Hi everyone. A friend of mine sent me this link, and I'm so glad they did.

I am in the process of being divorced by my wife of 11 years. It is an incredibly painful process for me - dealing with feelings of rejection and low self esteem. This, however, has been made infinitely worse by issues concerning our 2 daughters, ages 9 and 5.

When my wife left this time (she's left me 7 times over the course of our 11 years), she decided to play extremely dirty. As a result, she filed a Restraining Order on me, under a variety of fabricated pretenses. The worst part of the RO was that she locked down my visitation with my daughters extremely tight. I only get to see them 1 day a week.

This is tearing my daughters up. I have always been by far the most nurturing parent, between my wife and I, and have been a Very active father.

To make matters worse, until 2 weeks ago she was allowing them to call me every evening, but she has now suspended their phone priveledges due to an incident which occured; so our communication (my daughters and I) is strictly limited to the 1 day per week. The incident which perpetuated this behavior on her part was when my oldest told me on the phone that she and her sister were being physically abused by the son of the babysitter that my wife was leaving them with. He is 11, and punched my 5 year old hard enough in the stomach to cause her to vomit.

Being extremely distressed about the safety of my children, and unable to visit the premises myself because of the RO (the babysitter lives next door to my wife), I felt that I had no option but to request law enforcement to do an investigation as to the safety of my children in this environment. As a result of that investigation, the care provider will no longer watch my daughters, which made my wife extremely angry. Thus she won't let them talk to me on the phone anymore.

I am at a loss here. I don't know how to handle this situation at all. I have a hearing scheduled for next Monday to fight the RO, and the only reason I'm bothering is for more parenting time with my children. It's the emotional side of me that is taking the worst beating. I feel utterly depressed, and at times even somewhat suicidal (though I would never leave my girls).

I am wondering right now, will there ever be an end to all of this? Has anyone out there gone through anything similar? Why does my soon to be X hate me so much? I can honestly say to everyone here that I've done nothing but love the woman with all of my heart for 11 years. Why is she being so mean - for lack of a better word? Does this fit into some kind of pattern?

Any help from ANYONE would be appreciated at this point.

Thanks

Hw, document everything, get copies of the report. Get a good attorney, see a counselor and visit them often, this will be in your favor, showing how you are improving yourself and that you should be the primary care taker of your children. I am in a similiar situation, only 22 yrs. Did you document the previous 7 abandoments by her or can you?

You will be in my prayers

It's difficult to draw any firm conclusions without knowing more about you and your wife, but...yeah, your wife's behavior sure seems to fit a fairly standard pattern.

When my wife left me, she claimed only that we were incompatible and she had nothing bad to say about me personally. As the weeks and months (and years) passed, her story changed, and by now I have had a variety of strange (and false) allegations made against me. The way I see it, she needs to hate me, because if she didn't she would have to hate herself for her desertion and betrayal. In order to justify her actions to herself she has to delude herself into believing that I am some kind of monster. And in order to maintain her self-delusion, she has to reinforce it by acting as if I were a monster.

I can't say how well my experience correlates with yours. My wife was a very sweet and sensitive and giving woman (though also more troubled than I ever understood), and her actions in leaving me were highly uncharacteristic of her. The level of dissonance she experienced was thus extremely high. If your wife was not a very nurturing person, and if she was fairly cavalier about her previous desertions, then I'm not sure whether the same explanation entirely applies.

But trust me, what's happening to you is not unusual. Sad to say.

For me, my self-respect and overall emotional health were considerably bolstered by an understanding of what had happened - the underlying causes. I had blamed myself for our marital problems over the years, despite enormous efforts to do right by my wife, and I obtained great relief as I came to realize that my wife's unhappiness actually had very little to do with me. If you were as loving to your wife as you imply, chances are that her real problem lies in FOO ("Family of Origin") issues that she has refused to resolve. If you married in your early- to mid-twenties, then the timing is about right for those issues to boil over (according to common patterns)...

Unfortunately there's probably not a whole lot you can do, other than fighting for your daughters. Your wife may no longer live in a world in which you - the actual person you are - even exists. Everything about you, including your entire history together, may have been displaced by what your wife (thinks she) needs to believe, and negotiation and reasoning may be utterly impossible. That doesn't mean you shouldn't try, because I may be wrong, and even if I am right you can never know when she might start to come to her senses, but I sure wouldn't count on that if I were you.

Bottom line, if I have hit anywhere close to the mark, is that you can't do anything for your wife right now. Your only option is "tough love". Conduct yourself with honesty and integrity and decency, so that you and your daughters - and maybe some day your wife - will be able to see you as a man worthy of respect, a man that can be counted on to do the right thing. Your wife will have to take care of herself (or be placed in God's hands), because you are the last person on earth who can help her.

I'm sorry to say that you may be in for a long battle. So make sure you take care of yourself as best you can. If you're not seeing a therapist or counselor of some sort, you would be well advised to do so. You're going to need all the wisdom and support you can get, and you might consider anti-depressants as well.

Because you are now officially in one of the very worst sorts of hells there is. It is possible to survive in this hell, and it is even possible to be happy. Eventually.

But it isn't going to be easy.

WOW Gnome ...

Everything you said describes her so perfectly!

"In order to justify her actions to herself she has to delude herself into believing that I am some kind of monster."

This was the exact basis of the restraining order ... she described me as the sort of person that those who know me well find almost laughable.

"If you were as loving to your wife as you imply, chances are that her real problem lies in FOO ("Family of Origin") issues that she has refused to resolve. If you married in your early- to mid-twenties, then the timing is about right for those issues to boil over (according to common patterns)..."

As a matter of fact, she DOES have some severe unresolved issues with an incredibly disfunctional family life. Her father is a clinical manic depressive (bi-polar) and has been on lithium for most of his adult life. Her mother had several affairs on him over the course of their marriage - though they are still together. In fact, my wife utterly HATES her own mother for this. We also married in our very early 20's.

"Your wife may no longer live in a world in which you - the actual person you are - even exists. Everything about you, including your entire history together, may have been displaced by what your wife (thinks she) needs to believe, and negotiation and reasoning may be utterly impossible."

This is indeed true. By affecting the restraining order she has severed all ties between us as effectively as if one of us were dead. She seems (from the children's reports) to remember none of the joys or common bonds we shared (which were many). It's as if we were utter strangers.

"Your only option is "tough love". Conduct yourself with honesty and integrity and decency, so that you and your daughters - and maybe some day your wife - will be able to see you as a man worthy of respect, a man that can be counted on to do the right thing."

This is too true, and fortunately something I've been able to intuitively grasp - though it doesn't come easily for me. Throughout our marriage I've always given in to her wishes, in an attempt to placate the woman I love. I have begun to change this patter already though.

Recent example; I mentioned in my 1st post that I only see my daughters one day per week. They look forward to this day more than anything. This week, my wife took a vacation week from her work. She sent my 2 girls out of state to stay the week with her parents. She is not staying with them.

My oldest daughter assured me that her mother planned on having them back for our 1 day a week visitation next Saturday. She even told me that she would rather not visit her grandparents than miss our visitation. Today, I got a call from my lawyer, who informed me that he had just spoken with her lawyer ... she has decided that the girls will be staying with their grandparents through Sunday; which will cause them to miss our Saturday visitation. My lawyer was ready to volunteer a "make up day" on my behalf.

I told him that this was in no way acceptable. My two daughter's sole day per week visitation is more important than my wife's play schedule (she isn't even spending her vacation with them, rather she is farming them out to her parents so she can "play"). I feel strongly that since she has affected the entire restraining order scenario for her own purposes, she must adhere to the rules which she has herself chosen. Therefore, my lawyer informed hers that if she does this we will hold her in Contempt of Court.

I have no doubt that this will cause her further angry retaliations, as this sort of action on my part would be rather unexpected to her. She has always been able to count on me being the "nice guy". In this instance, I had to once again think of my girls 1st. What I don't understand is the fact that throughout the duration of our marriage she has been such an excellent mother. Somehow this too has been eclipsed by her own drive for ... something. I have no idea What that something is.

I think that not knowing what exactly is behind all of this is what's really torturing me at this point. There has been some infidelity on her part earlier in our marriage, though I don't think that's the motivating factor now.

"For me, my self-respect and overall emotional health were considerably bolstered by an understanding of what had happened - the underlying causes. I had blamed myself for our marital problems over the years, despite enormous efforts to do right by my wife, and I obtained great relief as I came to realize that my wife's unhappiness actually had very little to do with me."

I envy you this, Gnome. I still don't know what the underlying causes are; therefore I have no hope of closure at this juncture. I may Never know - if she has her way in continuing this noncommunication.

I know that what you've said is true ... that there is no way I can help her at this point. However, I can't help still loving her as much as I ever did. I'm sorry, but I married for Life. I just don't know any other way of thinking.

"It is possible to survive in this hell, and it is even possible to be happy. Eventually."

I do have a good support group of family and friends, and they tell me the same. It simply hasn't become a reality to me yet ... that I'll ever truly be "happy" again. I still keep dreaming over and over of this wonderful fairy tale ... where she knocks on the door, and asks me to forgive her. And of course I would. I know this isn't going to happen.

What I'm wondering is what to expect next. Will this dementia continue infinitely? Or will there come a day when we can sit down and talk about this, perhaps even become friends again. I could deal with all of this so much better if only there was some sort of mutual respect involved; if we could at the very least work together for the benefit of the children. If I KNEW what was happening so I could begin to heal.

New here, but not at all to your situation...Just went through the same hell you are going through.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Advice, whatever you do, DO NOT break that RO!! I will repeat again, DO NOT! no matter what she may say to you. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I spent 21 days in jail for violating a RO's after my former wife said "The judge's order doesn't matter, If you cared about the kids, you would come to the house..." BE VERY CAREFUL!!! Her anger may back you into a corner leaving you with no way-out....PLEASE Listen to my advice!

You need to just fight for visitation with your kids right now., be the best father you can be from a distance. Take this time for yourself and try not to over analyze the situation to much.
I know this sucks..But give her space, no pressure and stay away from pursuing her in anyway or form. It will only make your matters worse.

I hate use to use the cliche...Been here and done this.

Take this time and read about everything you can find here and reread it again. Get one of Harley's books. My guess is that some "lovebusters" have depleted the ol' bank account.

My prayers and thought are with you and your kids...

I will check in later-

New Dutchman

Well, too late for that. 2 weeks ago I was returning my girls at 6pm on a Saturday. My oldest daughter had an armload of stuff - kid's games, walkman, etc - so I helped her carry it to the door. My wife was standing in the doorway. Feeling awkward, I said "Hi, how are you?" She responded, "You're not supposed to be talking to me". I got in my car and left without another word.

20 minutes later the police showed up at the place I'm currently staying (with family). They proceeded to arrest me, and put me in jail. I had to put down $500 bail to get out. I have NO previous criminal history, unless you want to count a couple of speeding tickets.

The story she told the cops? That I walked up to the door when dropping off the girls, and said "Hi". That I wasn't being mean, just being friendly, but she wanted me arrested anyway. Why? She had just gotten the subpeona to appear in court for the hearing contesting the restraining order ...

So, this morning I will be at my arrainment in approx an hour. It's only a misdemeanor ... but it's a blemish on my clean record as far as I'm concerned. Still, there's not much I can do about it ...

My soon to be X wife is doing the same to me. Keeping my girls from me. The most you can do is listen to your atourney and be the best dad you can be. Remember by fighting for your children you are only doing what is right. I don't know where you live and how custody works in your state but here is my advice. Come out with both guns blazing. Tell your lawer everythings you know. Be sure to tell him if you have done anything bad at all. I mean anything. Because she will tell hers and it will be greatly inflated. Give him every detail of her infidelity. Do not tell him anything that you do not know is a fact. If it is something that someone has told you get proof, witnesses or whatever. Do not just tell stories. They must be undeniably true from her mouth. If you tell a story in court and it turns out to be false or exagerated it will undermine the rest of your case. Do not consentrate all of your efferts on trashing her. Give him twice as many things about the kinda stuff you do with your daughters. Did you attend parent teacher conferences? They will have record of that. What about school events, vacations or special projects. Do you help them with homework, take them to the dentist and doctors office. Anyhting that shows involvement prior to the separation. Especially stuff that has been done since day one like pick up or take to school every day. She has a problem and if you take it setting down you will get toasted. Then in the meantime just roll with it. Let her do whatever. Don't let her think that you are going to fight tooth and nail. Then when your day in court comes up you can be the lawn mower and her a$$ is grass.

PS
I'm not bitter with my wife at all, LOL.

I just got back from the arrainment. I now have a trial date for my "violation" of the restraining order. As I sat there waiting my turn, I listened to all the other cases - lots of DUI (driving under the influence), cocain charges, methanphetamine charges, theft charges, etc - and I wondered just what in the heII I was doing sitting with all of these criminals. I mean, I was there for saying "Hi" to my wife. Unbelievable.

STV, as far as coming out with both guns blazing, that is exactly the plan. I thank you for your advice ... and I've already had many a discussion with my attourney covering all the topics you described. I also have about 6/7 witnesses lined up for the hearing (which will be Monday).

As for the infidelity, I live in Oregon, and this is a "no fault" divorce state. Therefore, infidelity doesn't really apply, and I am told by my attourney that this would only make me look like a jealous husband.

However, there are a lot of other very relative issues ... such as the fact that I am indeed the parent who cooked almost ALL the meals, did all of the activities with the girls, went to the teacher conferences, drove them to school every day, did most of the house cleaning, coordinated the birthdays (my wife didn't even attend my oldest daughter's this year), etc. In short, I have been an extremely involved father for the entirety of the girl's lives.

This is what confuses me as to the provisions my wife set forth in the RO for visitation. She could have given them a lot more time with me; in fact, she could have chosen any amount of time she wanted. Yet, she relegated it to one day a week. Even in our most heated verbal dissagreements, she still always said that I was an awesome father. So why is she doing this to the girls?

Sure, I want the entire restraining order dropped. In this state, they're good for a year. I don't see how on earth we can parent the girls if we can't even speak to each other. What happens in an emergency? What about problems at school, etc? However, the most integral part of the RO for me is changing this horrible restriction of time with my daughters. I think that, even worst case scenario, I will still get more parenting time than the current 1 day per week.

Has anyone else out there fought a restraining order? If so, what was the outcome?

After my wife left me, I had to get used to the idea that I could not afford to care what other people thought of me. There's nothing you can do to prevent someone from trashing your reputation, and it doesn't matter whether the tools used are outright lies or grotesque distortions.

What's important is that you know the truth. They can't change that. And believe me, the knowledge of my own integrity is sometimes the only thing that has kept me sane when those around me have treated me as if I were some kind of psychotic criminal.

Who knows, the misdemeanor charge may even work to your benefit eventually. The more outrageous your wife's behavior becomes, the better your case becomes - especially if you act calm and cool under the worst sorts of duress. Of course, I'm assuming some level of rationality on the part of the judge or magistrate, which is emphatically not a given; but honestly, who comes off looking worse: the person who was arrested for offering a common (and innocuous) courtesy while carrying out his court-ordered responsibilities, or the person who had him thrown into jail for doing so? You come off looking polite and naive, while your wife comes off looking vicious and petty.

Your two greatest strengths in this fight (at least for the legal side of it) are how you conduct yourself now, and how you conducted yourself throughout your marriage. Be soft-spoken and cooperative, but absolutely unyielding where it really matters. Stick to the facts and collect as much evidence as you can gather. Do not make any derogatory comments about your wife that are not straight facts.

Also helping you is the fact that your wife is not acting rationally. Since she is living (at least to some degree) in a world of her own manufacture, she cannot even conceive of what it would mean to act in her own best interests in the real world. Unfortunately, her handicap also means that your daughters are in a very vulnerable position, and frankly if I were in your position I would be worried sick.

Your history of deferring to your wife's wishes may help you. By standing firm now, you may confuse her and lead her to do some stupid things as she tries to regain control of a situation which is not so firmly in hand as she may believe. Then again, that "nice guy" your wife has always been able to count on may be so thoroughly blocked from her memory that she already expects you to fight (and fight dirty) at every turn.

You say that you envy me for my understanding of the underlying causes in my situation, because the lack of communication in your situation gives you no hope for closure. To that I say: don't give up looking for answers, if having them means so much to you (as it did to me). You've been married long enough that you may well have all the data you need, and lack only the knowledge of how to arrange that data. Indeed, it was only after my wife had already cut off all communication with me that I finally discovered where to start looking. After she left, I spent weeks poring over dozens of books and scores of articles until I finally found a source of insight that pointed me in the right direction. From there I learned not only what had happened, but also what to expect, and it's almost spooky how closely my wife has followed the script ever since.

You say you can't stop loving your wife, that you married for Life, and that you don't know any other way of thinking. There are many others who have said the same thing, and I think that most of them have gone on to other relationships. Like them, you may discover that your feelings change as time goes on. It hasn't happened to me yet, and my wife has remained incommunicado for two years now (unless you count her response a year-and-a-half ago to the interrogatory I filed as part of the divorce process she started). But there's not much point in thinking about that now. For now, my advice is that whatever you do, you do not try to stop loving your wife. The cost of deliberately killing love is higher than the cost of experiencing the pain of betrayal by a loved one.

Take one day at a time. I understand your desire to know what to expect and your hope for some form of reconciliation. I've been there. I'm still there (despite all the well-meaning people who try to tell me that I need to accept that "it's over"). Eventually you're going to have to make some choices about what direction to take your life, and you may not know any more at that time than you do now. (As uncomfortable as it is, uncertainty is part of life.) But for now, all you have to do - all you should do, considering your level of stress - is take one day at a time.

Thank you.

I cannot describe what talking with all of you means to me at this low point in my life.

Taking this one day at a time is the absolute best approach. I tend to be a horrible worry-wort anyway, so confining my thoughts to the here and now rather than future events will help immensly.

Holding on to my belief in my own personal integrity is difficult. I have many family/friends who reinforce this for me on a regular basis ... but when someone you love and know so deeply blames everything on you, it causes you serious self doubt.

As for honestly wanting to resolve our issues and stay married, that's only partly true for me. I truly do wish to resolve the issues, and reach some sort of closure. However, I think that I was indeed (for the 1st time in 11 years) ready for a divorce the day I had a police officer escort me out of my own home in front of the entire neighborhood. That was the day that I finally came to my senses and realized what my wife was capable of.

From what I understand her attourney has started filing the "dissolution". Once this RO issue is over, if she hasn't filed I will ...

This in no way means I don't still lover her as much as I ever did - in fact, I'm still "in love" with her to be sure. I just realize that, due to circumstances beyond MY control, this will most likely never work out. If we got back together she would just leave again ... and I refuse to put my children through that anymore. They've had to live with the fear of divorce for years now, while being constantly drug in and out of the home.

Better to get it done and over with ...

I hear what you're saying, and frankly, I agree that you don't seem to have much choice about the divorce. It will probably provide some measure of protection for you and your daughters - although I think you may be fooling yourself if you really believe that a mere judgment entry to change your legal status is going to put an end to anything. If your wife wants to, she can keep dragging you through the courts for years, both before and after that judgment entry is made. But it doesn't really matter what she does: you just keep doing what you have to do.

For myself, although I want nothing more than the restoration of my marriage, if my wife came to me today and asked to move back home, I would tell her that I didn't think that was such a good idea. It's not that I'm afraid of getting hurt again; I survived it once, so I know that I can survive it again. But she needs to work through her issues first, and going back to "the way we were" would only get in her way.

Loving someone means that sometimes you have to do some very hard things...

Sometimes it means you have to let go of that someone...

Loving someone means that sometimes you get hurt...

But personally, I think it's worth the risk. The alternative is to wall yourself away from everyone.

Because you never know what anyone is capable of. No one who knew me and my wife would ever have believed that she could have done the things she did. Not until after she did them. So if she couldn't be trusted, can anyone?

As long as I know that I can be trusted, I can believe the answer is "yes". But if I give up my own integrity, what will I have left to believe in?

Believe me, I've been through the self-doubt. For years I held myself responsible for my wife's pain, believing that if somehow I could just find the right words and the right way to say them, she would finally allow herself to be loved. And then after she left, when she and her family began treating me like a pariah and even some of our confused friends were looking at me askance, I really had to fight the feeling that I actually was at least some kind of a creep.

The whole experience really opened my eyes to the power of suggestion and the mind's vulnerability to brainwashing. But I kept going back and looking at the facts. I knew what I had and hadn't done, and the facts just didn't fit the feelings. And then as my wife's accusations became increasingly bizarre, I was forced to recognize that her actions weren't really about me. Like everyone else, I have my share of flaws and weaknesses, and there were complaints my wife could legitimately have made. But she didn't. Instead she made allegations that made no sense at all.

So, gradually, I regained my self-esteem. I looked back on the choices I had made over the years and I thought about how I had handled the various situations in which I had found myself, and I considered how confused I was at the time, and I finally said to myself (in some amazement) "You know, I was a d***ed good husband!"

So give yourself time. No, it's not an easy road, but at least there's better footing ahead.

HWRAD & GNOME-I think we all married the same women... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

OK...

You better strap yourself in and prepare for a bumpy ride.

Very close to the same crap I just went through. Maybe even a little worse. I ended-up with a fabricated assault charge defending myself from an attack by my X-she manipulated our 5yr. old D to testify against me. My situation really has not changed, only I have. In the way I react to her now. In fact, I am in the process of taking her back to court, because she is violating the visitation schedule. I haven't seen my kids in 6 months.

I think Gnome hit the nail right on the head:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Because you never know what anyone is capable of. No one who knew me and my wife would ever have believed that she could have done the things she did. Not until after she did them. So if she couldn't be trusted, can anyone? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">She has shown you clearly what she can do. Don't be stupid like me and make this any worse on yourself or children. It's like getting burned on a hot stove. Do you need to put you hand right back on the burner for some more pain?

Your in Oregon. Portland? Washington/Multnomah county? I have gone through both RO hearings, Divorce courts here. I will give my 25K legal services bill, tip of the week. Prepare in building a good case in defense of yourself. If you are in either of these courts, they are both filled with bias and sexist judges. They will attempt to classify you, a man, as the "abuser". Don't be surprised that the allegations and lies really start to fly in the RO hearing. Attorneys know just what to do to hit those "hot buttons" on judges. They do this on a daily basis.

I assume that the hearing is in response to a ten day child custody/visitation provision. Your STBX is attempting to build her D case around this RO and possible abuse. Deceptive, yet effective standard attorney tactic in a possible custody battle. This can disarm the opposing party and take them out of the game quickly. Even if you still want to play, it will cost you a ton of money and makes it much more difficult to reach your objectives without having to jump through more legal hoops.

From my experience, I would have her served divorce papers when you attend the hearing for the RO. Don't wait around for her to get them to you first.

Three things might be accomplished in filing first;

1. It may just wake her up from her dimensia and maybe she might realize what the hell she is doing.
2. You are making a statement that you are no longer accepting or condoning her controlling behavour.
3. You gain leverage in placing yourself in the "drivers seat" in the divorce proceedings.

Above all, DEFENSE is the name of the game now. Take the high-road by not attacking her, putting her down, making her look bad, accusing her. These are the *key* things that judges look for in abusive relationships.

My guess is that you won't be able to persuade the judge to drop the RO. You have already violated it once. Judges see this as blantant disrespect for their authority. Strike 1. Modification is what you should seek i.e. more visitation, phone contact with kids only, 3rd party exchanges. Go with it, not against it.

Your strategy should include focusing on your mental, physical and spirtual health, spending quality time with your daughters. All these things will really help with your overall sanity. Continue to be the rational and stable father and an good example for the children. Not only will this help in custody evaluations, but will show your wife that you are really the incredible father that she can count on. Let her see this and my guess is she will self destruct on her own.

Lay low and work on your issues, no contact, not even with a 3rd party (family, friends, etc) or anyone about the divorce. Only discuss the children matters with relatives. Don't share your next move, keep her guessing and stay the hell away from her right now. No I love you's, written-cards letters,flowers or even relaying information via the children, i.e. daddy says to tell you. Be a complete gentleman, respectful and maintain building credibilty as an excellent father.

I know that you love this women. It's difficult to see someone we love hurt us. Don't get sucked in to the whole co-dependent justification process. You have to believe that no matter what may happen, whether you divorce or maybe not. You can not accept this type of behavior from her any longer. This is purely about control, manipulation to get what she wants. I see it and have went through it. It makes me sick to read this.

There is hope for you. I am finally recovering from the aftermath and now have a incredible wonderful new women in my life. In comparsion, my X looks like Hitler and my new significant other, Gandi.

Would you not agree that marriage is a partnership, involves mutual problem solving and mutual respect? Your wife is consumed with selfishness right now, fueling her anger and will lash-out & punish you to get or take total control. THIS will continue to escalate and cycle if you remain. Remove yourself from her circle of control. Head for cover and prepare a a sound strategy.

Let me give you an example:

If one of your closest friends screwed you over. Would you say to them, wow your my best friend, it doesn't hurt me, bother me, etc? Would you not expect them to increase the level/intensity and dish you up some more??

Or

Would you rather say. I don't appreciate the way you have treated me, I need to re-evaluate this relationship and think about continuing any friendship with you. Respectful, confident and assertive.

My email is: another_dutchman@ hotmail.com

<small>[ July 17, 2002, 07:40 AM: Message edited by: New Dutchman ]</small>

ND,

After reading what you wrote, I am now officially Scared. I don't see how I can even fight this thing. If the entire system is against me, then I don't have a prayer.

The girls have told me quite often that they constantly complain to their mother about lack of time with me, and ask her when they will be able to see me as much as they see her. She always responds to them something like, "that's not possible right now, but maybe when things settle down a little ... in a couple of YEARS".

I cannot wait a COUPLE OF YEARS for my daughters. By that time they will be utterly brainwashed by her and whatever paid for support group she has.

In the mean time, I can't even contact them by phone. I know a lot of people have offered me the advice to be the best father to the girls I possible can during this difficult time, and I have. The problem is that this is limited to 1 day a week, for 8 hours! No other contact whatsoever.

To make matters worse, I will probably not get to see them this coming Saturday, as she has taken them out of state to visit their grandparents. She had her attourney call mine to let me know that she is planning NOT to have them back on Saturday (though she promised the girls she would).

My attourney is now telling me, "Let's not make a big deal out of that right now, we have other priorites", as my RO hearing is coming up on Monday.

How do I not make a big deal out of my daughters missing their 1 day a week with me? They and I both look forward to it more than anything I can think of right now. I LIVE for this day.

I will be moving for a Contempt of Court on this. My lawyer doesn't seem to think that it's that important, but then again, this man has never had children.

I understand that I need to remain calm, cool, and be a gentleman; but I think I also need to be very firm also.

This is a case that your wife is obviously trying to allianate your children from you. There are groups that will support you in this. Judges nowadays DO NOT tolerate this and want a non-custodial father to have a good ralationship with their children. You need to follow the RO and make it clear to everyone involved that your interest is in the children and not your wife. She will try to use anything as evidence so don't give her ANY. Only interest in your children's welfare. In time this will all BE IN YOUR FAVOR if you remain calm and remember your objectives. Perhaps a guardian adlitum will be appointed. Your children will miss you more and more and this whole thing will backfire in your wife's face.
Do not worry about what your neighbors think about the arrest. Chances are some of them have gone through the same thing. You never really know someone until you divorce them and it can be the most horrible experience you'll ever have. Love can be the most beautiful, yet equally painful emotion-sad to say. The best people can screw up when going through this.
God puts natural laws in affect. "What comes around goes around". You won't be on the bottom for long. Just try to be patient(as hard as this seems) and pray alot! It works. She may feel she holds all the cards right now and may even enjoy making you squirm. So don't. Let her make her mess.
Be SURE that your lawyer is pushing the fact that she is trying to keep you from having a healthy relationship with your children! This IS IN YOUR FAVOR. So in some ways, the more difficult she makes it, the better for you. Good luck!

DON'T LOSE HOPE!

I know your feelings of despair, but you can not lose yourself.

Take the little time that you have with your two daughters right now and enjoy it. Protect them from seeing the pain that you are feeling. Try to be happy and not lett your feelings show (pain and depression). I know this is very difficult, but I promise you it will get better with time. You will get to see them more, just right now it not possible. Your children will be working on her to see "daddy" and they will never forget about you. Time is on your side. She will be consumed with caring for them 24x7. The stress of being the only parent right now will get her to realize that she will have to "utilize" you to get a break from the insanity-eventually. I have seen this happen with others who are in similiar situations. Time...just give it time...

When I was going through this, I was able to rediscover myself. I spent time seeing friends and doing healthy activities that I enjoyed. These were things that I was not allowed to do while I was married.

She has some some serious anger and control issues. I know this is difficult to fight against this without engaging a full scale battle.

Given your situation and the stress that you are dealing with. I would highly suggest you visit a doctor for anxiety and depression for possible medication. Additionally, some counseling would be good as well.

Lawyers only understand the process, not the emotions that are associated to this pain. Remeber divorce is a process and really is just a piece of paper.

If you need a friend to talk with it, please feel free to contact me via email.

Take care of yourself and keep us updated. You are in my daily prayers!

-ND <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

My heart goes out to you. I found much useful information at http://dadsdivorce.com/. The site, posted by a fathers' rights law firm in St. Louis, has many free resources that should assist you.

Thanks all for the useful information and the encouragement. I read this board every day now, and it's helping me to cope. In particular reading about the scenarios which are so close to mine helps me realize that I am not alone in these feelings and circumstances.

Today I am missing her very badly. I dream about her EVERY night, and they're always bad dreams (she's treating me with indifference, or malice). I was just talking with a mutual friend of ours on the phone, and I realized that I am still very actively in love with the woman.

It's not that I want to be ... more like some kind of addiction that I can't let go of. My emotions are the proverbial roller coster; sometimes I feel bitterness toward her for the things she's done - divorce didn't HAVE to go like this for us - then other times I feel a deep sense of longing in my soul; that I've lost an important part of myself which I'll never be whole without.

People keep telling me that there is "someone out there" for me. Blah. I will NEVER find anyone like her again. I wonder, does she feel the loss too? Does she realize at all who I was, and that I too am unique?

These thoughts are plaguing me today, and I hope I'm not sounding melodramatic. Having this forum as a release is cathartic for me ...

Thank you for the encouragement, and especially the prayers.

Well, you don't sound melodramatic to me, hwrad. But alas, I have little encouragement to offer. Last night I wrote out a response to your previous post addressing what you might expect (or at least prepare yourself for) from the court system, and then I thought better of sending it. I suspect that you might be in for a rougher (and longer) ride than you have yet imagined, but I'm not sure it's really going to help you for me to slap you in the face with all of that "reality" just now. And besides, the courts may end up treating you less shabbily than the way they've treated me. It's unlikely that we are in the same jurisdiction, and my lawyers have told me that the way my case has been handled is not exactly typical. So who knows? And anyway, you've only got to take one day at a time. "Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof", as Jesus once said (in good old awkward King James English).

The loneliness and the dreams you've got to deal with right now, though, and I wish I had anything helpful to say. After two years I still dream about my wife sometimes, and it almost always knocks me off balance the whole next day. But in one way you can count yourself fortunate: you have bad dreams about your wife. The really tough dreams are the good dreams, the ones in which your wife acts like her old self. Waking up from one of those dreams is sheer torture, because reality hits you and you get the emotional impact of your wife's betrayal all over again.

All you can do is press on. As each day goes by you will recognize that you got through another one, and that will give you confidence that you will be able to get through yet another...and another.

The emotional addiction is natural, as are the feelings of bitterness. Let yourself feel them, and just ride them out. In time, the ups and downs will level off to some degree. As for the sense of having lost an irreplaceable part of yourself...well, I still feel that way. I liken the experience to the loss of an arm or a leg: the wound can heal, but the limb can never be replaced. We adapt. We must.

I too have heard the "someone out there" speech, and I don't buy it either. Mind you, I don't believe in the concept of the "soulmate", that there is one special person in all the world who can "complete" me. In fact, if I had lost my wife to death instead of desertion, I imagine that I would probably already be happily involved in another relationship by now. But I built my whole life around trying to understand my wife and trying to meet her needs and desires. She was the only person I ever even dated, and the only person to whom I ever fully opened myself. When you've got a connection that deep and that unique, a relationship that has in a very real sense determined and defined the person you have become, I don't know if it is ever really possible to extricate yourself.

Does your wife feel the loss too, hwrad? I believe that almost certainly she does. But she is unable to admit it to herself. She transforms that pain into something else (such as anger), and she attributes the source to who-knows-what. Our minds are remarkably inventive when it comes to hiding from ourselves the things we do not want to face.

hwrad - My heart goes out to you; but for the grace of God..

I would strongly recommend posting on this bulletin board as well. I, of course, got it from MB.

Divorce Online

Blessings, and Peace

<small>[ July 19, 2002, 03:39 PM: Message edited by: Family Man ]</small>

Well,

Surprise, surprise ... my wife decided to bring the girls back in time for our visitation!

I don't know why she changed her mind, and I don't care; all I know is that we are going to have a SPLENDID day together at the county fair. I'm going to spoil them Rotten, heh.

Thank God for this!