The kids haven't seen their dad since Oct. 31, and of course by now they've forgotten all the bad stuff that ever happened and they miss their dad. Understandable. Sometimes they get mad at me because they think it's my fault, and that's understandable too. I let them vent, and try to calmly explain it to them, but there's some major adult concepts involved....they are 11, 9, and 7.

Bottom line is, he can see them anytime he wants...but he has to arrange supervised visitation thru the DHS. The ball is in his court. And before he can have unsupervised visits he has to complete sex offender treatment and convince a counselor that he's not a threat to our boys. Since he's never liked being told what to do, I suspect he will continue to tell everyone he can that I deny him visitation, but he won't do his part. That's ok with me, he was a disruptive influence on the children anyway and they are doing much better without him.

BUT.....I can't tell the kids that. So, I explain that daddy has to make arrangements and I haven't heard from him. They can't imagine he wouldn't want to see them, so they get angry and upset. They don't understand that he has big mental problems, a dislike for authority, and other adult stuff to deal with. What would you do?

by now they've forgotten all the bad stuff that ever happened
No they haven't. It may not be in the forefront of their mind but they remember.

Sometimes they get mad at me because they think it's my fault,
They get mad at you because you are available to get mad at.
Also, children tend to think if they act "good", dad won't go away or will show up & visit.

This is all natural. Just let them know you are there for them NO MATTER WHAT!

So, I explain that daddy has to make arrangements and I haven't heard from him.
That's about all you can do. Children will almost always see through lies. So if/when your h sees them & tells them it's all your fault, eventually they will catch on. The best thing you can do is make sure you don't lie to them about anything. If it is something they don't need to know about, just tell them that.

I must've missed something along the way. I thought the protective order was between you and him but the kids were still going to dad's for visits?

In any case, the letter in your other post where he says there's no law that requires visitation, that's just insanely cruel. I'm not much of one to talk about kid stuff since I don't have any, but it seems like a truthful explanation that leaves out as many hurtful details as possible seems to be in order. Bottom line: dad could visit them if he wanted to. The courts have measures in place to protect the children. All dad has to do is satisfy the court that he's a safe place to be in order to resume visits.

tell them that you threw his a$$ is jail for not making the bed correctly. . .

just kidding. . . .

i would add to conversation that there are rules for visitation and that their dad has problems following lots of rules sometimes, and that is also why he is where he is at. . . .

and then reinforce the fact that ALL people, you , their dad, them have to follow society's rules and laws in order to live a normal life with choices. . . if one doesn't follow the rules, then your choices are taken away, or made more difficult, which get to the problem of their dad. . . .

you can flame me, but its makes the general point that everyone has responsibilities to society to follow basic rules, and if not, then choices and freedoms are limited.

wiftty

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by WhenIfindthetime:
<strong>tell them that you threw his a$$ is jail for not making the bed correctly. . .

</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> hehehehe.......you made me laugh!

Seriously, thanks for the good answer. Reminded me of when we were houseparents at the boys ranch and the manager would explain how poor choices let to fewer choices and enough poor choices led to having someone else tell you when you could use the bathroom.....

Thanks Chris and LH too, good advice. Sheesh, parenting is tough enough without trying to go it alone.

YUCK! Understand exactly where you are at, fortunately my kids are 15 and 11 and have a better understanding of what their dad is and was.

I have been told for years that I have alienated the children from him, yet they are the ones who actually talk about what a jerk he was and is. The older daughter has absolutely no contact with him what so ever, the younger daughter got a time frame for a phone call once a week and had some highly regulated vistation times (not supervised, just 2 hours in length and as soon as it was extended to 4 hours, everything fell apart). It was finally set up that he couldn't begin any vistation with D again until he had a joint counseling session. He has never set that up.

I actually don't know which is harder, having kids who want to see their dad and he won't, or having kids who don't want to see him and having to hold them while they cry and shake in dispair at having to see him. <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

As far as the kids acting in anger towards you... that is a given, mom happens to be there and is safe. I've dealt with that issue to extremes, too. The older D, who has more and more flags that there was more than just physical abuse, has rage attacks... I usually happen to be the person who takes it all. Her sister can no longer be left alone with her, and I am so thankful that I work for myself and have flexible hours! She has 2 counselors and is now on Zoloft, but one more outburst and she'll probably be headed for an in-stay mental evaluation. It is shame, she was such a good kid, so smart... but one can see the true circle of violence as what spews out of her is just like hearing my stbx all over again. I hope that when the divorce is finally over that some things will settle down.

I think that is the hardest thing about having to give up the stay away order. I've lived with the aftermath and don't want him out there pushing the limits again. I won't hesitate to slap a full restraining order on him the second he gives me cause this time. It's awful that we have to learn to be so hypervigilant (my kids call it paranoid), but look at all the things that slipped through the justice system.

You're doing the right thing with your kids, be honest and be there for them. It may be the only thing we have going for us at the moment, but some day they will see that we were *always* there.

Lori