I feel so stuck right now and would appreciate feedback, words of wisdom, prayers, cyber hugs ...

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />
In my last session with Steve Harley, we talked about what I discovered about WH -A continued even though he said it was over (I know that's such a surprise on these boards <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> ) but the real kicker was his use of cocaine. I discussed that I felt I should legally separate from WH and Steve agreed.

Here's a brief background - For the past 3 + years , WH spent more and more time 1200 miles away from home where he had grown up till he's living there 99% of the time. He had an A with old HS friend, then last year got involved with OW2 and cocaine. This is the third time something like this has happened. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

I have been through the gut renching pain and come out the other side. I am much more at peace without him. Everything inside me says GET THE #@##$$$$ OUT NOW, yet I don't do it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

I have know this man for 27 years, and M for the last 21 years. He is still the same person I met in college. I'm the one who has changed. That probably was a factor in him going away.

Prior to him leaving, we where in withdrawl (In a nut shell, he rates high on every LB, and low on EN's)So why do I stay and not say anything? Fear?

We are also in business together & it's in financial trouble. At times I say wait till finances are better, then I kick myself and say what about my integrity, my peace of mind, my life. I have tried to second guess what he'll do but then I have to tell myself that it's about me and to focus on protecting me & the kids. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

When I am where he is, I stay at my Mom's not his house. It's like we are already separated and but we've never called it that.

But things get to me, like yesterday we were talking about having to lay off people and he had tears in his eyes. That part of him touches me. Now he's on his horse trying to save the business, when he screwed it up in the first place cuz he has been out of control with what he has been doing.

Sorry for the vent, thanks for "listening"
In the end, I know that I will be ok, that God will take care of me. I also feel that I need to step back and let God work on WH that God has some dealing with him. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

God Bless,

D

WGTT -

It's not easy breaking away from the marriage, even when you know it's bad for you.

I think that that is why God let alot of things happen after my own d-day that perhaps drove ExH away or prevented him from returning, because He knew that I wouldn't have the strength to break out of the relationship.

In therapy, my counselor is having me look at the reality of the marriage versus my picture of the marriage, thus all the introspection in my posts as of late, and it's important to see the reality and make the right decisions so that we can be the people that God wants us to be.

The hardest thing for me is doing what God wants me to do and not what I want me to do. I want to cling to a relationship that is no longer there, and will no longer be. And God is saying, that's not my plan for you, that I need to choose Him instead of my picture of marriage or my ExH.

When enough people tell you the same thing, then maybe there is message to be heard - and the tears by H - we're not saying that he's not human, he just isn't good for you.

And if he straightens up, you can always get remarried. But he'll have to straighten up for himself, and not for you. Sounds like he still has a long way to go.

Take care of you! K

((((((((((WGTT)))))))))
I am not enough smart to give you advice but I want you to know that you are a very nice person who WILL realy GET THRU THIS.
In fact I think you already got thru this. Triggers will appaer from time to time but you are strong (must admitt: much stronger than me) so each time it will be easier for you and intervals will be longer.
I don't know how to pray but I have you in my thoughts.
Love
D

God is in control,

alot of things happen after my own d-day

The same thing has happened to me, as I have discovered more and more about this man and each time was ready to vomit.
In therapy, my counselor is having me look at the reality of the marriage versus my picture of the marriage

It was interesting, I found a journal from the first year WH & I met. The same problems we were having then are still the SAME problems we are having now !!! Even his brother said to me - that he (WH) just doesn't learn from his mistakes, he keeps doing the same thing over and over.

The hardest thing for me is doing what God wants me to do and not what I want me to do. I want to cling to a relationship that is no longer there, and will no longer be. And God is saying, that's not my plan for you, that I need to choose Him instead of my picture of marriage or my ExH.

God is calling me in the same direction, to put HIM first and no one else. At times I feel that I have done that, then I realize I've backed away from HIM and tried to control the outcome myself.

It is easier for me when I am back in Florida. WH and his "stuff" is not in my face. There is wonderful prayer group that I attend & feel peacefull there.

he just isn't good for you.

I know it in my head, but my heart has to catch up.

Betrayed and desparate,

Thanks for your thoughts and prayers.

A big fear is financial and I have been telling myself that God has gotten me through so far, he can get me through this, even if it means selling the house.

I went to my prayer corner (the bathroom) and during my prayers I heard a soft voice say "Let go, there's more" then I heard it again "Let go, there is more" then, "Let me deal with him" WOW <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

During my prayer time, I wrote down all the negative, scary things that were going through my mind. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> Then, I went back and wrote a positve statement counteracting what I had just said to myself. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I feel much different now.

For example, I initially wrote down that I felt hurt and angry that WH left. What I wrote to counteract that - That it was a good sign, that WH was searching out other sickies and staying away from me cuz I have changed and gotten healthier. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

There is still more to go through, including pain. I am reminded of the saying "Pain is inevitable, suffering is not."

God bless,

D.

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Dear WGTT,

I think we are all in pretty much the same boat. It is so hard to let go and let God take control. I have been struggling with that myself.

I also have been reading old journals. Our marriage was never what I wanted it to be--we put on a good show though. It is hard to accept the reality of everything.

I think you hit it right on the nail when you said that God knew the relationship wasn't right--and he also knew we wouldn't be able to get out of it on our own. Maybe there is "life" at the end of the tunnel. Take Care Pat

Today has been very frustrating yet a relief. He did some crazy things today that for him are getting to be common place. He took 1/2 of the monthly check we get, yet, I have all the expenses and 3 kids.

Part of me was thinking to hang in a little longer bcos of finances, but I'm tired of trying to outfox him for the money. I just don't want to play those stupid @@$%*&^@ games anymore. I listened to him justify all these reasons why he needed the money (for the poor workers in the business.... yah right, he needs his fix) and caught him in several lies. I held my ground, didn't come unglued. He's not worth it.

Yes, God is telling me to get the heck out of the way of this man, he is bad, bad, bad news.

MnM-

Our marriage was never what I wanted it to be--we put on a good show though. It is hard to accept the reality of everything

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> We did too.

In the future, I don't want that for myself. I want a real relationship. A few years ago, when Wh first started spending more & more time away, I decided that I would use the time to work on me. One of the things I asked myself was that if H was all of a sudden to have this Paul like conversion on the road to Emaus, would I know how to be a good wife. The answer was no. I started to read Smalley books on relationships, and doing more things like that.

Throughout our relationship, it has been the pain and the jetky things my WH did, that motivated me to change. I sought God and he responded. I have a lot to thank WH for, but wished that he would have embarked upon the same journey. What a R we could have had. But that's not reality. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

I am so thank ful for everyone on these boards. There is so much to be learned by reading posts, posting questions and situations. I am always talking about my support group on line. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

For a while this spring I thought we were headed to recovery, and I got scared <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> He was acting bizarre (now I know why) and I thought "is this all there is?" <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> After dday, I wanted my WH back & began to think about all the things I would miss about him. Then as time went on, I saw the things that just are not tolerable in a healthy r.

Sorry for rambling, I need to vent and this is the place <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Thank God. I went through this before with out this kind of support.

God Bless,

D.

PS Pat - what grade do you teach?

Dear WGTT,

I don't know how to highlight--but your comment on what a relationship we could have had really hit home. That thought is why I think I get so sad at times. Unfortunately, it just never was. It really does take two committed people to make it work.

The finances are a big problem for me too. Once again, I have to trust in God that everything will work out. So far, it has.

I still don't fathom how someone could give up their kids, their home and their wife--for a bimbo. It is like they just throw away everything---I don't think I could ever do that...but that is why I am not in that situation. I am glad that I don't have to feel bad about it.

I teach 6th grade special services. This year I am teaching replaced reading, math and inclusiion science and social studies. Should be busy.

I hope you have a good weekend. Pat

Hi MnM,

Today has turned out to be a pretty good day after a crappy morning.

The finances are a big problem for me too. Once again, I have to trust in God that everything will work out. So far, it has.

God has done so many wonderful things in my life, so I should trust him with my finances. Sometimes I just want to be the director and orchestrate everything, but that doesn't leave room for
God to work.

I admire teachers. When I volunteered in my oldest son's class, I got a feel for all it takes to be a teacher and how difficult it was to keep all those kids interested. My youngest s is going into 6th grade.

Pray for me this weekend, there are some things that need to be addressed between WH & I that are not easy subjects.

Pat, you have a good weekend as well.

God Bless

D.

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by WillGetThruThis:
[QB]
Pray for me this weekend, there are some things that need to be addressed between WH & I that are not easy subjects.
QB]</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Thoughts coming your way. I need to do the same thing. I let my lawyer start something I don't think I really want to do. Good luck.

(((sing)))

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Thoughts coming your way. I need to do the same thing. I let my lawyer start something I don't think I really want to do. Good luck.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You
will be in my thoughts and prayers. I had seen your thread in GQ :

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I wanted to remind everyone what Plan A & Plan B are really about YOU, not your spouse but making yourself better. If you do that you will recover and YOU do have to recover from an affair. whether you are the BS or WS you have to have personnel recovery before there can be any other recovery. If you only have personel recovery, it is still a victory.

</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I wholeheartedly agree. It takes two committed people to make a M work and MB doens't guarantee that it will happen, what it provides are tools which are concepts that have worked time and time again.

Thank you sing, I am learning how to really use this board in a technical way & this is the first time I've used quotes. I am so excited! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

God bless,

D.

WillGetThruThis

I can definitly identify with what you are saying. I have prayed so long and so hard for direction and I was sure God was telling me to let it go and get out. Well, I was able to let it go, but getting out was a different story. Even tho I really wanted to be apart from him, it never seemed like a good time. First it was my S's graduation coming up. I thought ok, after graduation I'm going to tell him. Then I had to work out of town quite a bit and I thought after I can be here more, I will tell him. What ended up happening was I became very strong during this time, was able to completly detatch from him emotionally and physically. I felt like when I was able to detatch I received a remarkable healing of spirit of some sort. I had total peace of mind and have since learned a lot about myself and he no longer controls me and tries very little to control. He is a bully and control freak in my opinion. I didn't do anything moraly wrong such as A or anything, I just got to know myself better. I even went to see a lawyer because I was going to file. But there always seemed to be something I felt we needed to take care of first.(finaces etc)When I got totally comfortable with who and what I am and no longer "needed" him he started taking notice. I was afraid that he was going to change his idiot ways and become a decent person and I may not be able to change how I felt about him. Well, that is exactly what is happening. He is going on 3 weeks (doesn't sound like much but for him it is) with no love busting. I'm not sure he has ever seen this sight or knows anything about it, but he is doing a pretty good plan A. I don't feel madly in love with him yet and don't know if I ever will but I am giving him the benefit of the doubt that he is trying at this point. I can honestly say it may be to late but I am starting to view him as a friend and not the enemy anyway.

I think it is very hard to leave even a bad marriage after so long. I have to say that I really wanted to leave him after the way he treated me and the kids for so long and if he does go back to how he was, I will still do it. I am a different person now and I feel in total control of my emotions. The biggest thing was learning to not react to his love busting, and of course you have to let it go and not expect anything to be able to not react. I feel like by not reacting it took away his power to hurt or bully me. I don't think we were dealing with a drug problem and that's a different story. His personality would change so drastically that some people thought he may be on something but I was never able to confirm it. He is just a different perosn now. I hope he stays this way but if he doesn't, I will be ok.

I felt seperation was coming but couldn't bring myself to tell him so I just worked on getting over him with him still here. It's a good step at least it was for me. No I feel like I will survive with or without him.
Bottom line is take care of YOU.
Free

Free,

Great name. I am happy for you that your H is making a come back and certianly understand your feelings. It is hard and takes a concious effort and commitmment on both side to make a M work. There is a great article by the Harley's on resentment in the inidelity Q & A section. It basically says that our resentments stay fresh when the other is not activly protecting us and working on the M.

I too have detached with love, am in a good place spiritually and overall at peace with myself.I had hoped and prayed that my WH would make a come back, but he's in a downward spiral. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

In the past WH wanted me when he thought he was loosing me. For a period of time he would do anything, but it was sperficial, not true committment. This time, I am in a much better place. That actually may have played a part in his leaving. In essence I started a different dance several years back and wasn't the same person even before he moved out. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I felt seperation was coming but couldn't bring myself to tell him so I just worked on getting over him with him still here. It's a good step at least it was for me. No I feel like I will survive with or without him.
Bottom line is take care of YOU.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Sounds like a good plan. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

God Bless,

D

Hi again,
I'm wondering if my H isn't shaping up just because he thought he was loosing me. What ever his motivation, he is definitly easier to live with for now. If he is not sincere and reverts back to being what he was, I know exactly what I will be doing and I will be ok with it. It is truly and act of God that I even gave him another chance at all. I told God to change my heart if this is the right thing to do because I don't feel as dedicated to this as I should, but I am trying and avoiding LB. But it took me a long time to get to the point of leaving, I guess it may take some time to get back into staying. I'm trying not to consider leaving because I believe it will never work out if I keep that on my mind, however, realistically speaking it is an option.
Free

I have a really hard time with the letting go, because I keep just what if?

I am trying to get past that right now, I want to see my husband again, but the man that I married and have loved for so long is no longer with us and I can't continue to wait for him, but what if he might be coming around?

I know that the divorce is inevitable and will probably be at the end of this month, I know that. I just never wanted this to happen to us!! And I am so sad. How do I stop loving the jerk?

Dawn

Hi daybreak,
I also know what you are going thru. I held on for so long, wanting my marriage to work because I loved my H sooo much. There came a time tho, that I started asking myself if I was holding on to what I wanted him and our marriage to be or if I was actually fighting for something worth saving. I held on for 14 years after I found out about a pretty sick A he had been having over a 3 year period. Even so, I still loved him and couldn't make myself quit. He never left, other than to go to work and not come home for 5 or 6 hours after he got off. I had too many small kids to go out looking for him, although I did question him about it. He has lied to me repeatedly, cheated, hit me and been very emotionally abusive to both myself and the kids. I don't know how to tell you to let go and stop loving him, but I will tell you I paid a very high price to wade through this. They say love is a choice or an act of your will, but I could not help how I felt for him. Believe me, if he keeps hurting you, you will eventually stop loving him the way you do now. I had to take the facts and look at them really hard to be able to let go. Some times the things we think we want just end up costing us too much in the end. Once I was able to let go of what I thought was my love for him, I was much stronger. I thought I needed his love and devotion to survive. In a sense, I was as sick as he was. We need food water and shelter to survive. We don't need someone, who treats us bad, with us to survive. Once I let go, he did change but i'm not sure how I feel is going to change enough to make a great marriage. But like you, I still don't know how to control who I love. Maybe I just need more time to see that this big change is not a temporary fix to keep me and that he is sincere and it is going to last. He has done this before, only to go back to how he was as soon as I let my guard down. Sometimes I think we are better off without what we think we want.
Free

Hi wgtt. I was feeling very stuck yesterday and your post caught my attention. I also have a business, which I envisioned at the beginning to be run as a h/w team. At this point, I'm doing ALL of it, and H lives elsewhere. I grew accustomed to his callous disregard and neglect. Imagine my surprise when he actually said some kind words to me last month! Mentally, I had been leaving a door open for him, and it was steadily closing as the 6-month mark of separation drew near. Wouldn't you know, he starts being mr nice guy! It's been very successful at keeping me off balance.

You didn't mention much about the state of your business. Oddly enough for me, new opportunities were knocking at my door just weeks after H moved out. My ability to handle the monthly budget is doing fine. That's the good news. The bad news is my apparent inability to retrieve my passion and desire for my work. It's nothing short of a miracle that I even *have* a business at all! Over the last two days, I had a pressing need to upgrade a message board that was getting trashed by people posting obnoxious messages.

At one time, I loved my work. These days, it's like pulling wisdom teeth with my bare hands. My *desire* to do my work withered into dust a couple of years ago. I keep hoping it'll come back, but I feel stuck every time I sit at the computer. I hear my H's voice every time. He told me repeatedly over the years that I don't have what it takes to be successful in business, that I'd be nowhere without him, that I need to go out and get a "real" job (despite the fact that I was already running the business AND working parttime outside the home while he stayed home to take care of the garden and create a website that self glorifies his gardening ability). If the garden counts as an OW, then I have one outside my door 24/7! He also told me I'd never be able to mow lawn by myself, wouldn't be able to even START that mower, let alone push through our St Augustine grass. Well, I CAN start the mower, and I can push it through the grass. I LOVE to mow! I don't hear his voice in my head anymore when I mow.

I've been wrestling with getting his voice out of my head when I do my computer work. Two years ago, I wasn't a prayerful person. I've been at it for two solid years now, often feeling like I can't hear any answers. Last month, I read Stormie Omartian's book "Just Enough Light for the Step I'm On". There's a chapter on surrendering dreams. I've been so distraught over my lack of interest in my work, I've been surrendering my hopes, dreams, pain and disappointments daily ever since. If it's God's plan for me to be without a marriage, a home, an occupation, I'll gladly accept that outcome in exchange for some peace of mind and a sense of purpose. I kept telling myself I *should* be able to get my H's voice out of my head.

Last night I had a turning point. I heard a voice saying "you can do it." It came just moments after I decided that I need to sever contact with my H. I was thinking, maybe if I tell him I don't want to see him or talk to him on the phone, maybe I could get his voice out of my head. Within moments, I heard a voice besides my H. Instead of hearing "you don't have what it takes," I heard "you can do it." Sure enough, I went to my computer and got that script upgrade happening in record time. This morning, I thought about the huge backlog of things I haven't tended to properly for quite some time. Instead of the usual sense of dread, I found myself thinking, "I can do it!" I haven't tackled it yet, deciding to post here first. It remains to be seen whether I can eliminate my backlog or not!

wgtt, my exercise in surrendering dreams has been excruciatingly painful. It's no picnic! I came to realize that part of what I was lugging around was the residual pain caused by my marriage. I would think it should be easy to get rid of such undesirable baggage, but in my case it has been very difficult. I think I'm making progress. I feel more peace today than I have in a long time. I hope my babbling about my own situation might help shed some light on what's keeping you stuck. It's terrible being stuck! I hope you can get unstuck asap.

Free Indeed,

It sounds like you have the right attitude about what is going on:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> If he is not sincere and reverts back to being what he was, I know exactly what I will be doing and I will be ok with it. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Leaving it in God's hands and not getting your expcetations up. Accepting whatever happens.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I'm trying not to consider leaving because I believe it will never work out if I keep that on my mind, </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">There are some on these boards that sabotoge their own recovery because in the back of their mind they are saying "This isn't going to work out anyway." It is hard not to do in MHO but by asking God to direct our thoughts.... we should be on the right path.

Daybreak,

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> How do I stop loving the jerk?

</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">That is a good question <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

I spent 18 hours driving yesterday and am exhausted today. The good thing was that I listened to Bob Proctors tapes The success series One of the tapes was on confidence & it mentioned that some people lack the confidence in themselves to leave a destruction R and seek love and freedom. That if we don't take a risk, we don't build confidence and consequently confidence. He had a point. I had to ask myself if I was holding back out of fear (rationalizing) or did God truley want me to wait for another time. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

Lonesome heart,

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> my exercise in surrendering dreams has been excruciatingly painful. It's no picnic! I came to realize that part of what I was lugging around was the residual pain caused by my marriage. I would think it should be easy to get rid of such undesirable baggage, but in my case it has been very difficult. I think I'm making progress. I feel more peace today than I have in a long time. I hope my babbling about my own situation might help shed some light on what's keeping you stuck. It's terrible being stuck! I hope you can get unstuck asap.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Thanks, I know part of it is just going through what you have to go through, and there is no short cut.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> You didn't mention much about the state of your business </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">YUK !!! It is a disaster !!! I am hoping to refinance the house to keep the IRS away and make a dent on the creditors. This situation will probably force a resolution to this limbo.

In our case, WH is the technical person and a fantastic sales person. I take care of the administration. Our business skills compliment one another extremely well . Somewhere ther is an answer of how I can help support me and the kids. There are very few good paying jobs where I am. Right now, I work from my home and that is what I would like to continue doing.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> heard a voice saying "you can do it." </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Thats great. I have been saying that to myself even though I don't totally believe it. I have done that with mechanical things (WH used to take care of that) I am learning slowly but surely.

It's great that you have replaced the old tapes in your head with new ones. Stormie O has some great books and is a big inspiration. I haven't read that particular one.

Thanks for reminding me what I already know what to do actually none of this is rocket science, but when emotions are so raw, it seems like it.

God Bless,

D. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

<small>[ August 05, 2002, 04:27 PM: Message edited by: WillGetThruThis ]</small>