I suppose this section may be just for the divorced/gonna-get-divorced, but I need some feedback. I met this great guy...he loves God and is a Pastor in the city where he lives (4 states over from me.) He's been open enough to share his life story of relational "trials" with me. He seems truly repentant and on a 'new path' and he's obviously desiring - once again - to be married...thinks God is leading him to me/us to each other. I don't deal well with the baggage of the "X-Files" - a good relationship is hard enough to maintain without having to accept kids...and ex's who'll always 'be around' because of the kids.<p>My prayer to God has always been for a mate who has never been married and has no children. In that so unfair? I'd like to hear some honest opinions from some true Believers.<p>[ December 12, 2001: Message edited by: Anchorwoman ]</p>

Personally I'd run away as fast as I can. IMO he is using his past as a subtefuge to manipulate you into wanting to be the "one" in his life. This can be a very strong pull. They say the best defense is a good offense, and since he knows his baggage will be revealed, why not try to turn it into an advantage (and he has done so with you it appears)....one can only wonder how many others he has using the same type of approach on. Patterns are important, and tell us far more than ones may say about themself. This man has 5 failed marriages, there is a reason for that, and the only common denominator is .....HIM. If you persist in allowing this to go forward, at the very least get to know all his exW as well as possible and as quickly as possible. That this man has serious personality disorders is almost a given, and they should be able to reveal that to you.

Hi,<p>I see I am the first to respond to your post. Here are a couple of thoughts- Yes, the Lord does redeem our mistakes--we can screw up/ learn from them-- but with that said--let's look at the reasons he has had 5 ex's in his past! <p>This is a HUGE red flag!<p>There is NO way- I personally would consider someone with that type of history to be anything but a "high-risk and even "repeat offender"--
(to use criminology language!)-- for another marriage. <p>There is another poster on here who I have been involved with.. that also married a 5 timer-- and is now making plans to get out.<p>If you have laid that request before the Lord-- trust HIM to be faithful to lead you to one who can more closely match the criteria you are looking for-- Obviously , He has shaped your heart enough w/ that criteria that He has someone special for you. <p>Just b/c this guy is a Pastor-- does not make HIM GOD's voice piece- in terms of confirming himself to be the Lord's choice as your mate. <p>ALot of times-- the leading from a Pastor is of the Lord-- but--Biblically, I would want to explore his past relationships, and wht caused him to fail in them--- also, what he did to reconcile himself to his wifes-- if you truly think he is candidate for marriage, and why he feels you are the ONE he is being drawn towards-- not that his feeling of that-- is the sole criteria.<p>Perhaps, his feeling-- is based on being legitamize-- as " Pastor" - Was his previous divorces in the Lord, or out of the Lord--...<p>Think/ Pray hard- and then seek counsel on this man-- just b/c someone comes into our life-- and He wants us.. does not make HIM the one from the LORD !<p>Blessings,
D

Hi Anchor,<p>I am a wife number 3. I agree with the others, keep running. My H's pattern is loud and clear. I never talked to wife #1 or #2 about H before I married him. I talked to #2 after the separation, and found out things started pretty much the same way with H. Same lies and justifications how the current/former W was no good, blah, blah.
Like snl said , it's so hard not to fall on the trap. You really feel great, and if there's any self-esteem or self-respect problems, it's a quick fall and hard to get out.
I am still hoping H finds the strenght to break the pattern. He has at least acknowledged it , but can he do it, don't know. He got involved with OW, and she was quite quickly pushing him to divorce me. She's got no problems with 3 times divorced father of 5 as a new partner. Well, she's once divorced mother of 3 (youngest from an A with a MM)what do you expect...
This guy of yours may feel great now, but for the long run, it doesn't look promising.
Hope you will find the answers and will make a right choice for yourself.

Anchor,<p>I'd have to say for (for the very first time) that I agree with Sad_n_lonely. Run away!<p>But, if you must persist... Maybe you want to get a list of the x-wives and call each of them up and see what they have to say. It might be a real eye-opener. Or, I should say it is sure to be a real eye-opener.<p>Start running now.<p>Now, I am a Christian and have a lot of respect for ministers... but, they are people too - with all the faults and flaws that any man might have. They do have training in the art of persuasive speech. Check to make sure that the walk fits the talk. It might be hard to tell. Call up those ladies and find out if you must.<p>For the record, I married when I was 40 - and was celibate prior to that. There are never-married guys around. Some of them are rather nice. [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] I've even got at least one friend in that catagory (about age 39 or so). There is a couple in my church who married in their early 40's - first marriage for both - who seem to be very happy together. I don't know your "age bracket", but I know you can do better than that.<p>Happy hunting!<p>-AD<p>[ December 13, 2001: Message edited by: AbandonedDad ]</p>

Hi,<p>Seems to me that this man has a proven track
record and if you allow yourself to get involved,
you will only set yourself up for failure. <p>Make certain this is what you want before you
leap in feet first. Otherwise, you could be
hurt worse in the future than what you would
be right now.<p>Hope this helps.

My choice in running shoes is New Balance. What brand do you prefer? Get them on and use them.

If it comes from God, you will know it. It sounds like it's coming from the Pastor. It sound like this man is afraid of being alone. I think that your prayer is a valid one. Just because you've become interested in this man, and he seems to think that God brought you two together, does NOT mean that it's God's plan for you. I agree with the others. RUN as fast as you can. If God planned for you to be with THIS man, it will happen eventually. However, my guess is that if you take a step back and get out of it for now, this Pastor will find that it's GOD's will to be married to someone else quite quickly. Go to the source. If God WANTS this marriage for you, he'll continue to open doors. If not, he'll shut them. I think the fact that you found this site and asked the question, and the responses you're getting MIGHT just be the door shutting on this one!<p>MOM

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Anchorwoman:
<strong>My prayer to God has always been for a mate who has never been married and has no children. In that so unfair? </strong><hr></blockquote><p>Nope, not unfair, not unrealisic and not unattainable, as far as I can see. And God will honor your prayer and give you the desires of your heart.<p>Don't settle for second best. You are worth more than second best.<p>I agree with all the others....cut it off with this guy. Let him know that there is no future for the two of you. It's great that he loves God and it's great that he's a Pastor. But like they all said, his track record is not great. <p>What's the story of his other marriages? Were all his wife's unfaithful to him? If not, then I have questions about his ability to honor what the Bible says about divorce and re-marriage.<p>I don't even think you should take the time or energy to interview the other wives....I think you would always be second guessing yourself if you go further with him. Cut it off now, and with him being 4 states away, do it in a nice way, and then set your boundaries....just don't let it go on.<p>The very fact that you are asking the question shows me that you have some pretty serious doubts about him. THAT is no way to start a marriage, let alone the kids and X's. You gut is telling you the right thing...there something to worry about here.<p>Just my opinion.
Aloha,
Ms.O

Thanks All,
for that much needed advice...I'm hearing you loud and clear and I'm gonna go ahead and get that running underway! (cinderella: ROFL...that was cute about the shoes.) Dude and I had a long phone conversation a couple of days ago and boy he's laying it on thick.<p>For whoever asked for some add'l background info: I'm 29, he's 42. His length expose' letter that he sent last week led me to believe that his ex's created a lot of problems in past relationships...unfaithfulness, deceit, yada, yada, ya. According to his story - and I truly believe him on this one - he's an extremely compassionate person. In his 'pastoralship' he had a habit in the past of ministering to women in need (i.e. of a home) and allowing them refuge at his place. This 'compassion' created traps (and ultimately babies and marriage out of guilt) on more than one occasion. Nonetheless, I came right out and told him in Wed's conversation that, "surely the women weren't solely the blame." He was honest and said that they weren't but never would come out and say exactly what he did to sabotage his relationships. Only later in the conversation did he come right out and say that he USED to be a womanizer. Of course, I immediately concluded that this was probably a BIG part of the problem all along. OH! Did I mention that his youngest child is only 6 mos. old - out of wedlock?<p>Gee, I feel stupid for even stopping to entertain ANY possibilities here. Truly I think I was already getting cranked up to run, I just stopped in here to get some extra "reality" kick-in-the-rear assistance. I appreciate you guys!<p>Anchorwoman

Anchorwoman,<p>There are probably sooo many old/new threads that relate to your decision of this guy pursuing you.<p>Here's just one of those I think you should read. Pay close attention to the posters second post...<p>http://www.marriagebuilders.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=34&t=005197<p>Take care and good luck,<p>ANNA

P.S.<p>This link above was just in case you needed any additional "kicks in the behind". [img]images/icons/wink.gif" border="0[/img] <p>ANNA

OH MY GOSH!!! After that background, I say....RUN EVER HARDER!!!!<p>Glad to see you've "seen the light"...now run towards it. I know people can change, but a child out of wedlock 6-months ago, is not enough time for a person to permanently change in the way he would have to....sheeesh!!<p>Don't get involved with Rev. Dude....yikes!!!<p>Keep the faith!
Aloha,
Ms.O

Oh Anchorwoman,<p>Even the title of your post sent me screaming and I didn't read through your post yet. I agree with all the previous posts, run fast, and if you can't run, walk quickly! <p>Reminds me of the punch line of a joke I just had emailed to me. Short version is, a nun is about to be rapd by a man that has been following her, she thinks quickly and raises her habit. The man lowers his pants. The nun got away... it's easier for a woman to run with her skirts pulled up than a man to run with his pants down. <p>Grab your skirt and fly!!!

Faster, faster, faster!!!!<p>Would some skates help you get away faster?

This guy is either a relationship addict or a sexaholic.<p>There is a group called SLAA - Sex and Love Addicts Anonymous. There is another 12-step group called SA which stands for Sexaholics Anonymous.<p>While it is not your job to rescue of fix this man, you might want to pass on to him the telephone number of the international office of SA. They could help him find a group in his area. That number is 615-331-6230.<p>But, if he does much counseling, he might know that information. <p>Personally, I would avoid contact with the man. But, you hqve this information should you wish to pass it on.<p>By the way, what kind of running shoes did you choose?

Anchorwoman,<p>This man just seems to have a lot of problems with resolving conflicts. I really don't believe that five divorces is something you want to play with. The baggage seems tremendous... even though you don't know the facts, God does.<p>Run with all your might like the people say here. God does not approve of someone who continually breaks covenants...and marriage is a covenant.<p>God be with you....<p>The original Ramy...

Dear Anchorwoman,<p>I was involved with a minister for almost 3 years. He had the same "compassion" for women in need. You need to run as hard as you can the other way, because this man will say and do anything he can to persuade you that you are the "one" who is the best thing that ever happened to him, the one he truly loves, and the "one" that God sent to him. Don't believe it for a minute! I think it was you who said that they are trained in the art of persuasive speech. How is a man who has been divorced 5 times, has a 6 month old child out of wedlock still a pastor? <p>And the fact that he has been "sent" you from 4 states away by God is a HUGE red flag!This man pursued me so strongly, flowers, over 100 love poems and almost as many love letters. From the first, he wanted to marry me. I was the only woman who had truly captured his heart. I've never been wooed so passionately in my life. It was every woman's dream. At first I wasn't sure, but then I fell head over heels in love with him. I thought he was the greatest man in the world, and the fact that he was a minister was to me, a seal of approval. <p>I moved 3,000 miles to be with my minister and he decided that he "fell in love" with and got pregnant a woman he was helping to get away from her exhusband who was in prison. I don't know if it's a sick game with them, or if they really feel they are "helping" these women, but nonetheless it is sick. Get as far away from him as you can. You can do a search on my name to see my original story posted back in November of 2000.<p>When I went through therapy, according to my therapist, my former minister boyfriend fits the role of a sex addict. I was not the first one he did this to, and I am not the last. He is living with the woman after me, and thank God he is not in a position of power and authority anymore in the church to seduce women, most of whom are vulnerable in ways they may not see, but he did. 5 divorces? and another child out of wedlock? How many women did he seduce with words and sympathy to overlook his track record? <p>You may think he is great, but he is only showing you what he wants you to see. My former boyfriend never took any responsibility for his wrong actions, it was always someone else's fault. Even when he was on probation with his church, and a board member asked him to account for something, he was irritated because he said it made an already stressful situation that much more stressful. I remember thinking at the time "this church pays your salary, and the board has a right to ask you to account to them in the area you are on probation about". Just one more way he rationalized every thing he did.<p>Even in telling me he had done something illegal by sleeping with a woman he was counseling, he still justified his actions by telling me he thought I was seeing someone else. He blamed his "indescretion" on me, saying he thought I was getting frustrated with him because after almost 3 years, he had failed to come through on his plan to marry me. To keep me hanging on, he actually had the gall to tell me he cared about my soul more than he cared about the other woman's! And that he was "confused" and in love with 2 women at once. That is evil from anyone, but coming from someone who claimed he was a man of God it is even worse.<p>I think that myownme has hit the nail on the head. I'm sure if you backed off, another woman would be God's "will" for him. This man needs help desperately, and I doubt that he has had any counseling at all, much less enough that an out of wedlock child of 6 months has given him time to see what issues he obviously needs to deal with.<p>Patterns are very important, sad n lonely is correct on this one that this man has a personality disorder. You deserve so much better than him. God planted the desire in your heart to pray for a man of integrity. Wait for him. I would be very interested to know how you happened to meet this minister with the distance between you. <p>Don't make the same mistake I did. Thank God he saved me from such a situation. Looking back over a year later, I can see that my life would have been nothing but heartache and mistrust. It took me a long time to get over his manipulation and emotional abuse, but thank God I am healed of him. You don't want that kind of life. Do a search on my name and see the responses these fine people here gave me.<p>I used to think that because he was a pastor he was a wonderful and perfect man. Don't let the title fool you. There are wolves in sheep's clothing. Not all pastors are that way, I have been a Christian for many years and some of my closest friends are pastors, both men and women. <p>If your friend came to you and told you the story you have told us, what would you tell her to do?<p>Take care and God bless.<p>[ December 20, 2001: Message edited by: ashygirl ]<p>[ December 20, 2001: Message edited by: ashygirl ]</p>

Cinderella and Ashygirl,
Thanks so much for your continued input on this. Ashygirl, I REALLY appreciate you sharing your experience with me. It sounds very similar. I'm sorry you had to go through that kinda of trauma with you ex-minister guy...glad to know that you made it through. I tried and tried to dig up the original story but never could find it. Could you give me the specifics about which forum it's under: infidelity? emotional needs? living together before marriage? I should be able to find it with the specific name.<p>I used my Nike shoes for running but haven't been running as fast as I should. I'll provide details tomorrow. I'm so sleepy now.

Hi Anchorwoman,<p>God is good! I DID make it through and my life is so much better today!<p>
You can click on the sunglasses by my post here, then click on "view recent posts" and start at the bottom. You will find the beginning of my story there, in "just found out." If our situations are similar, and you ever want to talk privately, just ask and I'll post my email address.<p>
I'd be interested to know your details. Do you need a different, faster model of Nikes?<p>Take care.