As all know here, tonight was so hard for me. For last year as planes were crashing, I was in a divorce attorney's office signing away my family, my marriage and life as I knew it.

My STBX had my son for weekend visitation which turned into an extra few days. That did not set will with me, but let it slide. Then when WH was at old home in TN but a few miles from OW's house, I knew in my heart that contact would be initiated. I had placed in my last documents that son not be around OW. It has been so very difficult for him. Anyway, WH has said he had a cold and was feeling bad so I knew what that meant. OW is a drug rep. She is supposed to give them to docs not out serving as a pharmacy herself dispensing them when she doesn't have any medical training or degree. It was so obvious.

I asked H the other day when he called, very nicely if he had seen OW. Answer was no. Then he got out of the blue very angry and hung up the phone.

Flash forward. H drops off son today at my home. He did not bring him to school. Said he wanted to spend time with son. I don't like this b/c I am in plan B now. I need to know if I need to send another B letter or something. Or do my actions just do this? Anyway. H gives me wierd look, that stupid puppy dog look and then walks out. I did not really engage him in conversation at that point. He leaves and then son and I are playing, having fun. Son then says he has a secret. That daddy wanted him to keep it. That it was about the MONKEY. Told son there are no secrets between he and I. Son then preceeded to tell me that he saw her, went to her house and then saw her dog. Says he doesn't like her and doesn't want to have to play at her house anymore. I was livid. He and OW are supposed to be broken up for the last several months as per his teary, heartbroken phone call to inform me of this.

I proceed to not LB as much as I would want to, and just phoned H on cell to let him know I was aware and that not only had my wishes be disrespected, that our son was being encouraged to not tell the truth. H then said he and OW were "just friends now" and that she would be a good friend maybe indefinitely but just that. Truth is she dumped him earlier on. I am not going to let either of them off on this one now b/c my son isn't going to be any more of a victim of this fiasco any more. I told H that I don't care what excuses you use anymore, that I just simply will not buy the new age mumbo jumbo about things being over before Ms. Monkeyho arrived. The facts simply speak for themselves. He then says and rambles on and on about how there can be no "new beginning" (new age crap) for us and no chance of renewed relationship or friendship whatever between us until D is resolved. How convenient. We must simply spend more $$$ D'ing so we can begin anew. How very Hallmark.

Decided to bury this M for good. It is hard and I will continue to grieve, but went to church tonight for memorial service. It was definitely part of God's plan for us. Went tonight and it was packed. After the service was winding down, the minister asked each person to introduce themselves to the others around us and also say where we were and what we were doing when the events of 9/11 happened. There was a very nice guy in front of me and another couple with kids. They asked me and my eyes welled up with tears. I told them. They couldn't believe it. But the guy looked at me and said, I went through this very thing three years ago. Care to talk about it/pray about it later on?

Anyhow, then minister told us that each of us has their own 9/11. He read excerpts from Lisa Beamer's book. Just like her husband Todd, what will we do when that 9/11 arrives in our lives? Are we willing to stand up and do what is right, no matter how hard or difficult? Are we willing to sacrifice the easy way for the right way for those we love? Are we willing to stand up and say "LET'S ROLL"? Minister said his 9/11 came in 1971 when his father left his mother for another woman and emotionally abandoned his family. Those words pierced thru my soul. Then the tears came. It was if God was saying, listen now, this is relevant to you and is important..

Anyway, I am not going to let this pain for my son go on any more. ADVICE PLEASE ON HOW TO BEST HANDLE THIS. While I am in B, I want to not LB and just finish this D. H is waaaaay back in la la land and fog. Fog is definitely rolling around. Thick like pea soup.

Last night was like a funeral service for me. I have to lay this to rest. It is broken, horribly twisted, my M. It is dead, basically. Only God can bring back the dead so I am resigning that my actions wil probably do little if anything. But will do B b/c that will help me keep proper focus now. Focus is on son, healing, and doing what is right for him. Did get to say one thing to H before on phone. He wondered how I could forgive. Why I was willing so often to try to work on M? I said, when people are in the middle of something like an A or are in middle of a crisis, they do not act as themelves. They do horrible things that are counter to themselves. Said I was going to be as kind as possible but not buy nor understand nor rationalize these reasons he had given and that excuses just don't fit into my life anymore. He seemed somewhat to understand, despite fog. He then said, we'll see.

Back to later on. After the service, this really nice guy asked if son and I had eaten and I said that we were on our way. He asked if he could join us and just maybe talk to let me know whwat had helped him. His W had A's with people from an AA support group. His W had hidden alcholism from him for years. He was very successful, only a few years older than me, and cute, but that's beside the point. Went to a place nearby where son and I (we go there after church alot) play the fun video games and game stuff. Told son at dinner that this is just a friend from church and that he wanted to just eat with us. I am careful with boundaries. Son got up right beside table and played video games with a friend's son from church. Alot of people from church go there w/families b/c it is so close by. Anyway, he and I briefly talked and he gave me some scriptures he ha claimed. He said to give this time, just like with a death. Son then had to go to bathroom, so I we nt with him. Came back and this gentlemen had paid our tab. I said that I insisted on paying him back,as that I had money with me and didn't want to feel kinda wierd about that. But he said that is what a gentlemen would do when eating with a lady. A lady. To hear that from another grown man fully aware that my own H had not respected me for so long now. Son and I went home. This nice guy gave me his card and asked if I wanted to talk to please call him. He knows I am not ready to date. Made that fully clear. But God opened my eyes last night. I am worthy. I did my best. I am a good mother. I was a good wife. I was faithful. I can say without a doubt, "Let's Roll" now.

Please pray for us, for H still. We must never stop praying for our WS. Pray for OW. Pray God change them. I will probably pray this prayer until God indeed answers and intervenes. Until then, I will just post here and stay strong. Do I approach OW with my disapproval of her violating my attorney's written statement to H's attorney about OW not seeing son? How to do that? OR not to?

Am going to bed for two more hours' sleep now.

Hey Peachy!

First: talk with your attorney about the monkeyho breaching the terms of the agreement, and see how you can hold the X accountable. It is cheesey in the extreme that he asked your son to keep this crap a secret! What a great example (yech!!) Like you told me, don't let them fool you, they always want control and they lie and manipulate to get it.

Second: It sounds like you are really starting your new life! I need to get to that point too.
I am glad you have met someone in the right environment. I truly hope you can find happiness now.

BTW...I called STBX and reminded her about signing papers. I mentioned e-mail communication to her (as recommended by GIIC). Before I hung up, I asked her if Joey's last name was Buttafuco or Dirt <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> . She got really peevish. I started to laugh really hard (I couldn't help it!). She said "Well just wait till you start dating some fat cow!" I kept laughing and said "I won't be doing that crap for a loooong time". When she asked why I said: "When you get bit by a dog, it takes a long time to heal". She got really PO'd and told me to stop harrassing her. I kept laughing for some reason! I guess I was in a really good mood...I was not mad at all!

Take care a God Bless Peach!!! God will get you through this!!!

Pete

It's quittin' time. Just got home. This was a wierd morning. First got a call about 15 min. from work from StBX. He calls to confirm that he is "just friends" with Monkeyho. And then says he did not want to mean any "disrespect" to me for having son over there and that they are only "friends" now. Yea, and my dog just sprouted wings...

Then he starts a babbling. Starts a bit on the we had nothing lie. The we weren't friends bit. The we were over for so long bit. And then....He starts in saying that I had been friends with some guy (?). And then says that we can have no "new beginning" and start over as friends and then whatever (date?) until the D is done. Oh, that's really good. We can start over. Gee, I didn't know that was all part of getting a D. So I tried to use reverse psychology to him. Good for foggy babblers. Use it in fact when talking to son and he gets irate (age 4).

When he said that we should get this D done and then we can get around to building a new something or whatever between us I said, "sure" "sounds great". He was babble -less. Nothing. Speechless. Decided to just agree. It was so wierd. On one hand, he wants monkeyho to be around as his "special friend" and me to be his other "special friend" and whatever? Oh, I did say this after he was speechless. Told him that (THIS PART IS IMPORTANT GUYS) I thought this was all great and I wished I could just agree with him about Monkeyho, but the past speaks for itself and "it is what it is". That is a great line. Kinda fogs your point and makes it without even explaining it. It is what it is. Babbled right back. BUT HE LISTENED...Told him that although I appreciate where he's coming from (agreement part), I just am not going to accept any more excuses from either him or from myself anymore about anything(the I reject your excuses part). Told him "IT IS WHAT IT IS". Told him that HE DIDN'T EVEN KNOW ME ANYMORE (the I am fogging you now part). That if he wanted to become my "friend" he'd have to expend the time and energy in doing so b/c I am MAKING NEW FRIENDS ALL THE TIME. That there are so many new things I've found out about myself and if he didn't find out, then it would be his loss. Agreed that D would be done asap and that I would call my lawyer and light a fire. That my freedom under such circumstances was a GOOD THING.

Yes, siree. It was so refreshing to see him to admit that "we in fact, had been getting along a bit better recently". In saying that he had just disproved his idea that we were not friends. Despite the fact that I have NEVER GIVEN ACCEPTANCE AND ONLY GIVEN FIRM DISAPPROVAL OF HIS LIFE CHOICES REGARDING MARRIAGE AND PARENTING, he admitted this. I din't cave in on anything at all and yet things are somewhat improving. Not that reconciliation is possible, but that I am improving on the part of myself standing up for me and for son. Like the part of the song by Destiny's Child--"Baby..Can you handle this? I don't think you can handle this." This is my new approach. MB principles and a distant B. When contact, the NEW ME and no AFFIRMATIONS OF HIS CHOICES except my following through with D. Ended by saying he wanted things to , GET THIS FOLKS--see if I improve after the D and see if "I HAD REALLY CHANGED" (as if I had been the one who had violated our marriage vows and cheated, lied, etc.). Wow, he does have the serious case of THE FUNKY FOG. TFF. That is the condition we can now call it. Then he went on and said that we had to D b/c so much had gone on so bad this whole year (really? I didn't notice ha ha) and I AGAIN AGREED. He then posed a unique question. "Why would you ever be interested in me or why should I be interested in you after all the bs?" I responded that "PEOPLE WHO HAVE A'S OR OTHER EXCUSES FOR LEAVING A M ALL FIND OUT IF THEY CHOOSE TO THAT D IS HARD AND MAKES NICE PEOPLE LIKE ME A TOUCH NASTY". And then I said that even nice people will become not so nice when a D is in progress. That just happens when a M breaks up." Said it without any emotion. Let him know that it "IS WHAT IT IS". He agreed. This was sooo wierd.

And the guy I met last night is very nice, but I am not ready to date and he knows it. Getting ready to meet a girlfriend and she and I are taking son to the greenbelt where we will walk fast/jog and he will ride his bike. Get into that "bootielicious" shape I once had and will soon regain. Then maybe a date or something.

After the most horrific night of mourning and praying, God has restored my faith and my resolve and turned the switch for my brain back into the "on" position. I will continue to be the good and responsible mother who will make good decisions and wil not be swayed to accept his choices. And I do think that STBX may not now or in the future "Be able to handle this".

It is soooo strange. He called actually to sort of apologize in as I would call it, Bill Clintonese. Then I decided to stick the fog back. Roll the fog in on him for a change. See how he likes it. Could I be walking into the fog? It's gettin' grey here folks. Just kidding, I won't compromise anything. This wonderful idea worked great. Agree with WS then turn it into YOU being the one verbally in charge. They get all wierd and strange when we do this.

So here is the new equation for verbal success when dealing with T.F.F. (THE FUNKY FOG) and those who are suffering with this horrible syndrome.. One 1) Agree with them and say you understand their feelings on their ridiculous beliefs/rationalizations 2)Then slide in your truth--the "but I will not allow this to be validated"part in. 3)Finish with some "Funky Fogese" back at them totally off of the subject but positive about you and "your new life and how you are just doing so well". And somewhere slide in the line "IT IS WHAT IT IS".

Verbal example: " I can totally understand that you felt we were just not close anymore so you started seeing Ms. Monkey, but I cannot allow that to become something I accept morally. It isn't the right thing, even after all the thinking I've done. It is what it is. Plus I am moving on now,and I've got to go. You couldn't even possibly know me at all now. Not after all these awesome changes I've gone through. You think you know Ms. Monkey? Well try to see if you know me at all anyymore. Yep, it's for the best. See ya, I'm off to the gym. Co ed spin class."

This could be so awesome when used at an appropriate time. I will do this all the time. Just remember the equation and practice it in all situations. They will hang up their phone, walk away from our doors shaking their heads in confusion. They won't get us anymore. No possible logical explanation for us. We are no longer nags, bores, or old playing records. We "SORT OF AGREE" with part of what they are saying and we do understand them yet don't accept it and feel good about ourselves. How could that possibly happen to a BS? It just isn't conceivable.

But try it. I feel good.

My goodness, all this time I forgot I had a minor in psych....

Hi Peachy
Just a quick note to say how I was blown away by your posts. How totally encouraging Wednesday night was for you! I know you feel so validated (you always were, but it's great to hear it from someone who's new to you). And reading it here will give so many others (myself included) hope! That's great <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Last 9/11 I was in marriage couseling, had just found out about his EA two weeks before. And his EA was in NYC, so there will always be that memory for me too.

I love your TFF acronym...The Funky Fog...so you are teaching "The Funky Fog Talk" (TFFT)I've been reading other fog babble threads here, and they are helpful. I like your acronym though.

Thanks for sharing!

LOL,,,GO PEACHY,,I have to hand it to you,,thats awesome,,,and I am promiseing myself,that next time WH has something to say to me,im going to use it,I wonder if our stbxh's have been takeing notes together or something? WOW,,the fog is all consuming..

Getting ready for school/work. Am so happy to have son back.

Why is it that I am so brave yet in the mornings are full of dread. Does anybody else always wake up with the morning dread thing? And is anyone else always tired? I know that tired is understandable esp. if you are the primary and work as well. A full time mom working 30 hrs./week. No relatives near to help when I say that I'd like some. And the only pseudo relatives I have are enabling their son (My IL's) to continue down this path he's already own.

Just want to know that I am normal. That this morning dread is normal. I have it every day even when I am feeling pretty good as the day goes on. Mailed off check yesterday to lawyer. Know this will all be over sooner. I am dreading even thinking about Christmas or the holidays this year. I informed lawyer of husband's antics while with son over weekend. Try to note everything. It's easier this way. I am always scarred he will turn into the monster side that is always lurking below. Sometimes he can be so nice and then if I cross him, here it comes. In July, as you know, he tried to take primary custody away from me but was not successful.

Just some thoughts and the question of morning dread. God will get me/my son through this.

Not 'dread' so much, as just waking up feeling exhausted because of the stress load. Like, Yeeha I get to deal with XH's cr@p again today!! Yippee! ;}

I have had a lot more anger lately than I've had in a long time, toward him for his ongoing harrassment. I wish he could let go. I am more than ready. But, it burns him that I have a relationship; he's already tried to interfere with that (remember the cell phone call?) ... he just isn't ready to move on. I mean, I'm glad for all of womankind that he's not out there looking for the next Mrs. Humperdinck, but ... at some point he'll stop obsessing over how to control me, right??!

Thanks princess. Can I join the kingdom? You have a great th read going there and so much fun. What was up w/the cell call? I forgot? Anyhow glad to hear a new prince is in waiting for you! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> Anyway here goes from today.

Got to work and guess what? Another call from StBX on cell phone. Had to leave me a message b/c I was starting an iv on my patient for a procedure. He's learning about having to wait now. Anyway, he calls back and says he has to work late but will be around this weekend. That he will not make it in time to drop off $$$ for son's tuition at school but will come OVER and drop it by this weekend, because he will be hanging around his house. I did the new thing again. Agreed, then agreed b/c he didn't try to push stupid new age denial and philosophy on me this time. I am thinking it is along lines of conditioning. If you do good, I will return it with a word of approval, etc. Then he briefly talks about switching weekends b/c he has to go out of town for business and I again agree with him. Yikes! He is still nice. Then I pull the wierd phrase when somehow he gets around to our D. IT IS WHAT IT IS...Then I talk about all the changes I am and have gone through and then kinda wierd him out. He tells me to have a really good weekend and we are off the phone.

So here is the dilemma. I AM SUPPOSED TO BE IN PLAN B. I do not talk about relationship, just that I AM CHANGING AND IT IS GREAT. Only discuss parenting or $$$ really. OK. So he is dropping by to drop off the $$$ to reimburse me. What do I do? I don't want another repeater of last week. After all, I am doing the B. Or should I? This is all wierd and strange. He lives about 3 miles away and that's actually too close for me right now and considering things just "are the way they are" ha ha. Anyhow, I know this is MB site but I also know that in reality StbXH is not repentant, not agreeing to any kind of thing except things his way and has tottered off into the fog again last week. So....What do I do? I could just do as I always do and briefly see at door and be looking my best and smile and accept the check and shut the door. That was the extent of my effort until I made the mistake and let him spend the night last week when he asked to come over.

Advice here. I do not want to totter off into any kind of fog here either. I know what he has done. I know he may still be doing it (an A) despite many protests against it. However, we are in a D now and his lulling me into a false hope/belief OW and he are history could actually hurt my case. Let me be too soft legally on him. But I will just deny it, and say it is my lawyer's doing and that a Divorce "IS WHAT IT IS".

Ok folks outside of this equation, give me some wise input. I want to be doing the B yet maybe a distant A. He doesn't respond at all unless there is tiny aspect of A around. However, I will not LB, just will not accept any excuses or rationalizations. Until two weeks ago, we basically were only communicating via email and short but rude phone conversations. I was short and he'd end up being rude. Need input and analysis of the situation folks. A fellow parent and buddy of mine who's daugter is in my son's class thinks he may be wiggling or squirming somewhat in my direction. But she did say that unless he repented or wanted to express a sincere desire to walk away from fog that this was not going to be anything I should think about. I agreed with her over a diet coke and a slice of pizza this evening at chuck e cheese (gourmet cuisine to me). She thinks he may have begun thinking that he's royally screwed up. OW dumps him, W moving on with it and having a male for a friend? What would be next? He may just be wierding out b/c OW is gone. I am not a plaything nor an intermittent amusement. I am the real thing. The big cheese. And if he doesn't get it, then some other guy will one day...

Just need some thoughts and advice and plans here ok? Hope you are all having a good night. We are watching Muppets in Space and son is munching on pop tarts, milk, and leftover pizza. It's a good night. We have lots of rain and I can't wait to fall asleep. I will try to check back in w/you guys later on.

Ok "it is what it is" woman,

Remember...Plan A and Plan B are NOT about STBXH - they are both about you.

Although Plan A has been used to try an negotiate WH out of the affair, it does not truly work UNLESS WH stops the A - and that means no seeing the OW because everytime he does he goes through withdrawal.

With that said. Close your eyes and see how you feel. How does WH make you feel when you are with him? Does he make you angry? Will you LB?

People move to Plan B because they basically want to go out with a bang! They want the WS to remember them in a positive way, so that when the WS reachs their low, they can remember the happy feelings that they had with BS.

Now, with that said, Plan B is also about retaining some of that love for the WS because as long as you are around WH and he is TAKING love units then you will eventually, according to MB, lose all love and then if he wants to come back you're like - sorry babe!

So, whether you Plan A or B it's up to you. Usually you Plan B before you start divorce proceedings to give the WS the chance to see what divorce will be like, however for people getting divorced, you are usually in Plan A because the marriage is going bye bye and it's ok to lose love units because that is what you want.

It is also important to be strong in a divorce proceeding and not focus on getting WH back or you will get screwed by WS - and not in a good way. I know this personally from experience.

However, I have heard of more success stories from people who have Plan A's than Plan B'd - I think.

A general rule of thumb would be - do unto others, and if you can't then follow the ole if you can't say something nice don't say it at all rule.

Also, do what protects you emotionally. I cannot really see ExH or talk to him because it's too painful - and he's too controlling - but it's painful and I don't need to go throug hthat right now. If you are comfortable talking and dealing with WH then do it - the detachment is good too - I think what you are doing is maybe some divorce busting techniques like the 180.

It's ok to heal and move on because if the WS changes then you can always deal with that then, and you haven't wasted your life, the alternative is living in pain, always hoping and waiting for WS to come home and where will that get you?

Just some thoughts. K

<small>[ September 13, 2002, 08:22 PM: Message edited by: God is in Control ]</small>

K.--thank you very much. You are very wise indeed. And I shouldn't get anything especially a controlling WH who's still coming in and out of fog to get in the way of business at hand. Will continue on with D as if nothing has happened, and unless he changes at some point and actually does not a 180 but a 360 then I will as well. But don't really see it coming period. Just possibly more controlling behavior and his thinking it will make his Austin Powers lifestyle much better. Just think, he could have other babes and date his xW as well...La la land and fog. I don't work that way. Not a harem member. Anyhow, I see just how this could be harmful.

So I will I guess do A until it exhausts all love u nits left in me and there aren't that many left. Keep doing my "thing" with agreement but no validation and then ending on positive thing about me and life and fog him back. It is wierd but working. You sure know more than I do. Did your XH do this as well, the kinda get back or innuendo that one day he would like to and then go back into fog with Ow? Just wondering.

BTW, you are so strong and I just admire you and daily pray for you and your precious little ones. WXH of yours will be soooo sorry and probably much sooner than you can understand. I do not believe alot of people truly have BPD. It is elusive. He sounds like my STBX and there is a book called "When your Lover is a Liar" and it talks about different kinds of men who lie. Could possibly be narcissm and a touch of sociopath. That is probably more likely, but then again, I leave the diagnosis up to the experts.

Do you have my email?

Any other thoughts here? Any other opinions on what to do?

We just watched Muppets from Space and I am doing the laundry and then off to zzzzzzz. Oh, and I am going to a huge singles Bible study for 30 somethings like me on Sunday night!!!It will be so awesome to meet other people and also have the bond of faith with them...

Thanks, I don't know about wise, but I've certainly done my share of reading the MB principles, partaking of the MB counseling and posting on the MB discussion board - even the counelors at MB gave up on my ExH.

As I look back on the past year, when I was in Plan A, I thought that ExH was waffling - but he really wasn't. He just wanted to ahve his cake and eat it too. And I don't necessarily think he was being mean or malicious at the time, I jsut think that he operated on a very juvenile level -

he was hurt and was unhappy(I actually think mire due to his bad choices and absence of God and conviction in his life more than anything and an addition of ego), and here was OW with all the exciting feelings - my ExH wears his feelings on a string, he was torn initially - yes, but was being allowed to do what he wanted with me and still have her, and no one stopped him, everybody just let him do what he wanted - yes they said no, but with no consequences - kind of like when we tell the kids no, but have no follow through, so the kids keep on doing the bad thing because they can get away with it.

Then ExH basically was pressured by OW and his own fears and I wasn't helping because I was very pregnant and angry and had had enough at the beginning of the year, and you only get 6 mos. before you can file for divorce and I needed t ofile to protect myself. ExH freaked out at every stage of the divorce proceedings - he evaded service of process and thought that he was being "stalked" by the private process server. He broke into my house once to get the kids uniforms so he wouldn't have to return the kids to me. So I think he's definitely got issues to deal with especially with regard to his family - it's all coming out in my therapy.

My biggest problem at that point was actually believing that we could work together and hav ean amicable divorce - in his eyes it meant just giving in to everything that he wanted. And now I'm finding out that he can't control his bad behavior even in front of the kids - so I have to stand up to him for their sake.

It's just so hard to know what to do. I'd seriously look at his family's history and his history for clues. My Exs family were all divorced and remarried and thought the 2nd wives were better than the 1st ones - so that should have clued me in right there, although the A that my Ex had followed the Surviving an Affair story like textbook. They were soul mates and ExH has this NEED to be needed adn to TAKE, so one day he will exhaust the OW and she will be spent, as was I, and how far can one really get without God.

That's what gets me. Everyone wants me to just go with the flwo and accept his new wife and life, but if he can't go to communion(we're Catholic) then that's a BIG RED FLAG that someone's doing something wrong. But he's obviously not practicing the faith.

He has the baby for the first time overnight tonight and we'll see hoe that goes. ExH is trying so hard for control and for his image in front of OW to be this good dad. He is always wearing some sort of cologne - he used to be alergic to it when we were married, and OW showed up with him today to pick up our 3 year old and she's wearing this black low cut halter top - perfect for parenting a young child <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> - it seems they are still in the impressing ech other stage, both very insecure - she has her looks - for now and he has his money - typical superfical couple.

OK, didn't mean to go on for so long. Yes, WH's waffle and I think they are honestly confused - but you have to let them take your lead which is shape up or ship out - but in a nice way, you seem to be doing a good job. It's tough, but if they don't go to counseling then it's doubtful that the WS will ever get their act together for real - the life they lead now is just all smoke and mirrors and they aren't truly happy like we will be.

Off to bed for me too. Stay strong. K

Thanks K. Oh, and was OW's toes still flaming red w/that awful stripey thing on them like a teenager's? She was wearing that outfit for YOU and to show you that she is ALL THAT. You are still recovering from child birth and that is probably much worse for her to know. I am praying for your precious little ones. Think it is sick that OW can even be allowed to play mommy at all. She is awful. Hope all the kids are over there, there is bedlam, crayons on the wall, food spills everywhere, pets running amuck and each of them trying to control their offspring b/c their house is overflowing with kids and stuff. How can they ever get it togehter. The Brady Bunch WAS A FRICIN' TV SHOW. Not at all reality. Plus, Ms. Brady didn't wear low cut halter tops...ha ha.

You are right. They waffle. I used to call my home "livin' at the Waffle House". Told my friends that I had to leave to go home to the "Waffle House". I do not own a waffle maker. Hey, you could give that to your xH for Christmas as a gift from kids...That is a great idea. A waffle maker for King Waffle. And you could buy some toe jewelry for OW as gift from kids or a tube top waaaay too small. That would be sooo awesome.

They will reap what they sow. Your xH is headed for a fall with this OW. Keep the kids the top priority. And have you started getting out and about? You deserve to. I am going tomorrow morning to a single's bible study. That will be fun. God's all about us moving forward with HIM. With Him is the key part.

Does anybody have any other ideas? Does anyone think that WH is confused, etc.? My using plan A a good idea instead of B? I am getting a better response now. No sign of WH today,as he is supposed to be "hanging around" the area this weekend and "drop in" to bring reimbursement check.

Do wayward Men ever come back after leaving fog? How long usually after an A ends that their fog lifts? I am not waiting around for him, just praying that before I am way tooooo into moving on that WH comes to senses and realizes he has destroyed his family and finds his way. Please pray for us.

Oh, and I did get an offer for a date--I will post about this later. Turned it down and said that unless it is about ONLY about friends and meeting for sushi and a movie will I go. Just not really ready for that new guy thing at all. God hasn't placed desire for that yet in my heart.

All right I goofed up and LB'd today. STBX calls this am. It's raining cats and dogs and I am in the monhtly thing feeling well, yucky. Son and I are laying in bed watching cartoons. And he calls. Calls and says he will drop it by later this afternoon. We chat a bit and I find out he's been "visiting" the church where I am planning to go to Bible Study at. Oh, that's just great. They do have a huge singles dept. And that's probably why. Can't believe he has actually even been inside of a church personally. And I am wondering in my mind how he has turned this whole thing around. I get the new age, bull poop explanation and it gets my goat.

Here goes. We are talking about church and I tell him that I have a few reservations @ this Bible study b/c I want to go b/c I want to work on my spiritual side and not get picked up by other single guys there. Plus my single girlfriends are going to go for the same reasons as I. He then says that he has gone to the services and that he likes to just "play with their minds" when women try to hit on him at church. That made me mad. Then he goes on to say that I should be doing the following; working on "improving" myself, trying to become the best mom I can, etc. Then he says that our M was a mess from the beginning (here comes the lies) and that it was awful even up to the end and that the end was so very horrible. Ok. Here is where my LB begins and the truth does as well. First of all, we are still legally married. Secondly, I told him that I don't and will not accept excuses anymore for anything. Not from myself and not from him. The reason our M was so awful at the end was for reasons he knew all too well (his Affair) and that I am indeed improving myself but for me and that I will not tolerate any new age bull poop saying anything else and that there is JUST NO EXCUSE TO DO ANYTHING THAT IS CONTRARY TO A MARRIAGE JUST BECAUSE YOU FEEL LIKE IT. I told him I won't take his explanations ever again. Then I got upset. Didnt even get to say my famous line, it is what it is...Then I told him when my lease is up here, I am wanting to look to move further away, to another part of town in another county about an hour from here or if I feel like it, back home. Told him I am sick of living where things are familiar when nothing in my life is familiar anymore. Then he says I should enjoy living life as a single adult on my own for the first time in my life. What awful lies. I am a single adult now b/c my H thinks he is Austin Powers. Told him I don't want to live anywhere near this situation and just want to wake up to a new day where nothing is old, nothing reminds me of the dreams I once had for my family here and if I am indeed going to be that awesome single female, then I want to do it away from the Beaver Cleaver suburbs so I can embrace my singleness (my fogging him part and throwing it right back to him) and live where my single girlfriends live.

My God, this man really is either in such deep fog or his counselor has really sold him on this "it's ok to do what you've done and break up your family b/c ....." Just like the exact excuses in LMBT. The very same ones in fact he used. Reasons spouses give for cheating, divorcing, etc. I am madder than a hornet guys. I am in more than a LB'ing mood, I'm in a kickin' Austin in his privates mood. Note, I would never do such a thing in reality b/c that would only be something he could use against me.

What is wrong with these WS? How can now they even enlist the help of GOD int heir quest for ultimate hedonism? I am personally sick and disgusted by the whole thing. I have cried and am just plain mad at the thought he will come over this afternoon. So, I am going to clean up this house spotless, make myself look awesome, and make Austin see the new and powerful single me. I am not going to LB at all. Going to use up all my love left in my bank so it bounces. And then I am going to let him just go. I don't believe he is anywhere close to repentance. Nowhere close to anything. He can take his "new beginnings" and sell them to someone else. Not to me, b/c I know who he is and I know his game. I am not to be used by him. It was funny, I told him during the conversation that now it's funny b/c I can read guys much better. I can see what it is they are up to and I just laugh when they try (meeting and picking me up that is).

IF this is what Austin wanted, then he should be happy to get it. Happy that his lovely wife who was very faithful and a good mom is now single and being pursued on a daily basis by other men now. Happy b/c I am reasonably successful in my work and am respected and hold a board position for my state society. Happy b/c I am being a great mom. Let's see how Austin likes this. I will let him wallow in the fog. And next time he feels, anxious or whatever, I will tell him to call an escort service or direct him to the nearest singles' bar for help with that problem.

Living well is the best revenge. I am going to start living a new life even sooner than that. I will plan A and also do these things he's asked for. Heck, I will enjoy it.

What is wrong with these WS's so that their brains just get turned off and live so wrongly? How dare he say he is a Christian and go to church. He is doing EVERYTHING God's word says NOT TO DO and he's not only doing that, but justifying it.

Arrrrrrrrrrrrrgh! *&()^^%$^**((

Ok. No word from WS. Not since I LB'd over the phone. He owes me several hundred dollars and hope he will bring it over since I can't afford not to have it reimbursed as he promised.

Wondering if he is waiting until son is well asleep and pull what he did about a week and a half ago when he came over about eleven thirty and stayed the whole night pretending he was a H again. Hmmmm. I am just wondering. His fav. tv show sopranos, just went off and that means he may be getting about.

Did so much housework I thought I'd fall down today. But, I need the work. It is good to be busy. I am just feeling droopy now. What would you do in A? Not sure. Wondering if I let Austin come over if he tries? Not sure what to do. Cross that bridge if I get to it. That is the attitude to have. I am going to read shape magazine and place clothes in dryer and then go to bed. I hope you are all having a good night.

Had one weak moment tonight when I put son to sleep. He said, "mommy I will miss you tomorrow". You will pick me up from school the next day right? He smiled sweetly and said I love you and I miss you already. I went into other room and cried my eyes out. I am so angry at WH because of this awful pain and agony he has put my son and I through. He will just spout out another new age rationalization saying something like son won't have to ever see us fighting again (never mind the whole reason we even had arguements for the last year and a half were over another woman). His denials and rebuttals are amazing. I almost hope he doesn't try anything b/c I am not in the fuzzy warm mood. I am one tired full time mom and homemaker who's sorry to see another weekend pass by.

One day I want to have a date. A really nice one where the guy takes me to a fancy restaurant. One with candles and atmosphere. Feel like I'm in some kind of holding position like a plane waiting to land or something. I want to have love one day from a man in my life. I am actually very happy with it being just my son and I though. At least now I don't have to have the burden of wondering each night who and where my WH is and what he's doing. That is his responsibility now. Oh, and one day in the future, I will get roses again. Roses for no reason whatsoever.

Haven't had flowers or dinners or anything for almost two years now and it seems a lifetime ago. Last roses I got were actually sent to wrong address. Sent to OW and ended up at my house. On V day I got white roses in 01. A dozen. I don't like white roses. She got my pink ones instead. I never touched the last roses I got.

One day I will get them again. And they will be just for me.

Please continue to pray for son and I and of course, for my WH. Pray God open his eyes and heart before it is too late. Time is ticking and we are inching closer to the D. No court date is set yet, but my check and call to the attorney may speed this up. Pray for us. Thanks for being so kind and loving to us during this. I used to be so embarassed to post here, but now I find it a solace and a blessing as I also re read other articles by the Harleys.

Have a good monday and pray for this family. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Peachy!!!!

Way to keep venting!! Have a super day! And like they used to say in the Navy "Don't let the [censored] get you down!!!"

Your day will come...

See ya and God bless!

Pete

Hey folks...STBX is supposed to have son tonight and I am calling the preschool to make sure he did now. Austin sent an email saying he couldn't drop by last night b/c he didn't have checkbook. BS. That several benjamins is really needed and is HIS responsibility now as per court system. Anyhow, I am supposed to actually have plans tonight. He said in email to call him tonight and he will bring it by or something. But...I have plans. I am not going to be home tonight.

Have agreed to have a late snack and a margarita with a guy I am friends with. Just a friend thing. That is all. He said that I should just go out so that when I actually have a date one day, that I won't wierd out in the presence of a male. Plus he said it would be good for Austin to know I am not at home for a change. No more sittin' around waiting or not waiting for him to come by. Or for him to call, or for him to do anything at all. No longer waiting, that's it. Wonder if his OW is accompanying him on a business trip? Hmmmm. Used to be her m.o. She'd get a free trip and Austin would get a free _ _ _ _. That was the way it worked in the past. I have read the book by Dr. Phil while at work and it is awesome! I also listened to a motivational tape and I am ready to fog the fogger once and for all...

I would love, do not get me wrong here, for this M to work itself out somehow, but realize that WH is not taking any accountability for his own actions and is blaming and rationalizing all of it. That is not productive and he is living in total denial of reality. So whenever he tries it with me, I will use my formula in a paragraph. The understanding part, the truth and how his rationalizations don't fly anymore part, the it is what it is bit, ending with the I am fogging you part to utterly confuse Austin. We should call this approach, Reality Fogs the Fogged. This is good especially b/c Austin has a very bad case of T.F.F. which is acute and can be fatal to any relationship. Med humor ha ha. It is diagnosed with a unrelenting distortion of truth combined with a total denial of all reality and consequences. This should actually be a real psychological diagnosis in the med books folks.

Here is a bit of what I read. This book has been so good for helping me somewhat get on with things. I will give you the paragraph that has spoken volumes of truth to me: "What most people want is not truth, but validation. They want reinforcements for their thinking, right or wrong. They seek out the people and the information that support the conclusions they have already reached, factual or otherwise (this could be the OM or OW). The only things they want to hear are things that make them feel good, that give them comfort about WHO OR WHERE THEY ARE RIGHT NOW."

Is this right in line with MB and the principles concerning those who are in A's and are recklessly shattering our lives around them? They want the whole world to believe their b.s. They want us to accept their bended truth and their twisted morality. We are supposed to move on and be friends believing that in the end, this new kind of relationship between no more marriage partners but parenting partners (as the new age butt heads say) is a good thing. We are to accept this load of bull poop, swallow it whole and smile. Denying denying denying all the time.

I am not denying anything anymore. I am in a horrible M now. Why? Because instead of choosing real life with its ups and downs and addressing any marital problem head on, my H chose to go elsewhere to find understanding when he could have found IT AT HOME WITH ME SHOULD HE EVER ASKED ME TO. And when confronted with that truth, he still ran because HE WANTED THE COMPANY OF ANOTHER WOMAN. He wanted the excitement and danger an affair brought with it. He didn't want the same old wife anymore. I am far too predictable for him. Although very attractive and capable in many ways, I am not something new to be conquered and attained. So because of a CHINK IN HIS MORAL ARMOR and an unwillingness to learn from his TWO FAILED MARRIAGES NOW, he chooses to wander aimlessly into the fog and blaming and denying all the way as he wanders further and further away from his home and family.

I accept my faults. I accept whatever he may have found to be not to his liking but I AM NOT THE ONE WHO BROUGHT THIS ON. Yes, I hurt about alot of it, but I can do that and should do that because the longer I keep myself denying that this crap hurts me, then I cannot heal myself. My moral armor is still just fine in fact. I am still a good person, a great mother, and a good friend and relative to my loved ones. Only one thing has changed dramatically in my life and that thing is MY HUSBAND COULD NOT HANDLE THE LIFE OF BEING A MARRIED MAN AND FATHER PERIOD.

Didn't mean to vent here folks, just opened my eyes a bit today. We should too. This is probably the hardest part. To pull my head out of the clouds dreaming of what I'd like my life and my crumbling M to become, when it simply IS WHAT IT IS. I did my very best. My best was indeed good enough for both me and my son and my best will suffice now, today and tomorrow. However, I am formally letting Austin know today in one way or another that this poor defensless little former housewife is no longer either poor or defenseless. The old me is deciding to emerge after an almost 9 year sabbatical. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> As the drunken crop duster pilot says to the aliens in "Independence Day" --- I'm baaaaaack!!!.

Peachy,
You go girl!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

I say the same thing exactly = my ex was "NEVER" the marrying kind. He wanted the wife, kids, home, and wanted to play around like a single, care-free guy!! Go out all the time to bars with his friends, 6 or 7 weekend trips through the year (without me and the kids, of course). And that is exactly what he did. There was never one in particular OW, i think there were several. He is not the "commiting kind either"!! I think he felt he was free to date or see whoever, and do whatever he wanted.

I took 11 years of that nonsense, that was enough for me.