wow, Kareena, did you even read my post??? I am not looking for an exuse and my H and I are doing ALL the work possible, therapy, meds, books etc. "not that kind of disorder" what does that mean? My point was that clearly he had been working really hard to overcompensate for his shortcomings until the stresses became to much. I feel badly that his life must have been very hard to manage even in the good times, being undiagnossed ADD. I am looking for a way to help my self get over some of the pain and try to be a compasionate human being. You sound very agry in your post to me and others I read, what or who are you so mad at?. Ballet, you are lucky that you caught your H befor an affair, but the fact is I did not. I am glad to hear that the meds made such a difference, that is what I am hoping...his apt with the specialist is not for another week, so I was just looking for any info, encouragement or support.

hb's sunshine: My story has a number of similarities to yours. My H wanted our D, began his multiple affairs during and after my pregnancy, still professing to love me more than life itself. He seemed to start off on a new relationship, lose sight of us and not notice anything. My Mom died when our D was 4 months old. I too, had a lot to deal with and my H was never further away. My D is now 5....I requested H come to a decision and commit or move out. He did not forsake all others, and I had to ask him to leave. We have been separated, but working on reconciliation for several years, now. My m-i-l says that he does not want to let go of us. It has now become a very predictable pattern. We go through a bad phase and when he believes that he might lose me, he comes back and tries again. I think that people with these conditions are accountable for their actions, however I think it is a little easier for them to make mistakes. When my H makes a mistake, he justifies his behavior in order to deal with the pain he causes himself and others. I have had to look long and hard at his behavior patterns to try to find out what our relationship means to him. I still love my H and he now tells me that he is certain that we belong together. I believe he is trying, but he seems to take these little side trips. My H once made a statement to me regarding how he makes his decisions. He said that he thinks of many things to do, but that he usually chooses to do what is right. The exceptions to the "usually" are very painful. This was an interesting insight as it is so different from how I think. I look at an idea, think it through, and discard it when I see the potential flaws in the idea. My H has an idea, embraces this idea and goes with it until the flaws begin to emerge. Then he abandons it. In other words, he is impetuous. I am working on trying to curb this in him. I carefully point out the flaws in the idea before it gets too far. My H does seek my advice about financial issues, etc and this gives me opportunity to help him here. He obviously could not talk with me about a potential affair. He is flirtatious and charming. He seems to attract women quite easily and so the scene is set. I have prayed for understanding and I do see how it was probably easier for my H to betray me than it is for someone with different thinking patterns. It is not an excuse because he knows right from wrong. But, understanding this about him does allow me to forgive him a little easier. I now see any tension, stress, or problem between us as a potential excuse for my H to betray me. It is as though deep down, he doubts my love. I think if you asked him, he would say that he loves me more than I love him. It is not true, I love him dearly and I hope that someday he accepts this as the truth. I have come to realize that the OW were not better than me in any way, in fact I now believe that his heart is mine. It is just that they represented one more person who may be able to fill the emptiness and need inside him. No one can fill it and perhaps he will realize this soon. Not much advice here, but I understand where you are at. I found this to be true within myself as well. I had to choose to be who I am, to let go of the pain, to believe that I deserve what I want from my H, even if he does not provide it.

Thanks for responding, I am sorry for what you have been going through, it sure is tough. Is your H on meds? going to therapy? Mine is in therapy and is seeing a specialist in ADD on wed. to get meds. The diagnosis alone seems to have helped a lot. Your H sounds like he has very low self esteme, mine does too. This is very common in ADD especially undiagnosed or medicated. My H feels I am better than him and he doesnt deserve me. Luckily this was a one time thing and my H did not fool himself into thinking he loved the OW. The tough part now is to forgive him so that he can forgive himself... the constant guilt and burden of knowing what he has done is making his treatment difficult. I have recently read many great books on ADD and the improvement with medication is said to be dramatic, I hope so! I have always handled the money so that has not been a problem, and like you, I am my husbands best friend and confidant. Try to read up and get him some meds, I'll keep my fingers crossed for you.<BR>

hb's sunshine: Thank you for responding. In answer to your question, no, my h has not gone for any help. As a teenager, his mother had him diagnosed and put on meds. He chose to quit taking them after he left home. He says that he can control his behavior by getting his rest, eating right, etc. We have discussed treatment on several occasions and his mom even set up several appointments for an evaluation. He failed to make the appoinments and it has now become a subject that can not be discussed. I do love him and I believe he loves me as well. It is still more difficult than anyone can imagine. Perhaps more so because we know that they have additional issues that are related to the condition or are a byproduct of the condition. Yes, my h has low self esteem. He can not stay at a job for more than 3 months. He can get a job quite easily and I keep telling him all of the good qualities that I see in him (even if they are not fully developed). Right now, he is back to the "I love you and we need to make this marriage work." I am praying and hoping that things will somehow change, I mean really change. We are on a constant roller coaster ride and I can expect that his views on "us" will change before the month is gone. I do understand what you have gone through, but I sense that you have some understanding of your h and truly love him. I can't make excuses because the pain is too real and too damaging, but I can say that understanding has helped me to stop placing the blame on myself and gain a healthier perspective on my situation. Sometimes I think that I should go to plan B and pursue an emotionally healthier life, but my h has remained resistant to giving up. I am trying to find a way to be okay in the middle of this all. I have to say that I am getting there. The setbacks are not nearly as bad, nor as frequent. I do not know how long you have been going through this. I do believe that stress has a large effect on their behavior. I see patterns in my h's life, he is consistent about his inconsistency. I do believe that there is hope and an answer to all of this. Take care.

I am married to a man that has Hypomania. He has anger outbursts, abusive tendencies, narcistic behaviors, as well as physical symptoms. He is completely loving, wonderful and "normal" 26 or 27 days in a month, then without fail, BOOM, he begins the cycle. It can almost be compared to a womans mentrual cycle. Every month like clock work. In his past relationship, lasted over ten years and two kids, he was very unhappy and did nothing to remedy his problem. Barely admitted there was one. Since being with me he has gotten help with these issues with medical doctors, therapists and psychiatrists. Now he is on medication and doing SO GOOD! We look at it like a cancer. Like he is in remission, so to speak.

Hmmmmm..very interesting. I applaude everyone of you who have stood strong through your spouses illness's, nomatter what it be. NO ONE can possible understand what it is like to love and to live with someone who suffers from any mental illness. IMPOSSIBLE. <P>I dated my husband for about 18 months or so before getting married, and there were no signs. Okay, maybe a few. But once we were married, it all came out. For the last 16 months, our relationship has died. I begged him to go get help, he refused. I tried and tried to make him happy. He isolated himself. He has ben emotionallyunavailabe our entire relationship. He would "pretend" to be happy and sweet for a few days when he knew I was at the point of walking. Then it would all return. He became paranoid, recording my telephone conversations, he would ask me why I was in his closet, because his things were slighlty moved. he knew everything I did. He was obsessed with everything. Accused me of cheating, told me to go cheat, he wouldn't care. Then accuse me of cheating. He only wanted to work. We would go out, he would sit in the corner and pout or he would put on the act so everyone loved him. Nobody knows what I went through. I tried and tried but in the end, no one can help him but himself. After all of this time of being emotionally alone, well, and mostly physically too..am ready to call it quits. I feel nothing, and the relationship has been dead. Call me a failure if you will. But I refuse to live my life like this. I wanted to help him, I tried but he refused. Now, he wants help. Now he wants to work things out. It's too late. My heart is cold and hard. I feel nothing for him.

I suppose any marriage has its challenges, but the challenges imposed on a marriage by chronic depression in one of the spouses is overwhelming. The lack of energy, the lack of enthusiasm, the emotional withdrawal, the paranoia and defensiveness create so many odd twists to a relationship throughout the years that it's hard to know where to start. I hate to say it, but a chronically depressed spouse is a selfish spouse in so many ways.<P>I think what is so incredibly difficult to deal with is the fact that she is in denial over her depression and the affect it has on our marriage. She has been taking Prozac for six years now, which has banished the grotesque nightmares she used to suffer. However, the cloud still hangs over her constantly, and the agonizing thing is that she can't tell there is a cloud! Attempts to help her always lead to self-defensive, angry responses (she has a terrible diet -- no breakfast and often no lunch -- if I suggest this may have something to do with her lack of energy she bites off my head).<P>Furthermore, our sex life has fallen to zero. It's hard to tell if the increasing emotional distance between us has led to the lack of sex, or if it's the other way around. Perhaps it's a vicious circle. Initially I found it difficult to be physically intimate with someone so lacking in energy and life, but now our increasing disrespect for each other squelches any desire.<P>I vaccilate between trying to make sure I'm coming from a kind, loving place and being resentful of the burden I bear because of her depression. Even though our sex life has fallen off, I make sure to touch her, kiss her before going to bed, extend common courteries, ask her how her day want. She doesn't reject any of this, but she NEVER reciprocates. She hasn't proactively given me a kiss or touched me in years (in fact, she has always said she "hates to be touched"). She's a black hole of emotional energy.<P>I fear that my increasing resentment (over having to be the breadwinner plus pay bills plus do all the cooking plus clean the house plus attend to all the maintenance of the house, all vacation planning, ... she's got no energy!) is winning out over what little passion, patience and compassion remains for her.<P>I mentioned she is taking Prozac. Unfortunately she is not combining the Prozac with counseling -- she seems to think that by taking the pill everything is magically better. But things are NOT better - in fact in some ways they're much worse. I suspect she is suffering from side-effects such as fatigue, low sex drive, inexplicable skin conditions, inability to feel guilt or remorse (for an attempted A, for example), and lack of the ability to cry anymore, even over tragedies befalling loved ones. She just can't see it, odd as that may sound. <P>Sorry this is so rambling. There is just so much that is intertwined in a marriage where a spouse is depressed, it's hard to know where to start, it's hard to know what's important and what's not. But worst of all, it's hard to know what to do -- she doesn't seem to think there is anything that needs to be changed on her side ... I'm the one that is ruining our marriage because of my resentment and disrespect of her. <P>Scratch that. The absolute worst thing is loving your 2 1/2 year old son so much that you can't imagine being only a part-time parent to him. I'm doubtful that our marriage can be saved, but I am willing to do anything or try anything to salvage it for his sake.<P>But things do get more complex. Various things led me to believe she was having an A. I 'found' a series of e-mail between her and one of her exes planning liasons and sharing loving words that only lovers should share (he's also married with a toddler, a professor who has a penchant for only dating his students, such as my wife and his current wife. He's a piece of work). God I was crushed.<P>I confronted her in a letter (in person she would just clam up and blame it on me, one way or another). When I came home and wanted to talk about it, she became quite angry with me -- no remorse or guilt in the least -- and said "there is nothing to say. I refuse to talk about it until we are in front of an objective marital counselor". Odd, I wouldn't have even thought of having that response if I were in her shoes. <P>I should be happy that she has agreed to see a counselor. Lord knows I've been seeing one lately. But my experience with her counseling is that she is only happy with counselors that never challenge her to push away the cloud, others she "doesn't click with". But nonetheless, at least we will have an avenue to at least look at the issues that have been building up over the years.<P>I love my son. I want him to grow up as part of a happy family, with fulfilled, respectful parents. But I fear that I cannot save her from her depression, only she can. But I doubt she wants to. She almost cherishes her depression, expresses it in her art.<P>Tell me, what is worse, being the child of divorce parents, or growing up with an increasing awareness that the love you thought your parents held for one another is really just a thin veneer of affection? One way lies heartache and loneliness, the other lies heartache and cynicism.<P>

virakech-<BR>IMO personality/mental health issues are the hardest, saddest row to hoe; when you want things 'fixed', or made better, not only can't the other person feel the empathy for the dissolving relationship, their own behaviors and actions/reactions are doing the majority of the dissolving. yesterday was my H and my first marriage counseling session (he suffers anxiety disorder, for which he's medicated, but also has a severe alcohol addiction whcich has given him the soulless, remorseless personailty of a sociopath. it's horrible). 30 minutes into the session, after we'd each given our perspectives on the marriage and what is 'wrong' with it, he said i'd given him nothing but ten years of misery, said he definitively and completely wanted OUT and walked out of the session. so, i'm crushed, and now have to begin the wrenching process of leaving my home, giving up on my relationship and nursing our 9 year-old through yet another dad-created upheaval. the torturous part is H's inability to see any part he's had in it, and his cold, cold rage at ME for trying to mend things, for trying to get him to open up and feel, for just being in his life when he left emotionally a long time ago. but a friend said to me last night, "years from now, when your son asks, you can tell him in all honesty and with love that YOU did everything you possibley could, above and beyond the call of duty, to save that relationship." so that's what i'm clinging to. that, and the fact that after all this time, i now know without a shadow of a doubt, that H is simply incapable of having a give & take, healthy adult relationship. it's reaaly NOT me, and my 'inappropriate' reactions to his behavior and treatment of me. when i'm not furious, i feel sorry for him. <BR>sorry, i probably should have posted this in 'divorced'divorcing', but i felt for your hurt. won't be posting any more in 'marriage builders' - nothing left to build. please send your prayers to a stranger who has to rebuild her shattered life all of a sudden,<BR>m

maybe -- I pray for you and your son. At least he has the love and understanding of a balanced, kind mother to help him through.<BR>