OK, last week was my birthday, and from two kids, g 11 and b 14, i got one card from my daughter.

now, to me, my POV, their mom is not teachintg any respect for the other parent, and I always make sure that they have a card and a present for their mom on her birthday. . .

i am wondering if i say anything or teach them respect my way once a year? now, X soaks this up as feeling important and loves all the attention, in fact, she competes with me for the kids attention. . . . other people have told me that also. . .

anyway, any suggestions on bringing up the topic with X, or kids, or drop it? BTW, last year, it was one card and a $7.00 phamplet about cooking from my kids. . .

at christmas, my kids asked me what i wanted, and i gave them two items that i really wanted, not expensive, one for each, and they were readily available at the mall. . . avg cost $30 each. . .

i got all kinds of junk that was worthless. Meaning, X did not help them learn or shop very well. My X loves affection of gift buying such that our house filled up with junk, and in my mind, is very materialistic. . . a sore spot for me. . . anyway, that's the background,

need suggestions for dealing with the situation. . . or not. . .

PS. its so bad that everytime i went shopping for groceries, 11 yo wanted to buy something for mom,and then also mom's boyfriends' kids, etc. and wouldn't stop asking when i did not let her, even after i explained it to her.

wiftty

Hi wiffty - one thing that works for me is giving each child a much larger allowance ($4/wk) than they had before. Then I don't buy them "extras" haphazardly, the way I was doing earlier in the separation. First, that was adding up, and second, as you point out they will keep asking. There are rules, written down, as to what the allowance does and does not cover. And they get it for every week, not just the weekends I have custody.

Now on the parent gifts, there I suggest you ignore it. Recognize their money for this would probably have to come from Mom, and it may be painful or awkward for your kids to ask, if your ex makes it obvious she does not want to. This is a case where I think you benefit, if only in the long run, from backing off the pressure.

For your ex's birthday and Christmas, just give your kids a budget to buy their Mom a gift, and let it go at that. In my case, this is not covered by their allowance.

If you do the math, you see it still adds up, but the amount is controlled, and this solves many other problems for me. I assume your kids are not working yet, when that happens, I guess things change somewhat.

- Tom

PS - things my kids use the allowance for are toys, souvenirs, snacks at the movie, library fines, breakage, etc. There are no advances or loans (I told them I would have to charge interest in that case <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> . They aren't old enough to know how interest works). Things they don't pay for are clothes, lunches, admission fees, activity fees, birthday and Christmas presents. But they do get a budget when invited to a birthday party.

My vote...Let it go.

You can not change your ex, you can not tell a person how you want them to give to you.

You can show them how to give to others, you do that, but don't tell them how to give to you...

So, let it go.

ANNA

anna,

that's what i have been doing, and the only part that irks me is that if feeds into X's inflated sense of winning her one sided competition. ..

that is what ultimately irks me. ..

the resistance i get from X about suggestions that i think is good for the kids by trying to co parent, some have gone to her lawyer to try to prevent me from doing, but then i mention that if i can't do it, she pipes up all happily to be the parent to do the stuff. . .

the whole one sided selfish competition just irks me, so i need someone to reinforce again that its not the right path to take.

i read an excellent article on how selfish people are developed, one way is by observing parental competition, another way is to give them everything they want, which my X does by claiming that she is supporting them and their development.. . .

ugh. . . i just wish i had never met this woman. .. who had a child development major in college. . .

thanks for keeping me in line.

wiftty

Something I have learned to do is if I want something from the kids...I let them know what I want.

"I" take them to the store..and "I" give them the money to get it..they don't ask their dad to give them money to buy "ME" something...if they did he'd give them a couple dollars each and take them to the everything's a dollar store..and have them buy them buy something there...how do I know this?? From past experience when we were married..

So if there is something YOU want for your birthday...I say stop 'expecting' YOUR EX WIFE to change..and all of a sudden take your kids out and actually BUY you something you really want..

Another suggestion...Stop taking them to BUY presents for her..if she want's something from them for her birthday or christmas...let her take them...or let her b/f take them...

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

thanks for keeping me in line.

wiftty[/QB]</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Well, Actually I probably could have been more helpful by thinking more on this instead of just jumping in with a quick response.

Especially since I have had this same issue...I didn't get as upset as you, but I did think at one point, "Why am I making sure he has gifts when he doesn't make sure the kids get me anything." So I decided to change that.

A couple of years ago on Mother's day ex didn't help younger or older son get me anything as usual. They did it on their own and I knew this...I was proud of that. So, Father's day rolled around and I let the kids do or not do what they wanted to for Father's day. I told them it was Father's day, but they never suggested buying anything or going to the store so neither did I.

Kids were upset because father's day weekend ex's girlfriend got all these presents for her own kids to give to my ex and kids had nothing to give. Even though girlfriend put from my kids as well, they said they really didn't feel it came from them.

Sure enough, I don't even know how the subject got started, but ex said to me something like, "I thought you would make sure the kids got me something, you always did in the past." I said, "Oh you never make sure they get me anything, so I finally took your hint you and I wouldn't be responsible anymore?" He mumbled through some excuse...but that turned everything around for him and even taught the kids a lesson.

The kids are more aware to get their father something now as well because they don't want to feel that way again, they are taking more responsibility. That is something I didn't even factor in when I decided to butt out of ex's presents.

Ex takes kids shopping and the past year I have been getting really nice presents from the kids...compliments of ex helping them pick it out and shopping with them...

Sometimes if you let the kids fall they learn their own lesson.

That's not even my only time to deal with this...

My brother is a lot younger than me. My sisters and I have always got him a gift and he would give us a gift but my mom would find and purchase it...fine while he was little but after he turned 18 I had a problem with this.

My mother spoiled him and would continue doing this. So one year I stopped, he was probably around 20...and he said to me, "All my other sisters got me a present...you didn't." and I said, "I got you the same thing you got me, what's the point here. He said, "I got you something." I said, "You are 20 years old, mom bought something and put your name on it, that isn't the same." Birthday rolls around, same thing...This year at Christmas he bought me and his sisters something out of his own money and picked it out. He wanted my respect, I could tell...I let him know how proud I was that he is growing into a very responsible man.

As for your wife, it sounds like you are like me and my ex, you could care less what she thinks about anything and she could care less what you think about anything...

Anyway, there ya go...

ANNA

<small>[ April 13, 2003, 03:05 PM: Message edited by: Anna2000 ]</small>

I'm with ThornedRose on this one.

Our 1st year divorced I did everything, I took them shopping for their mom's b-day, X-mas, and so on.

When those things rolled around for me, unless I gave them money, all I got was a stinking homemade card. WAIT, those homemade cards are worth more than gifts and show true feelings of love.

So the girls and I talked about it and we decided that if they wanted to get me something then I'd give them money, otherwise the gester of the card was perfect.

Sadly, after my X's last birthday my middle daughter came home upset. WHY DIDN'T YOU GET MOMMY A GIFT? Sweet child it's not my place to get your mom a gift, you could of made her a special card like you make me!!!! (My real question that I never asked any of them is Why didn't they feel the desire to make mommy a card like they make for Dad?). When I talked with my oldest about it, apparently MOM had gotten upset because I didn't buy her a gift from the kids.

To me the lesson taught was received. Maybe I'm a little bias but they give respect where respect is do.

<small>[ April 14, 2003, 08:36 AM: Message edited by: LostHusband ]</small>

what my problem is that i had expected the original behavior to continue, but my expectations are not realistic. . .

she agreed to co parent, run stuff by me, etc, and as soon as she got a BF, that all stopped, and she refused to cooperate.

that is what i didn't see happening. it was the pushing my buttons enough, but changing agreements, etc, and not following through, that she could convince her boyfriend that i was her problem, just like she convinced me that her parents were her problem when we met. . .

so its my fault for not anticipating the change and not seeing the change coming. . .

thanks
bill

wiftty