My EX called me AGAIN ( I thought this drama was over), and now feels remorseful about the sex, since she feels that she has betrayed her friendship with my ex GF, ….apparently, she doesn't want exGF to think that she has come between us (will this crap never end?)

Just to put you in the picture, ex GF is a friend of EXWW's friend: so they are acqaintances, really, not good friends. I feel that EXWW is fearful that the friend, F, will tell ex-GF all, and that EXWW will feel exposed by that, since she wants everybody to like her. I have told F everything. She knows how manipulative EXWW is, but is nevertheless her friend. EXWW is now doing a patch-up job with friend, F, to attempt to rescue her reputation, so as NOT to be seen as the manipulative, R-breaking, meddling person that she is.

She is now busy convincing everybody, including herself, that it was only the friendship between herself & me, that was of ANY issue to her.

I thought the conversation was to be something serious, like maybe she thought about giving ME custody, but no. It was just more of the same. She has realized what she'd done, and how it all looked, and was trying desperately to fix things, so she'd end up squeaky clean, and I'd end up looking like someone who was trying to get back with HER.

I've thought about it- the friendship she says she misses, the friendship she is so desperate to protect & maintain, is the love & intimacy that we shared since the day we met. The love & intimacy that sustained us through the marriage, that endured through hardship, that made us smug & secure within our relationship, while it seemed that other couples around us were constantly fighting, while we were OK. This is of course the CLASSIC CAKE & EAT SYNDROME. She still wants this, with ME, while she feels free to explore the world of other men, & other relationships, while I wait in the wings for my cue. This is of course abusive in the extreme. I don't think it's deliberate, but just some kind of FOGESE LOGIC (like fuzzy logic?), and stems ultimately from selfishness.

That's why she called me, in an emotional state, wanting me to come over NOW, to discuss the blow-up between us, when she knew FULL WELL that I was at the GF's house.

Any other stories?
muzohead

Muzohead - You know I have yet to experience this aspect of everything - but you know I was actually waiting for the day my ex would call me and want me to coming running back to him - but after reading your stuff - I have decided to completely stay away - It is overwith - they do not deserve any part of us... It sounds to me like your wife doesn't like the fact that maybe you are moving on and not sitting around wallowing in self pity because your marriage is over... Try to stay strong and don't give into her anymore... Good Luck...

This is of course the CLASSIC CAKE & EAT SYNDROME. She still wants this, with ME, while she feels free to explore the world of other men, & other relationships, while I wait in the wings for my cue. This is of course abusive in the extreme.

Did YOU think you were going to get back together/remarried when you had sex with her or were you just having a bit of cake?

<small>[ September 30, 2002, 11:07 AM: Message edited by: Chris (CA123) ]</small>

Muzohead...did we have the same WW <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> ?!?! Is first initial K!?!?! This sounds like mine! We've been separated 3 months, and legally now for one. She calls today and says she is having an anxiety attack! I tell her to tell it to her boyfriend (who she moved in with). She says he has offered, but I am the one who should be responsible for helping her out!!

She says "What do I do? blah, blah, blah, blah," I remind her--yet again--she was the one who made this bed now sleep in it!

As for sleeping with her again? Even though she is very attractive, NO WAY! I see all of the vanity, lies, etc. Plus, she told me last month that she had unprotected sex with another man (not current one) a couple of years ago. ("It was just once.. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> " Then she says "What's the problem, you didn't catch anything"!!

I too will add my voice to the chorus chanting:

NO MORE SEX WITH EXWW

MAW64:

The hardest thing in the world to do- but not impossible. I had, like you, ALSO decided that I would not allow this to happen, but it did. I really did not expect her to use the approach she did, and it looked completely genuine from the onset. What can I say? "there's no fool like an old fool......?"

Chris:
Yeah, I deserve that, and it's fair comment. Truth is, I would drop ANY GF in a FLASH if I thought that she genuinely wanted me, genuinely was sorry, genuinely wanted to work on something, etc, etc, etc...Problem is, I need to realise that this is NOT the case, before I can remain firm on this. I really miss her. I don't think she is being honest with herself, or me, and admitting that she made a mistake, and wants what we had before. I sense this in her, and it makes things so much harder.

Time To Move On:
WOW! You're not kidding! Maybe we should swap notes, so you can be my "AA-type" mail buddy, in case I feel resolve weakening! I was extremely content with her when she was seeing her BF, (the one she was seeing when we divorced), but she has since broken up with him. Listen buddy, you better get ready for the attack when they break up! I was caught napping completely. So from my experience, it was much easier when she was seeing someone, there was just that line that couldn't be crossed. I would prepare myself if I were you. You're right. They sound SO much alike, it's scary.

TMC-MAN:
Yeah, I think I'll write some music to the words, and use it as my daily mantra.

" No more hanky-panky, man
You're in for a spanky, man.
when you're thinking of the EX
....just remember, NO DAMN SEX!"

A bit lame, but the best I could do at short notice

Chris, my e-mail is muzohead@xsinet.co.za

Thanks guys for the support. I need it.

Oh, bit of an update:

She called again yesterday, just to say AGAIN, that we should stay out of each other's business, (duh?), and so on, and so on. Then she says, " oh, by the way, I happen to know that "GF" really wishes that you call her...." CLICK ..I hang up

She calls back, says sorry, she was out of line, she apologises (ok, FINE), then proceeds to say WHY she said so, and justification, more justification...CLICK..I hang up

She calls back AGAIN, I don't answer.
Later, she calls back, and apologises again. I say nothing just let her talk. Waiting for REAL apology. Nothing. I say good-bye. She e-mails me:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Listen that was out of line on my part.....and thoughtless given what you said last night...my apologies
I won't be discussing this further....or breaking any confidences as I've assured you previously...
I just want you to be happy... </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I didn't reply, and don't intend to.

No contact since. I can't wait for when she does. She will, no doubt. I think I'll limit mt responses to monosyllabic monotonic ones.

Later
muzohead

Muzohead - Hey I like your ditty - and the sex thing - well I have thought about it because it has been a long time but I think that it would just hurt me in the long run and I know it wouldn't mean anything to him and I would not lower myself... I believe that your wife is jealous - like I said before about you moving on and not standing still moping anymore.. Maybe you should try to find a girlfriend that is totally out of her circle of friends so she would have no contact with her... I mean to go from one screwed up relationship into another caused by your exwife - I would think you would want nice and boring to some extent - no more drama - only happiness - Good Luck...

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by muzohead:
<strong> Any other stories?
muzohead</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Hi again MuzoH! Yep, your STBX is most definitely in the FOG - and a very selfish one at that. I say you're on the right track. Let her chase after you - while you're the cool one - after all, you are moving on. Ha! If I was in your shoes, and she called me there, I'd say - "Don't you EVER call me here, understand?" and immediately hang up. She 'needed you' to talk. Ha! Where was she when YOU needed her?? She made this bed I say let her sleep in it - and for sure, it has rocks in it. She definitely has a lot to learn in a big world without you in it. By all means pursue that relation with the GF - it is one of the best things you can do.
That's why she called me, in an emotional state, wanting me to come over NOW, to discuss the blow-up between us, when she knew FULL WELL that I was at the GF's house. Part of my story: Well, after I had moved out, my ex was already engaged to OM, she had been for 5 months as of our Divorce Day - and she encourages me to 'find someone else' I told her no I wasn't interested at the time, maybe later. Less than a month later, I did decide to look up an old friend from way back when... She finds out - and goes ballistic. She tries to lay this BS guilt trip on me but I'm not buying into it. So when she realizes that I'm doing what I want to for the first time in years - she turns our own 2 sons against me, her entire family, and tries her best to turn my Family against me. She wants me to 'be punished for the rest of my life' for 'breaking up our marriage', etc. She decides to keep the few piddly things I was entitled to in our Divorce Decree... Excuse me? Who was engaged to OM right after we separated and I was still living with her??
What-ever, it's such a farce anyway...
Sure am glad I BURNED those bridges and have so many NEW horizons with the WONDERFUL Wife the Lord allowed me to meet...
Harold

MAW64:

Sorry, been offline for a while- work. Yeah, I don't know, reeally. At this point in time, I'm quite cheesed off & put off by women in general. (no offense). If a woman approached me now, I'd literally run a mile. As I said before, I don't want to become cynical or despondent. I've just found women to be extremely dishonest in relationships. (maybe this is just true of people in general, to be fair), and so I've had it, for the time being, with the GF AS well.
Glad you like the song! Just wish I could sing it with conviction right now! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

DJ:
I'm really happy for you & your new wife! Great to here!. Yep, the EX uses every excuse in the book to talk to me now, she just called now, while I was typing this(!), about the kids' medication I bought. I'd already given them the message, since she wasn't in from work yet ( 9 PM!). I gave no comment about it, and she wanted to chat, I could hear, started to ramble on about something, but I was non-responsive. This will carry on for a while, I know. If you read my post on PEACHY's thread, you will see what I think is going down, and where she's coming from. Yeah, I can play cool.

muzohead <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

<small>[ October 02, 2002, 02:40 AM: Message edited by: muzohead ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by muzohead:
<strong>

DJ:
I'm really happy for you & your new wife! Great to here!. Yep, the EX uses every excuse in the book to talk to me now, she just called now, while I was typing this(!), about the kids' medication I bought. I'd already given them the message, since she wasn't in from work yet ( 9 PM!). I gave no comment about it, and she wanted to chat, I could hear, started to ramble on about something, but I was non-responsive. This will carry on for a while, I know. If you read my post on PEACHY's thread, you will see what I think is going down, and where she's coming from. Yeah, I can play cool.

muzohead <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Hi MuzoH~ Thanks for the 'best wishes' and I'm sure we'll all be wishing you some when you meet Ms. Right! Yeah, I sure know what you mean about the PHONE GAMEZ - my ex tried that crap with me too - ha! I remember one day I hung up on her 6 times - didn't feel the least bit guilty either! I found out that the shorter you keep the conversation, the less non-responsive you become, and the more times you hang up without saying anything but CLICK - eventually she begins to get the message that "she has driven you away" because you are no glutton for anymore of her punishment and abuse. I guess if I were you also, I would BLOCK her email address, and if you have IM - block her on that too. Have your GF block her phone numbers, if that is possible. Has she been trying to get NOSEY in your business, eg. GF, finances, etc? If so, the best line is - "Well, it's really NONE of YOUR business - CLICK!" That gets them every time, I know, it sure worked for me. Depending on the level of hard-headedness she has, you may have to do it more or less before she gets the message to BUTT OUT of your life. It looks like she doesn't want you, but wants to FOUL UP any relationship you get into, because she doesn't want anybody to have you either. And sex with her? Just begging for more stomped-on feelings and a multitude of hurts and more regrets for something that she STOLE from you and refuses to give back. I guess in short (pardon my rambling on, sorry) the LESS contact you have with her - the better off you'll be and the FASTER you can begin healing from this stab wound she's given you. She will continue twisting the knife every opportunity she gets - just don't give her any more chances.
Best of luck, and God bless,
Harold

It does my heart good to hear a male point of view! I feel the same way about men, Muzo, right now, that you feel about women! Jeez, if the one who promised me the sun and the moon for all those years and then sc**wed me over so royally can be Satan, how do I trust any of the others? Are looks and sex really the first priority for all men? Of course, if I put too much thought into it, I'd realize that there was a willing, and also married (another of Sergent Slimeball's priorities)woman participant for each of Sarge's trysts...how desperate can women be, anyway? Does everyone just have to score to prove to themselves that they're worthy? Then I realize I'm about to alienate the entire population so I just go off and mutter quietly to myself...

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by The New Me:
<strong>It does my heart good to hear a male point of view! I feel the same way about men, Muzo, right now, that you feel about women! ... how do I trust any of the others? Are looks and sex really the first priority for all men? Does everyone just have to score to prove to themselves that they're worthy? Then I realize I'm about to alienate the entire population so I just go off and mutter quietly to myself...</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Hi TNM! No, I can assure you that not all (tho probably far too many) men think with the wrong head. (Excuse the expression, but it seems to fit fairly well when you consider the sub-human behaviour of some men) There are a few (thank goodness) men who look INSIDE a woman because of her personality, sweet spirit, wisdom, quiet gentleness, 'fun to be in the company of', etc. Hollywood and our popular entertainers would have us believe that LOOKS, MONEY, and FAME mean happiness. Wrong! If that is so, then why do so many of them divorce and commit suicide? One of the joys of my 2nd (current) Marriage is that it brings me true joy to just KNOW that I have done everything I can - and continue to to - what I can to make life easier and better for my Mate - and just seeing her face light up with a smile is what makes my day! When my wife is happy - then I'm happy. When she's sad, I'm sad with her. Why? Because we are ONE. Wandering Spouses LOSE THAT belief and concept when they break their Sacred Wedding Vows and look elsewhere. Am I old-fashioned? Sure. Sorry I am? Nope - wouldn't have it any other way.
So, please don't give up hope - there are other men and women out there who know and believe what things are true, of good report, etc.
May God bless you.
Harold

Well,

I don't like admitting it, but I've "fallen " again. No, not sex, just invited ex to dinner to talk about everything, once & for all, ans YET AGAIN, I asked her to consider giving us another chance together.

Yep, you guessed it, CRASHED & BURNED! Shot down in flames. Once again. When will I lean. Point is, she just emphatically denied having said ANY of that stuff that her friend relayed to me, about her not having wanted the divorce, or anything like that at all. When I asked her why it was necessary to sort out things with me when I was with my GF, she just brushed it aside quite easily, and made as if it were so unimportant. In short, I made an A$$ of myself again, but this time it was easier for me to see her objectively, since she lied to my face, and I could see it. Coffe time.

OK, so come on guys, let the " I told you so's" roll on!

muzohead

The new me-

Sorry, I missed your post!
Anyway, my view is, they (WS) get completely trapped in this single, SWINGle lifestyle, since they have committed adultery & gotten away with it, they see no reason to go seeing just exactly how many people they can get to sc**w, to put it bluntly. There's no accountability to anyone, and they feel completely free to do as they please. I am sure my ex is being dsihonest with me AND herself, in denying feelings for me. It's just so much easier to carry on regardless, throwing all caution to the wind. I'm sure in her mind she believes she can do this for a while, and then maybe, when she's had her fill, come back to me at any time. Coffee time for her.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Does everyone just have to score to prove to themselves that
they're worthy? Then I realize I'm about to alienate the entire population so I just go off
and mutter quietly to myself... </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Well, talk about hitting the nail on the head! No, you'll only ALIENate those who are already ALIENS(!) , if that's possible.
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

muzohead