I am boiling mad here.

What do you think... The A (they, H&OW, think a relationship) has been going on for 5 months.
My boys told me OW stayed with dad. Since the A started they haven't seen WH much at all.
I am not sure what they have seen in the house, they often climb to my bed in the middle of the night, as well as their dad's.
This makes me feel so sick.
Is this right, after such a short time to expose them to? This was only the 1st or 2nd time YS has seen OW. He said OW is nice...just had to swallow it. OW certainly won't be busy telling him: " Of course I have to be nice , that your daddy will love me..."
WH did this with OW#1 too. Her son slept with my boys in the same room.
I am moving back to my home country in May, and was hoping WH would have had some respect for this matter on these last few months. Well, he blew it, there's not a drop of trust and respect left for him.No love either. I think I'm even past plan B.
In July WH was bragging at me, how THIS time he will do it right, be honest, take it slowly etc. etc. It looks like a fast forward version of the A with OW#1 to me.
It was a house of cards even before it started.

Hi Bears,

A couple things here, Hon.

Your WH telling you he'll take it slow this time, and then not following thru should certainly illustrate to you that this AFFAIR (illegitimate relationship) is no different than the first AFFAIR, just a new OW, same script.

I am very upset about the kids overnight stay with OW there too. It's so damn wrong. Your WH simply isn't thinking with his northern-brain, if you get my drift.

I don't know Bears, I tend to think you may want to look into the kids's rights, legally speaking. This is morally so wrong, and if anything, regardless of Plan A or B, you should communicate the immorality and the wrongness to your H, IMHO. I know I would. But always in a Plan A-way.

The more I think about this, the angrier I get. What in the world is he thinking. He has shown he "sleeps" with OW #1, and then turns around and shows them the same with OW #2?!?! What message is he sending to his children. GOOD GRIEF!

Ughhhhhh and Grrrrrrrrrrr!

Lv,
Jo

<small>[ December 09, 2002, 08:50 AM: Message edited by: Resilient ]</small>

Bears excuse my ignorance but I seem to have missed something here. My Kids have slept in the same house as WW and OM2 from day 1 after she left? It is something that I felt that I have no say in and that I have not encouraged but in truth have not spoken much about. often its the kids who get hurt in this way.

Yes in a "perfect" situation the OP is introduced slowly and the kids given time, in mine and apparently yours this isn't the case. Neil.

Hi Neil,

Hope it's okay I respond to your post.

Haven't you expressed your disapproval to your STBX regarding the impressions this leaves on your children?

First, neither Bears nor her WH (that I know of) have filed for Divorce, but regardless, sleeping with someone other than your "SPOUSE" in the presence of your children is wrong. It's sends the message to your children that adultery is the norm. When they grow up, they'll believe that since momma did it, why not them. Us parents are role models for our children.

I do believe you can have say as to what your STBX can and can't do when it involves your children. I have seen several parents here in this situation obtain legal advice and recourse on behalf of their children to seek agreements from their STBX or Wayward spouses' in terms of appropriate and morally mature behavior.

Jo

<small>[ December 09, 2002, 10:28 AM: Message edited by: Resilient ]</small>

Thanks Jo, in truth I am not overly concerned about it. I have very sound sensible girls that are a credit to my W and I. They have been through the mill this year and come out the other side. It was disappointing to hear of OM2's swearing and my W was also upset about it. In the UK you have little say in the situation legally unless there is potential danger (which in my case is not there). We have an agreement that they will not be left alone with OP's which is about the best we can make. It seems to be working out ok.

Neil.

You say he did it before? What is so shocking that he is doing it again then? Obviously, he sees nothing wrong with his conduct. Speak with your children. If you have problems with the sleeping arrangements, I am sure the visitation can be modified to be day only visits, if the children corroborate what you said here.

Same thing has happened here as I have discovered within last two weeks. New OW is indeed sleeping over at Deucey's and her two year old is spending the night in same room as my four year old in his bunk bed. Makes my son very confused.

I have contacted my attorneys about this and am letting them deal with it. I will not allow personally such behavior. Stbx says it is his business what he does with son when son is at his home.

They are disturbed men. And emotionally disturbing our children is not to go on anymore. I am going to legally put my foot down. Let your stbx know what is going on and in the meanwhile do as I had to do. Get a legal stance. Maybe file for once. I endured two other women until I filed. This one, the new one is one of many since. Stand up for the kids. He is in the fog and may stay permanently. Do plan B and read LMBT by Dobson. He is not a good parental role model. I believe if they do that no visitation is in order. I am going to try to use that to secure my rights as the primary legal and physical guardian of my little one. Do what you have to. Your bio sounds just like my time line and I am unfortunately ending this sham of a marriage in three weeks. Nobody says they can't change one day and then seek a new relationship and a firm marriage one day but now there isn't hope. Do what you have to. They will not wake up while in the deep fog ok? j Just won't happen unless something in their world falls down upon them. Make maybe this the legal thing to fall down on his selfish head. Forget about him and keep the kids as the focus ok? We have to. I am praying for you my friend. God bless you and stay strong.

I'm probably going to get slammed for this, but....

I don't think you have a legal leg to stand on. While morally, it's considered wrong, if the two of you are getting divorced, legally, he's not doing anything that the law would consider to be an endagerment to the child.

This exact same situation happened to a friend of mine. His STBXW was living with her OM... whom he saw as being the reason for their divorce. So, he told him that if she didn't knock it off and stay at her apartment when she had the kids, he'd get the custody arrangements to no longer include nights. He too said it was morally wrong. His lawyer agreed with him and promised to press the issue (like he's going to say no... he bills by the hour). After tons of money spent, there was NO change in the custody arrangement. The judge cited that while distasteful and morally unsound, it was not a detriment to the children.

Bottom line, it's wrong, in my opinion. It's distasteful, disrespectful and it shows the children exactly how little your STBX cares about you (and their) feelings. But, I don't think you'll have much luck getting your children apart from the STBX over it.

Quote:

Yes in a "perfect" situation the OP is introduced slowly and the kids given time, in mine and apparently yours this isn't the case. Neil.

Ewwwwwwwwwwwww, Neil, that is JUST what my almost X said to me....and it still does not justify putting children in that situation.

Bears, I did a lot of research on the net about this very issue, (the cheapest way, so that when I need to fight for this, I will already have the statutes atmy fingertips, saving my lawyer time, and me money) and found out a few interesting details, one of which is that the court will uphold what is right for the CHILD. My kids don't want to spend holidays with their dad if OW is there, and so I was looking up stuff to protect their rights.

This is children we are talking about, and if your WS sees it as a jealousy thing for you, well too bad. We have the real picture in this. It is absolutely immoral for the children to be exposed to this, as well as emotionally confusing.

Do what you can for your kids...you are all they have right now.

Love and light,

Jacky

my X did the same thing with OW. OW & her X have in their D-papers about having no one sleep over while the kids are there. My X picked ow & one of her kid, took them to his place & slept with OW while the child was in the next room. son told dad everything, all 3 of her kids hate my X. OW X contacted his lawyer who told him to write her a letter about it, saving all copies for a later court date. since it is in their D-contract he could take her back to court to get the kids. They share the kids 2 weeks each. Which is really bad on 3 small boys. Our son is 13 1/2 & has no desire to see his dad since he found out dad was engaged to OW. son is of legal age to stop all contact. I thank God our son is older & I dont have to share my child with every whore that X sleeps with.

m-too long
c-13, 29, 8 gd
d-5-02
me-48, x43

ow-32
c-3 under 10
d-7-02
m-10yrs

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by TheStorm:
I don't think you have a legal leg to stand on. While morally, it's considered wrong, if the two of you are getting divorced, legally, he's not doing anything that the law would consider to be an endagerment to the child.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Hi TheStorm,

Bears and her WH have not filed for Divorce. They are separated, but no divorce pending that I know of. Just an FYI.

Jo

Thanks everyone for your replies.

I can see there are different ideas coming out, all very good, as we all have different situations. Definitely, most of us seem to agree it's morally wrong, and it is.

I have thought about legal action in this case. I did in July 01, when H waffled back to OW#1 after our reconciliation attempt, OW#1 had been harassing me&H with constant phonecalls. I also heard she could get mentally unstable, so I didn't want her around my boys. My lawyer wrote a letter to H which totally prohibited OW being present on children's visits.
It was never sent, because H soon after started talking about getting back together. He was also away for few weeks on an overseas trip, so I didn't have to worry about kids with OW.

But this time, because I had heard the new OW is at least a bit more level headed (Who knows, when H starts mucking her around, she could turn psycho too...!!??) I though ok, I just have to put up with her being around. That meant just visits or outings, but no overnight stays.
I know I should have talked about this to H beforehand. Knowing he had done it before.
He still seems to think the boys are too young understand. Yes, at 4 and 51/2 years, they don't know much about moral concepts. But they can and will get confused.
In May and June(we lived in the same house) they were running into our bedroom in the mornings. OS often wanted to be reassured his dad's going to be sleeping in the same bed with mum.
H has had his 3 daughters living with him for this year. (15, 13, 9yrs)
So they have seen all this going on too . H with 2 OWs and with his wife in just one year. I was concerned in May- June they will have to see one more reconciliation attempt fail, and they did.
They have done well, getting on with their dad, but just recently have got very tired of it all.
I don't know exactly what's been going on, the friction of having OW2 around(+OW1 still harassing H) is likely to have started to cause stress. They are very precious girls to me and they don't deserve this at all.
OW2 has got a 13 & 10 year old (not sure about the ages, around those) herself, the girls probably find the blended family thing as an added stress.
Luckily they are going to move back to their mum in couple of weeks time. They are looking forward to it, and so is their mum!
My boys said OW2's kids weren't there for this last visit. So she's playing high morals with her own kids. I don't think H and her have yet had a "7 kids&us" weekend... How romantic will that be...
I filed for D in August when d-dayOW2 happened, straight away. I did it in my country of origin. We got married there, and all the documents are from there (not in English). My application was declined,either I or H need to be residing there, otherwise it won't go through.
I informed H and told him to sort it, by now, as far as I know he hasn't done anything.
I have asked about it, and his reply is silence.
We are still legally married, and so is OW2 (her H wants her back), which makes it even worse. H is an OM.
Jo, unfortunately I already LBd, send a couple textmessages to H and some of it was out of pure anger. Fortunately you can't put too much into a couple of msgs. No replys, but that was predicted. H is meant to see the kids in 2 weeks for another visit, before that things need to be cleared.
After the worst peak of anger is gone, I still think 5 months into an A (read: Affair, not a honourable relationship!)is wayyyy too early to start sleeping together with kids in the same
house. Or should I say, it's never acceptable! Unfortunately, many of us unable to prevent it happening. I had known H for 21/2 years before his daughters were visiting us. Even then it wasn't easy for them, I wasn't their mum.
In the end of the day, kids will always hope to see their parents together.

Maybe H is unconciously creating and replaying his childhood scene for his own kids.
His father was widowed twice. And he can still remember(he was 6yrs then) being very distressed about his current stepmum being in bed with his dad. He pushed between them whenever he could.
Whatever it is, he should still be able to behave like a fully grown up man.

Many thanks.