Went by H apt with kids on the way to the beach to see if he wanted to go with us. His cell phone was off and we couldn't get through. Kids ran up to get him just as he and ow were getting into his car. She got out of the car and got into hers and left. I yelled at her "How could you do this to two little boys. They're only 6 & 9"<P>He claims they were going out to lunch to talk. He says that she still contacts him but they haven't been seeing each other.<P>I told him he had to choose and let me know by tonight. I did not yell or create a scene except when she was walking to her car.<BR>He says he loves both of us and doesn't know what to do. How can he believe he'll be happy with someone who took his family away from him. Is this rock bottom? Do you think he's hit it. I've never caught him red handed before.<P>How could he look me in the face and lie like that? He said he was planning on coming home in a few months. He even told the kids that. <p>[This message has been edited by Hoping (edited September 03, 1999).]

This is the first time I have ever seen her. Great now I have a face to put on the images.<P>I don't know whether to laugh or cry. Feel relieved, angry. I don't know if my marriage is going to be over tonight. I don't know what to do.<P>I told him that he may think he will be happy with her but six months down the road he may realize that he's not.(This is a married/separated woman who is seeing another married man) The relationship is based on lies and deceit. I told him that he may not be happy at home but he's sure not going to be happy being a part time father. He has a better chance of happiness by cutting contact with her and trying with us. He says he has been trying. I told him that if is still maintaining contact with her even as friends, he is not trying. That his feelings for me will never truly return if she is in the picture in any way. He has to get over his feelings for her, he may be miserable for a while but once he gets over it we can work on us. On the other hand,if he chooses her he will always be miserable knowing that he left his family. <P>What do I say when he calls and tells me that he's choosing her? I know that that could happen. They could resume their relationship, he'll realize that the grass is not greener three months from now, hit the bottom of the barrell and want to come home. Or maybe he won't want to come home even if he finally realizes what kind of person she is because he hurt us all so much.<P>I told him to choose. What if he makes the wrong decision. Help<P>Do I go to plan B. Tell him he can see the children on Tues. and Thurs. and everyother weekend. Come get the rest of his clothes. Don't call me. If you need to tell me something find a go between. Tell him not to come here, he can pick the children up at his sisters house. What do I do<p>[This message has been edited by Hoping (edited September 03, 1999).]

hoping, sorry to hear about your pain. I can relate to the uncertainty. I am not up to date on your situation, but it still seems like the OW is lingering around. I don't know if you went to plan B, but your H needs to be aware you will demand no CONTACT with the OW, everytime he hears/sees her his withdrawal is back to step 1. He seems to not be able to got out of withdrawal to make a decision. He needs to know you are serious about plan B, if he chooses to keep OW in his life. He sounds like he still needs reality wakeup call that you will move on without him, cuz it's too painful for u to wait while he decides. If he comes back you need to follow the rules for marital recovery.

Did you really mean the ultimatum?<P>What if he chooses her, do you want to end the marriage?<P>I think you have to decide if you have the stamina to continue plan A or not. If you can't (And we certainly understand that one) then it is B.<P>If you want us all to help with the Plan B letter, we can....<P>I can say I am not surprised, Lor was pretty on target. Darn it.<BR>

No I do not want my marriage to end.<P>I don't think I can continue with plan A knowing that she is still in the picture as a friend or otherwise. Now that he has an apt he can see her whenever he wants.He finaly admitted to me today after much prodding that he is in love with her. Previously he always said he still had feelings for her.<P>I guess I am ready for plan B. How do I get started. I just reread some parts of Survivin an Affair again. Do I close our chekcing account, freeze our stock account, write the letter telling him that I love him but can't see or talk to him while he has any relationship with her, outline a visitation schedule that he suggested and use a family member as a go between. How do I organize this. How do I decide what he has to pay for besides his own apartment. That will be a major bummer because we make just enough money to live on. He will not be able to afford an apt, child support, car payment whereas I have family members to rely on for monetary support. Help

Hoping,<P>I don't have time to post properly right now. I am so sorry and I will say special prayers for you. <P>Know we are here and that we care a great deal. {{{{{{{{HOPING}}}}}}}}<P>------------------<BR>God bless you and all of us.<P>Samantha<BR>

This is so sad, on Wednesday morning when he left for work he took some of his clothes and all the bathroom stuff he needed. He left without saying goodbye.<P>My kids called him to say hi at work and he asked to talk to me. He said he was sorry he left without saying goodbye.<P>What is this?

Dear Hoping,<P>I am hoping he decides to stop seeing her, but I have a feeling his addiction is so strong, that you need to go to B. <P>On the first page of the MB site, under "what's new", Dr. Harley addresses the Plan A and plan B and refers to specific pages in SAA. I think you ought to flip back and read the article.<P>Implementing Plan B:<P>Without lovebusters, you explain to your spouse how you cannot go on with the affair, and what would be required of the spouse to start a reconciliation. I would think he would have to agree to work at rebuilding the marriage, and agree to end all contact. <P>At the point that he agrees to end contact, then you can negotiate the lifestyle changes which will help avoid any future contact.<P>I think a defined visitation plan, with a "morality agreement" - meaning husband will not bring the children around the OW whatsoever. In the event he chooses to divorce or go for a formal court agreement - you may have real trouble with this. So for the children's sake, I would see if you could negotiate a morality agreement with him, and spell out what the consequences if he should bring the children around the OW by "thoughtlessness". <P>A third party is important, so there will be absolutely no further contact with your spouse. Avoid asking the children questions about your spouse.<P>Inventory the assets and the debts. Decide what it will take to support your household. Find out what would be a reasonable consideration of child support in your state. Some state's start at 25% of the net take home pay, and depending upon the lifestyle of the children. Meaning, if they attend private school, all effort should be made so that the status quo doesn't change much.<P>Start a separate checking account - and the balance in the joint account would be part of the assets. <P>Freezing the stock is not a bad idea, it seems you need to find a way to limit the ability for either of you to have access to it without a joint agreement.<P>A great way to raise a little extra cash right now is to have a garage sale, or save on child care by sharing child care responsibilities with another family. Be sure and budget for you little incidentals to help you deal with this crisis. <P>This can be a real challenge, making it on your own during B. But the best part about all of this, is that you will go through a sifting of priorities - kind of like a refiners fire. What is true and good will remain. You may be surprised to see how strong you always have been.<P>I am sooo sorry this came to this, but once you resolve to do this, do this with a passion and with true commitment. <P>Dr. Harley says that many times the affair ends before you think it would have. But, the time it takes for it to end will seem like an eternity for the betrayed. I can believe it.<P>And once you finally enter plan B, then concentrate ONLY on you and the children. Do not look for signs of the affair ending or blossoming. Put all thoughts of him out of your mind. Easier said than done! <P>And the most important thing of all: Pray. Pray from the deepest part of your heart, God is closest to the broken hearted.<P>God be with you and give you his peace, and his wisdom.<P>Connie

Hoping<BR>How are you? You have been so patient, kind and good through all of this.<BR>I wanted to post to you yesterday but I'm a little dopey.<BR>Take care of yourself. <BR>How do you feel now that you have a face instead of an image? Sometimes reality can be easier to deal with. <BR>It seems so clear that there is really no future for your H with this woman. He just needs to realize that and you can't do that part for him.<BR>Know that our prayers are with you. You have done so many good things. You need to think about you!!!!

I'm so sorry. <P>I want you to know that I did not want to be right, but I just went through a month of hearing what you were hearing and it was too too similar, as are our husbands. It may have just been lunch, but getting together at all means there was a phone call as well...in our case the phone calls had been going on since at least April. That date comes from my informant. He won't talk about that since he really has no dates or times in his memory.<P>My H had a month of separation to live his lies and cheating and when caught, he seems to have been done. It was long enough that she was getting really annoyed that the divorce (never filed) wasn't final. (She doesn't date married men, you know. Ugh.) When confronted when I said I still wanted the marriage he said he did too. I gave him 4 days to decide to move home, mainly to discuss it in front of my counselor, but he spent those intervening nights at our house.<P>TNT laid out a great Plan B if he doesn't come home.<P>I have felt a real sense of calm since that day 3 weeks ago. I am working full speed ahead on the marriage, but at the same time I'm not afraid of losing him if he can't fulfill his part. I'm gentle, patient, kindhearted, amusing, no selfish demands, but not taking any crap.<P>For his part he is accountable for his time, has promised honesty and fidelity, spends recreational time with me, is affectionate, hasn't officially ended it with her but says there hasn't been any contact. I'm a little stuck on this one since he has lied continually saying there has been no contact for 7 months. But cautious trust has to start somewhere.<P>Keep praying, Hoping. I say Deb's prayer for overcoming infidelity every day at least once.<P>Again, please know I was not wishing this for you and I'm sad that he has betrayed you again. Now you need to decided what it is you want and work toward that goal. If it is your marriage. Go for it. If not, I don't think anybody here can fault you for the effort you've put in.