I have been married for 12 years to a woman who I wanted so much to make happy and give her nice life. Through a good part of our marriage, we always had a similar outlook on what we wanted out of life - a loving mom who stayed at home with the kids and kept up the house and a loving dad who worked hard to be the breadwinner for his family. I guess I was always a little selfish in that I liked the fact that this girl wanted to live her life for me and please me in every respect. I tried to do the same. She didn't need a lot to make her happy. All of this is what made me fall in love with her. She has a very calm, laid back personality with a low energy level, where I am higher strung with high energy and constantly feel the stresses of life. I saw these dramatic personality differences while we were dating, but felt like the love we had for each other would allow the best aspects of both of these personalities to rub off on the other. In the long run, this turned out to have an opposite effect. For the first few years, things were okay probably because everything was new and the responsibilities and rigors that go along with life were kept to a minimum. But then as the kids came (we have three in five years) and the responsibilities of life multiplied with house and financial burdens, our marriage began to fail. The bad thing was that we didn't realize it and now it may be too late. I began to become resentful of my wife who was a stay at home mom / housewife because I felt like all of life's burdens were on my shoulders alone. It has really intensified over the years to a point where I have lost respect for this woman. I found myself coming home from long, grueling days at work feeling like she was not making a contribution to the "not-so-fun" things about having a family, such as regularly keeping the house clean, cooking or caring properly for the children. In the beginning, I discussed my concerns with her in a loving, supportive way, letting her know how important her job of being a mother and housewife is, but my concerns were always taken as a criticism. I always had to compensate for her shortcomings and on many occasions, absorbed a great deal of her housewife chores even after coming home from a long day at work. Over time, things worsened as I developed a negative opinion of her by absolutely believing she is lazy and taking advantage of the life I gave her while I do all the sweating. Sometimes, I am downright indignant and even verbally abusive. Please don't take what I am saying as male chauvinist, because I am a very supportive husband and would do anything for my wife. But I did feel like I she was not upholding her end of the bargain. After all, marriage is not always a bed of roses and life's responsibilities are not always fun. I think she holds me responsible when the house becomes dirty, dinner has to be cooked or one of the children need help with homework. I can't get over these issues which have now festered for probably over 5 or 6 years. My wife in turn, has now totally alienated me. She has stopped loving me and we are at a point now, where there is little or no communication, absolutely zero sex and a clear lack of respect for one another. I still love her (even though she thinks if I loved her I would just be content with whatever she does or doesn't do), but can't get past this issue. If my personality was more passive, I probably would have been able to overlook a lot of these things but I just can't. The days where she would want to please me are also gone. We have been seeing a marriage counselor now for about two months, but I think I have criticized my wife so much, that I have done permanent damage. She is also on anti-depressant medication. I realize my shortcomings here, but continue to feel unfulfilled. Our therapist has said that she can't help us unless both sides are willing to compromise and change. I will do anything to make this marriage work but there needs to be give and take on both sides. I am sensing that my wife is not sure she wants this marriage anymore. I am sick about this, because I know I'm a good man and I want our happiness back. Any advice is most welcomed. Thank you.

Dominic,<BR>You've come to the right place. The folks here know what your going through. I have only a few comments to offer.<P>I believe your marriage is screaming for change. Marriages and relationships change through the years and if you don't adapt, you end up where you are now.<P>Is your marriage ever going to be the way it was? No, but it can be much better if you're willing to work very very hard. Both of you.<P>Did your harsh words and criticism of your wife cause permanent damage? Probably, however, if sounds like there's still a little hope and love left and that's a good sign.<P>What to do now? By all means continue counseling. I would suggest you read through this website. Learn about the MB concepts and start with the questionnaires. You will have to stop all the negative behavior.<P>Change may mean that your wife takes a job or gets involved in volunteer work. She can only play domestic housewife so long before she goes crazy. The children are old enough now to handle day care and the upkeep of the house is a dual job. You need to help as much as possible around the house. I'm in a dual career marriage and I know what it's like to be wiped out at the end of the day. However, I've learned that it doesn't take that much effort to do the dishes after dinner, pick up dirty clothes and take them to the laundry, do some of the carpooling, help check homework, do baths (depending on ages of kids), etc.<P>It's sounds like your W's depression is a symptom of her need to feel good about herself. Encorage her to get out and do something she enjoys. Church work, gardening clubs, there are many ways. She may enjoy getting a job and contribute to the financial support. People in general need to feel like they can make a contibution, not just to their spouse or the family, but to the world itself. Think about it! Would you want to do her job 24/7 with the only thing to look forward to is a grumpy spouse coming home wanting dinner, beer and a f**k. (I'm being harsh here to make a point. Please don't take it personnaly)<P>Love means looking past all the faults and truely give thanks for the lives being shared. Don't keep score! Do as much as you possibly can to help out. I'm sure she will respond in kind.<P>Good Luck!<P><P>------------------<BR>Later,<BR>B

Dominic,<P>I understand your frustration and feel your pain. However, being the recipient of verbal, emotional, and mental abuse, I can also relate to your wife. I was criticized for years and the damage can never totally be undone. Being a housewife is a 24/7 job. No coffee breaks, (no potty breaks), NO RECOGNITION. Do you recognize the good things your wife does? Often? When she does clean the house, do you strive to KEEP IT CLEAN or do you just come home and make a mess? Do you pick up after yourself? Appreciation is shown in many ways - verbally and in actions. She may not be ready to work on your marriage - but YOU can turn it around if she still loves you. Don't give up. Read the MB website for ideas and keep working on it. Love busters will do you no good at this point and will result in even more damage. Be patient and good luck to you.<BR>

Through your whole post I hear "unmet needs". Are you both fully aware of each others emotional needs in order of their priority for each of you? Figure this out through Harley's materials. Lack of nurturing in your relationship can bring on pent up stress or depression in both of you.<P>Do you ever surprise her with something very special to her? Do you take her "out" and treat her like a queen often? Wives need romance. Do you make sure she can get away from responsibilities/kids on occasion? At-home moms really need that! You can get away from your job but her job at home is constant unless you allow her meaningful breaks away. She needs to look forward to something; make plans together! A change of scenery helps the mind too.<P>My guess is, she's suffering depression from the verbal abuse. It totally drains, damages, and de-motivates a wife! (I know!) My H expects that I can be "new" each day...he doesn't comprehend the extent of damage his careless tongue causes me emotionally for days, months, even years!! You must prevent such episodes!...Find ways to deal with your frustrations. <P>It is alot of work keeping up with 3 little kids! Be understanding that she could have been running all day, but the house may not look like she did a thing! She could be suffering from burn-out. Is there any time she has alone to deal with her inner self through prayer, journaling, even exercise (which helps stress)? <P>She undoubtedly feels your stress...what are you doing to manage your own work stresses and emotional life so you can present yourself to her as the caring, charming man she dated? <P>Life can wear on all of us, but we have to find the inspiring things, our own stress relieving techniques, and ways to re-create ourselves (recreation). Some people are energized by just being around people, while others need solitude to gain focus and happiness. What does your wife need? Listen to what she needs most, and plan to change what needs changing! You have analyzed things from your view of things...but listen, and find out where she is without criticizing. <BR>I'm confident you both can rebuild, but you've got to be part of her process of getting out of withdrawal. <P><BR><p>[This message has been edited by Renae (edited April 18, 2001).]

I appreciate all of your sincere and candid responses. It appears that everyone's opinion is that this marriage is able to be saved. I wish I felt that way. On one hand, I am optimistic by the advice given, but on the other hand, I am living this day to day and just don't see how this can be done by only one side working it at. Both parties have to want to change to make the marriage work. I feel my wife is has given up on me and I have done irreversible damage. As I said in yesterday's post, I am more than willing to COMPROMISE, but not give in. I am fully aware of the issues I need to work on, the most important being how I can lessen my continuing high expectations of her as well as how I handle everyday stress. But, by closing my eyes to everything and continuously biting my tongue, you are asking me to completely change who I am. If she would only show some signs that she hears my concerns as well, things would improve. Give a little, get a little. As far as the comments about the housewife being a 24/7 job, you will get no argument from me. I appreciate what she goes through each day and no one ever said it was easy. I hope I didn't give an impression that I don't help out (or believe I should help out), because I would have to say I probably do too much (she says it too). In fact, each day when I come home from work, I will share in most of the responsibilities, whether it be helping out with homework, coaching baseball, cleaning up, bill paying - basically whatever is needed. On one hand, she tells me to sit and relax and don't worry, but on the other hand, the house looks like a bomb exploded and there are many things that I could help with. It's just my personality not to sit still. We are in this together. By the time all these things are done each day, I have about 30 to 60 minutes before I am ready to go to bed just to repeat it all the next day. I am not at all complaining though. I am a father and a husband and this comes with the territory. I guess the chip I have on my shoulder is the fact that, say what you want, but with all three kids in school, my wife basically has about 40 hours per week without kids. This should be more than enough time to do the normal house cleaning chores, laundry, shopping etc. as well as have time for herself. I have encouraged her to get involved in outside activities and projects and do things that would please her, but with the exception of donating a few hours of time at the children's school, she has not undertaken anything else. Playing games and chatting on the computer for a good part of the "work day" seems to be her outlet. This obviously infuriates me to a point that I can't hold it in and the verbal abuse starts. As far as some of the comments made in your replies.. Have I taken the time to recognize and praise her for the things she does do? I would say, absolutely Yes, she would say absolutely No. I guess all of the verbal abuse I have given her over the years has caused her to be deaf to my praises. Any advice on how I could improve this would be most appreciated. I do try and get out on dates with her as much as possible, although I am sure it's not enough. I never sense she has a really good time though. We have basically given up many of our friends over the years which I have probably caused due to the everyday stresses of life where any free time I have would rather be spent relaxing or doing something with the kids, than going out. Yes, I sometimes bring her flowers, and will on many occasions, order a dinner out or bring something home to alleviate a hectic day she may be having. I do try, but I guess not in the right way or what she needs. I don't know what she needs anymore. I ask her, but receive no answer that I could work with. She doesn't care what I need anymore. I just want some communication, some love and some praise every once in a while for the good things that I do too. She keeps telling me that I don't know her even after all these years. Maybe I don't. She has said that she has stopped trying to make me happy and that her and I would be better off with someone else. I am bleeding here and am losing my life. I want our happiness back.

Warmest Greetings:<P>Sometimes when we get frustrated... we can only see our own solution... but there are many solutions available if we stop to think.<P>Consider the emotional cost of your frustration with the cleanliness of your home. Consider the emotional cost of your wife's hurt with your anger towards her... that comes out in criticism, disrespect, and verbal assault (I tend to engage in angry outbursts and am by no means "above" you My latest angry outburst? Well... I did manage to not "say a word" (I whipped him off in passing : ) )<P>So... in this case... what are some mutually agreeable solutions that will focus on... SOLVING THE PROBLEM... instead of trying to win the argument (taking out frustration)?<P>Here's a thought. Hire a cleaner one to two days a week? <P>When you come home... the house will be clean.<P>When you come home... your wife will not have to face anger or criticism... AND... if you say you understand that she IS overwhelmed (with both responsibility AND the stresses upon her)... and you CARE and are willing to INVEST in HER... ch-ching.<P>You'll be working TOGETHER to find a SOLUTION... realizing that the ISSUES between you are the problem... not you... not her.<P>Focus on the ISSUES... and SOLUTIONS... instead of acting upon all of the FRUSTRATION... that UNRESOLVED CONFLICT has allowed to fester.<P>Amazingly enough... when you address the ISSUES and begin to SOLVE them... the FRUSTRATION... will dissipate.<P>As long as you want to win the argument... you both lose.<P>As a salesperson... I try to create "win win" situations with my customers, co-workers, empoyer. I know that if we both win... we are building compatibility. It pays. I get referrals. All sorts of benefits. I'm bulding... RELATIONSHIPS.<P>The money I could make today... if I "gouged" anyone... would cost me in the longrun. I'm building for my future. I'm building relationships by selling a good product at a good price with good service.<P>You could insist and demand that everything be done the way you want in order to satisfy your needs... or you could build your relationship by investing your time, your energy, and your resources in seeking to build and establish win win solutions.<P>The cost of ASSISTING your wife is much less than the cost of GAINING by demanding that your frustration be dissipated by doing things your way. If you focus on the issues and the solutions... frustration will not rule and dominate your thoughts... blocking your ability to see more ways to accomplish your goals.<P>As much as you are able... please don't take it so personally. Please strive for a win win and be willing to be the first to lead towards the path of solution.<P>Blessings, peace, and happiness to the two of you,...<P>Laura

Dominic - I feel really sorry for you and your wife. You need to know that emotional/verbal abuse is just as bad as physical abuse - the only difference being physical can be seen. I have been a victim of emotional/verbal abuse and am now in counseling and taking an antidepressant. I feel like I can't control anything in my life. My husband has always felt that he is superior to me and anything that I do. Eventually this wears a person's inner happiness with themselves down till they feel they have nothing left. If you can't please your husband, why try? If your wife feels that anything she accomplishes isn't good enough for your standards, she will begin to doubt anything and everything that she does in life. I don't think you realize what damage you have done. I am still trying to get through the damage my husband has done to me. I know I'm doing the right thing by thinking of myself and my three kids and I would tell her to do the same thing. I don't know how you will ever get the happiness back in your marriage if things are as bad as you say they are. No one deserves to be put down or made to feel as if they aren't worth anything. I think you have a lot of issues that you need to work through/deal with. You need to ask yourself something......if you really loved your wife, why would you make her suffer from your abuse? You need to get help. I admire her for trying to save herself. I feel for her, because I've been there and am still there. I don't know if I'll ever recover from his years of torture - telling me I'm not a good mother to my kids, making me feel that I'm a selfish person, and whatever else comes to his mind - Another question you should ask yourself - why do you REALLY want to save this marriage?? Is it because you are afraid of failure? I can't see raising three children in a household where mom and dad don't love each other or have a kind word to say to each other. What is that teaching your children? Believe me, they see it all. Eventually it will hurt them, too, in the long run. I will pray that your wife recovers from this damage you have caused her and that you will eventually find happiness with yourself.

<BR>Tasha - I appreciate and understand your comments. It seems however, that you are only focusing in on one point made in my post which is the point of the verbal abuse and emotional torture that I seemed to have caused my wife. I'm not sure how you formulated your detailed response from only one or two statements that were made. I can certainly understand where you are coming from because it sounds like you are in the same boat. It's understandable that you are biased, but it seems that you may have unintentionally ignored many, many other important issues that I also raised. Please try and remember, that there are always two sides to every story... <P>I will start this off by wholeheartedly agreeing with you about the damage inflicted to my wife and there is absolutely no excuse for what I have done. With counseling, I am truly trying to recognize and ultimately control this behavior. I will tell you that through my entire life, it has never been in my personal makeup to be verbally abusive to anyone, let alone someone that I love. It seems like this only occurs when (in my opinion) my wife goes out of her way to deliberately not please me or intentionally "push my buttons". We have many differences of opinion regarding what roles each of us play in this marriage and I feel like I unselfishly give more than 150% each day and my wife does not (or cannot). I put myself last. I don't have to tell you, but even for the most happily married people, life is not always fun! The difference is they have learned to compromise and strike some type of a happy medium - you win some, you lose some. There is no question that to have a happy marriage, you have to work at it and sweat everyday. It can't only be what one person wants or thinks. Making comments like, "I don't care what you want or need", or "this is the person you married, take it or leave it", is not an option for happiness. Swallow your pride if it important to your spouse but maybe not important to you. That goes for me too. You asked me if I loved my wife and the answer is yes, but married life is not two people consumed only with each other sitting on a beach with rose pedals falling all around them and the rest of the world completely shut out. The responsibilities and rigors associated with kids, finances, work, house upkeep and life in general have gotten the best of both of us. What has made the marriage fail is that we view them and handle them differently. I exceed the speed of sound to try and maintain everything and as a result I become stressed out, frustrated and resentful. Believe me, I know that my personality puts others on edge and is not the easist to live with each day. But, I always mean well and really am a good, sincere husband and father. My wife on the other hand, has a very low patience and energy level and basically shuts down when life gets overwhelming. She can be good hearted, but has resolved herself to the fact that no matter what I think or feel, she will do only what she wants to do, and nothing more. Sorry, but I call that childish and selfish. If she loved me, she would help me control my self imposed stress, but she says that's not her job. Thank god I am not an alcoholic or addicted to drugs because I fear I would get the same response which is - "not my problem, deal with it yourself." There have been many, many situations where I have been there for my wife when she decides to "breakdown" even at the expense of the children. I will pick up the pieces (whether it be homework, cleaning or whatever), even after coming home from a long day at work, while she on the other hand, is home all day by herself while the kids are in school. When you have two people on this "team", who view responsibility at total opposite ends of the spectrum, it spells resentment and discontent. Marriage needs to be a team effort. Sometimes, teams win the game and other times they lose. A true team player is not selfish and works extremely hard for the good of the team, but always sacrifices at their own expense. <P>Why do I REALLY want to save this marriage? I am not at all afraid of failure like you stated. I am more afraid that I could be missing out on what could be many happy years living a wonderful simple life together with the same woman I married 12 years ago and seeing our family mature. No matter what has happened or what may happen, I do want to share my life with this woman. We worked hard to build this life. I want her back and will work hard at it. But, if we have any chance at all to survive, she needs to work hard too. Yes, this is the same girl who once saw all the good things and was so happy being with me. I continue to pray for strength, that somehow God will see us both through these tuff times and help us learn to become more of a team. We have been given so many gifts in this life and they are being taken for granted.<BR><p>[This message has been edited by Dominic (edited April 24, 2001).]

You sound very much like my husband - He always claims that a marriage is like a team - working together for the good of the team. However, HE is the manager/coach of the team and I am the only teamplayer. He tells me everything about what I should do, when I should do it and how I should do it. He even thinks for me and tells me how I feel. It's amazing that he has that much insight. Let me tell you a little about my husband and you tell me if it sounds like you......My husband knew when he married me that all the pieces of the puzzle weren't there (if you know what I mean). He told me that he swallowed his pride to accept me into his life. He feels that I should be honored that he did this for me 'cause he was trying to give me a better life. He wants everything done his way - no matter what this is. He feels that I am not a good mom to my kids. He tells me constantly that I am selfish and only think of myself. He makes me feel like I'm worth less than two cents by constantly telling me about my weight and that he never liked sex with me. (I would think he enjoyed it at some point by having three kids with me). How is this supposed to make someone feel? Like they WANT to be with you? If you loved your wife, you would NEVER put her down or make her feel like she doesn't deserve to breathe the same air as you. I'm sure you feel superior to her or you wouldn't be verbally abusing her. Typically verbal abusers are controlling people who try to make everything in their lives perfect. Well, believe me, no one is perfect and neither is this world. I still feel that like my husband, you have a lot of issues that you need to work on. It is not your wife's problem to tell you that you have a problem. It's like an alcoholic or drug user - you have to admit you have a problem, and get help on your own. You need to help yourself if you expect anyone else to help you. Remember you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make the horse drink it. I guess what I'm trying to tell you is that I admire your wife for getting the help that she needs - but stop blaming her for your shortcomings. You and only you are responsible for your actions, be it verbal or physical. I don't believe she is intentionally "pushing buttons" as you put it to get you all worked up. I really think you are using that as an excuse. What person in their right mind asks to be abused? I agree that I am biased in this, but I could be your wife. There are so many of us with the same story - your wife should also look into a support group. I know what your wife is going through. It's not something that she can control. Instead of viewing her as a lazy person, why don't you give her time away from the house and kids - just for herself - to get away and maybe try to feel a little better about herself. I'm sure she is feeling so low right now - like she's no good and worthless. Has she ever had suicidal thoughts? That is a possibility when someone feels there is no other way out. I just urge you to be more considerate of her and her feelings. If you want this to work, it's gonna take a lot of patience and understanding on your part. Instead of looking at her faults, focus on her good points. She doesn't need your praise - she'll just feel that your saying that to keep the peace. I hope that this helps you, but you have to help yourself, too. I pray that you get the help you need to end the abuse - you need to find a way to deal with your problem and not take things out on others. Take care.

<small>[ January 27, 2005, 04:10 PM: Message edited by: hanora ]</small>

Dominic, <P>I have to agree with hanora. Being a stay at home mom isn't what you think it is. <BR>Consider this story. A woman was constantly badgered by her husband because she was at home all day, yet the house was a mess. There were toys out, the kids were dirty, laundry wasn't done and dinner wasn't ready when he came home from work. <BR>One day, the woman grew tired of hearing the complaints from her husband. She got tired of answering him when he said it looked like she didn't do anything all day. So she decided that the next day she would do absolutely nothing. <BR>Her husband came home the next day and found toys all over the place - not just the few that are normally there; he found the kids still in their pajamas, he found them filthy - not just dirty; he found food allover and dishes all over. The laundry was strewn about the house. It looked like a cyclone hit it. When he finally found his wife - in bed - he asked her adamantly, "What did you do all day?" she replied, "Absolutely nothing, dear."<P>Do you see? What you think is nothing, is actually a big dent in what could be. A stay-at-home mom spends most of her day picking up after kids. If they ever sleep, she might get the chance to take a shower. Something, I'm sure, you take for granted. But the kids wake up. They want to play. They want mom to play. What is more important, a clean house, or a well-adjusted child. <P>I never really understood what the picture meant in my brothers house. I read it all the time when I babysat his kids. It said, "Cleaning and dusting can wait til tomorrow....I'm rocking my baby, and babies don't keep."<P>Can you see it? Take a really good look. How are your children? Are you embarrassed to take them out in public? Do babysitters tell you they don't want to babysit a second time? Can they read, if they are of age? Has your house burned down? Has there been any flooding? <P>If you've answered no to any of these, then I'd say you are concentrating your attention in the wrong place. <BR>Let it go. Life won't be perfect, ever. But if your family grows up to be loving and caring, that is what is most important. <P>Do something for me. When you get home tonight or tomorrow, take over. Let your wife have a few minutes by herself. The rewards will far outweigh the sacrifice. You get a break from your job just by driving home. She doesn't get a break. Hers is constant. Appreciate what you have, before you lose it.

As a guy, sitting in a hotel room, after 16 years of being with his wife including 6 children together, Dominic, forget the house and what she does or does not do. First and foremost, talk to her. Go on a walk and spend time with her. You had better drop the focus on what you've done FAST and focus on what she needs from you. Ask her what you could do this week, or just today, that would please her, that would make her feel loved. Then do it. Make yourself a checklist, put it on your calendar. Do it again the next day or week without asking. You need to focus on what would show her you love her. I think you know what makes her feel bad - you have to drop these things. They are not worth your marriage/ relationship. You need to kindle some love - and this will take time - but it's better than ending up where I am.

Dominic - I guess you really didn't like what anyone had to say here, did you? I know you're in denial and just trying to put the blame on your wife. It's a real shame you lost something so good. Here's hoping you learn from your mistakes. I know someone else is gonna appreciate what you won't. Thought we could help you out here........