Over the last 6 weeks I have been doing everything that I could to try to save my marriage. My wife has told me I was controlling and that she wanted out. I read about 8 books and learned alot about myself and her as well. I am in a separate bedroom, but she isn't satisfied. She wants me out of the house because she can't be confronted with me every day. She had EA, assume that is all, over the phone for the past 2 - 3 months which she says she stopped immediately when I found out. (When all this started). <p>Initially her friends were supporting her but now they apparently aren't as much because they don't agree with her choices. They are trying to support her but not agree which is making her mad. I don't know if ANYONE actually agrees with her. She says that she has NO CONFIDENCE in her decisions right now but (In her gut) she knows this is right.<p>Well, I thought she was progressing through all her anger but last night when we talked I can see that she is fighting everyone and everything right now. We have two children whom we both love. I am so afraid that when I move out they will feel like I have abandoned them. I want to tell them that it isn't me, it is your mom who doesn't want me here, but that will only put them against her which does them no good.<p>I just can't believe that she is so against trying. I tried to "take her down a good scenario" last night in which we reconcile and both learn to meet the other's needs, but a little ways into it she just couldn't handle it and got up and said "it is too far away". She just doesn't want to try and it is killing me. She is so afraid and yet so damn stubborn. Her best friend called last night. I answered and apparently my answering words makes her think that now we (friend and I) are in cahoots so to speak. <p>Anyway, I feel like I am about through. I have incredible strength and desire but last night took alot out of me. I thought she was working through this stuff but it doesn't seem like she is. We are seeing a counselor separately and I asked her if she thought going more often would help. She said the only thing she has gotten out of going was affirmation that me moving out would be a good thing. She has gone about 6 times and has progressed no further than that. <p>I have seen the counselor since she has and my take on it is that time may be the answer, not that moving out was the only thing, however I am not even sure what the question is.
She feels (to me) to be fighting the world and she just thinks it is because the world is against her, not maybe because she could just be against what the rest of the world thinks. <p>I love her very much, but last night was the first time I wondered whether with her lack of commitment, it really mattered. I can't keep our marriage together myself, and I KNOW that I can't have a happy marriage if I am the only one trying. I can't give on everything. I was not the only part of our marriage that needed help.<p>She says she knows I am not the only problem, but when she got frustrated last night she blurted out "I like who I have been". She doesn't even see her contribution to our problems. She doesn't want to see that she was a part of OUR behavior, not that I just ruled the house. In fact I always thought of her as being the general leader of the house. Sure I got my way alot, but she acts as if I came home and jumped on a throne and started giving orders. That is simply not the case. I did come home and start the kids on homework. I did have expectations about what our boys should be doing, but my expectations don't seem to be out of alignment with the rest of the world as far as I can see. <p>She feels vendicated now that I have admitted that I have been controlling in alot of ways. So now all the feelings that she has and every instance that she can think of is true. She feels that I am controlling because I don't want her to drink and drive or have open containers in the car. She feels that I am controlling because I worry about her when she stays out at the bars until 2:30am. "You should just trust me and not worry" she says. Ha, I used to trust her but I always worried, not because of an affair thing, but because I just loved her and worried about her being out late and possibly being in danger. She thinks I am controlling because I got angry when we were broke and she went out and bought a pair of shoes. She says "I am an adult and if I want to go and buy shoes, then I can, and I will accept the responsibility." She has a fixed income, but I can moonlight so everything extra means that I have to work more in order to get it. And NO I don't overlord and control the money, but I think I should still have a say in how it is spent in certain situations just as she should.<p>I don't know. I really love her and want to be able to have a good marriage. She has no commitment and is in such a place right now that she can't see anything real. She recognizes that she is having a hard time, but appears to think it is because of everyone else, rather than herself. <p>I just don't know anymore how long I can hold on. I am worried that by the time this is all settled that my feelings may have changed so much in the process that I will no longer care. I don't want that at all, but last night just killed me.<p>[ February 22, 2002: Message edited by: Almostthrough ]<p>[ February 22, 2002: Message edited by: Almostthrough ]</p>

Almostthrough,<p>I'm sorry about what's going on. I know it's hard right now, but if you read what MB has to say, it will help you understand your situation.<p>My question to you is why are YOU moving out? She is the one that does not to try. Don't move if you don't want to.<p>My second question is - are you sure your W is not having an A? By reading your topic, it seems that she might. That's my .02 cents. I hope I'm wrong.<p>You are going to feel all kinds of emotions. Get ready for the roller coaster ride of your life.<p>Good luck<p>Dino

The reason I will move is because she absolutely refuses to leave the kids. She says that she will take our boys and move out but there is "No way in hell" she is leaving them. She acts like it is nothing for me to leave. Even though she has incredible difficulty with them alone for more than a few hours. She is in complete denial, and frankly I am loosing patience. I love my boys too much to put them through loosing me and having to move. I know that she would not leave them because she believes that it isn't best. I am willing to leave because I understand that what is going on right now isn't working and no matter what, without some time and space, at this point she is in no place to work. And if we break up then a few months isn't going to make any difference to the boys, but if we can come to an agreement and make our marriage work, then they will be better off for the move. She has no regard for the situation at hand. Just that she doesn't know what she thinks, therefore everyone who thinks something along the lines I think "has no idea where (she) has been."<p>Now up until a couple months ago I thought we had a relatively good relationship. We did have a few problems, but nothing that I thought was too out of the ordinary. But apparently she has been having this secret angst against me that even she did not understand. She feels like because we disagreed and I "got my way" that I have always been controlling. I don't know, maybe I was. I just stood up for what I believed. NEVER to control her. We have come along way from where we started in life, and was about to make substantial jump in income with me finishing training in the next couple years. <p>I don't know what happened. I am not sure that it even involves me any more. I know that last night completely slapped me in the face however. My feelings are no longer the same as they once were even a few hours ago. The complete disgust that I have for the situation is new and may just be a temporary thing. But I have forgiven the things in her and her situation that have affected us and she doesn't even want to try to think about forgiving me and mine. Frankly, I am not even sure that I care anymore. I have never been so hurt in all my life as I have been in the last 6 weeks. I have never tried to hurt her at all. She knows that, but she has made no attempt to avoid hurting me. In fact she has gone out of her way to hurt me many times during this whole fiasco and I have forgiven her each time. I am through with the giving of everything only to be told that it isn't enough. By God, I have had it.<p>I am not giving up, but I used to think that I would give anything to make this work. I no longer feel that way. I love our boys dearly, but can't give myself completely up in order to keep them. They would not be happy with a dad who wasn't himself. I am so damn capable and have so much to give. Even if they only saw me on a few weekends and summers. I love her, but can't do this anymore. I have read everything on this site several times over and I understand what is going on. I thought that I could handle it, but sadly I am not as strong as I thought that I was.

Almost... - I have been there. I am at your same step in life. My H is the one who had a EN/SA. He has said all the classic stuff your wife is saying. Everything is about them, they don't give a hoot about you. I would think with what you are saying, that her affair was sexual and is still going on. My H didn't tell me it was sexual until 6 months after discovery. Which was wrong, he held important information about his sexual activity and didn't give me the opportunity to decide whether or not I wanted to have sex with him because of his adultery. I can see all the same statements you are getting. They call you controlling, cause you keep asking questions. They don't want you, they want the OP. They want what they want, the euphoria, fantasy is so strong. But they don't realize it is not for real in the real world. My H was so abusive verbally to me, he pushed me on the ground outside once, called me terrible names, in front of the kids. H threw things, went ballistic, told the kids to get the h*ll out of the house, and stayed out late many nights, and one night didn't come home till 4am. He was out talking to the OW on the cell phone. <p>Yes, when one only works on the marriage, one is the only one who says I love you, one is the only one doing the emotional needs, there is no hope. Steve Harley in our counseling has told H the same thing, he asked H what is your path? Cause H isn't following the MB path, that is why Jennifer fired H, and told us to talk to Steve. Last session we had with Steve, H was defensive, hung up on Steve, and that is why Steve asked H the question of what is your path. H couldn't give a real answer, said he didn't know a path and that he was to not LB. <p>As you can see, H can sit here and type type type. Many have told him here, that if he were to work on the marriage as much as he does here, things might work out.<p>I pain for you deeply. I know what you are feeling. I talked to another WS on the phone, and another thing is that if one is not able to give up the past and move on, nothing will happen. That is where my H is, he won't give up the past (states here quite frequently about the miserable marriage), H won't give up the past with his mother (he stated that he had a not so good child hood), his mother did the best she could at that time with her being a single YOUNG mother with a 3 & 4 year old boys and no help from the father. No financial help from the father, and father only saw the boys maybe 1 or 2 times a year.<p>The BS gets the short end of the deal. The WS got all the fantasy, euphoria with the OP. Money was no object on my H part, spent thousands on her. The WS doesn't show guilt or remorse. Such is my case. They live in the same home with their spouse, expecting all the same frills here, make dinner, clean, wash their clothes, etc. and still have the OP on the side. This happened to us here. H would spend hours and hours talking to the OW, come home expect dinner here, have clean clothes, I answered the business phone and then he would go on and talk to the OW in our home, like nothing is different. <p>If I were you, I did, and wished I had spent much more money to get all the details. I hired a cheap investigator, now that I was trying to be conservative, cause we didn't have that much money, and to see that the H spent thousands, I wish I had gone for a full blown investigation. This is so painful to our family.

Almostthrough,<p>I know what your going through. No matter how hard you try you can't keep a marriage together by yourself. Trust me I know.
Don't feel guilt, my wife accused me of being controlling as well, and other things. For months I was depressed because I believed everything she said. After some deep sole searching I realised it does take two to brake a marriage. You each have your faults, but the faults aren't necissarily 50/50.
Stay confindent and strong. Make sure you see your children, that's the most important thing.
Keep going to councilling, if possible try to get her to keep going. Go to church, bring your boys, prey to God. If your wife goes, even better.
Your wife is in a world of her own right now.
Chances are if you push her to reconcile she'll just get angrier, and blame you for more things.<p>Good luck buddy,<p>PS If she does file for divorce, come to http://www.dadsdivorce.com for support.

Almost,<p>One thing that you may want to do is check with a laywer if you were to leave. In some states, if you were to leave, the other spouse could get a court order against you that you have abandoned the family. You might not get back into the house without help from a laywer. <p>Are you sold on the idea that your wife are to get the kids? You may want to talk to a laywer on this as well. It's not always the W that gets the children. Check on the General Questions fourm and look up Sad Dad's situation. He is looking for custody of his children and has a good shot. Just my .02 cents.<p>Good Luck.<p>Dino

almostthrough,<p>I will give you one piece of advice. DO NOT MOVE OUT!!!!! If your W is unhappy and/or having an A, let her leave, WITHOUT your children. Nothing will be accomplished by leaving and you can only hurt yourself. I left for a month at my W's request (prior to knowing about OM, although I suspected). All that happened is she and OM became closer. I know things are tense and your children may be feeling it, but it is your W that wants to be away from you. I repeat, DO NOT, under any terms, leave. There are legal ramifications. <p>sad dad

DO NOT LEAVE! STAY IN THE HOUSE!<p>I know that 6 weeks have been an eternity, but it is still too early. Your wife is still in the confused state. She has feelings for this person and here selfishness is in control. She has these feelings and that is all that matters. What you are seeing is exactly what I saw in my wife. Your wife may still be in contact with this other person. If you leave, it just allows her to become fully committed to the A. If you leave it also leaves you in a very bad place when it comes to custody of the children. Once you leave she can claim you left the family and you will not be able to come back to the house. <p>My wife committed A with a neighbor, 18 months later started communicating again and I stopped that. 7 month later she started communicating again and started A 5 month later before I discoved it again. For 5 weeks after the last discovery, our house was just like yours. 5 weeks after discovery, while I was at work, she packed her bags and the kids bags and left the state to her mothers 650 miles way. Ater 5 days and while I was consulting an attorney to have the kids brought back to the state by court order inwhich she knew I would do and was told I could do by her attorney, she asked to come back home to work things out. While she was gone, reality hit her head on. It has now been 17 months and everything is great. <p>You need to stay at home. If she wants to move out, tell her you are ok with that but let her know that you have no intention on having less than 50% custody. Currently, she would like you to leave and never to appear again. She could then have an affair and also have her kids. You need to apply the marriage builder principles and just wait. She will continue to act the way does while 1) she is still in contact with the OP; and 2) while she has not given up on her feelings toward the OP. Once she realizes what she could be giving up with the children, at that time she may start thinking logical again but up to this point, her feelings are making her decisions. Remember, she made a choice to feel the way she does for the OP and she can also chose to have those feeling with you again. Feelings are not a random event that we cannot control, feeling are a choice. You may not have them know, but if you chose to, they will come over time.

She's still linked with her lover. You can only really focus on you, keeping clean, exercising, maintaining a social life and keeping it together at work. Do your share of the domestic chores too.<p>Don't attack her affair. Don't add to it's intensity. But certainly don't condone it.<p>She will probably come round within 6 months. You've got a long and difficult road to travel. Full of pain and emotion. When she finally breaks ALL contact with her lover (I'm SURE she hasn't yet) your marriage has hope. And even then it is hard work for a long time!<p>If you leave, her lover will fill your space. If you stay, you make it impossible for that to happen without her making the choice to leave you. And that is something she is unlikely to do. Good luck.

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by hubby:
<strong>DO NOT LEAVE! STAY IN THE HOUSE!<p>I know that 6 weeks have been an eternity, but it is still too early. Your wife is still in the confused state. She has feelings for this person and here selfishness is in control. She has these feelings and that is all that matters. What you are seeing is exactly what I saw in my wife. Your wife may still be in contact with this other person. If you leave, it just allows her to become fully committed to the A. If you leave it also leaves you in a very bad place when it comes to custody of the children. Once you leave she can claim you left the family and you will not be able to come back to the house. <p>My wife committed A with a neighbor, 18 months later started communicating again and I stopped that. 7 month later she started communicating again and started A 5 month later before I discoved it again. For 5 weeks after the last discovery, our house was just like yours. 5 weeks after discovery, while I was at work, she packed her bags and the kids bags and left the state to her mothers 650 miles way. Ater 5 days and while I was consulting an attorney to have the kids brought back to the state by court order inwhich she knew I would do and was told I could do by her attorney, she asked to come back home to work things out. While she was gone, reality hit her head on. It has now been 17 months and everything is great. <p>You need to stay at home. If she wants to move out, tell her you are ok with that but let her know that you have no intention on having less than 50% custody. Currently, she would like you to leave and never to appear again. She could then have an affair and also have her kids. You need to apply the marriage builder principles and just wait. She will continue to act the way does while 1) she is still in contact with the OP; and 2) while she has not given up on her feelings toward the OP. Once she realizes what she could be giving up with the children, at that time she may start thinking logical again but up to this point, her feelings are making her decisions. Remember, she made a choice to feel the way she does for the OP and she can also chose to have those feeling with you again. Feelings are not a random event that we cannot control, feeling are a choice. You may not have them know, but if you chose to, they will come over time.</strong><hr></blockquote><p>bump

<p>[ February 25, 2002: Message edited by: Almostthrough ]</p>

Oh, God I feel horrible. I just don't know what to do. I understand all your ways of thinking that she should be the one to move or I should stay, but I just don't understand how I can stay in our house with her acting like she is. I understand the "fog", but she is very upset and has stated that she will move out and take the kids if we don't separate. She says that she needs to work on "me" (herself) before she can work on "we". She is worried that if she doesn't understand her part in our behavior that she has no chance to avoid it again should we reconcile.<p>I can understand her hesitancy, but I just don't know what to do about it. We have already agreed that I will move out tonight. I am going to go to a temporary place until something more permanant can be found. God, this is the most devastating thing I have ever had to do in my life. I pray and pray and only feel calm when I am praying. She feels that she cannot give me the chance to try to show her that we can have a happy marriage. She says at this point it is "fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me."<p>She is trying to learn from our mistakes, but acts like the only way to preserve herself is to run. Oh, I hope that isn't the case. She says that she has not made up a decision as to what she wants to do, and won't until she can figure out more things. I can't go back on my word that I will leave temporarily, however I am petrified that this morning will be the last that I ever see her. I have cried more this morning than I have in the past 33 years. <p>I know that you guys feel that she may still be with this other guy, and I have no proof that she isn't. There is no way for me to do anything about it. I feel so lost and abandoned. The thing is if she is being unfaithful still then I don't want anything to do with her. I have already forgiven the first time because I felt that I was involved, but she has repeatedly stated that she has not seen him nor contacted him. If she is doing that and stating something else then I will never be able to trust her anyway so staying is meaningless. <p>I have to trust her and trust in God now. I have to believe her and believe what she says because if I don't we can never really be together anyway. If I tried to back out and stay, we would be over within a week. If she is lying to me and still seeing someone or she has already made up her mind that she wants divorced, then me being in the house will do nothing to change that. If she refuses to continue to progress through her issues and becomes fixed within this bitterness that she is currently in, then we won't be together anyway. If I continue to be miserable living with but apart from her then I will not be happy either. I have realized that at least at this point there is nothing more that I can do to preserve my family. My only option is to trust her and give her room. Because short of her changing and wanting me back then we have no hope regardless of where I am staying. <p>At the end of McGraw's Relationship Rescue book a question is stated basically saying "Is there a time to call it quits?" He says essentially that you have to earn the right to quit. That until you can look yourself in the mirror and your children in the eye and say that you have done everything possible to save this marriage and their happiness, then you havn't earned the right to quit. Until you have done everything in his book he thinks that you havn't done enough. Well, I can't get my wife to read the damn book and I can't force her to let me do the exercises without her consent. So upon moving out, I will truly have done absolutely everything possible that I know of to preserve my family and marriage. I will be able to look into the mirror and my children's eyes and say that I did everything for them and couldn't make it work. That even though I wanted very much to try again adn had learned a tremendous amount of things what would allow me to be much better, their mother would have none of it and refused to try, for her sake, my sake, or theirs.<p>My fear is that me being out of the house will allow her to "forget" me and become OK without me when she would have been better with me in the picture. To that end I will continue to insert myself as much as possible into her and my children's lives. We have already discussed that we will talk about what is going on at least once a week. We will plan family outings at least once a week. I will spend time at our house with the children and she can choose to stay in the house or leave as she sees fit at any given time. I have explained to her that everything at this point is up to her and that it could change in the future as my feelings and desires are modified as well. <p>I will be over at our house several times a week in order to see our children at least until I get a more appropriate apartment. We are planning on having dinner every Sunday together during which time either she or I will cook. This will allow some togetherness without the need to always be together. <p>I have told her that I will continue taking the boys to church and that I will ask her each time if she would like to go. She said that was fine at the moment, but has declined going up to this point. Haha, I remember when I was little I used to find church boring and monotenous, but the church that I attend now is wonderful and I wish they had more services. Especially now that I will be spending several nights alone. <p>I must pick myself up and keep going. I have my final boards to take in about 4 months and I have to pass them. I must become someone that is confident and kind. I must become the person that I want to be, and perhaps in so doing show my wife that I am something worth coming back for.
I have always been confident and known just exactly where I thought I was heading. This is perhaps the first time in my life where I feel like I have no say in my future and it is the most important thing that has ever happened in my life. I pray that I will have the strength to continue. I pray that I will have the strength to be the person that I want and need to be. I pray that I will be able to show my wife that for all the things that have occurred, forgiveness not forgetfullness is the key. I don't want to return to how we have been, but I desparately want to build a new and wonderful marriage and family with her and our children.<p>Please pray for my family's preservation and renewal. Thank you for your time.

I'm a wife with a controlling husband, but had never realized it before. I was too busy working and taking care of the family. No EA/SA on my part, but I didn't recognize the signs of depression in H. He's in a fog. I'm thrilled that he's out of the house because I'm more relaxed now. My friend said I had been "walking on eggshells" around him. He wants to make it work, but has made no efforts other than to make that statement. He's refused marriage builders & PAIRS. I don't know what will happpen next, but need this time to figure out why I let him control the house.
You sound like you want it to work. From my vantage point, show some effort. I'm the one readign the books, not H. But I'm waiting until he recognizes the issues before we can deal with them. Hopefully that will be together.

I have shown every bit of effort that I can. So much so that I was beginning to bother her because she thought that my actions were too conscious. I told her that in order to change, I had to do things consciously at first until they became just the way I was. <p>While I am not through trying, I don't know how to do anything different. I have been as good as I can and she said that I seemed to be trying so hard, but she didn't want to lead me on. <p>I have finally come to grips with the fact that I no longer control anything wihtin my relationship with her. Everything that occurs from here on out will be how she deals with the situation that she has demanded. I am not giving up everything, however I am not agonizing over everything either. I no longer have the power to affect the outcome of our relationship in any appreciable way other than to cause her to leave. I am going to be the person that I want to be and hopefully with my new outlook, that will be the person she wants to be with. I am a good man and never meant to hurt or control her. In fact I always thought that she was far too strong to control.<p>I did fight for what I thought was right, and probably did that to a fault. I admit that. I no longer feel that I have to be right. I would rather be happy than right. I love her dearly and want my family to be whole, but no longer feel that I cannot live without her. <p>I can be a good father even in divorce if that is what is in my future. I will do everything that I can to avoid that, but I am not giving up myself in order to please her any further. I am changed and at one time would have been her slave in order to keep her. Thank goodness that she didn't come back when I was in that state.<p>If you can think of ways to show effort without being so overbearing that I cause further problems I would appreciate it, but I am not sure just being and acting better will get through to her. She has stated that she can see the effort and change, but she just isn't sure it matters.

I can't offer any help or suggestions on how to try and regain your spouse. I am in the same type of relationship as you. Nine months ago my husband announced he didn't love me anymore and was leaving. I was shocked, didn't even know there were any "major" problems. I knew our interaction and conversation had dropped but thought it was because of his long work hours and travel.<p>We also have two children. They are only 5 and 9 years old. Neither of them understand and are very hurt. If you are not already doing so, I would recommend getting the children into counseling. Talk with your pastor for a referral to a christian counselor specializing in children. I have been taking the children to counseling for the entire time and it has helped them a great deal. (No my health insurance does not cover much of this but it is worth it.) I have even started doing some home play therapy with the children. I learned this form of therapy from the counselor.<p>I have tried to get my husband to go to counseling. He went a couple of times and told the couselor that he was not there to work on our marriage but simply to get along for the children. (No he has not been involved in the childrens' counseling. He did not express a desire to be involved in their counseling until he talked with an attorney and had me served with divorce papers.) I too have read the books, tried various techniques, etc. Nothing has helped clear a small path toward reconciliation. I have even asked him to try and rebuild our relationship and his love for me if only for the sake of the children. So we both could look at the children and tell them we both did everything possible to keep our family together. His response, "Sorry things just didn't work out with us."<p>The children live with me and I am focusing my life on them. Like you, I take them to church on Sunday and Wednesday. They are involved with the childrens choirs and chimes. We also do daily devotions and have regular faith building discussions focused on daily life issues. Not only has this brought the children closer to our Lord but it has helped to build my faith more. <p>Now comes the "words of wisdom" that I keep holding close to
Jeremiah 17:7-8 "But blessed is the man who trusts in the Lord, whose confidence is in him. He will be like a tree planted by the water that sends outs its roots by the stream. It does not fear when heat comes; its leaves are always green. It has no worries in a drought and never fails to bear fruit."<p>The Lord lets things happen to us sometimes because he wants us closer. We cannot see the big picture and I keep trusing that the Lord will continue to sustain me and hold me close. The only way I am strong enough to get through this is because of Christ. <p>Like you the pain of the situation is killing me. However, like you I gain comfort from prayer, bible study, and worship of our awsome God.

Again, DO NOT LEAVE.<p>Yes there is a time to walk away and let time heal but now is not that time. It has not be long enough. If you leave now, your marriage will probably be over( odds are). Leaving now will do 2 things, 1-- let her do what ever she feels like doing and does not have to try to hid it and can justify it because she is separated, 2--- with you gone, she will not have to deal and think about all the issues that have happen and she will then rather walk away instead of trying to rebuild the marriage. <p>Yes, she has stated that she will leave. Let her, it is her choice, but it is not easy but don't let her control you into leaving the house. It will be very hard for her to do all of the steps she will need to do to become independent with a child and she may decide to stay and try to work on the marriage, but if you leave this makes it very easy and then lets her to start preparing herself for divorce.

You've got to do the things that make you happy. We seem to have some things in common, based on your posts. I am also extremely hurt by how it seems to me that both of our energies were not fully put towards 'fixing' things, or at least exploring all of our options. That I'm not done trying, there are so many things to try yet, and she just doesn't want to.<p>You've got to do what makes you happy. Are you changing the person you are for HER, or because you actually see faults within yourself that you want to change for YOU?
If they are things that you want to make you happy, do them! I sent my WW flowers, because that makes me feel good. She called after she got them and we ended up talking for quite some time, and it provided the perfect opportunity for me to just lay out how I felt!<p>If you're changing things in yourself, show it, don't tell it!

Almostthrough - <p>I too know exactly what you're going through. I could have said a lot of what you said in your post. See my own post of today.<p>Let me just say that W and I are still living together, 18 months after the D filing. That doesn't please her much, and it's more out of necessity (and lack of independent funds) than anything else. And there certainly have been times when she's asked me to leave, or threatened to leave (with the kids). But it hasn't happened yet.<p>Also, there have been scores of times when I have felt like it was time for me to quit too (now is actually one of them). But somehow, after a day or so, my positive side returns, and I keep going. Frankly, I don't know how I've stayed as positive, overall, as I have, for as long as this has continued. It truly is a roller-coaster ride.<p>I wish I could say that this has led to a positive ending for me. I can't see one happening for me right now. Somehow, no matter how I try not to, I keep seeming to pound on reconcilation, and it's probably having negative results. But the clock is ticking on my D, and I don't know how to change the situation before the clock runs out.<p>Just remember, though, it isn't over until it's over. Hang in there.<p>Loserinlove

Hi,<p>My turn. DO NOT LEAVE! In order for her to leave and take the kids, it would be a tremendous undertaking! If she does leave and take the kids, she's in for a rude awakening. The kids will be miserable and you better believe they will make her crazy. By her leaving and taking them, the kids will know it isn't what YOU want. They will not understand why mom is taking them when in their view nothing has changed - dad hasn't become a seething monster, dad is just as loving as ever, so mom is going to be the heavy. Think she can handle it? They'll blame her you know. Not that it's what you want, but it WILL happen.<p>Don't leave. It's your house, your family. Stand up for what's yours. Take care.<p>[ February 26, 2002: Message edited by: weirded out ]</p>