H has not participated in raising the children - even before he left. He's never been interested in holidays or birthdays, but - NOW - since he left he calls at the last minute to come deliver a present for the kids. It isn't particularly convenient for him to come when he calls at the last minute and is actually difficult for both the kids and I to deal with. He makes no 'previous arrangements' it's at the last minute or nothing at all...<p>My question is this, if I tell him, "no this is not a good time, we have other plans - but Tuesday at 7 would be good" I don't know what his reaction will be. But, I'm really tired of him ruining events for the children by showing up at their 'moment' and taking them away from guests and other plans. We've literally missed planned events, because he 'shows up at the last minute'. At Christmas it was building gingerbread houses, which I couldn't reschedule because of time and prep... the kids are still regailing me with - Mom, we didn't get to build the gingerbread houses this year. And at Christmas, he said he would be here at 12 PM (noon) and was over an hour and a half late. The kids wanted me to fix lunch for him - which I did, but after they ate they wanted to go shopping for my gift (daughter had something she had to pick up at the last minute). So, they left to go shopping and I was stuck here meeting him... DUH.<p>For son's birthday January 3rd - the party was at five - sandwiches, soup, cake, ice cream, and punch, and he called at 7 as the kids were playing with toys etc. Son told him Thanks for the gift - continued to play - and he took other son aside and made a big production of 'talking to him' but did not participate in the play time. Older son missed out on playing with the guests, because he was stuck 'talking to dad'. Later, when guest were leaving, older son said, but I didn't get to play. He was upset because he had wanted to see dad - but he wanted to play too. Dad doesn't come by to SEE the kids at any other time.<p>Would I be within my 'rights' (for lack of a better word) when he calls at the last minute, to say, "Sorry, this isnt' a convenient time, can you come by --- XYZ day at Z time?" Is it really me controlling the situation to do that - or would it be just a better way of handling the situation?<p>I believe for the kids and I it would be better if we were somewhat prepared for his visits aka. gift wrapping not scattered all over the floor, party stuff all over the kitchen, and the kids would actually have time to see HIM - not him be disrupting an event for them.<p>Suggestions?<p>Jan

There is nothing wrong with you saying that this is inconvenient.<p>however, if you are worried about controlling, then you have several options:<p>Intro 1) "Sorry, this isnt' a convenient time," or <p>Intro 2) "Because I don't want to establish a pattern of interrupting and missing preplanned events, such as that had occurred at ABC, I'm sorry that this is not a convenient time."<p>followed with:<p>Option 1) "I am free at --- XYZ day at Z time, is that good for you?"<p>Option 2) "What would be another good time for you?"<p>
wiftty

Dear SeekingJoy2,<p>I agree with wiftty, I do not think that there is a thing wrong with asking him to come at a more opportune time if he is just popping in. IMHO he is trying to manipulate the situation. If he comes by at a moments notice, you are not prepared and maybe somewhat flustered - so he is more likely to be in control of the situation. If he has told you that asking for something that is just simple good manners is trying to control the situation, then he is definately trying to manipulate you in my opinion.<p>Maybe you can explain to him that the children would get more out of his visits if they got more notice? It sounds like the situation is stressfull for them right now. And hopefully, your H is interested in how the kids feel.<p>In my opinion, when the spouse chooses to leave the family home, then they are now just like all other guests - and they should show the same consideration that guests do. That's just my 2 cents worth.<p>God Bless,
Lisa

Thanks - I FEEL manipulated when he pops in at the last minute. Even when he calls but is coming right over - I feel like I'm being 'controlled' into doing it his way.<p>I don't want to shut him out - but I don't want to feel this way.<p>I feel there should be a way that isn't imposing on our lives for him to visit the children. Particularly since he never wanted to be a part of our 'celebrations' before he left - I feel that his pushing into those days now is inconsiderate and manipulative.<p>Thanks again for the responses.<p>Jan

Hi Jan!<p>Of course you have the right to set boundaries in your house. Expect him to react angrily for at least the first 4 or 5 times of doing this. Be consistent and he will finally get the point and respect your wishes. He may say "it's now or never", just tell them him you will take "never" then. <p>The changes I have made have been very difficult for my stbx each time I set a new boundary but eventually he excepts them, mainly knowing he threw his fit, his fit didn't work, I remained consistent and he had to adjust.<p>Take care and goodluck.<p>ANNA

Anna - <p>Hi - thanks for the post. I don't know why I am so insecure about setting limits within my own home. I looked back at this post earlier - why am I worried whether he might feel I'm 'controling' or not - it is now MY HOME and he's NOT THE HEAD of it anymore.<p>MAybe I just needed to see that in black and white - and more appropriately - WRITE IT IN BLACK AND WHITE.<p>THanks again.<p>Jan

Seekingjoy,<p>I echo the previous posts...Set Boundries..<p>You can inform him...I'm sorry but we have plans and are walking out the door, had you called earlier in the week/month to set up a time to come over it would have been better..I'll call you later when we get in so that we can schedule a more convient time..<p>And I personally no longer 'wait' for my stbx to show up..if he says he will be here at this time..
and we have other plans set for an hour later and he still hasn't shown up..I'll leave..does he get upset..yes, but thats his problem not mine..<p>The kids are learning this too..that if they have plans..and dad calls at the last minute to see if they can come over..they will tell him, I'm sorry but I have other plans..you should have called earlier in the day/week..he hasn't learned yet..but..maybe one day..

Hey Jan, <p>I know exactly what you are saying about putting it on paper. Sometimes I have a problem; I start to post; my problem is resolved as I type. <p>I think when you let someone be head over your family for years and years it is really hard to tell this person "no". It is almost like disrespecting your parents...<p>It felt good once I started setting my boundaries. Let us know as it goes how he reacts. Just another warning, it won't be pretty the first few times...<p>Take care girl,<p>ANNA

It's a weird feeling, isn't it, negotiating when their father can see the kids now. I think a lot of that weirdness stems from the years you struggled so hard to include HIM in family life! You encouraged it at every turn, and he called the shots (of whether he would participate or not). And now...you call the shots. You know he won't participate in their activities. He never understood that when you were together, so why would he try to blend in now? Don't feel guilty about that.<p>Yes, I think it's quite acceptable to politely tell him if his plans are not convenient. Suggesting another time is great. Then it's HIS turn to politely negotiate. If he doesn't, well, you tried your best. This isn't anything that will get you in trouble in court--the man doesn't even wish to set up a regular visitation schedule. <p>Despite all the problems, your kids know who is the involved parent. [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]

Thanks for the responses... <p>Today was interesting - we went to church - then on the way home happened to see the car H has been driving (he seems to have ruined the engine/tranni - something in his truck) so his boss is providing him a vehicle. One of the kids said, "There's dad! Think he'll call today?"<p>I replied casually, "I don't know, do you want to see him?"<p>My son (who is intent on working things out between his dad and I) said, "Mom, I don't think he has time to see us, he's got to be back to work on Sunday afternoon." <p>I said, "Really? M (the boss) doesn't work on Sundays except during harvest and planting." <p>Son said, "Mom, dad says he always has to work on Sunday, I think it's just an excuse though, so he can watch football games and other stuff we don't do."<p>I said, "What makes you say that?"<p>Son replied, "Well, that's what he did when he lived with us, he would leave on Sunday afternoon to go watch the game with his cousin so he didn't have to spend time with us."<p>I'm gloating... [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img] Is that allowable?<p>I think the kids have been talking among themselves... I know one of the girls mentioned that she told little brother that Dad spends most of his Sunday's at his Aunt's house... HERE IN TOWN.<p>I thought that was interesting.<p>Just passing on my morning... We are having a great afternoon - playing games... The girls went to play trivia and the boys turned on a movie while they are having quiet time... Shirley Temple... nice choice.<p>Blessings,<p>Jan

Jan,<p>In some ways..I am happy when my kids see these things and make comments because I know it's not
'just' me and my imagination..(as I have so many times been told.."your just imagining things")
but, it's also sad that they 'notice' these things..because they are learning the truth and
they look at their dad differently and their relationship gets even more strained because of it..and the kids feel as your son said..
"dad just doesn't have time for us" which sometimes translates to them.."dad doesn't love us" --

TR - <p>I agree with what you are saying - but I have some serious doubts about encouraging the kids to think their father loves them - when it's rather obvious he doesn't. I've watched my children suffer as they watched their father pay attention to someone elses children - because it would get him a sale, or earn him power points, or whatever - while he ignored or worse screamed at our children for doing the same things, or wanting his attention. <p>It's hard to understand - but it is okay for them to realize that he doesn't care - because they also know how much I do care. I'm finding - through working with them - and through the counselor - that there is less 'rejection syndrom' problem later in life - if they accept the fact early that one parent doesn't 'CARE' about them in the way the other parent does, it is easier for them to understand a lack of approval on that parent's part. In fact - I've noticed with my younger son that he doesn't seek his father's approval in anything he does.<p>I realize that my situation is not the normal stituation and that most fathers do actually care about their children. I also realize that it's possible for a man to decide later in life that he wants his children, and does care about them... I don't expect that to happen here - I've watched members of this family over the past twelve years, there are several generations of this family that have literally walked away and never looked back. I have been rather shocked at the number of family members who have no clue who their grandparents are or even what their names are, because the kids married and left never to speak of their parents again. My H walked away from the family farm in 1994 and has never looked back. Even living within thirty miles from his parents, and seeing them as often as I do - THEY make no attempt to communicate with my kids or me. His sister lives here in town and her daughter doesn't EVEN know that my kids exist and they are first cousins. Her H has talked to me in the stores and we are friends, he knows and talks to my kids, they call him UNCLE - but he suggested that they not do that when my H's sister is present - because it makes her angry. Their daughter and my youngest son are the same age - and are 'friends' in a play group. My son knows K is his cousin - but she doesn't have a clue that she's related to him. Extremely sad situation... <p>The worst part - My H's aunt is married to my third cousin (no Arkansas jokes please - I'm from Colorado).... I knew this - but what about my children who don't have a clue who their relatives are on that side of the family?<p>My perspective is probably tainted by years of being ignored and abandoned by my H and his family - but I do believe it has merrit.<p>Thanks,<p>Jan