a loveless relationship on her part.

I disagree with what her parents say. And, if you read this site, Dr. Harley would disagree too. I think you can bring your relationship back from a brother/sister one by following Dr. Harley's principles. But both of you have to be committed to making the necessary changes.<P>If she is willing, and you are willing, you can make it happen. <P>------------------<BR>Love is meant to heal. Love is meant to renew. Love is meant to oust all fear. Love is meant to harmonize differences. Love is meant to bring us closer to God.

760, (can I call you jack or something? calling you 760 seems like you are a robot <P>I read your post and I'd love to talk to you about this subject. I posted a similar one (brother and sister mode) on the emotional needs board...<P>I am a woman, who has felt the same way as your girlfriend and is working on re-building intimacy with my husband. It is possible- there are so many success stories on these boards. <P>Let me tell you how my H and I moved into what I call brother and sister mode:<P>When we married (I was 19, he 24), I was head over heals for him. We were very passionate, had a very active sex life. You should see our wedding pictures, the way I gazed up at him in awe. Friends used to joke about how we were with one another. There was love. <P>As time passed, we also never fought. I know now that it wasnt' because we never disagreed.. it was because my husband would rather avoid conflict than deal with it, and so did not fight with me. The more he withdrew in that way, the less intimate I felt with him. We did not sit around talking intimately about our feelings, dreams, pasts, futures. We did not have conversations to debate important topics. He thought everything was perfect because we did not fight. To me, it was an indication that he did not love me enough to share his true feelings. He thought that because we sat on the couch at night, watching tv and laughing together that I was happy. But in reality, each day I got lonelier inside. Soon, I actually 'forgot' how I felt on my wedding day. I didn't believe I had ever gazed at him in awe. I felt so distant from him emotionally, I did not want to have sex at all.<P>Eventually, I felt so distant from him that I convinced myself that I had never really loved him at all. I told my best friend about how hard it was for me to kiss him, have him touch me, have sex with him. I told her how we were more like brother and sister, that I had never really felt that passionate about him at all. She thought I must have been kidding. She, being of sound mind, remembered how we used to be. I, being dead inside, couldn't recall those feelings at all.<P>When it got to this point, it was also true that I had found someone else, another man, to confide in and be intimate with(emotionally first and then after many months- sexually also). This made me feel even less intimate with my H and I said all the same things your girlfriend is saying now... She can't kiss you, you are not her soulmate, there is no way back. I felt that the OM was my soulmate, and all my passion was for him. <P>I'm not sure how I finally came to the conclusion that I wanted to work on my marriage, because for a long time I did not. But when I did, and I ended my affair, my H was willing to take me back (thank God). But once I was willing it became clear that if I was completely honest with my H, and he was completely honest with me, we could bring that intimacy back. An honest display of thoughts and feelings is what was missing.<P>We are still working, and I don't feel very passionate for him yet. But I do see that it is possible. The closer we get emotionally, the more I want him physically. <P>You said in your post that you have tried many times to fix this problem of brother and sister mode. I am so curious to find out what you did try, and how it didn't work. <P>Don't listen to her parents! I believe they are wrong here! Also, maybe you shouldn't even be discussing your relationship with them at all. Please get back to me on what you are trying, and maybe we can come up with some different ideas. Are you living together now? At least you have come to the right place- there are so many helpful people at this site.<P> take good care, tamis<P><BR>

Thank you for your response, at least it is encourageing that there are people who care about each other and do not see this sort of thing as final. I have printed your responses and look forward to reading them. By the way my name is Dave I tried entering the name as my username but it was already taken so I used the id of the computer I was on at the time. <P>The situation is this. D was living with a guy that did'nt really care for her, showed her little interest and used her to be a general dogsbody. She left him and went back to live with her parents six years ago now, I met her and we had a great time together, we decided early on that we wanted to be together and so I aimed for such an Ideal. Six years down the line I'm told that the decision to change the arrangements was made four years ago and she never informed me about it. She has'nt really been honest about things, when I ask her what she wants wether to be by herself or with me she says she dosent know. I ask her why she wont let go and she says what happens if I have made a mistake, so she cant let go and she cant go forward in the meantime I am left hanging not knowing what to do. I try to describe situations that would happen to us if we split up and if we stay together but she cannot make up her miond either way. In the meantime we have no intamacy for the last 18months and I have very little self esteem left, have no faith in me and certainly dont beleive in me ever being attractive to any other partner. It seems to be one slow destruction of my soul, mind & heart, I tear my life apart constantly to find answers to this. If she said I have someone else then fine or lets live together then fine, at least we have a direction and not this limbo we now exsist in. She still lives with her parents and is an only child. She is very much part of the family and has lots of animals that keep her at home and involved. There seems to be so many things for her to do that she has crowded me out of her life. We started off working together and after deciding to work at being together I followed my career and have eneded up 70 miles away from her, which I see as 3/4 hour travelling time but she sees as out of sight.<BR>She seems to have isolated me so much that there is no time for me in her life or opportunity it would seem.

dave,<P>It sounds like this is very hard on you, because she is with her parents and you are alone thinking about her.<P>Maybe she is getting scared thinking about a lifetime with someone after what she went through with the first guy. What would happen if you printed off the emotional needs checklist from this site- could each of you fill it out? Possibly it would help her decide what she does want, since she seems at this time to not even know what she wants. <P>What kind of conversations/contact are you having recently?

You can travel 70 miles in 3/4 or an hour? Wow. What state do you live in? My car won't even go that fast. And if it did, I'm sure the police wouldn't be to happy.<P>

tamis<P>Contacts at first used to be daily and now they are once weekly limited to daylight hours I see her at 1pm and leave her at 10.00pm. There is no intamcy between us so there is no reason for her to sleep with me now. I just seem to pick her up take her out, look after her for the day and drop her home. I know this sounds fairly strange but this hasn't just occured, this has gradually come to be the normal for her. But every time I take her out I am waiting for her to decide what she wants, I don't push her and back off when I feel she is being hurt. But it dosent work the other way round, my pain is out of sight out of mind. <P>I look forward with joy to the one day I spend with her, I get ready as though it's our first date, to me that day is the day when my life drops back into contentment and happiness. Reality is that day the rest of the week is a chore and a bind. Now she has the opporsite view to me, the week is reality and the bind is seeing me on that one day. She will often dress in jeans and not make any effort to look nice to please me. She is very beautiful and dosent need external adornment to look better, but it would be nice if she would do this for me...once. I buy her dresses and suits and yet she never wears them, they stay in the wardrobe and never see daylight. I take her to concerts, theatres, places of interest, the coasts anywhere I feel she would get great experinces from and would awaken her love again and yet it all is taken as expected rather than grateful. <P>The more I write about this the more I seem to realise that she really dosent need me in her life anymore and perhaps the best way is to let go, after all only one person's going to hurt then...me.<P>Dave<p>[This message has been edited by 7600120 (edited September 09, 1999).]

Dave, <P>maybe you're right. if she's not enjoying you and the relationship, maybe you should just stop going there and wasting your time. If she misses you, she will call.<P>tamis

tamis<P>Thanks you for your input<P>Dave

Dave, I have been through that brother/sister stuff (excuse) in the last year. It turned out my W was involved with her Boss. She has to vlaue the relationship at some and be willing to work on it. All things are possible, but it takes two. I believe if I was strong enough and able to maintain the MB principles, I could have won her out. But alas, I'm not and I've reached my threshhold of tolerance. <BR>Try the MB principles, I believe it can be done. Good luck, Mike

Mike<BR>thanks for your reply, but we have split up now and at least I dont have to rack my brains to find answers to all this. I have learnt uch a lot from this site as regards the principles of love & keeping a relationship together that I have now a lot to offer someone new. She really wasnt interested in keeping this alive, it was such a burden and effort for her that it was easier just to let her go now. Yes I know I've wasted six years working on a dream, but it turned out to be my dream and not ours. If you can come away learning from your mistakes and carrying the wisdom found on these pages to someonelse that want's to make it work, then there is a bright future out there. Sometimes you cant make people see the danger or how a certain course will destroy there life together, and no matter how much you try you will be despised and tore apart for your loyalty and devotion to the cause of love. I wish her luck and really don't think I could ever put back together this relationship anymore. I deserve something better and from reading others comments, I know there are great and devoted people out there, which I know I will find. The best thing about reading all this information is I now can see the danger signs more quickly and avoid the shallow people from now on......thanks to everyone that commented, I was sad when I started this discussion but now the future is starting to look brighter, like a heavy burden of carrying someonelse has been taken off my shoulders......Good luck to everyone that has problems, and I hope you all have willing partners that will work it out for you.