Does anyone know when the roller coaster ends??? I mean I have been divorced for a month - I know not long but geez I cannot even see the end in sight - I mean he still has stuff at my house - tools, etc.. I ask all of the time for it to be taken out - and he says yes I will take it don't worry - duh??? Then I have asked him repeatedly not to walk in the house and hang around - he is getting a little better but not much - we have two kids so he is at the house on Tuesdays, Fridays and Saturdays - he tends to call and ask my opinions for numerous things - Like example Saturday - I guess his brother was arrested and needed to be bailed out so he called me and told me - and I was like ok what do you want me to do about it ?? And he said nothing I just needed someone to talk to - well he has lost that right - well actually he wanted it lost so why is he still somewhat depending on me... My major huge problem is that the other woman I believe am like 99% sure (though still don't want to admit it) lives next door - and everytime she drives out of the driveway or stays out all night like Saturday Nights - I freak - like I am consumed with wondering if they are together - and I shouldn't care because we are divorced - but I cannot deal with the fact that he might be with her.... and having to look at her all of the time is freaking me out - and Friday night when he had my youngest daughter bowling - well coincidentally the ow and her son showed up - and he told me because he didn't want me to freak - Now I know I am mostly to blame for this because I am having a hard time letting go - but am I ever gonna want to let go??? Is he ever gonna stop needing me??? Is he ever gonna figure out he wanted a divorce he got a divorce - now stay out of my life so I can move on and get over him???? What is my problem????

Do you REALLY want to be rid of him? If so, give him a deadline to remove his things or they will be taken to the goodwill. Change the locks on your doors. If he calls and you determine it's not about the kids, tell him you are busy and hang up. Not rudely, but firmly. ONLY YOU can make your life accessible to him or not.

You have to set boundaries and enforce them. No more Miss Nice Girl.

As for your feelings of jealousy...they are normal but I think you might consider seeing a therapist/counselor. They might be very helpful in helping you work through these things and move on.

<small>[ October 21, 2002, 12:23 PM: Message edited by: franklymydears ]</small>

Frankly My Dear - I have been seeing a counselor since April and I am trying to move through this - but basically he has me feeling bad most of the time - like the woe is me - like when I bring up his stuff he is like ok I heard you - you don't have to tell me again - well I do - and I know that I have to stop being Miss Nice Girl - but I don't know how... I really didn't want to be rid of him in the first place - so that is probably why I have such a hard time being assertive and making him do it - most of the stuff that is there is his tools and stuff that weighs alot...and is actually worth alot of money - but I don't think it should be there - You are right it is because of me that I give him access to my life - and he shouldn't have any access - AT ALL - How do I work through the jealousy -??? Any ideas...

maw-

They say time heals all wounds and you will find it more true than ever. The jealousy will pass when one of 2 things happen...enough time passes OR you find a male friend that you can be comfortable with, again some time will have to pass for this too. Talk about your jealousy with your IC, just to 'get it off your chest'. You are paying your IC to listen, use the time for whatever you want.

In my case, I've been lied to so many times, I almost 'don't give a sh@t anymore'. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Embarrassed]" src="images/icons/blush.gif" /> In the mean time...vent..vent..vent..all you want in here. If you have any close gal friends...talk..talk..talk. I know the visits to the IC are too few and far between.

Frankly is right about your ex's stuff. He must take it out or he will have a reason to come over..forever!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

Doogie - you are right about being lied to - I don't even think he knows the difference between truth and lies - honestly - A male friend is probably exactly what I need but I just cannot imagine being with someone else - and I know you are both right about getting the stuff out but I have asked on numerous occasions - and I have got to tell you he is actually offended that I keep bringing it up - I guess I just stop and look and my life and I am overwhelmed by what he has done to it - and now I must start over - it is really unfair that this has happened and somedays I just think I cannot take this anymore - but the problem is that I do have to see him because of the kids - and I guess I just feel bad for him - I am going to my therapist on Saturday - I will ask him how to get rid of my jealous... thank you

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> but basically he has me feeling bad most of the time </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">HE doesn't have the power to make you feel bad. You are the one responsible for that. I know what you've been through is hard but the fact is, the marriage fell apart and now you have to pick up and go. Just like when someone dies. I know that divorce is harder than an actual death because choices were made. Death we have no say in.

I still say tell him 'you have until Sunday to get the rest of your stuff.' Then if he doesn't, haul it right off to the pawn shop and at least make some money for the 'storage' service you have been providing. Time to play hardball, baby.

maw-

By getting his stuff out of YOUR house, you can limit your exposure to him to just the kids. If you have ANY friends that can help you get his stuff out...take it to HIS house (or wherever) and leave it in HIS front yard. He will then see you are serious...give him a FIRM deadline. When you see your IC and talk about the jealousy...if you have to yell or cry out...DO IT...you will start to feel better. But you CANNOT blame your self or you will never get out of the why...why..routine. Once you keep remembering that HE is to blame, your jealousy will turn to anger...then to hurt...but time WILL heal!!

Concentrate on you and your kids and plan for YOUR future. Keep busy (as much as you can) and soon your ex will become less and less of an influence on you. Keep your conversations with him confined to the kids, or visitation. DO NOT talk to him about your feelings or let him talk to you about his. If you do, you might become his "other woman" to his 'new woman'. Don't let that happen <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

Frankly and Doogie - you are both oh so right - I will bring up moving the stuff out again - when he comes over tomorrow night - and right now he swears he doesn't have anyone - like I believe that - I want to cut him off so bad - because basically he is lost to me now - we are divorced but he still has this hold over me - like when he calls to ask a question or calls to talk - I like an idiot talk to him - I don't know maybe somewhere I am hoping that he changes his mind.... I don't want who he is now - but I would have loved to have who he used to be - but I know that isn't happening - he always tells me - we need to get along for the kids - and do you know I have never really gotten angry for what he has done to me and my life - and yes frankly I know that I bring myself most of my anguish - wondering, thinking what if - what will be??? But now I must just put him out of my mind - and there in lies the problem - You are right I will set a firm - get your stuff the heck out of here date...... I don't need him for anything - I shouldn't have any of his stuff - I am becoming very independent... Thank you for your advice...

maw-

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I don't need him for anything - I shouldn't have any of his stuff - I am becoming very independent </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Keep saying this...and you will soon believe it AND live it!!

Doogie - Thank you very much for the confidence !!!! I shall try to just keep repeating that in my mind - I don't need him - and I am hopefully soon not going to want him... I am worthy to be treated with respect as we all are - you included <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> - Thank you again - it is nice to know that people care and can relate...

Maw,

My friend my friend. NOTHING HAS CHANGED IN A MONTH. YOU ARE DOING THE SAME THINGS. Obsessing over the presumed trampy neighbor. Letting him hang around. Answering his calls. What is different may I ask? Your post today is THE SAME POST. Have you ever read LMBT by Dobson? You must MAKE HIM CHANGE. If you keep doing what you are already doing now, you WON'T GET ANYTHING DIFFERENT. You will still be in limbo. What about going to plan B? How is this decent counselor getting you more independent of this using guy?

He's got it way too good. He is divorced from his x W. Gets some of his EN's met through your "caring" and your "talks". He has his stuff there. Conveniently so it can ward away other men. HE has is "really good friend" next door. He is married to NO ONE AND IS EATING ONE HUGE DEVIL'S FOOD CAKE.

Just say no. Go to B. Just say no. Go to B.

Read the WHOLE A AND B PLAN PRINCIPLES HERE. Six months, a year from now, maybe several, you could still be posting the same thing. You are divorced. Treat him as such. I don't get it. You want things to be different. But you HAVEN'T DONE ANYTHING TRULY TO SHOW HIM TO TREAT YOU DIFFERENTLY.

As dobson says in book, you must turn what was white to black and vice versa. Turn his world upside down. Let him see the result of his actions. He can't have the best of both worlds. What is the worst thing that can happen???You dont see or talk to him. You are still divorced either way. But if he sees that you are fed up, you are changing, working on you. That is totally different. But KEEP THE FOCUS OFF OF HIM FOR NOW TOTALLY. Either in doing MB or LMBT you will get an answer. But it is for you, not for him.

REfocus now. YOU ARE DIVORCED. HE IS PROBABLY CHEATING. WHAT YOU ARE DOING NOW IS ONLY CONDUSIVE TO MORE OF THE SAME BEHAVIOR. If you want different behavior, change the behavior you are using.

I want to see a totally new kind of post from you. One where you have gone into plan B and are so self aware. So strong that you could care less if ms. just a good friend next door lived in a glass house and she was gone every night of the week.

Put his stuff out in a big box on the front porch. Have him pick it up along with your Plan B letter when you are gone. YOu gotta do this. For you. For sanity.

There is life out there. Painting a few rooms isn't getting on with it. Make the real changes that you need and that he needs to see. You may be the only hope he has of wanting to change. And that can come only from you getting on with life totally now.

Peach- I know I know I know - and I guess I just needed to hear someone lay it into me again..And you do it so wonderfully - If I could put all of his stuff in a box I would but it is all of his tools and a huge tool chest etc.... I will tell you I did just get home a 1/2 hour ago and he is on my caller ID twice and normally I would want to call him and see what he wanted but - I don't want to - I am really trying I am just weak...And you are right I am not going to care about the tramp next door because they really deserve each other - I know there is a whole world out there for me - it is just accepting that I can participate in it - that is scaring me I guess...You are very strong....I was never really good at A and I am definately no good at B - but I know that is where I should be and I really am - I have to stop taking care of him and stop caring about him - you are right what can happen he wont talk to me - he will want a divorce - well we have one already- OK so you just yell at me everyday and I will eventually get it I guess - thank you - and I hope tomorrow is the day that I give up and accept that I am divorced and move on... I know I can do it - I know I will survive - I just need to take the leap - Thank you for the pep talk - or pep slap depending on how you want to look at it..... mimi

MAW - you are going through a hard time. I am not divorced as yet, but bending divorce. I am not looking forward to the day we go to court. But this is what my WH wants, so he is getting what he wants. I have the same problem, he comes over here to get things and etc. He never abided by the rules, and this has caused him major conflict and anger. But you know, he knows exactly what he did, he did have sex with the other woman, who ever goes to a hotel, takes each others clothes totally off, and touches each other everywhere, and did the Bill clinton thing, it is considered an affair. My WH keeps telling me he didn't have an affiar, but it won't stand in court. No one is going to accept the Bill Clinton thing, and it has gotten that name by our once famous leader of this country.

The roller coaster will end one day, when you have control. It is hard, and believe me, I am having some very hard days. But I see my WH doesn't really care about me, he doesn't really want me to live a good life, just throw me a bone once in a while. His actions tell more than his words. And the truth is told by his actions. He can't even be civilized in conversation, yelled at me yesterday for phones not being answered right, everyone in this family is afraid of his screaming at them by him, his mother is so depressed by the situation WH put her in.

But we will get through this, and one way I am coping is going to counseling, and have started regularly attending a Lutheran church that is local. I am becoming acquaintances with the parishoners, and the pastor and his wife are just wonderful.

So the walkaway spouse gets all the glory, had their fun, and continue on with their fun. They get to spend money on a total stranger, and give their spouse a bone here or there. It is part of the MLC, and what ever they call it, let them call it, but we know what they are in, and until they admit to their senile attitdue, there is nothing you can do.

Stay away from him totally, my lawyer said, once the divorce is final that I can change the lock on the doors. I will, I can do what I want to with the house, and put it up for sale if I want to. Won't sell now cause economy is so bad everywhere. I do want to get the house sold in a couple of years, and downsize to a small house, or condo. I am interested in a house already, been inquiring about it, and would like to purchase if the economy keeps going down, and rent it out until I am ready to move into it. It is quite nice, a 3 bedroom ranch with a full basement, and 2 car garage, on 1/2 acre. I have to think kabout the animals, so need some room for the animals. But by that time the 2 big dogs will probably have gone to doggy heaven. So just keeping my options open.

The roller coaster is there, and it is hard to deal with. Work on yourself, and yourself only. Don't do anything for him, what has he done for you. That is what I look at my WH, why do much for him, when he does so little here. He keeps telling me to have the kids fix this, or do that. He does not want responsibility for anything here. He wants to get rid of me as soon as possible. I have finally said, yep, that is what he wants, so therefore, I am moving on, without him. That is where you have to go, move on like he does not exist, except as an acquaintance.

Cry to Much - Good Advice - he doesn't deserve anything from me - about changing the locks he never comes over when we are not home - so he justs walks in when we are there and knocks when someone else is there - Today I am feeling stronger - you are right they are the ones that wanted the divorce and I need to treat him like we are divorced - My sister gets so mad at me because though we are divorced if he is missing his family life then he will just call or come around - I don't even think he realizes what he threw away but again that is his problem - I am feeling stronger today - Peach really got through to me - yesterday - Like I said he called twice and I didn't call back - very impressive for me - I am usually the one to run to the phone and help him - but not anymore - Actually my problem with the house - is that - the prices around here are so high - that I could sell my house for a good amount but then I wouldn't be able to buy one - My kids want to stay where they are - or I definately would have moved because living next to that trampy neighbor as peach puts it is rather difficult... I am in counseling and I go to a womans group at the therapists office - those woman have been very helpful to me - they told me that divorce wasn't just divorce it is a way of life - I am thinking about joining parents without partners - to meet other single people - so thank you again for your advice - And I am going to try and continue to feel strong.... Wish me luck - and you to I wish luck - thanks again... Mimi

Mimi...remember how I told you that I told him "his stuff was at the curb, and the garbage ran on Tuesday?"

Well, part of his complaint with me was that I was overweight and "couldn't exercise, as I had a bad back and a broken foot", as he told our therapist...

Unpack the chest. Borrow a hand truck if you don't have one. Move it one piece at a time. Right out to that curb. His stuff was pretty easy for him to pick up, 'cause it was all dumped neatly...IN HIS BOAT. I picked the mother up by the hitch and drug it, inch by inch, all the way to the garbage pick up. So what if my back went out? I got my point across, and I sure loved ME for it...

The new me - I am going to tell him one more time that this weekend it all needs to be out - I will give him one more chance - I am done with the lying the talking to me when he feels the need - this whole situation bites but you know what I am going to be ok - if he wants the lady next door he can have her because she is as screwed up as he is - so I am at the point now where they can have each other - they are both lying cheating scum.... And that is that - Of course the way this goes I could be feeling something else altogether tomorrow - but who knows.... I hope not - I will not call him, I will only speak to him as needed - I am done - I hope - I really am done..... Thank you for the encouragement.... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

maw-

When you feel some need to talk to him...DON'T. Just come on in to MB and post...post..post. We will be here for you. Look for a friend to confide in..kinda like a buddy...anyone..even from here. Swap an e-mail address with someone and presto...you got a bud. It is time to take care of maw..you be lookin good very soon... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Doogie - thank you - but really I am going to need to talk to him one more time and tell him - that you know what once and for all - you need to get your stuff out - I don't believe you - I probably am never going to - and it is your choice to continue to lie to me - but for once and for all after a year - I am divorced and I am done - I do not want to be your friend - I have to be a friend to me - now - not to you - I have to worry about me - you are gone out of my life - that is your choice and that is the way it is.... What do you think about that ??? I am really feeling strong today - I am done.... I think I hope pray for me to be able to do it.... Mimi

maw-

I have every confidence in you. Stay determined and focused...on YOU! We will all pray and pull for you ...remember...we are all here for you. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Doogie - Thank you - Thank you - I did talk to him - I told him to get his stuff out - that I didn't want to see him - that he was just to pull in the driveway and beep - to give me back my car key and he offered the house key - then I kind of talked to him a little and he basically told me he was divorced he could date who he wanted to - including the neighbor - so basically - I spent 19 years of my life - with someone who doesn't give a crapola about me - so I am done officially - thank you very much for your continued support... I will survive as we all will...