Thinker go ahead and tell about his affair. Thing is, most people won't care. You need to get help for yourself. If he won't move out can you move in with one of your kids? A friend or your mother? Your bitterness will not destroy him, it will destroy you. Your continual harping about the OW will cause such animosity between the two of you that I can't even see you co-parenting with each other, let a lone staying married. My ex went off years ago after hearing of my affair and he suffered tremendously because of the way he handled things. Thinker a judge will not pity you if you go into the court room with that attitude. My ex did and the Judge fined him and told him to get a life. Your trying to force things out of SNL that he doesn't have. Work on yourself, move out if he won't and get your act together before you end up destroying yourself and everybody around you. And....please stop focusing on the OW and her marriage. Stalking and harassing added to your inability to let some bitterness go will not draw sympathy from a judge, your family nor your friends. What happened between those two is history and you need to focus on the present and the future.

Revelation today - I do listen and think about what you all have said. There was or (is) this drive in me to be vindictive to the other woman. I know as of now, that I will never like the other woman, but thoughts of pity are starting to come for the other womans husband today. Knowing that he is married to a adulterer X2. I don't exactly feel sorry for the OW, cause she knew exactly what she was doing, since this is her 2nd sexual affair. But there is this not caring, but a feeling of this woman needs help. Mental help.<p>I met a woman in my physical therapy class today. We talked a little while on the floor doing our routines. In the dressing room, she asked me why I look so sad? I thought actually that I was feeling a lot better than this weekend. She told me her story, shortened because of time, and I came out and told her a short version of my status. Turns out that she does counseling. I usually leave right after changing, but she said why don't we talk while she takes a shower and gets ready to leave. So we talked, and others in the rooms started to intervene in the conversation. It was quite neat, we had a group session going. Some stayed during the whole talk.<p>This was the most helpful day I have had since talking to the Harleys! I guess what I am trying to say is that I being myself, respond better to hearing a voice in conversation, than typing. I read what you all have to say, but tones, emphasis, reactions to statements make a difference in my understanding. Like when I talk to Orchid on the phone, is so different to me than typing on the computer to her. Maybe in time I will adapt. I read what you all said, and tried to do what you all said. But today made a slight difference in my perspective of this whole affair. Not totally, but some difference. This lady and I are going to talk on Wednesday, she comes the same time and days as I do. <p>So I have read what you all wrote. Yes I was totally focused on this woman, and my life was running on this woman. She is suppose to be nothing to me now, just history, that was a history of pain. She is no longer to exist in this household. She no longer is of importance to SNL, and especially to me. I don't want to know if she disappears off this earth. She has made her life what it is, and she has to suffer all the turmoil that is going to eat her up. Her guilt will be with her the rest of her life, and I am so grateful that I didn't do what she did, and so grateful that I don't have to tell my husband or anyone that I had 2 sexual affairs in my marriage. Having affairs is a mental breakdown of humans.<p>I am not saying that I am better than her, but I am saying that I am thankful that I have not sinned in adultery. And that I didn't hurt my husband in that way. I will add, that the WS does not know the pain they caused their spouse. This woman and I talked about the pain. She asked how the pain struck me first, and how the pain feels now. We talked about love, I told her about the criticism that I had during my growing years from my brother and my mother. We talked about christianity, I asked her if SNL and the OW committed adultery, she said definitely. To unclothe another not being married to, to have naked bodies next to each other, to touch each other sexually, and to have a sexual response (which is now lust) if not doing it with your spouse, is adultery. They weren't married, and the OW was never going to leave her husband (which was known by both of them) so the OW was out to get what she could, the OW knew what she was doing, since this was her 2nd sexual affair. This lady said that going to a minister would be a good idea. <p>To end, I see a light ahead, it is dim, but hopefully as the days go on it will get brighter.<p>Thanks to you all, I am realizing now that I have been focused on the wrong person.

Oh thinker I am so glad you finally have someone to talk to about all this! Hopefully you can begin to heal and move forward with your life!

Kal Girl - Thank you. Yes, I do feel better, and I am focusing on the right person now. The woman told me that I will have days that I fall back in the same old routine, she told me this will happen, but you will rebound sooner than before. Then eventually, it will become easier. I seem to have made a baby step in the right direction. You know it is nice to have someone to talk to. Someone that gave me a hug, I shed some tears, and some of the other women in the dressing room, gave me hugs too. The interaction was wonderful.<p>I feel that a group session in this territory would be quite beneficial to me. Seeing how todays talk affected my mood today. When my GYN suggested that I join a group session, support group, it seems to be positive to hear that others are suffering and in pain like you are. This is now my goal, to join a group session if I can find one, this seems like it might work better than an individual counselor. <p>I prayed to God this whole weekend that I would die! I prayed to God please help me, end my misery, end being mean to SNL, I didn't want to live beyond Saturday night. I drove around Saturday night till 2a.m. and wanted someone to run into my vehicle and kill me. It was awful the thoughts I had in my mind. It was scary, just like the thoughts that I had once before. I knew it was depression, but I didn't know how to deal with these feelings. They were eating me away. I just saw my GYN and I felt okay, but here it was 3 days later and I felt like crap. <p>I feel God heard me, and brought this person into my presence, and I guess I looked terrible enough that she seemed to sense a person was in need. There is this chritian aide at the physical therapist clinic, we have been talking about God, and she is going to a christian college to become a physical therapist with religion therapy. It is something new. She prayed for me when my dad was very sick, I prayed for her on a big test that she was to have Friday, talked to her today, and she said she felt God was with her during her tests. She will know if she passed Friday night, and will tell me Monday. Anyways, she asked me if there was something that she could pray for me today. She sets me up on the stems. She said you seem to be depressed today, and I told her just too much too think about. I will ask her Monday to pray for me. <p>Also, today my mother called to tell me that one of my dads best friends died today from cancer. He suffered with the cancer with hospice for 3 1/2 months. This put me in a sad mood, the family of Al is doing well, because of the duration of time that Al was so sick. My mother and I talked today, and she went to the house to talk to his wife Francis. Neighbors were bringing food over, and invited mom to sit down and eat with them. They are thankful that Al went to the Lord. But they said they will miss the old Al, he was loved by his family so much, and mom and I said dad and Al are probably fishing somewhere. This is so great to hear from my mother. To hear her say dad is with a good friend. To think that dad has a really good friend in heaven with him.<p>Thank you, and Thank you Lord!! Hopefully, I will return to church, and return reading more of God.<p>[ February 11, 2002: Message edited by: thinker ]</p>

SNL and Thinker,<p>I do not post but I do read alot, and after
reading what you two have posted, makes my
problems seem like cupcakes compared to what
you two are doing.<p>I know there is a far better time and place
to air your differences than here. You two,
it would seem, need to talk, like two adults
should, face to face, not email to email or
post to post. <p>This site is supposed to help folks, not argue
whatever differences, outlooks or versions of
your history that you might have. <p>We are all here for the virually the same
reasons, and arguing over the site is probably
not the appropriate thing to do. <p>Maybe, instead of making statements of the
accusatory nature, you should take a step
back and look at yourselves and see what you
have contributed to your present state. <p>Whatever you do is completely up to you, but
it certainly has to be better than blasting
each other in the public. <p>Ken

Yes, the MB site is their to help each other out. It is a site for help and comfort. I do not like what SNL writes about me, but that is for those of you to decipher. <p>I will continue to read on this board, but will give some positive insight to those who really need help.<p>There is only one person in this marriage to make a difference. My H needs to find the answer and to move on it. As you all know, he will do whatever he wants when he wants. Like he said, nobody will tell him what to do. Therefore that is the problem. <p>SNL is a good man, would be a good marriage with him, but he from day one of having that other woman in his arms, is not willing to have a marriage with his wife. He is not finding his answers yet, and he thinks he had the in-love, soulmate, etc. with the OW. But she is gone, and she dumped him. So that is the answer here.<p>Just trying to live each day, and trying to have a good birthday for our youngest today. He is turning 16 today, and going for his drivers test on Saturday. Our baby is growing up, and boy does this make me feel old. Thanks for all your advice.
I am working on the right person now.

<small>[ August 08, 2004, 11:11 PM: Message edited by: laura_lee ]</small>

<small>[ August 08, 2004, 11:11 PM: Message edited by: laura_lee ]</small>

Laura Lee - All I can say is for myself my feelings. As far as SNL can say, as you have read his posts, he didn't see me at the alter as his loving wife to be. He said, he didn't love me at the alter.<p>I didn't know this at that time.<p>I saw a handsome man that I wanted to spend the rest of my life with, to have a family with and to grow old with. When he said his vows, I thought he meant them with his heart. To hear him say he didn't love me at the alter is a heartbreaking statement. It is so sad to have SNL say that, but if that is the truth, then that has to be the way it is. <p>I meant my vows when I said I do. This was purely out of my heart. <p>This man made me feel special when we were dating. He made me feel like a princess. He bathed regularly, smelled nice, and made his appearance attractive. I loved to smell his shaving lotion.<p>This man and I talked a lot. We did things together that were a lot of fun. We exercised together, which was an important part of keeping one in shape. We went to the park a lot, took a dog with us whenever possible. Usually took a drink of somesort with us. There was once we took a blanket and 2 little pillows and each a book. We laid our blanket out and pillows and read and actually he fell asleep. It was nice to lay there and watch him rest, there was no sex or anything like that. Just to see him there, sleeping.<p>Like sleeping in bed, we slept apart for so many years, because SNL has a severe case of sleep apnea. SNL had the surgery, but it didn't help. He sleeps with a cpac machine. He will ask me if he slept good. When we had the power outage here, he slept terrible, he tossed, turned, coughed, went to the bathroom alot, because he was so active all night, and didn't rest. At first SNL blamed me for not being able to tolerate his snoring. When the snoring is so loud that you can't sleep, there is something wrong. But of course SNL blamed me. Anyways, he finally realized things were getting bad when he was falling asleep at the stop signs and stop lights. He was literally falling asleep with a fork or spoon in his hand. He finally had a sleep test done, with my suggestion earlier in the months. They found out he had severe apnea. Also, we slept apart after that for 3 years, cause I just didn't want him in the bed. There are reason, but no sense in going into them.<p>SNL has good traits, and some bad. Like all of us, we are not perfect. No one is perfect, but I feel we do pretty good as a couple if both of us are considerate and thoughtful to each other. I make up for some of his weakness, and he makes up for some of my weakness.<p>SNL likes adventure. SNL is different than my dad. I wanted someone different that was not like my dad. I loved my dad very much, but I wanted someone else to be my partner for the rest of my life. <p>There is much more to say, but need to get to sleep. Am beginning to type sloppy. Bye for now.

Not a good day today. Feel like I should just be by myself. Didn't talk with Gayle today, she had an appt. to get to. After done with physical therapy, my vehicle wouldn't start. H put one of those self-energized things that you hook up to the battery to start, and the stupid thing didn't work. Had H come to rescue me, would of been happy to just sit in the van all day, and sleep. Can't seem to do anything today, just a really crappy day. No more conversation for me today.