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#735558 09/24/02 06:35 AM
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Hello all,

I am not this second seperated but we are at a point in the road that it's now or never.

Some things have been happening lately that have broken trust and we've had these serious trust issues for our 12 yrs of being together, it does get too hard to heap something else up on that pile.

I'm at a point where I need to make a decision, I know I cannot live always wondering if he will cheat. Not trusting anymore because he did something so out of his character, and living with the knowledge that a neighbor in question seems to have a crush on him. It's gotten to be too much for me to bear.

I'm am almost too afraid to leave. Have any of you knew that it wasn't just going to be a seperation that if one left that was it, the seperation itself would in fact be a problem of trust as well and you couldn't go back to it? That is where I am, I know what it will be like if I decided not to go on...it will be much more of the same, him not trying, him not being there to help me through it only becoming very angry, and me being insecure to sickness. That is not how I envisioned my life to be.

Nor did I envision my life to be seperate from him, this is a man who has not tried to save our marriage ever. He said he is not the fighting type, meaning fighting for our marriage. I feel cheated, like I never dreamed in a million years I'd ever get divorced but it is just around the corner because we have run out of tape on this relationship. It's do it now, or wait be miserable then end up doing it anyway....

I am so afraid with 3 small children, not that I can't work, but I am afraid of being alone for the rest of my life. I had aunts that have been divorced with multiple children and they never truly found true love, they wandered in relationships here or there but never had anything significant and now they are in thier 70's and had 30 long years of lonliness. I am afraid of ending up like that, all I want to do is to be happy. I stayed in my marriage as long as I did because I am so fearful of the lonliness that lingers for years and years. There is not fairytale in divorce I know that, but are there happy stories someone can tell for a mom with 3 children? Please someone give me some hope, or will I be burying my chance for love and happiness if I were to divorce? I'm so hurt and so confused...

Toni

#735559 09/24/02 10:17 AM
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Toni -

It sounds like you are already alone.

And by staying in the marriage, well then you do not even have the opportunity of not being alone, and finding someone else.

Their are two choices either try to continue to work on the marriage or not.

And who is to say that your H will even decide to stay in the marriage? If someone has a crush on him, then he very well have an affair and decide to leave and then you will have absolutely no choice in the matter.

Right now it sounds like you need to get some counseling to get yourself stronger and able to make some good decisions for yourself and your family.

You may also want to spend some time trying to get yourself ready for the work force - get some training or schooling so that you will be able to support yourself. You also need to protect your assets in the marriage.

You need to take a look at the reality of teh situation and find someone to help you make some practical decisions. And if you are not ready, then strengthen yourself so that you can handle what is to come.

Divorce is AWFUL! It's HORRIBLE, and difficult to get through if ou are not prepared. Remember too that you will need thousands of dollars for attorneys.

I would try some of those books like from Susan Page about how one of you can bring the two of you together or Divorce Remedy by Michelle Wiener-Davis. If there is anyway to save the marriage then I'd be trying - even if it was while I was making plans for divorce. All the studies say that if you can make it through the rough times the married people are even happier than they were before - but it does take two.

Pray about it and hang in there. K

#735560 09/24/02 01:01 PM
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Hi Toni

I am a mom with three children.

I don't post often these days, but I do tend to ramble...warning.

I guess each of us know when we are "done". Are you really sure you are there yet? You said in your post that what your husband did as "something so out of his character" That may be a really good thing Toni. I mean, serial cheaters do have a rather sneaky way about them and their CHARACTER is what is at question here. Does your husband have a good basic CHARACTER? Could this have been a one-time thing, and he is foggy and maybe he will be back someday. Only you know...but really know before you say you're done. We want to get through this mess with as few regrets as possible, and you don't want to regret not giving it your all. You sound very tired right now.

On the other hand...I am a divorced mother of three (teens) after a twenty year marriage. I met a man at a time when I had no business dating, I was seperated for 8 months and not yet divorced (gulp). One year and 9 months later we are living together, madly in love, hope to be together forever. No marriage plans yet because I receive spousal maintenance and can't marry until it's over, and that is years away. I know, living together is a bad example for teens, I hope they understand.

My ex-husband is engaged to and living with OW(#2).

It's been a long, sad road. My kids will never be the same. I hope and pray every day that I have made decsions that will not hurt them. Thankfully they are pretty wild about my b/f and he has been careful not to try to "father" them.

I warned you that I go on didn't I?

You know, it will never be the same as having the
family you envisioned. To be honest, sometimes it all feels like the life I'm living is second best. Money is a struggle. The kids emotions are all over the place. But it does get a little easier after time (a long time) and it does feel good to have someone love you and say all the wonderful things to you that you deserve to hear.

life goes on...don't worry about being alone. You will find so much strength in what you can accomplish on your own you will amaze yourself. Wait a bit to find someone to love, but they're out there too. There are plenty of men that have been hurt and need us too you know.

Give your marriage some time though. If and when you're ready to quit, you'll know. You won't need anyone else's opinion. Something inside just shuts down and you know you could never ever love that person the way you did again.

best wishes to you
allison

#735561 09/24/02 01:39 PM
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I love him to death, I'm in love with him the problem is with him not acting like he loves me. I guess I could settle for the rest of my life and nothing change. I "know" now that nothing will ever change, I can predict my future with my h.

I've only been married 11.5 yrs been together 12, out of all this 12 yrs I have never seen him cheat. I think his character is great, he's a wonderful man but wonderful man, wonderful friend doesn't always equate to wonderful husband. My family loves him, I love him everybody loves him and blames me for everything but not one of them has been married to this man.

He has been addicted to pornography addicted may be a strong word but he lied about it a lot in the past, and at the same time he was also not a very sexually driven man that would continually turn me down. That did little or nothing for my self esteem and did no good in showing me he loved me and wouldn't cheat on me. He did things to break us down, and never did anything to help me through things or to help build us back up. He is the type that just goes with the flow on everything if I'm withdrawn he goes his own way, if I'm really trying he is there when he can be or if he notices.

I just know he'll never fight for us. He told me this morning in a talk that he has tried to change to be more of what I need, he's tried and tried but can't. He explained we must be incompatible, I said yes many married people are incompatible but you sacrifice a little on the imporpant things and try to find a happy medium. Everything goes right over his head, he don't communicate well at all, he'd rather go bye bye emotionally and when asked to go to counseling he says he will but never makes any attempt. We were in counseling before and he quit, he says counseling makes us worse.

When I asked him two days ago to leave...he said okay, just tell me when and you know you have to get a job because I can't do everything on my own. That kind of response just tells me he is not in it, he don't care one way or the other if were together or not. It's hard to accept..I love you, but not feel it much, I want to be with you, but feel more like an convenience.

I'm not here asking anybody if I'm ready, I'm so afraid. I'm afraid of missing him for the rest of my life because I am in love with him, but on the flip side this is destroying who I am. Staying any longer in this marriage means to sacrifice who I am, and to just deal with it. I've already sacrificed too much and I feel like it is time to think about me.

Thanks for your input it really is very appreciated. Thanks again...Toni

#735562 09/24/02 02:25 PM
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Toni,

This is indeed a slippery-slope. Did your husband have an affair? I take it he did not, but you think the neighbor is attracted to him. Ok...Toni, I was wrong to tell you about my new relationship. I just wanted you to know that yes, there are wonderful men out there and when a person is truly done with their marriage for whatever reasons it is possible to find love again.

Toni, what has your husband done to make you fall out of love? Is he meeting any of your needs? Does he have any idea how unhappy you are? Wouldn't he try harder if he knew.

Those of us here with husband that were unfaithful have almost all wished for the same thing from our wayward spouses...truth. With truth about how alone or frustrated they were feeling we would have had some basis to work on the marriage.

I don't come here too often anymore and I'm sure others know your whole story. Without your needs being met you and your husband are both floundering, and watch-out...affairs happen easily during these times.

I don't know if any of this helped, but I didn't want you to think another relationship would be the best thing. Please don't romanticize what the future could hold with another. Yeah, I'm very happy with my partner, but don't for a second think my children would not rather have an in-tact family.

allison

#735563 09/24/02 02:36 PM
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Just wanted to add - read the info. on this site about incompatibility.

From the number of posts that you have, you may have already done that, but I just wanted to make sure that you have actually tried the How One Of You Can Change the Other books and that you've done a Plan A - remember - that the emotions won't be ther efor either of you at first, but that things can change - and no you won't get your needs met at the beginning, but if you start to met your husband's needs then the theory is that he will automatically want to meet yours.

It has happened - go to the recovery board.

It takes a decision, remember all the love is a choice info. that you've heard.

You may want to give yourself say 6 months and really work on a plan or two and see what happens supposedly the Divorce Busting stuff works too - and it also advocates MB.

So before you throw in the towel, you may want to make one last go at it and really use a few of these techniques.

And remember - Plan A is also about you - rediscover yourself and work on you too.

K

#735564 09/24/02 06:57 PM
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I've been doing a plan A for the most part, I try to meet his needs. He just says I don't accept him the way he is, he told me tonight the he thinks I will never be happy without my needs being met and he is not the man that can do it. He's tried, and he thinks we're just incompatible. He told me he don't think I'm with him for love because I have some expectations out of marriage and those expectations are to much for him. I understand this is all about Plan A, but I can honestly say that I have been plan A'ing at the best of my ability and I have thrown myself in a place after him and many things for a long time now.

I told him that most people are incompatible but it's about compromise, he gives in a little she gives in a little and if they love eachother they can eventually find a happy medium. He said nothing, he just keeps saying that he has done all he can do. He has done nothing, he sits there and don't communicate, he rarely shows me affection, has told me he is not sexually oriented and not even sexually attracted to me but that was okay because he couldn't be attracted to anyone right now. If this is trying at the best of his ability I don't know what not trying is? He has basically given up.

The things he said I need are as follows...HIM TO SHOW ME SOMETIMES THAT HE LOVES ME AND THAT I AM A PRIORITY TO HIM. He comes home after work, he works hard he is a wonderful dad but I need to be built up sometimes when broken down, I need to have someone that will communicate back with me, someone that is interested in me sexually especially after the whole issues with porn, and someone that cares when I'm sick. He is not like that I was sick for a whole year could barely walk and he was very distant and uncaring. He didn't help with the housework and he wasn't emotionally there for me to cry on his shoulder.

I just don't think with what I do try to live with in our marriage that this should be this huge issue and him to act like I am asking for the world.

I havent fallen out of love with him he just forgot to love me...he doesn't even love me enough to fight for our 12 yr marriage.

How would y'all feel?

#735565 09/24/02 07:47 PM
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I would feel just like I do. I know what you are going through, I've been doing it for 22 years. One difference is my H always wants sex, no matter what I feel like.

I feel like he has never been there when I needed him emotionally, he has cheated, lied, been abusive and you name it but I rationalized and made excuses for him all this time and I was utterly miserable, all because I loved him. I have come to realize we can control how we act and react but I cannot control who I love.

I have stayed through better or worse because I loved him and thought I couldn't live without him nor did I want to. Even tho I didn't love what he did. I think now that I loved what I wanted it to be, which was not at all reality.

About 2 years ago I was thinking well, maybe he'll change. I had always forgiven him for everything, even though I was hurting alone. Then I thought "who am I kidding, this has been going on for 20 years, HE'S NOT GOING TO CHANGE".

So I started looking at my life instead of trying hard to forget it. It had a pattern to it. The other day I was reading about abuse. It had the some pattern to it. I walked on eggshells through the tension building phases, I cried during the blow ups, I cried some more during his remorseful phases getting hopeful that this time he was really going to change and lived for the honeymoon phases.

Your situation may not be like this exactly, but it does have a ring of similairity about it. We both love(ed) someone who we felt did not show us they loved us equally. The other thing I have been reading about is "healthy vs unhealthy" relationships. We are both in unhealthy relationships. If for no other reason we feel like we can't live without our H. Well, take it from a veteran here, things don't just get better. Sometimes, they don't change at all. I am working on myself right now and learning what ideas and practices I have that are unhealthy for me or the relationship. I am getting stonger by the day, H is still as he was. He is beginning to withdraw tho, I think it is good, as I am totaly withdrawn. ,. For so long he was my whole life and I was just a small part of his. That is unbalanced and unhealthy. It would have been more unhealthy if I was his whole life. Relationships are one place, IMO, that two halves do not make a whole. I think each partner whould be whole to start with. There are a lot of sites on the net to read about healthy/unhealthy relationships. I have given all I am going to this relationship at this point, and I too, am at the crossroad you speak of. It is so miserable to be depending on someone else to make us feel complete or happy. We have to be that on our own, and then they just add to it. When I emotionally detatched myself from H, it was tho I received an instant healing of inner pain and it was then that I started to grow. We cannot grow while we are in so much agony. I have an inner peace that I would trade for nothing. I don't think my marriage will be healed at this point or repaired. I paid a high price for trying this long and wish I had gotten out a long time ago. I just want to make sure that I have done everything I could possibly do to save it. I truly think I have. Virtually all lines of communication are gone between H and myself. He is hateful and sarcastic if he does say anything. I was very fearful of being alone too, but I am alone with him. Of course he has a different story. He thinks the problems lies with me b/c I won't mind him and do as he says. Since I don't intend to start minding him, then I am looking at other avenues.
I hope you can find the healing and inner peace I have found, no matter what you decide to do.
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#735566 09/24/02 08:46 PM
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Hi ladies. I've been 16 yrs with a man who has become more & more abusive. I understand the thoughts you're expressing here.

I just want to say that it's really important before we call it quits to consult with God about all this, & ask Him to lead. This decision to leave or stay is too big to make alone.

There is a right way to go through this.
God gave the church jurisdiction over marriage.
According to Matt. 18:15-19, you bring the offender (apathetic or abusive spouse)to accountability and Let your husbands make their choice with full understanding of the consequences. Will they choose to hear the truth, grow, and rebuild love or be hard-hearted? And God will be with us, regardless of our husbands' choice. Our confidence must be in HIM to give us a future & hope.

My H has been brought to accountability, and he says he can't change and then he filed for divorce.

We should not make these decisions alone and without the support of the church. I pray God brings wisdom, direction, & peace to your hearts as He is daily giving to me! It is not an easy road, but HE longs to be close to us through it.
Hugs to you!
Love,
Renae

#735567 09/24/02 10:34 PM
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That is what my h is saying he has done all he can do, he can't change, he is not the man for me. I have a lot of things to ask God for fogiveness and I will start with this now. I asked God so many times for my marriage to improve and I wonder if that is what my h is seein now that he cannot change to stay married.

Thankyou too indeed, I'm sorry you've been married so long and still not happy, I know a couple married 40 yrs and there is no communication and they don't even sleep at the same time him up all night she is sleeping. It's sad but just because you've been toghether for so long doesn't mean your marriage was magical. I hope things will work out for you eventually as well with all your heartache and hard work you really deserve this mans love.

I am more hurt because he is just like "okay"...he is throwing us away, showing little to no emotion like he wanted this. I feel like all the pain and heartache I endured was all in vain, these past 12 yrs seems like a lie. I love him still...more than I even understand. My friends don't understand why but I do, and my love has never lessened only grew greater. All of this feels fake, like pinch me and wake me up. I'm depressed, I'm actually worried about my state of mind right now I've never felt this low in my life.

Thanks again for posting y'all, I don't know any other way but out right now. With no job, no schooling, no job history. Am I destined to fail? How can he do this to me...How could I have meant so little? I am just very naive.

Toni

#735568 09/25/02 08:45 AM
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Hi all,
Excellent point Renae. I have prayed so much on this issue that I feel God saying "I've already given you my answer" I have consulted with my pastor, who by the way after hearing all, knows my H and actually likes my H, has advised me to at least get a seperation. My IC is a Christian also and she told me I need to get out. As she put it to me, the Bible speaks of Divorce only three times and says God hates divorce. However it speaks of evil and sin frm G to R and God says to flee from evil. I know with out a doubt, at least in my case, I have the OK from God himself to get out. I feel it in my spirit and we have been over this many times, trust me.
But this is an excellent thing to remember for all of us. One of the reasons I stayed so long is I feel like Satan himself has been trying to destroy us since we got married and I refused to let him win. However, my H seems bent on helping him out. I don't feel like I have given up without a fight, I am just to the point that there is nothing here that is worth taking every ounce of me to save. The thing that bothers me about my situation is this; It so much seems like my H is two very different people. One of them is nice and the other isn't. One of them is rational and realistic and the other one isn't. However they both lie, yell, hit, don't have a kind thing to say about any of us.

I have caught him in the middle of some pretty bad acts, and he just lies and says that's not what's going on.

Yes, I put up with a lot of stuff from him, to the point of thinking I was going crazy, in the name of love and religion. He is also a very negative person who says that everyone and everything is stupid, calls people morons etc. Out life has had a very profound effect on my kids. One is very withdrawn and extremly sensitive, the next one all but hates him, the next one is so much like him and my D can't wait for him to leave. In the long run, I have to ask myself what is mor important, my kids lives and well being or the institution of marrige. I am picking my kids lives, if that's not right the me and God will take care of my mistake.

I know what the Bible says about marriages and divorce. However I also know that if you do not have love, you have nothing. We all make mistakes, we all need forgiveness, but is it worth it to live misserable, to the point of being destroyed, to keep from getting a divorce? Do you think God looks at marraiges and says "Oh good they stayed married through thick and thin, this is good" when each individual life has been destroyed to accomplish this? I never planned to get a divorce when I got married. In fact I said it would not be an option. You can stay and do a lot of things you didn't think you could do, but is it right and is it necessary and is it any more noble in the end when everyone is destroyed?
In my opinion, the answer is no. I have wasted many years of my life waiting for things to get better, praying for them to get better, working on changing myself, getting stronger, wiser trying to do everything I can to better the marriage. I am personally a lot stronger for it and I am happy with who I am, but when it's over, it's over. Everyone's situation is a little different to alot different, but when your H breaks your wedding vows, breaks you and then calls you names when you try to keep going through it all, it's time to get out, at least for me. I don't feel ecstatic about this decision, it is braking my heart, but it is what I have to do.
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