Yesterday, my stbxw was supposed to show up to help do yard work at the house we own jointly so that it will be more presentable to potential buyers. <p>My friends told me that she would not show up, because that has been her modus operandi in the past, but for some deluded reason, I believed that she would, in fact, show. Can anyone guess where this is going?<p>I have carried the ball through most of the marriage and for the entire divorce process. I am the one who was laid off and yet I am the one who had to manage to scrape together the legal fees for the TWO of us. I am tired. I am depressed. I am broke, and I have finally had enough.<p>I do love this woman with all of my heart, however, I am tired of being taken for granted, kicked around, and just generally treated badly.<p>Emotional Needs? GIVE ME A BREAK! Only a child runs off in a huff when his/her 'emotional needs' are not being met, or when some shinier toy or prettier friend comes along. <p>ENOUGH! MY emotional needs have not been met in 15 YEARS and I stuck around and cared for my (birth) family and cared for my wife and parts of HER family as well, and I did not go running off to get my emotional needs met by some pretty blonde! This is for one reason; I AM AN ADULT!<p>This stuff about EN's is similar to a situation in which two 4 year olds are playing and one can keep the other around only so long as he has nice toys and will let the other make the rules of the game. One day, another kid's toys are going to be nicer and one of our 4 year olds is going to be pretty lonely.<p>I am not talking about a situation where one partner in a marriage is actually neglected by the other partner over a long period of time; I am talking about the situations which are so common on this BB, and that is where one partner just gets bored, the excitement and newness of the relationship has worn off and the real world has made itself known. How many stories here involve a WS saying words like, "I love you but I am not in-love with you any longer". I heard those words, and I expect that many others of you have, too, both men and women. Folks, those are the words of an adolescent, at BEST.<p>In 2001, my father died, my wife left me, and I lost my job. ALL RIGHT ALREADY! I GIVE. <p>How many others here can post similar, and worse, stories? I suspect that it is a fair number.<p>I woke up this morning determined to change my life and I am going to do it.<p>I will keep you all posted, thank you for letting me rant.<p>My best to you all,
vb_guy<p>[ May 05, 2002: Message edited by: vb_guy ]<p>[ May 05, 2002: Message edited by: vb_guy ]<p>[ May 05, 2002: Message edited by: vb_guy ]</p>

Dear vb guy;
Both me and my future wife where in the same boat. Her ex neglected her and never work. She carried the whole ball of wax herself too. When ever he wanted a new toy he would go out and get it and make her pay for it.That even includes any presents he bought for her(or actually for himself).She worked,looked after three kids,a house,bills and was getting deeper and deeper in debt. His response was not his problem.
As for myself I was in a marriage where I was neglected and had a wife who was not loyal to the arriage(No affairs just would not stand up for it when it mattered most). I understand you when you say enough is enough. We both have had it with her mother and the balloon is about to go up on this. Good luck to us all.
231<p>[ May 05, 2002: Message edited by: 231 ]</p>

Probably gonna get banned for this.......but........<p>((((((((((((((BEERMAN))))))))))))))))))<p>I have long thought about the very things you write in your post. I, too, see Plan A as totally enabling the WS to go ahead and have their affair, without having to deal with an irate spouse in their ear. Using Plan A means they never, ever have to face the consequences of their actions. Guilt, oh yeah maybe, but not for long!!! They go with the OP, then they come home once in a while, and they get treated well there too. Meeting their needs.......well meeting sdome of them while the OP is meeting others......well isn't that what keeps affairs going???<p>WHO is going to stop what they are doing in this situation? They are being rewarded for poor behaviour, ethics, morals etc.........little wifey is not going off the deep end about the OW, hubby is taking this like a man.......well it must be OKAY to do it.<p>Oh yes, I will get a lot of flack for this post, but VB guy is right........someone gets bored in a marriage, and our society is set up to make it easy for them to quit. Plan A makes it even easier. My H has not even acknowledged my changes, behaviours, thoughtfulness etc, since DAY 10 of our separation. He is just sooooooooo happy I am not in his face about it.<p>Well, when you get this angry, that is time for Plan B. I am already IN Plan B, but I find that just as enabling, if not more so than Plan A. My natural inclination was to LB that man to hell and back.........and I still believe in MY case, it would have gotten more results. THEN, when he came home, time for Plan A and all that.....<p>I am sorry if this post offends staunch MB supporters, but I just had to agree with the beerman, and say that the WS's are just a bunch of spoiled kids who threw their pacifiers out of the cot because they didn't get their own way. Disrespectful judgement there.........you BET!!!<p>IT IS JUST TOO EASY FOR THEM!!!!!!!!!<p>(Angry......yes, isn't it obvious?)

Nina too
Just remember this: yes you are right about having it too easy to get out when the glitter is gone but would you have it harder for them to get out if there is abuse invovled or that the person married the other just to have three squares a day and a roof over their heads? Would you make it hard to get out and use religion and guilt to keep them there if the person was neglected like vb guy or others. Yes some marriages faulter but can and should be saved while others where there is physical or mental abuse should not. And others should not be forced to stay together agianst their will(actual on going personal expericnce here)
231

I was talking about how easy it was for WS'S who want their little play toys because they are bored with the marriage, not abused BS's. I was talking about being in Plan A, trying to make it work when they are out there having a high old time with OP, doing EXACTLY what they want, and never having to worry about their spouse, because the spouse dare not tread on toes. While WE, the BS's sit at home and plan the next Plan A move. There is something inherently sick in this thinking, I now believe.<p>People in the old days were part of a BIG family. When someone went off the rails, family members would take them aside and steer them to a better course. Yet today, my MIL won't tell her precious son what an AH he is, even though she thinks so. WHY? She doesn't want to lose him, too. She doesn't want to interfere in 'his' life. Never mind that he has destroyed the lives of his kids and I. Oh no, as long as HE is happy, that is ok. BLEH........people are too irresponsible today.<p>For the record, I am not ever going to agree, and neither are the Harleys, that an abused spouse should stay. And funny, I actually think that having an affair thrown in your face, and their high and mighty attitude about THEIR LIFE and THEIR NEEDS is just a load of c***, but more so, putting UP with it is letting someone abuse you, no? I say get out.......abuse is abuse.

VB,<p>I'm glad you are making a change in your life. It's time for you to move on. Last year was a tough year for you and now it's time for you to use those heartaches to make you a better person some how. <p>VB I consider you such a good friend, this is why I am going to tell you straight up why you should get out of this depression and change your life...<p>Often life throws us a lemon and we take it so bad that things domino from there...<p>You've had a few lemons thrown your way and now you have become obsessed with these negative feelings.<p>I am concerned about saying the things I am going to say but through months of this depression I see you becoming more and more obsessed with the "why me". If you stay in this depression and continue with this obsession of "why me?", only MORE bad things will come VB. <p>I'm going to lay it out on the table...<p>A depressed person can not work functionally to get a job. <p>A depressed person can not work functionally to make relationships with friends or romances work.<p>A depressed person will eventually lose his friends and not gain new friends.<p>A depressed non working person will eventually not have a place to live because there is no money. <p>You need to try to break this cycle of bad things happening to you VB. There are certain bad things that happen that are totally out of our control, you had that with your father's death, but with other things, like getting a job, building new relationships, you do have some control.<p>VB, I see a man that is passionate, caring and good, a man that has so much to give to people, I see a extraordinary man that is extremely intellegent with a future in computers that most people can only wish they had half your brain. I see a strong man that can fight this and win. That can in 10 years from now have the family and the dreams he wants. <p>There is only one thing standing in the way of your dream. That is YOU. You are the only one standing in the way. So do what you said this morning and make a change.<p>You can be happy again VB, but you have to make it happen, no one else can do it for you.<p>Love,<p>ANNA<p>Nina,<p>Well girl, I think you are going through so much in your life, you just had surgery and you have a "husband from hell" to deal with. Plan A is about you, be happy with all the positive changes you had in your life. I think some day you will look back at MB and plan A and you will be happy with all the things you learned from MB. You will be able to now effectively use these in your new relationships and even with your children.<p>Unfortunately, not every marriage can be saved no matter how much a person changes or how great a person is to begin with. The thing is that you can walk away from your marriage knowing that you gave it all you had, there will be no regrets on your part. If you wouldn't have plan A'd him, I think you would have always wondered "What if?" You can hold your head high girl.<p>Take care guys,<p>ANNA

Hey Guys. Nina, your response spoke to me. I don't really regret my plan A ( such as it was), but I thought of the following passage from another website.<p>To me, this illustrates the potential hazards for the plan A'r. To me, the gender assignments below are interchangeable.<p> <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Sometimes there is an over-functioning spouse and an under-functioning spouse. One partner takes on a lot of responsibility--and then resents it. The more a person puts energy into something and tries to work on it, the more committed to the relationship that person is. The other partner, who is only semi-involved in the relationship, is freer to get involved in an affair; they're not as connected to the marriage.
This is interesting because the popular notion is that the person who has the affair wasn't getting enough at home. The reality is that they weren't giving enough at home.
How do you handle that?
In rebuilding that relationship, more equity has to be created. The issue isn't what can the betrayed spouse do to make the partner happy--it's what can the unfaithful spouse do to make their partner happy. In research and in practice, my colleague Tom Wright, Ph.D., and I have observed that when you compare who does more--who is more understanding, who is more romantic, who enjoys sex more--the affair is almost always more equitable than the marriage. Usually, the person was giving more--more time, more attention, more compliments--in the affair than in the marriage. If they can invest in the marriage what they were doing in the affair, they'll feel more.
There is some research showing that people are more satisfied in equitable relationships. When relationships are not equitable, even the over-benefited partners are not as satisfied as those in equitable relationships.
You seem to be constantly reversing the conventional wisdom about affairs.
I've noticed that when younger women get involved in affairs early in the marriage and then leave, often they have not been invested in the marriage. They're working hard, climbing a ladder; the husband is the one making dinner while she's working late. He is the devastated one, because he is really committed and has given a lot. But he is peripheral in her life.
I've seen several couples who had a plan they agreed on, to build a house, or for one partner to go back to school. The person who had the responsibility for carrying out the plan was totally engrossed in it, while the other person felt so neglected that they then had an affair. The betrayed person felt terribly betrayed, because he or she thought he was working for their future. But he didn't necessarily listen to distress signs.<hr></blockquote><p>FWIW<p>Anna, to me, makes great sense. VB, what new dreams do you have? What do you need to do to get there?<p>Dan

Nina Too;
Sorry girl, I didn't mean to upset you. I've been alittle bit sensitive about this issue of late. My future wife's mother is really working overtime to try to get him back into the family eventhough he was an [censored] to her.She left him because he was controlling,emotional outbursts and the fact he did drugs and stole money not only from her purse but from the kids as well.
Being a born again christain, her mother is very literal about the sins of separtation and divorce. Where I try to tell the better half that she is not a sinner and that God knows the difference between a sin and a mistake.As probally you already read somewhere else here the mother opened a very personal comunicate between myself and the GF. I'm very touchy to the fact that some noses are in where they don't belong and the GF is being hammered by her mother with the bible as the weopon. I don't like people forcing others to do what they think is right and use god and guilt as a tool to a means. So again I didn't mean to offend you.
231

Dear Anna:<p>I am far from being insulted or having my feelings hurt by your post. It has further inspired me to 'get out there' and change my life.<p>I have a few things to take care of personally before I will be ready for a new woman in my life, getting a job chief among them. So I am going to use the Summer to take stock of myself and change those things that can be changed. I will also be sending out resumes in far greater numbers and in the meantime will get any work to help make ends meet. Who know what will happen?<p>STBXW, you moved on a long time ago, I should have followed your lead. Good luck, happy life to you. Goodbye.<p>vb_guy<p>[ May 05, 2002: Message edited by: vb_guy ]</p>

Hey vb_guy,<p>When I read your "I'm dying inside" post, I figured two things:
1. You'd commit suicide
2. You'd rise to the occasion<p>I'm grinning ear-to-ear that you've chosen number 2. (I was there, like many others, so I know)<p>Your road ahead will be difficult. As you make each difficult step, the next one will be easier. You will gain momentum and learn things that just can't be taught in any other way. You will have some setbacks along the way, but will make progress.<p>Looking back, I've gained some extremely valuable insight that I know will serve me well in the future. My WSXW on the other hand will be in a world of hurt when her fantasyland comes crashing down as she has learned nothing.<p>I must admit that I haven't read many of your posts, but I appreciate your unique way of looking at things.<p>Welcome to your new life,<p>Kevin

Hi, Kevin:<p>Commit suicide?........well to be honest, it did cross my mind. I have decided, however that I am going to live a full, rich and active life.<p>I have three real passions at this point in my life; computer programming and OO software design; woodworking/carpentry; and model trains, strictly n-scale. So, while I have no woman in my life, I am going to concentrate on those three things, especially the software, because that is my bread and butter (Dr. Atkins would not like the bread).<p>I have decided that I am going to become the best software designer/architect that I can become and that will lead me to place I have never thought of in my life.<p>I hope to stay on the far Eastern end of Long Island, because I love the water and I am a real yankee at heart.....a 'down eastah', you might say.<p>Here's to all of my MB friends, all of my IM friends, and all of my local friends who have been by my side through all of this.<p>
Thank you,
vb

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr> I hope to stay on the far Eastern end of Long Island, because I love the water and I am a real yankee at heart.....a 'down eastah', you might say. <hr></blockquote><p>that saying comes from Maine, and does not come from Longah Island! <p> [img]images/icons/tongue.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/tongue.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/tongue.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/tongue.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/tongue.gif" border="0[/img]

VB-Guy,<p>I am so happy for you, as you seem motivated to make things better for yourself.......Good luck in your Journey

WhenIfindthetime:
you've never been to my part of Long Island...Sag Harbor was once the largest whaling port in the entire United States, and we grow better potatoes than Maine does....... [img]images/icons/cool.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/cool.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/cool.gif" border="0[/img]

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr> you've never been to my part of Long Island <hr></blockquote><p>Are you sure I haven't? I went to college on long island. . . . I am a ship pilot of various harbors around LI. . . i have sailed in regattas on LI. . . i have friends that had boats in LI harbor . . . so are you sure I haven't?<p>
wiftty