Originally I was going to meet my wife(WS) in person to discuss what she wanted to talk about. However after thinking about it I told her if it was to discuss divorcing that she could send me what she had to say via an email or by talking on the phone. Well we spoke last night and my wife told me once again the decision she has made is the right one and that her feelings have been confirmed about me by her living on her own for a a year now. She asked me to go along with a divorce. At this point I don't know what to do. She keeps asking me why do I want to be married to someone who is no longer there in the relationship. My wife heard about some online divorce thing that makes things cheap if both parties agree. I still feel I am getting the short end of the stick so I am not sure what to do. I feel she is getting everything and I am getting what is left over by her decision. She told me by her getting the divorce that will give her closure in life and it will allow her to move on. She thinks it will give me closure but I told her for me that won't work. Signing some piece of paper isn't going to give me closure for all of this mess. So I ask what do I do? Do I give in with the entire idea and get it done and over with? Do I wait until I am ready which I can't say when I will be ready for a divorce? The only thing I might go along with is if my wife agrees that I get to stay in the house until I am ready to move out. At that time she would get the money from the sale for the time she lived in it. The furniture would also be dealt with when I move out. Moving out would be done when I am ready. So, does anyone have any input? I am real confused and on top of that even hurt even more by this divorce talk. There is part of me that wants to just throw in the towel and say that is it. The other part of me tells me I am just not ready to be divorced. Help.......

If your WW sends you papers to sign......I would consider that the end. As long as those papers do not show up, the marriage is still savable. Is your WW still with OM??.....If she is saying she wants the divorce period and is still with OM.....do you really want her back? Just curious <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

I went through the same thing as you did as far as getting the leftovers of the estate is concerned. Because you are the one who is still in love and in the marriage, and your W is the one who is not concerned about you anymore, you are emotionally vulnerable in this situation - as I was. One tends to be so nice to the spouce that you give in to demands on the estate that one never should and would have done under normal circumstances. One feels there is a problem with dividing the estate but one wants to be nice and asceed to the other one's demands. What I found helped in my case was to seek good legal advice and talk to some friends about your circumstances. They tend to talk sense into one's head which helps you around your emotional disadvantage. It usually helps to get a bit angry also. Nothing prevents one from becoming solidly stuborn and not asceeding to any demands on the estate. The last mentioned approach might just bring the wayward spouce around to reconcider the divorce.

ITSOVER....
I don't think my wife is with the original OM. I could be wrong but I stopped trying to spy on her. However with her being single over the last year and living in the city and going out with her single friends. I am sure she has been getting a lot of attention. She tells me the feelings aren't there to be in a relationship any more. Do I really want her back? Well I want back the person I married not the person she is now. If that makes sense. If she stays the way she is now I don't want her back. I want the person I know back but my wife says the person she is now is the person she really is.

Do I tell my wife if she wants a divorce than for her to go file and I am not assisting in the process?

confused_guy......I married my EXwife when she was young 22, and had been with her since she was 16 <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> . She too changed......basically after she got her college degree and became more independant. I wanted the person I married early on also, but I made a huge mistake by marrying an unexperienced person. She grew into the "whatever ya wanna call it" that she is now. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

confused_guy,

Been there - done that! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> My X came to me with the same suggestion - as if I wanted to discuss the end of my marriage at our kitchen table "over cookies and milk". It is immaturity if you ask me. I told her "no". For like you, I had no intentions to get divorced. For me it was even more so because of my strong belief that marriage was a vow, not just a legal contract. I simply asked my X if she thought a divorce was going to be as easy as a walk in the park? She left the house and ran to a lawyer. She took my comment as me saying I would fight her all the way. Nope.

The divorce was HER decision, so it was up to her to do ALL the work. Like you, we had no children, no real savings, just a house (which I still have). So from a financial perspective, it would be 50-50 no matter what happened. I did go talk to an attorney and the first words out of my mouth were "I don't want to be here and I do NOT want this divorce, but I realize I need someone there to protect me and guide me through this". My lawyer was great! I also think that is VERY important - to find a lawyer who understands you and who you feel comfortable with. I told him that I will only do exactly what is necessary by me, by law. I would not help this process in ANYWAY.

It ended up that my X paid a lot more money for legal work than I, since she had to initiate all filings and such. I NEVER got mean or angry. I gave her just about everything she wanted from a materialistic perspective - Why would I want something that was her's or that she wanted anyway? There were one or two items that I firmly said "no" to. But other than that, it all went through and I came out of it WITHOUT anger in my heart and with my head held high.

I spent the entire year fighting for my marriage, fighting for my love for my wife. I took a stand and I lost. But more correctly, "she lost".

You are going to hear people telling you to do this or do that. Get mad, get angry, don't let her walk all over you and on and on... Most of them really care about you and don't like seeing you get hurt (some just have unresolved anger of their own). BUT YOU NEED TO BE TRUE TO YOU. If you love her, then love her - to $ell with everyone else, including your wife. Love is a choice and it shouldn't depend on what the other person is giving or doing or saying...

Its been 3 years now without my X and I still have no anger towards her. Hey sure, I get mad sometimes, but those thoughts leave just as quick as they come. The bottom line is that I won't allow myself to keep anger in my heart. Anger helps nothing - no one! It makes you feel bad and it makes the other person feel bad. What good does that do? For anyone?

Stand strong and firm. Don't beg your wife to stay, but if you don't want to divorce her, well then get an attorney ONLY to protect yourself. Plus I told myself, "if she were to get everything, would I really not be able to survive and thrive because of that?" Hey nothing in life is fair. So I think being true to yourself is the most important thing. That may mean you live through some pain, but in the end you are a much better person for it...

god bless,
mike

-------------------
32 yrs old
Xwife 29 yrs old
divorced 2 years
separated 1 year
no kids
together for 8 years
A much stronger person now

Read the other post. Her email is EXACTLY THE SAME as the first one I got after he took up with Monkeyho, soulmate #2 after me. Same words.

He wanted to be friends. Yea right. This guy has screwed me every way possible and broke into my home last month.

My advice? Don't read anything into it. The WS's seem to take the BS on a ride. Emotionally and financially. I know you're hurting. I am so sorry. Praying for you too. But seek a lawyer. I don't trust someone who's cheating. Period.

I say contact my buddy ORchid. She is good at speaking "fog talk" and I would almost limit your time in contact with your W. Let her see you're getting on with your life. She probably thinks you're doing what you are already doing. pining away for her.

Remember what Dobson says in LMBT. The diagram of the clingy spouse. The more you cling, the more they run away. Work on you. Get legal advice. Focus elsewhere and do not cling! You can always go through with a divorce and apply MB at same time. And I think some advice on plan A andB would be good for you. Would almost say, "you know wife, you're right. let's be friends (but be distant and just say that like she's just saying that.). I want to get on with my life etc...And do it. Don't answer when the phone rings. Change your schedule. Be unpredictable. At the same time, it's good for you too. Fun.

Orchid and Redhat on A/B and Gen. Questions are good with dealing with the foggy. Her email was pure fog talk. REAd NOTHING into it ok? Just get an attorney.

I must admit it is very hard not to read into what my WS says or has said. It just amazes me that the person I see and talk with now is totally different than the person that I once knew. I know everyone changes but it is amazing when someone changes and it doesn't appear they have changed for the better.
What my wife said may have been all fog talk but the sad part is soon if she keeps pushing the issue we will be a thing of the past and we will be divorced. She thinks the divorce will give her closure so she can move on in life. I can't keep hanging on to someone that is no longer there.
Do I try delaying the divorce or do I just let things serve their course?

Hey guy,

I read something thirty or forty years ago to the effect that a divorce isn't the end of a marriage, it is merely the funeral ceremony. I don't know it that is completely true, but you get the idea.

As far as the idea of she gets what she wants and you get the left overs, well, you just don't have to accept that. The lawyers have a saying concerning settlement of financial matters and physical possessions:

"The person who needs the divorce the most is usually the one who takes the financial beating."

Your ws is saying she needs the divorce so she can get closure. Then she is trying to convince you that you also need closure, what ever the hell that is. It sounds like a line of bull.... to me. Sounds like she thinks she can get a divorce and get a property - financial settlement on her terms too.

Let me point out that this is a marriage builders site, created to save marriages. And yes, you do have to kiss up quite a bit if you want to save a marriage. But once it reaches the point where divorce is inevitable, there is no percentage at all in acting like a doormat.

What ever you do, stay away from those online divorce things, and stay away from her lawyer. Don't you ask her lawyer for advice, it is like asking a barber if you need a haircut. She sounds like she is willing to do anything to you financially that you will allow her to do.

If the time comes when you must move ahead, the first thing you have to do is stand up. And stand up for your interests and your rights. You count too.

She claims she needs a divorce to feel closure... Hmmm... Could it be she's having some second thoughts that she's trying to silence? I could be wrong (I frequently am LOL) but I think sometimes people burn bridges because it's seems less painful than continuing to struggle with ambivalence.

Or (probably way off base), maybe she is counting on you to not go along, so she can pretend you're somehow preventing the divorce? Again, she may be struggling with indecision and not wanting to take the responsibility for the choice.

Whatever her motive, I think the advice given here about Plans is a good idea. You let her know you don't want a divorce (ESPECIALLY not a cheap online one), that you're still committed to the marriage, that she's free to file if she insists... but she doesn't get to make your choices for you. You aren't preventing her from filing (though she may pretend you are because the cheap divorce has to be mutually agreed upon). When my husband and his family tried to make me feel guilty for the expense of the divorce, I pointed out that it was a consequence of his infidelity that HE should have thought about ahead of time (besides HE filed for divorce).

Thanks for all the advice. Now I feel I need to get prepared for what I am going to say to my wife. I think I am going to say what I have to say on this subject in a hand written letter so she gets where I am coming from. I don't think I would hold up well on a phone conversation or a face to face conversation.
How do I tell her that if she wants the divorce that she can be the one to pay for it all and she will have to be the one to do the work to get it done? I don't want to be the bad guy in the end. How do I say this to her without sounding like a mean guy but not being a door mat either? I want to be some where right in the middle.
I think my wife is going to flip out about my view on this that is why I want to make it clear and so forth about how I feel and what I am going to and not going to do in all of this. I am still going to talk to my lawyer on Friday even though I will have to pay a $100 consultation fee. Any other advice or words of wisdom?

confused_guy,

As far as the lawyer is concerned, remember always that "he/she" works for you! If you don't feel comfortable with him/her, there are a lot of other lawyers out there. Tell him exactly how you feel about divorce and that if he/she represents you, it will be ONLY to protect yourself, NOT to be aggressive. It is very important that you "fit" with your lawyer...

As for how to word it to her? In a loving, sincere way. hmmmm.... Maybe "Listen, I understand your decision and I respect your choice. But I have to be honest, I don't agree with your decision. I know that won't change your mind, nor would I want it to. I want you to be in this marriage because "you want" to be in this marriage. I don't believe in divorce as a solution. We can disagree on that point. But I have to do what is in my heart, just as you must do what is in yours. I ask that you understand and respect my decision. I do not intend on participating anymore than what is legally required. While you may think I'm doing this to "hurt you", I'm not. I'm a man of beliefs and this is something that I feel very strongly against, so I will not help a process I don't believe in. I will be cooperative with whatever you need from me, but you'll most likely have to meet with a lawyer to move forward without me. I'm not going to apologize, but rather only ask that you respect "my" decision, just as I'm respecting yours. There is nothing to read between the lines here - The divorce is your choice; it is your process."

I know you still love her, so think of this as maybe the last "gift" you can give her... Gift? Yes a gift - You are forcing her to stand up and take control of this process - you aren't making it easy on her. I can't be sure, but would I be correct in venturing a guess that things always came easy for your wife in her life? If so, well then by her doing this "all on her own", it might bring some maturity and growth to her character...

But be true to yourself as well and when the process starts, don't try to stall or interfere with the process - do whatever is legally required and NO more...

just my $.02 <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

God bless,
Mike

You need the lawyer. I know you don't want to, but you need it.

Good stance. Agree that forcing her into doing a real divorce, lawyer and everything is important. Make her pay the fees, hefty ones. Make her do the legwork. Make her do it all.

She's foggy. She has Om for support and you need to lea n on family and friends right now.

"I think my wife is going to flip out about my view on this that is why I want to make it clear and so forth about how I feel and what I am going to and not going to do in all of this."

One of the (very few) benefits of my marriage breaking up is the realization (I realize - don't know if my soon-to-be-ex-husband will EVER get it) that I don't have to worry whether he approves of the decisions I make. In fact I'm at the point now that I don't feel any need to even explain my reasons to him.

However, since you are still hoping to salvage your marriage I think you're being wise to consider putting your reasons in a letter. She may flip out but there's nothing wrong with trying to save your marriage. You're not forcing her to stay married against her wishes just because you refuse to make it faster/cheaper for her to skip out on her committment.