Hello dear friends --<p>It's been a while since I've visited here ... many of you will remember me by a different name but for the sake of anonymity, I've decided a new name was in order.<p>My ex H and I have been divorced for just about a year. We have two children, 11 and 14. Both of us have remarried. I think he's very happy.<p>I know I'm not. I'm constantly tormented by thoughts that divorcing my ex was the worst thing I could have done. I honestly believe it's ruined not just my life but that it has seriously impacted my children's lives as well.<p>I can't seem to find peace, not within myself and certainly not within this new marriage. There is just so much to say...but I don't want to overwhelm (or bore) anyone.<p>You know the old adage "Be careful what you wish for?"...I could be poster child for that notion.<p>I am profoundly sad but I have no idea how to change things. <p>I used to visit here when the ex and I were in the throws of separating. We both ended up having affairs but I honestly believe that I didn't try hard enough to save my first marriage. It was like I thought I could just start anew, fresh, a new beginning. I was wrong. The bond my ex and I share because of our children is incredibly strong. He is their father. He was a good husband. I just didn't realize it at the time.<p>An illness during those dark days I believed seriously colored my decision to go ahead with a divorce. The same illness plunged me into another relationship too quickly...the new marriage just doesn't feel right. I wonder if I'll ever regard it like I did the first marriage.<p>I'm scared and I feel alone. I wish I could just get together with my ex, alone, and talk to him about all of this. I know he wouldn't go for it though.<p>How does a person build a bond with a new H after a decade and a half with the original H?<p>Sorry. I babble.<p>It's good to be back. A big hello to all my old friends...K and the gang.<p>Peace,<p>Ruined Life

well, you do have problems, that's for sure...according to MB principles you should have told your H (the one you are married too) about all these fears and concerns...have you? Wanting to get together with your previous H alone to have relationship talks is a huge disservice to your H, and tantamount to starting an affair (if you plotted to divorce your spouses and get together again). If you do not want to be married, than tell your H and divorce him before you go looking elsewhere for love....or tell him your very understandable feelings, and work through them with him.<p>[ April 03, 2002: Message edited by: sad_n_lonely ]</p>

I am sorry that things are so not happy for you. I don't want to lecture, so please don't look at it as a sermon. I, too, have been divorced for nearly a year. I am seriously seeing someone, but there is no way I would marry him at this point. What were you thinking to marry again so soon after the divorce? Did you not think that the kids would have a hard time? <p>Again, I have two teenage children as well. In the early days of the divorce, they were struggling, but nothing like they are now. They have had to adjust to their father not being around...they had to move...the last thing they needed was to have both their parents married to someone else. <p>The transitioning phase you are going through is normal and natural. It takes a long time to get over a divorce; no matter who instigated it or filed. Unfortunatley, you now have to deal with two adolescents and the stress of a new marriage. Remember, your new husband can't make you happy if you aren't. You have to find it within yourself. I don't think your new marriage is doomed...I think that perhaps you need to talk to him about how alienated you feel...overwhelmed by what has transpired. Your old marriage is gone. The door has been closed and now you have to try and look ahead. I would suggest that you talk to candidly talk to someone...a counselor, your pastor, etc, to help you find your way right now. <p>Don't beat yourself up. Hind sight is always 20/20...try to objectively think about things. Divorce, remarriage...all that in less than a year. <p>Good luck to you...

Hello there...<p>There are certainly things we do in life, or that happen to us, that feel as if they have irreparably ruined our lives. In order to go forward in a healthy way, we need to accept these things, the good and the bad, and then put them behind us, learn to look forward, not back.<p>I think you will have a hard time finding peace within the new marriage, or anywhere else, until you find it in yourself. Maybe some counseling would help you to do that???<p> <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>How does a person build a bond with a new H after a decade and a half with the original H?<p>Sorry. I babble.<hr></blockquote><p>I don't think that's babbling at all. I think it is the right question to be asking...how do I go forward, how do we learn to be a good couple, how do we build those bonds? As you find those answers, your pain over the past will likely ease. So, how are you working on building bonds? Are you using MB principles?. <p>Good luck--<p>Kathi

Ruined,<p>I agree that you should always be careful what you ask for.<p>As for talking to your xh, you had that opportunity and threw it away. You can't disrupt his new life because you are unhappy. You should let sleeping dogs lie.<p>As for building bonds with your new h...I was married for 18 years to my first h and remarried exactly thirty three days after the divorce was final. (And no, I wouldn't do that again---I would be more patient and get to know him better--but it's been like Mr.Toad's Wild Ride!) While my new h and I have both made mistakes, we built our marriage and life just like everyone else--one day at a time. You already have a bond--many, in fact--with your new h. It's up to you to let go of the past and learn to be happy with your new life.

Dear "Ruined",<p>I can definitely relate to your post. My divorce also has been final one year. I was the WS <long term internet affair> who didn't put forth enough effort to fix the marriage. The intense withdrawal symptoms for the OM and no positive changes in my ex left me in a torn limbo-like state. By the time the 'fog' lifted, my ex said it was 'too late'. He discovered that there were other women out there who could be attracted to him and he announced he 'would never trust me again." It was impossible to carry out plan A after he moved out and was hell bent on divorce. He'd call me every day asking me if I filed yet. I believe at this time, he was on in a fog of his own.<p>Today, I am still with the "OM", recently engaged. He's been wonderfully understanding, supportive and has built a nice bond with my pre-teen son....however, I still ache inside for my lost husband and marriage. We spent nearly 20 yrs together. Having spent this length of time with someone, they become almost ingrained in you. First love is a deep love....something I didn't realize until it was too late.
There has been resentment towards my BF for the role he played in ending my marriage...persistently pursuing a confused married woman...there is anger towards my ex for not 'fighting' for our marriage, and mostly there is sadness and disgust at myself for the hurt I've caused my spouse...driven in part by selfishness and ego.<p>How do I deal with this? Alot of soulsearching &
talking within myself and to my fiancee. The anger and sadness and regret needs to come out, or it will eat me alive. My fianee feels that I won't allow myself to be happy because of the guilt I carry. My obsessing about the past and frequent musings about my ex and his new love are my 'penance' so to speak for my 'sins.' I'm slowly realizing that the events of the past few years were a result of a complex set of issues....nothing black and white and not necessarlily the blame of one person. <p>I also have fantacized about privatley talking to my ex to see if he too harbors regret, but, why stir up things now? He apparently is happy with new life and my engaging in that behavior would prove I haven't learned a thing from my past mistakes.<p>Today, I'm trying to focus on the PRESENT and to be grateful for the good things in my life. I don't want to be part of the overwhelmingly poor stats on second marriages stemming from affairs failing. I agree with the other poster that your life isn't necessarily 'ruined'....and that applying MB principles to your current marriage will help greatly in erasing the pain of the past.
This...and time....
Sorry for the length. Hope some of this helps. [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]

Sad_n_lonely:<p>Your advice was, of course, right on target. Being honest with myself and those around me is one of the problems I face daily. I did talk to my H today, with a therapist we're already seeing and told him all about my doubts. Right now, he is devastated. But at least everything is out on the table. <p>You are also correct about meeting with my X, I think I'm looking for an easy way out. I've always avoided pain to the enth degree, but I know that with life comes pain...and some sunshine too.<p>Thanks again,<p>Peace,<p>Ruined Life

Dear Happy Mac:<p>[QUOTE][QB]What were you thinking to marry again so soon after the divorce? Did you not think that the kids would have a hard time? [QUOTE][QB] <p>That's just it....I guess I just wasn't thinking--didn't want to think. I really thought things would just work out. I know that sounds outrageous, but I really just wanted to start over and I wanted to jump over the painful part. I assumed we all would, I guess. Stupid, stupid, stupid.<p>[QUOTE][QB]The transitioning phase you are going through is normal and natural[QUOTE][QB]<p>Thank you so much for that. I really needed to hear that this transitionary phase is normal and nature. I know that intellectually but I guess my heart's not quite following (does it ever?) But yes, that does help put things into perspective.<p>As mentioned in my reply to sad_n_lonely we are seeing a counselor./therapist.<p>Peace,<p>Ruined Life

Dear Kam6813 -- Aw yes, move ahead and go on...isn't that so much harder than it sounds? It sounds noble and brave...but is just so incredibly painful to do sometimes. The 20/20 hindsight of the past suggests to me that I can go back and fix that which did not work out in the first place. I'm older, wiser now. Tweak a few things here and there and poof, my first marriage is alive and well again, my children happy and me content. Somewhere in there was the lug who like a pair of old slippers are so comfy.<p>You're right, Kam...I do have to accept the mistakes I've made. And this challenge may be my most significant yet.<p>Peace,<p>Ruined Life

Such encouraging words of wisdom! Thank you didallas. It sure felt good to read that the world keeps spinning and bonds keep gelling. I'd felt like anything worth having I tossed away.<p>We do forge new bonds. And yes, when I think on it with a clearer head, we already share several.<p>Peace,<p>Ruined Life

Dear Who's Hurting Now:<p>I'm sending you hugs and hugs and hugs for a post I could have written myself. You seem to have learned some things from the past...I hope I will too. No, I know I have and I will continue to.<p>"The intense withdrawal symptoms for the OM and no positive changes in my ex left me in a torn limbo-like state. "<p>Boy, can I relate to that--all of it.<p>
"I still ache inside for my lost husband and marriage. We spent nearly 20 yrs together. Having spent this length of time with someone, they become almost ingrained in you. First love is a deep love....something I didn't realize until it was too late."<p>Ditto, ditto, ditto.<p>I hope the resentment towards your BF is a topic of conversation between the two of you. That too needs to be addressed and dealth with. But, man can I relate.<p>
"mostly there is sadness and disgust at myself for the hurt I've caused my spouse...driven in part by selfishness and ego."<p>Yes, in moments of "madness" we have to reconcile ourselves as the sane, logical wife/mother to the impulsive, slut who could actually destroy a family over an Internet love affair. At least you're not married, sweetie.<p>A lot of pain, eh? For a stupid fantasy life that actually seemed real for too long a time. I sure hope someone on the brink of an affair reads this and feels the bitterness. It's real!<p>Thanks, Now Who's Hurting<p>Peace,<p>Ruined Life

Dear Ruined,<p>This is a very difficult subject to discuss. There are many facets here, including regret, infidelity, and second or later marriages. <p>I myself have dealt with all of these issues also, although I have gone further down the road than you. It's been three years for me.<p>It sounds like you're doing all the right things to heal yourself. That's what needs to be done first. If your marriage survives and succeeds, that will be a bonus.<p>Your post gave me a reason to post for my first time, because I understand the pain of realizing you moved too quickly. I am now happy in my new marriage. It was touch and go for a short while (about a year) as I fought my own demons. <p>I hope you can come back and tell us you have healed your marriage.

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>The 20/20 hindsight of the past suggests to me that I can go back and fix that which did not work out in the first place. I'm older, wiser now. Tweak a few things here and there and poof, my first marriage is alive and well again, my children happy and me content. <hr></blockquote><p>That's really what regret is all about, I think. Feeling that with what you NOW know, you could go back and "fix" things...if only. Different sitaution, but I've been quite mired in that spot. Took me a long time to accept that I did the best I could at the time, with what I had to work with at the time, and forgive myself for not being wiser then. Somehow, once I accepted that it became easier to let go, and to quit wishing for a do-over. <p>Anyway, I know that letting go of the past and looking to the future is much easier said than done. Sounds like you have made a start, and I hope things continue to progress... <p>Kathi<p>[ April 04, 2002: Message edited by: kam6318 ]</p>

To Ruined Life and Who's Hurting Now:<p>Have a couple questions for you two, if it's okay.<p>1. If your ex's and you didn't have children together, would you still be feeling the remorse, guilt, etc. you're feeling now?<p>2. The distain or resentment you feel/felt for the OW/OM that you are now with or have married, regarding their roll in the A, do those feelings ever go away or are you simply harboring them?<p>3. How long have you two been D and how long before you felt these feelings of regret regarding the A. Did you feel these feelings before the D or before you married the OP?<p>Thanks for your help ....<p>Lv,
Jo<p>[ April 05, 2002: Message edited by: Resilient ]</p>

Thank you so much for sharing your heart and pain. <p>I am glad your in therapy to work through the issues. We all have issues 1st marriages and 2nd marriages.<p>I would encourage you to post this on www.gloryb.com so they can have all the facts for what they are in for. I am not sending you away. I want you here too!!! You have a bumpy road ahead but you will get through this. <p>Keep posting...

Please no offense, but this is a fascinating topic for me because it touches upon things that can be applied to other things in life, too, and,
well, it is true drama.<p>I am an incredibly nostalgic person--I spend a lot of time looking back upon my past. I am a lucky man in that my life is full of fantastic memories, friends, and relationships. My parents went through many hard times and many infidelities, but they are still together and gosh, at mid sixties, like a teenage couple in love!<p>But some of the choices I have made in life, as opposed to choices I almost made, were the result of contemplation of just these sorts of things.<p>Have you ever heard a pharase, "you can never go home"? It holds tons of merit. Even if you were to get together with the x and you guys realized you are truly in love, and you divorced your new H, etc etc, you would be miserable. Nothing would seem right. The old days are gone. All of our old days are gone. I would love nothing more than to go back to college days and have it be just like it was then. I have done this--gone back--seen old friends, and it is good! But not like the crazy old days. <p>I had a highschool sweetheart who was my first love. We lived in a beautiful little Illinois town about a hundred miles from chicago. I ended up moving to Texas to go to college and after trying an LDR for awhile, I eventually broke up with her. She wss the most easygoing, well tempered, live and let live, beautiful girl I had ever known, but hey--ya gotta do what ya gotta do.<p>Well she never looked back. I became a black spot to her. I would come home and visit friends often, and try to see her, but she would always refuse me. For years and years I went through crappy relationships and heartache thinking of my little girl I left behind. I suffered through years. After I graduated, I got a job in Houston, and out of the blue I got a letter from her. It might have been the original scriptures, as far as I was concerned. Houston is a cold, hard hearted city. And here was a note from an angel. It was friendly, but curt. My response letters were never answered. Fianlly I moved to Seattle and immersed myself in a life of friends,
women, and a little financial success. <p>The one day, from out of the blue, I got a message on my answering machine. It was my long lost love, and she left a message professing that
I was her one and only love and will always be, etc etc. I had finally moved on, and here she was. Well, she flew out and we got together for a few days. Then she came back and stayed for a week over thanksgiving. But something was amiss. I was working at a well known corporation and making some good money. she was still kicking about the hometown working the same job she was
when I had left almost twenty years before! Her speech seemed incredibly small town, with lots of
"ain't got no's" and "it don't matter's". I was almost embarassed to have her talk to my highly educated friends. She was still beautiful, but
looked a little worn out, while I was all about working out and skiing on weekends. She wasn;t familiar with any of te underground bands or arty movies we all loved and took for granted. <p>In short, she seemed different now. Except it was I who had changed. She remained the same. Exactly the same.<p>You really never can go home. It's like, finally seling an old car you drove for ten years and then, several years later, buying it back again.<p>My sister had said that our old family home was up for sale in illinois and she was thinking about buying it; a stately old home with upper balconies, etc. Well the owner that had bought it from us ripped all the old porches off and
put a DECK on the back! He tore out the old lead glassed windows and put in modern double panes.
The house was a mockery of what it once was, and I could never stand to see it like that.<p>So I guess the point is, look back with fondness, and maybe even with sadness. But you can never go back. You can never go home. You belong where you are now, or where you will be in the future.

To Resilient,<p>In response to your questions....
1) If we didn't have children together, would I still be feeling the same remorse guilt, etc.<?><p>I'd have to say that having had a child with the ex makes the letting go process much more difficult. I not only ended a marriage, but a FAMILY as well was changed irrevocably. This fact increases the guilt factor ten fold. Also, if we didn't share any children, I'd have no business communicating or seeing the ex ever again. Ending the relaionship cold turkey would have been a less painful route in my opinion. Seeing the ex <with his new love> continually dredges up old feelings and aggravates wounds trying to heal.<p>2. The resentment I feel towards the OM re his role in the affair...does it ever go away?<p>I really hope so. It's a topic we discuss often. I think what I need from him, is to fully understand how his actions affected my life, the good, the bad, and the ugly. He needs to understand that many lives were changed because of our affair. He needs to show some semblance of remorse for what transpired and not just to say, but to truly believe that we both made painful mistakes....mistakes that will never ever be made again in OUR marriage. You can't go back, the past is the past, but, just knowing he acknowledges his wrong doings, and he's learned from his mistakes will help ME in letting go of the resentment. We're working on it.<p>3. How long were you D and when did you start having these feelings of regret?<p>My D was final a year ago yesterday after a year of separation. My feelings of regret began to surface when my ex proposed the idea of separating so that "I might get a real taste of living with the OM," and hopefully the relationship would wither. He told me if we still loved eachother and were meant to be together, we'd see it 'in our eyes". Well, silly me...the tables turned. Months later I learned his proposition to separate was fueled by him meeting and falling in love with another woman he met on a business trip. At this point, I was emerging from my 'fog', and he was clearly in the midst of a dense one of his own. I begged him to reconcile...get counseling...anything. When I confronted him with the knowledge of his OW, he demanded a divorce. Neither of us ever had an opportunity to Plan A it. There was too much hurt and anger. His goal at this pint was to move one....without me.<p>I think this is what bothers me the most. Yes, I hurt him deeply, but I still loved that man and do to this day. He apparently didn't love me enough to fight for the marriage. Reading these boards I see countless women who've been hurt to their very core time and time again, yet who STILL want their husbands back and would do anything to re-establish that love. I wonder if its a male-female thing. I see far few men willing to forgive and move forward working on their marriages.
Any thoughts?

Who's hurting now; I agree with you, I think there is a difference between men and women and how they react to an affair. I too years ago was a WS. When my ex found out about my affair he immediately started an affair of his own and filed for divorce. He never gave giving the marriage a try a thought. Maybe deep down he wanted out as bad as I did? I'm in a different place though compared to some that are married to the other man. My second marriage is the best thing that happened to me and even though I'm sure my two kids would prefer their dad lived in our home, my husband (their step-dad) is a better role model then their dad is. Our first year of marriage though was REALLY tough. It wasn't because either one of us had doubts though, it was the fact that my ex's OW couldn't get me out of her system. Between the two of them, the harassing, lies and pure evil put a tremendous strain on us. We hung tight though and now 6 years later the ex has finally decided that he has enough in his own life to be trying to destroy mine.

Hi Ruined:<p>You've gotten some excellent advice (especially from kathi). I would suggest that you work on THIS marriage, and continue to move forward by learning to practice the MB skills. You're in counseling with your husband, and that's terrific. You've been honest with him, and that's also good. You need to continue with the honesty---he should know that part of the issue is that you haven't had time to grieve over the old marriage. And my suggestion to you is to not wallow in that grief, but come up with a plan of action that will build your marriage up---by spending time together (you and husband), as well as in a complete family. If you spend the time together, and follow the other rules (Care, Protection, Honesty), you're very likely to find that romantic love that you're looking for.<p>And you will realize that you did the best you could in the past---and you'll be ready to let it go.<p> [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]

BonnieSept and WhosHurtingNow - re: the male/female thingy.<p>Here's one male who worked his a$$ off to try to save his family.<p>Just raising my hand,