2. Blaming (Intentional Grounding)

Someone wisely observed, "A man can make many mistakes, but he isn't a failure until he starts blaming someone else."

Blaming your wife for the marital problems can leave others with a distorted view of the situation. When you blame your wife for your current situation, you rob yourself of taking advantage of the reconciliation game plan. Football players know that one of the best ways to beat the opposing team is to defeat them mentally, so they will start fighting among themselves. The same is true in your relationship. Blaming your wife makes winning almost impossible because arguments and fighting usually result. As you try to run your reconciliation plays, blaming has the same tragic effect as tackling one of your own players.

We encourage you to resist making "you" statements such as "You're the one who needs to change," "You should have warned me that our marriage was in trouble," "You're not the same woman I married" and "You weren't submissive enough," as reasons for your behavior. These "you" statements are devestating, and they seldom improve your situation. Therefore, to win your wife back, avoid using these types of blaming statements. The most important reason is found in Proverbs 15:1 "A soft answer turns away wrath, but a harsh word stirs up anger."

Using a statement such as "You were just too sensitive," stirs up more anger in your wife. As this happens, the blaming backfires and exposes your resistance to improve or change. just as the Buffalo Bills felt hopeless going into half time down by 25 pts., your wife may lose hope when faced with blaming. Try to keep your focus on imporoving your character and loving your wife by meeting her needs. When you experience the urge to blame your wife, remember King Soloman's wise words: "A man of knowledge uses words with restraint, and a man of understanding is even-tempered."

More to come...

3. Having a critical spirit (unsportsmanlike conduct)

4. Being impatient (encroachment)

5. Setting a time frame (illegal snap)

6. Displaying affection in physical ways (holding)

7. Overkilling (piling on)

8. Underestimating hurt (unnecessary roughness)

9. Disregarding boundaries (offsides)

It's late so I will write more about these areas tomorrow, k?

Hang in there Stephen, God is doing a good work in you.

Hello LoveMyEx,,,i'm doing ok, thanks,, and yourself??
Thats sort of weird,, we both lost our post,, oh well, we'll just say we have something in common, LOL. At one time i thought maybe i had something in my post that maybe God didn't want me to say,,

Had a phone call yesterday, my other mother passed away. She was on old girlfriends mom from my past. I always stayed close to her.Mom that is.

The children and myself walked to the park this evening. They had a blast. Myself as well. I found myself missing my W, more so for the childrens sake. While i was watching the children having fun, i was also realizing/thinking now its just not the same. Had quite an empty feeling there for awhile,,
It started thundering, so we quickly headed home! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />
Yes i did read Isaiha 58:6, and i have been doing a lot of praying!!! For my 12 and 14 year olds included. I spoke to the youth pastor today regarding their anger,,,two days ago i came home, and they were at it like cats and dogs,,, they to have become filled with too much anger, and hate. So we sat down and had some serious discussion!!! About how satan works, and I reminded them what Jesus is about. I then apologized to them, for how i allowed myself to act,,,I had them start reading Proverbs, then Galatians 5.
After trhat, its their choice, only to stick to the new testament.

Yes i have the kids, and my wife moved out in Feb. along with her first two children. Which i miss tremendously!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

I'd like to sign up! (devotionals) Right now i have zero income. Also, i have no credit or debit cards.
With no income, i had to park my van. Insurance and plates are now expired! Hopefully within a week i'll have my van insured. We've been walking to church, which actually iquite pleasant!!! It takes about an hour to walk, and with my 5 and 3 year old its a little too much for them.

Regarding reconciliating, i really never gave up on this thought. NEVER!!! In fact, my family was somewhat upset when i would share my true thoughts. So, after awhile i basically listened, and sometimes said things i'd wished i hadn't!!!It was in contrary to what i really believed. I always knew God hated divorce. Eventually i allowed people to think what they wanted,,,,including that i wanted the divorce.

I STRONGLY agree, passionate about marriage, and reconciliation!!!
Its so sad when i thumbed thru the yellow pages, finding sooo many divorce lawyers. My search was actually for a lwayer who would, or could tell me ways to stop the divorce. I may be showing my ignorance here, but i actually didn't know. Its nothing but no fault, and all it requires is just one. I'AM so GLAD, that you came to MB!!!thank you God! That you found my posts, and sent me back on the right track!!!!!!!!!!
Hopfully we'll meet, thru those pearly gates.
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Even if my *wife* and I never reconcile, by choosing this path, which has really been full of pain, I have grown alot and I have been kept from being a bitter, angry person. So many people are so bitter and angry, and I think it's because of the hurts in life and all the unforgiveness. Even though I have wept buckets of tears until I just ached and even though I have felt out of my mind at times, I still would rather go through this pain than to chose the path of hating my *wife* and "moving on" with bitterness and anger.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">A few months age the Pastor was over to my house. I was telling him, how i now have hate in my heart, for the first time ever, i have hate in my heart, and its directed to my wife!!! I think this day i filled one more bucket. Maybe two days later i refused to hate, i shared this with my two oldest children, cuz they to said they hate her. They as well no longer hate her.
It was scary to realize how easy it was to allow hate in my heart. ESPECIALLY, to my wife.

So far the only books I've read is *love Is Never Enough* and then of course, the Bible. There are others i would love to read,,,,

Is It tomorrow yet? LOL <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Just moments ago my 3 year old son woke to go potty, he made it to the toilet, started doing his business, only to realize his feet were getting wet! He didn't raise the lid, by the expression on his face he knew something wasn't right, but he couldn't figure it out, so he just stood there, in the puddle he created,,,,
I suppose i need to enh here, as i now have a floor to mop, at 11p.m.
For what ever reason this reminded me of a post i read days ago, how a single mom was telling a mother, whose husband had recently left, how its great to be a single parent,,,,,,,,
My opinion, being a single dad, S U C K S !!

Again thank you LoveMyEx!!!! your fabulous, and its always lifting, reading your posts. They just do not get here fast eenough <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Good night to ya,,,,,

It is the desire of Gods heart to reconcile all marriages, "that none shall parish"

<small>[ August 07, 2003, 10:21 PM: Message edited by: Stephan ]</small>

Stephen, I am going to write you!! I have to go right now though but wanted you to know I am praying and wondering how you are and will write more later. May you be filled with God's peace today and may you hold steadfastly to His promises. Don't take your eyes off him because the enemy will be right there causing you to fear, doubt, and give in to anger, etc. So keep your eyes on God and press on with His strength. God bless! Will write more later!

Hi LoveMyEx, i'm still hanging in there, hoping, and praying!!!
I had a email, and a phone message from my W yesterday. Her voice sounded as though she was crying,, her email, well its difficult to tell with reading words. Her questions though were concerning,,

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> On Sunday you said you would email me the ideas you had been tossing around.
I haven't gotten them yet.

When I try to call no one answers the phone.

You've emailed me to say that you can't call me back yet I have received no collect calls.

I'm planning on picking the kids up at 10:00 am tomorrow but I'm a bit concerned about driving all the way there to have no one answer the door.

Is there any reason in particular you're doing this? Were you being truthful when you said you would email your ideas and do you still plan on doing that? And finally, are you intentionally avoiding me so that I can't have contact with Veronica and Wil?

Please let me know what your intentions are.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I don't know how i still manage to leave these type of impressions,

Because of this message, and her voice message, i eamiled her back last night. I even allowed some of my heart to be expressed to her. Sharing what some of my intentions are regards to our marriage. Reassuring her i still want no part of a divorce. I also said my intentions are to always forgive, and forget what has been done.
After i sent it, i started thinking about the *football* rules. I had a few penalities, drew the flags.
I reassured her i could never and would never, in any day, do anything where she can't see our children.
This morning while she was here, i gave her a compliment, regards to her hair. We made a lot of small talk. AFter awhile i realized i was wanting to open my heart to her, so i went inside, moments later, she came to where i was.

We never discussed anything regarding each others email. When she was leaving i again said how i liked her hair, her reply was *I'm glad you like it*
God this is so difficult!!!

I tried to figure out how to put a link in here with my response to her email, that way IF you wanted to read it, it was your choice, by a click. I realize i was wanting to be assesed, and or evaluated,,,, i sooo want to do whats right, and be sooo perfect, making sure as to NOT make a mistake. Yet knowing, this is virtually impossible.

I ahd a funeral to attend to yesterday, my other mother passed. This was difficult in itself. I started thinking all over again, how it was for me, when my W left,,(moved out) what brought this on though was cuz i was thinking of her H, how he know has to come home,,,, Do you understand, the connection i mean as well?

Well, i'm down to one child, my 14 yd went with my W. So i suppose i'll take advantage of the situation, and go grocery shopping!!!
I hope your day is good!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

ttyl,,
God Bless you, and thank you Lord!!

P.s. I'am so glad you responded to my post <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

<small>[ August 09, 2003, 01:38 PM: Message edited by: Stephan ]</small>

Hi Stephen,
Sorry I have not gotten back to you sooner. I have been very busy today and also this site is a pain! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> What I mean is, it's kinda a pain logging on... I always forget my password and type it wrong and have to go look in my email. Is there a way I can change the pssword to something else? Do you know? I also get kicked off alot too... I think it times out because I'm using AOL (vs. Explorer)... I'm not sure..

Anyways, I saw your other message about not being sarcastic. After your messages in here, I could tell you weren't. I had read that one before these so I didn't know where you were coming from as well then and wasn't sure. But I'm glad to know you weren't. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

How are you?? I want to write more to you later today, and this will be short. Let's see... let me just say real quick that this is going to be a journey. One of the main reasons it is soooooo important for you to draw near God through prayer, faith, and esp. in the Word, is because your emotions are going to be on a roller coaster! And I am saying this from past experience of "been there, done that." How I deeply, deeply regret times I reacted in anger! Ugh! After my divorce, I worked VERY hard at following the principles given to me from Restore Ministries... I was very kind and loving to my husband when we talked (we talked several mos. afterward... we couldn't see each other, I moved back with my family... across the U.S.... looking back, dont' think I should have, but I trust that even this, God can overcome.. somehow... someway... in His time), I was apolegetic and forgave him, didn't point fingers and blame, sought forgiveness for my own sin and didn't point out his sins, etc... and it was soooo amazing how I saw God soften his heart towards me! He was super angry at first, and then just pouring his heart out to me. At one time, he even said, "You are going to come back here and we are going to get remarried and have babies."

Anyways... stupid me... I can't remember all the conversations, but things made me mad and I thought the typical stuff like, "I don't deserve this" and "I can find someone better", etc... and I got mad and vented at him, and basically blew it. His heart hardened towards me again.

So I share this with you to tell you that your emotions are going to be up and down and you probably, like me, will struggle with anger. I think I wavered alot with doubt, anger, and fear the first few months when I felt I wanted to reconcile and was praying for it, etc. I would think, "yes" and then, "no, this is crazy", etc... and whenever I listened to someone say "move on" or get mad at him or when I'd say something about him to my family... bad move... then they'd get mad and well, that really wasn't what I wanted... so I learned to go to GOD and GOD alone. My family is not Christian anyways so they think it's okay to never forgive him. So, I say NOTHING to them anymore. Only because getting bad input and hearing hateful, unforgiving things caused me then to feel depressed and want to give up and well, it would pull me away from the Lord really, and cause me to think like the world... think about what I "deserve" and all that.

I think I am rambling here. But.. Prov. says "GUARD YOUR HEART." I used to think that meant not loving someone you shouldn't love. When I was single.. not giving it to just any guy. Heehee... I guess it can apply to that, but I now believe it doensn't mean to guard it from love, but to guard it from things like worldly advice, hateful words, unforgiving people, etc... because when we get that input... well, it can harm us... can cause us to question, to doubt, to fear, or to feel like they do. You know, to agree with them and think, "yah, he's a j-e-r-k... why am I even wanting to be with him again... you are so right." Stuff like that. I don't want to be like that. I just really, really, REALLY don't.

I so don't want to be bitter, hateful, angry, etc. I don't like the sorrow I have felt so much the past few months. But I was thinking today that right now, the only way to stop loving my husband would be to hate him. If I made myself hate him... think of him as this and that and the other, and harden my heart and "move on" and I just cannot do that. So, I guess maybe I am a fool for loving someone when it's not visiblly returned, someone who divorced me, but in some ways, I'm glad to be a fool in this way, even though it hurts like the dickens. It has also helped me to put my eyes on Christ and on the hope of eternity and heaven and think of what life is all about because I have many times considered what life holds if I am single forever, which may be the case. And I have been reminded that marriage is not a guarantee from the Lord. A good marriage is also not a guarantee. Nothing is a guarantee, and the truth is, I deserve nothing and it's only the grace of God that sustains me and it's His mercy that blesses me.

There is a verse that says, "Though He slay me, I will follow." That is how I feel. I figure, maybe the next however many years are going to be the pits... who knows! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> Gee... how bad can it be... I live in America, healthy, educated, etc. I could be an impoverished woman in Afhganistan with no freedom of religion, no Christian bookstores, no education, etc. It all just reminds me that this earth is NOT our home. The Lord said we WILL have trouble here. And Paul said that the married would have more troubles than single! He said you should stay single for that reason. And so I try to tell myself, Okay, I have however many years to go, maybe I'll go to China and be a single missionary and be used by the Lord, and then I'll day and then I'll be with Jesus!!! And all the pain, sorrow, difficulties, etc. will be gone FOREVER!! That helps me put things into perspective.

I really am not addressing your comments much here am I? Sorry! I didn't think I'd say so much. Well, maybe you can get something out of it! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I will write more soon!

May the Lord give you wisdom to help you discern how to talk to and act towards your wife. I know you feel like you are walking on think ice, right now... like any wrong word or wrong action, and it will put you back several spaces. Been there! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> So... may the Lord give you wisdom and discernment and strength!! And also comfort, rest, and peace... the peace that passes understanding that comes as a result of faith in Him. That's the best peace! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

God bless! Hang in there and I will write more.

Hi LoveMyEx, i think if you click on *my profile* then click on *view update profile* you can change your password.

Thats ok,, that you didn't get back sooner. I was hoping maybe my post was your only life,,LOL

I'm doing ok,,,, yesterday (Sunday) i was up for awhile, then down, up, down,,,
Mid afternoon i noticed my W was on line, so I IM'ed her. Just to say hi. It went into something from a year ago,(broken window)
Later when my 14 y d was back home, she told me my W had started crying, about the time we were chatting. While my W was here dropping off our children, we spoke quite a bit, (most of it was about how i did this and or that)(From even six years ago) I informed her that i understood as to why she thought this and or that, tried reassuring her this and or that was not the case, nor was it my true intentions.
She spoke about an agreement regards to physical custody, she mentioned she would come back, if i was to do something with my 12 y s.(ultimatum) Later she stated how she missed her old job, missed this place,,,, informed me how i hurt her with my flirting (six years ago) and touching other females. This i swear never happened!!! I just liked making people smile and or laugh, male or female. Believe me, w/o touching and without any sexual anything.
Anyhow, she informed me of ALL the things i did that hurt her,,, all i really ever said was i understood, accepted where she was coming from, and reassured her not once was intentional.
We went into to much of the past, but maybe thats how and where it starts!? Not one time did i display any anger, i allowed that to be filled by someone else. I really truly felt as though we gained quite a bit. ( UNTIL)
We discussed her coming back, getting her (ours) dreams back on track, together. Doing this and that. After she left, i was feeling pretty good. When i was able to replay, think about our conversation, i realized she never gave any real answer either way. Also, the three children that were with her for the week-end, started talking about their time with mom. How the other guy was there, they went over to his house. My w's first two children told their mom, they didn't want her to get another boyfriend. Her son, is also this other guys son, told his mom that itys sick what she's doing, saying to her, *your married!* My 14 y d told me of things my W said, i'm not sure if W said these to play me, or if she was sincere?
i think i'm back to as confused as i was a few months ago.

We had a tornado warning here earlier, my W called making sure we were aware, i really thought that was nice. She has begun displaying a softer heart. Praise God!!!

Now, after my children spoke of issues, i'm now wondering if maybe i was following my heart, and allowing myself to be sucked in again!? Meaning was i being led to believe, and manipulated.
I was asked why i said some of the things i have, so i informed her that before i spoke to anybody, i made it clear that i was all about saving my marriage. I already knew things i have said, was twisted,,, so i was able to clear up a few things. I was asked why my sister does not want us to get back together, i said probably cuz of things i have said.
My W is convinced that i wanted her to be stuck at home, cuz occassionally i'd take her cash, or the card.
I spent the last two days visiting my sisters, often in conversation my W came up, so i, as usual would defend her. I just remembered, my daughter said how my W defends me as well, and also i'm still referred as to dad, from my W's other two children. and by my W also.

I asked my W if she would and could forgive me, for all the times i hurt her.
I see that God has been softening her heart!!! Thank you God!

Its sort of weird reading, listening to you, its as if i'm reading my own writing, (in so many ways) although i haven't wrote it. Does that make sense? I always read your posts several times, its comforting if you will. Maybe its because like you stated, *been there-done that*

Finding someone better, i suppose maybe that could be an easy thought, myself i can honestly say i never allowed myself to have those thoughts. Even to this day.

Hate,, what a thin line between love and hate.
After sharing yourself to the degree you have. LoveMyEx, you don't have it in your heart to hate. In March i allowed myself to hate my W, two maybe three days later, the preacher man was here, i shared this with him, and my hate was gone. During those few days, i even was hating myself, for allowing any hate in my heart, for anybody what-so-ever. Especially my wife!!! Btw, i believe God sent that preacher man that day. If we hate one, we in turn hate ourself. Even if its a fraction,,,

Its almost a shame, a beautiful person as yourself, i'm actually at a loss for words now. I'm thinking worldly thoughts, yet at the same time thinking Bible style. I really am at a loss for what i truly want to say. Maybe i don't know how to say what i want to,,, Why is it scary to think that i could end up finishing my time here on earth, w/o a female companion, a wife!?

All day today i had the comfort feeling, along with peace. I was in an extremely wonderful mood. I was talking with a lady (counselor) the possibility of maybe my W coming back, i was asked what does she have on me? So i explained how God hates divorce,,,, blah blah blah. That she's my wife,,, How Jesus forgives and forgets. Her comment was yes, but how many times,, also that he wouldn't keep allowing,,,

I suppose i should end my book here, sorry.
I do think i get something from your posts. Again, i read them over and over.
There is a reason,,,
LoveMyEx, i hope your evening is wonderful, and God Bless.

<small>[ August 12, 2003, 03:01 PM: Message edited by: Stephan ]</small>

Hi Stephen,

How are you? Forgive me for not writing sooner. To be honest, I am not extremely fond of this site. It discourages me. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> I read too many husband/wife hating posts. I understand the pain, etc. behind them, but I guess I don't really see this forum as a reconciliation site but more of a advice seeking site but the advice given... well, is not Biblical. I want to keep encouraging you, but I really do not feel it is a good use of my time nor is it profitable for me (mentally, emotionally, spiritually) to be in here.

I will write more later, k? I do want to be an encouragement to you as much as I can. I hope you are doing well. I truly do. Remember that God is the greatest counselor of all. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

I will tell you that in seeking reconciliation, you will probably mostly stand alone. I mean, well, very few people (including in here) encourage it or even can understand where you are coming from. Everyone seems to think that we deserve these perfect spouses and that their sins are absolutely unforgiveable and that they are "unchangeable." It honestly grieves me so greatly because I know that it is not true and it is only our lack of faith, lack of prayers, and lack of knowledge of God's ways found in His Word that results in no change.

You know, in the Bible, it says things like "don't slander", "don't gossip," "love your enemies", "bless those who curse you", "forgive," "lay down your life for your brothers,"be patient," "be gentle and humble," "pray", "have faith," "be kind and compassionate," "do not let the sun go down while you are still angry," "do everything without complaining or arguing," "Forgive as the Lord forgave you," and soooooooooo much more!!

From comments in here, I don't see people obeying or even talking about these Biblical principals and it is no wonder there marriages are in the shape they are. But everyone wants to just blame the other person. But what good does it do? When we don't pray, aren't in the Word, and don't obey... well, we basically mess up our lives because we do things the world's ways and not God's. But often, when you try to tell people these things, they just get angry and point the finger at the other person, "He did this" and "she did that." And yes, I know that and I understand... but we are all sinners. While I know that there are some sins that are the result of a very, very hardened or depraved heart (such as unrepentive adultery or severe abuse) and these things can't just be "put up with", I do not think it does anyone good to... well, to harden one's own self, etc.

I am rambling again. I am just truly sad. I guess it is hard for me to understand. I honestly love my husband so much. I know that if we are together again, there will be things that will "make" me angry, but I also know that "love bears all things" and that there are ways for me to handle that better than I did before... like forgiving and having compassion, etc. rather than thinking that somehow God owes me this perfect spouse who is never going to sin against me.

Much of my love for my husband, which I have shared has grown since the divorce, began as simply an obedient love believing that although we are divorced in man's eyes, that bond of oneness that God created on our marriage day, has not dissovled in God's eyes. That is why, if I remarry, I will be committing adultery. I see two options, stay single or remarry my husband (that is in the Bible). I don't want to be legalistic but I also don't want to ignore something that is clearly in Scripture at the sake of my own "happiness." NOWHERE in Scripture is there evidence that my goal in life should be my happiness.

Anyways, I guess I am on my soap box tonight preaching. I am just frustrated and saddened (not by you) at so much of what I read in here. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

I better go now, but I do want to address your recent posts. I will try to do so tomorrow. I am not on the computer that much and usually don't turn it on until the evening so it will prob. be later.

God bless you!

p.s. Read Ephesians. I've been reading it lately. It's a great book. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

P.S. Your counselor's response to you is the reason I never have gone to a counselor after the divorce. VERY few people will understand your stand for your marriage... until after it is restored. I think there are times that God calls us to something that takes such increadible faith and perseverence and seeking HIm, to the extent that others see you as just "crazy", because it is something very few seek to do. Look at Esther confronting her husband the king. Sarah being told she'd have a baby in old age. Even she laughed at that! Mary, having a baby (Jesus!) as a virgin. Even her husband Joseph was going to quietly divorce her! Notice that they did not broadcast that to everyone. God showed her it was going to happen, and it says that she "treasured" it in her heart (indicating that she told no one at that time). Or Hannah... she would weep at her childlessness and pray for a child, and even her own husband, Elkanah, who loved her, did not understand and she really did not explain much. She would weep to the Lord, dry her eyes, get up and go on... then do it again. (Personally, that's the closest of how I feel with my stand because I seek very little human advice on it and I tell very few about it. I just live my daily life, praying and weeping in the solitude of my room alone with the Lord).

Think of MOses. God spoke to him in a burning bush. Or the call on Paul's life and how God blinded him. Or Abraham being told to leave on a journey to who knows where and being given promises that he never lived to see. And being told to sacrifice his son.

So many examples of how God often works in our lives in ways that require faith, patience, perseverence, trust, and that very few people understand. Think Noah. EVERYONE laughed at him and mocked him.

If you continue this journey of seeking reconciliation, I can tell you that very few will understand or support you and if you seek advice or support or approval, etc... you will probably be torn between belief and doubt and will have fears and worries. Even if you don't seek advice, etc...you will still face fear, etc. I do!! My own mind begins to doubt and question often!

But you might also be blessed with at least a few people who will stand with you... pray with you and encourage you. You will probably find them at your church or other Christian friends you have.

I was so excited 'cause I recently made a friend who herself, separated from her husband years ago, 'cause his alcholism was getting out of control. She did not want to divorce though and is a Christian but even her pastor told her, "You know, very few alcholics change." Her family told her she made a mistake marrying him, and shoudln't feel bad but should divorce him. Only a couple people supported her in the right way. Well, 3 mos, and her husband changed. He came back home and has never been drunk or hardly drank since (and this was years ago)!

Guard your heart Stephen with what you read and hear. Hold all things up to the light of God's Word and evaluate what His will for you is according to His Word, not according to what others (like counselors) say.

Oh, one more... Hosea. Have you ever read the story of Hosea?! God told him to love and marry a prostitute! And to take her back every time she cheated on him! It's a human story but actually is also symbolic of Christ's love and commitment to us.

You know, Christ is the bridegroom and the Churh is the bride. The Church often sins against Christ and "cheats" on him by loving things of the world (money, fame, people, ourselves, etc) over him. How it must hurt him! But he never divorces us! He often punishes us ('cause he also is our groom and our Father!) and sometimes "separates"... but He forgives when we repent and He always loves, even though it costs him much.

Last thoughts for the evening....

Hello LoveMyEx,,
I can understand for the most part, but at the same time i'm somewhat confused. Meaning that the encouragement you send, spreading Gods good will,,, its a well known fact that not everybody can or will share the same opinions,,, but to think that if maybe one marraige, or even one individual was to help be persuaded, or turned around. Do you no think that it would be worth it? Your being in here,, again, i strongly agree, about being in here, emotionaly and or spiritualy. It can be rather an depressing area, but again, if *you* were to help even one marriage,,,,,

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I want to keep encouraging you, but I really do not feel it is a good use of my time nor is it profitable for me (mentally, emotionally, spiritually) to be in here.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">It appears that the majority of individuals who come in here, already have their monds made up, therefore they will remain blinded, as well as deaf. For whatever their motive and or reason.
I know when i first came into MB, i was searching for the proper advice, hoping that maybe some one has been there, therefore could steer me inbto the proper choice, or action,,, so as i could save my marriage, w/o a doupt. I realize i allowed myself to become more so involved with the slandering. Oh boy, wouldn't God be proud of me now!? As well as my wife!? Did it make me feel any better? NOT at all.

Everybody has a story, no matter what, who, or where. The advice in here, after one asks/shares their story, or issue, some times i wonder if the stories only become more ready available for the *Jerry Springer* show. LOL

Regards to *standing* and standing alone, i realized before i came into MB, that i was a major minority to saving any marriage. The world has become so convinced that divorce is the only answer, or solution. Yes, not only are we sinners, but we are extremely *selfish* sinners!!!

The majority of my day today, i have been wondering why am i so focused on learning, what i have been. What is the point? Thinking, wondering, soo often convinced that my wife will never want to reconcile. So, why should i waste my time!? Then, i also can remember that God has already began softening her heart. She spoke of how she missed her old job, spoke of coming back,, yet, still giving ultimatums!?
I realize just how difficult it is to keep satan out, or away. After we spoke on Sunday, i question her motives, asking, and at times telling myself she's only trying to manipulate me, so she can use me, so get her own satisfaction. Yes, satan still works over time, within my thoughts. Why, because its a *choice* i allowed myself to make!!!
Again, whats the point!? As you are so familiar with the two choices, either reconcile, (or re-marry, if we divorce) or remain single,,,,

I will remain standing, as difficult as it may be, or will become. Yes, i have already heard how *crazy* i must be,,,

Earlier i was reading where in, Conn. i think, anyhow there have been cases where the spouse has been able to sue the other person involved, regarding to affairs. I'm not so sure about thenm being sued, what if there is no money,,, but to at least hold them accountable, maybe a stiff and or severe fine of some sorts. Maybe thats what this world needs!? Being realistic, yes the world needs more *christians*, knowing this is virtualy impossible. So, again, if the third party involved woth a married individual, was to be held accountable in some way, than maybe, just maybe, the divorce rate could, and or would,,,
s l o w down!!! Granted i don't have a crystal ball, but anymore, I wonder what this world is going to be like in another twenty years, with marriages. AT the rate of divorce now, marriages will s l o w down!!! Imagine, ALL of the broken families,,,

LoveMyEx, if you ever want to email me, i will leave my email address. I say this because i do not want to keep posting in here. I don't want you to feel obligated in any way what-so-ever, to keep responding to my posts.
You will always know how i'am. Because like you have said,,, been there, done that. Well, now *we* can say been there, done that, with so much more in common, including standing. What we stand for, what God stands for,,, so, in the future, if you ever wonder how i'am doing, you can ask yourself,,, and you will already know. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

You are ever so encouraging to me!!! I will be reading Ephesians,,,

I will CONTINUE to tell the world,,
I'M A STANDER!!!
http://www.rejoiceministries.org

God bless you LoveMyEx!
I will continue to pray for your reconcilation.

*ask, it shall be given to you, seek, and you shall find*
praise God!!!

<small>[ August 13, 2003, 06:28 PM: Message edited by: Stephan ]</small>

Hi Stephen,

Yes, I know... even just one marriage will be worth the ... hmmm... feelings? I have in here. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I am still developing my backbone. I have always had a great passion for truth ever since becoming a Christian at age 12... neither my parents were and I was determined to find truth and also share it... but I tend to get discouraged. I truly need to grow in that area. Because you know... you really are right. I know most will dismiss what I say as foolish or whatever, but if God uses me in just one marriage, it'll be worth it. That's how I came in here in the 1st place! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I came here 10 mos. ago when first divorced but after finding rejoice and restore ministries, and after finding the atmosphere here not really encouraging towards reconciliation, I did not come back. Then I read a testimony of a woman on Restore Ministries whose marriage has been restored and she said she found the ministry by someone in here who referred her to it. I thought, "Maybe that was me!" and the idea of God using me to help heal a marriage, even if just by a referal, was a truly wonderful feeling. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> That's how I ended up coming back in here.

Anyways... I was reading 1 Kings today! Wow. I tell you, when I am out of the Word, I'm just so ignorant and when I'm in it, it's so powerful and convicting, I just don't want to do one single itsy-bitsy wrong thing!! I was reading Proverbs too. I need some wisdom! I was reading how Michal, David's wife, despised his dancing for the Lord and how she basically rebuked him and treated him as if he were disgraceful. As a result, she never bore children!

There is a verse that says that "my people die out of ignorance" (along those lines) and it's so true. We do our thing and disobey God and end up here... divorced and a mess! Like me... I did not show love to my husband like I should've. I embittered him. If he ever does reconcile with me... it will only be by God's grace and Him truly working in my husband's heart!

Well, before I go off on a tangent <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> ...

You said, "It appears that the majority of individuals who come in here, already have their monds made up, therefore they will remain blinded, as well as deaf."

Yes... you know, that's how my marriage ended in the first place. I was so stubborn and so thinking I was doing right things, but I was embittering my husband and by the time I was convicted, it was "too late". I would give anything to go back and be grateful for things I took for granted, and to keep my mouth silent instead of sharing his sins, and so much more....

You said, "i was searching for the proper advice, hoping that maybe some one has been there, therefore could steer me inbto the proper choice, or action,,, so as i could save my marriage, w/o a doupt."

Yes, and that is good. Actually, I believe I also found Restore Ministries from a referal from someone in here. So God can use this place, huh? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

You said, " I realize i allowed myself to become more so involved with the slandering. Oh boy, wouldn't God be proud of me now!? As well as my wife!? Did it make me feel any better? NOT at all."

God convicted me when I sent an email to my friends one night, a very bad night, and although I felt my intentions were innocent, I did make my husband look bad and should have had more discretion. He was very upset to read the email. Then I shared things with my parents and some friends and when they started speaking negatively of my husband, could I blame them? I gave them the "mud" to sling him with. And I hated it. I still do. I hate to hear anyone say even things like "you deserve better" because you know what? No I don't! I deserve nothing and any good given to me is a gift from God. But anyways, I just don't like when they talk with unforgiveness or as if I am better than my husband, etc... but I'm the one who gave them the info. and I truly regret it very, very much!

Also, I wanted to be able to say with truthfulness, "no" if/when my husband asked me if I'd said bad things about him, etc. I wanted to be "blameless" and have a pure heart and a good conscience before both God and my husband.

You said, "some times i wonder if the stories only become more ready available for the *Jerry Springer* show. LOL"

Heehee... yah, I guess that's the kind of stuff, that, well, I just don't think is necessary or even beneficial. At the time, we think it's doing good to "vent" but is it really doing any good at all? We vent and vent and vent but does it change our circumstances or soften our hearts? Usually not.

You said, "The world has become so convinced that divorce is the only answer, or solution. Yes, not only are we sinners, but we are extremely *selfish* sinners!!!"

Yes, you are very right. Divorce is so accepted nowadays and so easy to get and seen as a "solution." It makes me so sad.

You said, "Thinking, wondering, soo often convinced that my wife will never want to reconcile. So, why should i waste my time!? Then, i also can remember that God has already began softening her heart."

Yes, I have been there to... up and down, back and forth. Even now, I still battle various thoughts thinking "it's impossible", etc... But it's not and I try to remember testimonies of both Bible people and people like Charlyne and Bob. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I mean, to hear Bob talk and to think that he was having an affair and he told his wife, "We will NEVER be together again", etc. And here he is, leading a marriage reconciliation ministry. It's like Peter. When he looked down at the water he was walking on, he began to think "what on earth am I doing? This is nuts" and then.... he began to sink! He walked by SIGHT at that point. The Bible says that faith is believing what we CANNOT see. We walk by faith. I need that reminder every day, because I sink once or twice almost every day! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Stephen, try not to question your wife's motives. She is very confused right now and also, deceived. Okay, this might sound crazy, but if she is trying to manipulate you, and if it is not putting your or your kids life in danger, then let her manipulate for now and pray, pray, pray and let the Lord deal with it and work on her. She probably is not trying to "use" you but I think because of your fears, you wonder that. I will tell you just a little.. but don't want to say too much <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> ... but my husband was convinced that I did not love him, that I was deceving him and manipulating him, and alot of stuff... but I wasn't. I truly, truly realized that Satan had deceived him and there was almost nothing I could do. I think that in a situation like this, it is really easy and tempting to question the other's motives and to have fear of trusting and believing. I think that's all Satan to be honest. I mean, I guess some people manipulate and use, but I think also alot of times, we think they are out of fear. Pray for wisdom and discernment. Even if she is manipulating or using you, it's not grounds for divorce, it is forgivealbe, and you are still called to love her. You need to put all your faith, hope, and trust in God. He will take care of you. If you put your faith, hope, and trust in your wife, you will be let down, time and time again, because she is imperfect and a sinner, just like you.

Another cool Bible story is that of Abigail. She was married to a pretty evil guy, Naman. Name wouldn't show kindness to King David and David was on his way wiht his troops to wipe out Naman and all the men. Abigail found out and kindly appealed to David and basically saved everybody. She later told her husband and he basically had a heart attack or something and then he died 2 wks. later and then David sent for Abigail to be his wife. What stood out, is that Abigail simply did what was right (although she did call her husband a "fool"!) and she didn't yell at her husband or anything. She trusted God and He took care of her.

You said, "Yes, satan still works over time, within my thoughts."

I know... I will pray for you! You are on my marriage prayer list! Read Ephesians... read the last chapter about spiritual armor to remind yourself how to fight with Satan.

You said, "As you are so familiar with the two choices, either reconcile, (or re-marry, if we divorce) or remain single,,,,"

It's 1 Cor. 7:10 "To the married I give this COMMAND (not I, but the Lord): A wife must not separate from her husband. BUt if she does, she must remain unmarried or be reconciled to her husband. And a husband must not divorce his wife."

1 Cor. 7:39 "A woman is bound to her husband as long as he lives."

I have a hard time getting around these verses.. you know, saying "yah but...". I mean, I don't want to be "legalistic" about them, but they seem so clear and straightforward.

TO BE CONT....

CONTINUED.... (sorry I guess I was longwinded tonight!)

You said, "Yes, i have already heard how *crazy* i must be,,,"

Well, you are not alone! I'm right there with you, "crazy" and "in denial"! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> People always have their opinions. We live in such a majorly opinionated world... look at talk shows and supermarket magazines/tabloids and CNN and all the shows that are opinion, opinion, opinion, to the point that I sometimes want to say, "Mind your own business!!" I think so much time is wasted on empty talk.



You said, "Earlier i was reading where in, Conn."

What is Conn? Conneticut? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I'm not sure.

Yes, there definitely needs to be more stigma attached to adultery. Major movie stars often have girlfriends and boyfriends before ther divorces are even final and it is absolutely no big deal at all!

You said, 'So, again, if the third party involved woth a married individual, was to be held accountable in some way, than maybe, just maybe, the divorce rate could, and or would,,,
s l o w down!!!"

Yes, but God WILL hold them accountable and their sin will not go without consequence. We will never see a world in which righteousness reigns because Satan is the "god" of this earth. The Lord has, for whatever reason, allowed him to do his thing, although the presence of the Holy Spirit and God's power keeps the presence of good and all of God's attributes in us Christians. I mean, well, if there were no Christians on earth, think of how evil it would be. If there was no presence of the Holy Spirit. That's basically what hell will be. But anyways, this earth will always be corrupt and sinful and the Bible says that "the road to life is narrow" and "few find it" and "broad is the path of destruction." Personally, I can't wait until heaven... simply can't wait! But, I don't want people going to hell either and I know we are still here because the Lord is patient wanting all to be saved.

You said, "Granted i don't have a crystal ball, but anymore, I wonder what this world is going to be like in another twenty years, with marriages."

It is scary. All that is going on right now with homosexuality and divorce, it is hard to imagine the state of marriage and the family in 20 years. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> That is why you and me have to stand for our marriages. Just think... if God restores... think of the testimonies we will have and how God can use them. Often when I begin to lose hope and think "forget it", I think of that... I think of commitment and God and love, and I hold on to hope even when I see no reason to hope.

AT the rate of divorce now, marriages will s l o w down!!! Imagine, ALL of the broken families,,,

"so, in the future, if you ever wonder how i'am doing, you can ask yourself,,, and you will already know."

That is a profound thought. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> Have you read the testimonies at those two sites? You really need to read them (therre's more at the Restore site)... you will find that so much of what is said sounds so familiar! The way that the "wayward" spouse is described sounds so alike in each situation.

You said, "You are ever so encouraging to me!!! I will be reading Ephesians,,,"

I'm so glad! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> To both. It's wierd to say, but I can honestly say that I'm glad I have already been there because I am able to offer you words of wisdom and encouragement because of being there.

You said,"I will CONTINUE to tell the world,,
I'M A STANDER!!!
http://www.rejoiceministries.org"

Oh, was it you that mentioned the devotional and money? I can't remember for sure, but you MUST sign up for "Charlyne Cares"! It is free and it is awesome! And if you can afford it, get the book "Prodigals Do Come Home." It's written by Bob so it's a man's perspective, but I think any one divorcing their spouse would be similar to how Bob was. Also, there is another book there called "The Spiritual Journey Towards a Healed Marriage." And, at Restore Ministries, join. It's 10 dollars but you don't have to send right away, I don't believe. But if you join, then you can get a prayer partner... they try to set you up with another man in your same situation.

TO BE CONTINUED

CONTINUED.... ((Okay, really, really longwinded tonight!!! Sorry!!)

I have been with a prayer partner since the beginning... although, I met her elsewhere... either here or somewhere else. All this time, her husband has been home and filed for divorce and just a week ago, he moved out! I feel so inadequate to even know how to counsel her, but I feel I am going through it with her. I had another prayer partner from there whose husband had an affair, divorced her, said he didn't love her, etc... and then, came back and wanted to remarry her! And boy, she went through the pits of depression. I guess we all have or will. I have.

Anyways, I am talking too much, but you can get a prayer partner there. And you should order the man's book if you can afford it. If you can't, write them and tell them. I wanted the "Be Encouraged" tapes but couldn't afford and wrote and a woman, whose marriage was restored <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> , sent me hers (she obviously didn't need them anymore). She told me that when my marriage was restored, to pass them on!

Did that Gary Smalley book help at all? I have thought of keeping it as a counseling reference but I have also thought maybe I should send it to you. What do you think?

You said, "God bless you LoveMyEx!
I will continue to pray for your reconcilation."

Thank you Stephen! It is going to be a long journey I am afraid, but I'm willing to wait. (sigh). I read your post today first and feel encouraged! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I started a post but don't want to go read it... I'm afraid I opened some sort of can of worms and that tempers are flaring in there. Maybe I am wrong... we'll see. I might not read it! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

God bless you! Why don't you write back here and I can give you my email also. The only thing we have to be careful of is you being a man and me being a woman. It's usually better for a man to counsel man and woman to woman. Esp. also because you don't want your wife to know you are emailing a woman, even if it's "innocent." But, I also want to keep in touch with you to be able to encourage you. Tell me what you think.

Hang in there and I am attaching an article I read today from "Family Life Today." Do you listen to them on the radio or read their stuff? It is Dennis Rainey's ministry and very good. I love him! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> This is an article on men for men. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

http://www.familylife.com/articles/article_detail.asp?id=92

Hello LoveMyEx!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />
Actually i'm glad you were long winded. It gives me sooo much more! Most of my days are filled with just my children, so when i'm reading your posts, i don't know, maybe theres a part of me that embraces so much from you,,,(your posts)
When the W and myself were talking the other day, she also mentioned some thing about me no longer involving myself with friends, i informed her it was a choice i made, and the reason i made it was because i was devoted, and committed to my family. That i have no regrets, i was comfortable with my choice.

Regarding to manipulating me, truly i wished i wouldn't allow such thoughts!? As for putting the children or myself in danger,,, i'm just so concerned what happens to the children, especially when she has them, and they are subjected to having to witness their mommy hugging another guy. My 5 Y D was talking about this again this evening. She proceeded to tell me she looked right at (name) in his face, telled him you not my mommy's boyfriend or husband, i'm serioys dad, i looked him right in his face! Pretty smart little girl, but so sad,,,even my little three year old comes home, still telling me *mommy nean, hers ugly!* then starts crying. Some times i want to just ask her,, are *you* happy now!?
Granted i could be wrong, i just don't think she should subject them to this, they should not have to witness this. Maybe i'm being selfish, but i also don't think that she should take them over to his house!? Is this quality time, time they really need for and with their mommy? I just don't undersatnd.
Oh boy, so many times do i ever try to figure her motives!? So often i think i'm really needed to force her back,,i'm still accused of it, again, i try to figure out the motive Confused, i do know often I'AM. At times i'm still Mr. Angryman, ha ha My title should be some thing like;
Mr. Confused Angryman Standing. Trying to find the humor!?
This morning i had an interview, it was almost next door to where this other person lives. When i drove by i thought the red car in the drive was my W's. Oh boy, all thee emotions that ran through at the same time. I allowed myself to turn around, drove by again, only to realize it was not hers. My real point is i allowed the emotions to settle in me, when i should have tried to be more stronger, and refused to acknowledge the hurt.

Confused, i'm very confused. Especially after listening to my w sat how it hurt her, for me not saying the words, i love you. When actually i said these words on a daily basis, but more so with my actions, and less verbal/

Conn. Yes i meant Conneticut, at the time i wasn't sure if i was spelling this correct, so i trie to abbreaviate.
I know the third party involved in Affairs will get theirs, i just hope some how, some way, that here on earth, while still alive, the justice system can and will come up with a way to hold them accountable. Make it mandatory for lets say a six month jail term? Or longer! Look at the permanent scars that can be automatically installed into some innocent children? Think about it, if i can go to jail for *communicating* with my wife, than i think the individual involved with any adultrous affair, should be held accountable, for the damage that has been installed in the innocent children. Those scars have ever lasting effects, where as an adult, being phoned by the caring adult, well this act they can get over it, a heck of a lot easier, and quicker. Does all of this make sense?

Because my W is now in the arms of the person she is,(her first sons dad) i'm wondering if my marriage is, and was a mistake??? Today i was allowing myself to think it was, hoping that maybe in my future,,,, my second marriage will then be, what, justified!? Glorified!? (sp)

("so, in the future, if you ever wonder how i'am doing, you can ask yourself,,, and you will already know.")

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> That is a profound thought. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I'm not quite sure what you mean by this? Is this a bad thing? If so, i'm sorry,, ok? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />
Maybe this is one of the tones my ignorance is shining thru.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I'm so glad! To both. It's wierd to say, but I can honestly say that I'm glad I have already been there because I am able to offer you words of wisdom and encouragement because of being there. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This seems to be selfish on my behalf to accept some thing like this. Can you understand? I can't agree with saying glad *you* have already been there. Its almost as if wishing misfortune on one, so another can maybe benefit.

Yes i did sign up for Charlyne Cares. I don't use cards, and still unemployed. When i start working again, i have the intentions to send them the requested fee. My children has some needs, you know, school is about to start real soon. Granted, maybe i 'am looking at it in the wrong order,, cuz if marriage was saved, well thats more important than a pencil, or a pair of pants.

When i do join, i will set up for a prayer partner. I wished it could be with a fenale though, personaly, it seems like it would be easier,,,

Yes the Gary Smalley helped, but i still penalize my ownself. Draw several flagsm still. I go back and read it from time to tine. My opinion is you probably should keep it for your reference, only cuz more people will benefit that way. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />
Thank you,,, <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Here is my email address, and i'll be careful, if your careful. LOL <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />
caleystephan@hotmail.com
I'm going to delete this in awhile, i don't especially want just anyone getting this.

I read the Family life article, thank you!!
And noppers, i haven't yet listened to the radio show,,,

Thank you LoveMyEx,, more important, i thank God.

Hi Stephen,

Sorry about that last novel! I won't type much tonight... I have a very, very, VERY bad headache and about to go to bed. I have had a... hmmmm... "hard" day I guess. I haven't talked to my husband in months, at his request because he desired to "move on". It is hard with us, because I live on the West Coast and he is out in the upper Midwest. I moved back here after divorce but think I should've stayed. Well, he has a girlfriend that he wants to marry. Somehow, I think I knew. Maybe God was preparing me to hear it. I contacted him recently, and today asked him (via email). I did not say much, but... well, I feel as if I am in mourning.... again. Not all hope is gone though. I thank the Lord for Charlyne and the other site and the testimonies that help me see that. But, I do not know what the future holds. I cannot say. But I am fasting and praying and want to fast for a few days if I can make it. I truly need the Lord to help me. My sorrow often feels greater than I can bear. It is not just my sorrow for my marriage, but all these marriages. I just feel so burdened for marriage and hate divorce so much. So, my eyes are also hurting very badly right now because I have cried alot today.

I am glad though that you like to read my novels! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> After I post, I am amazed I wrote so much! Now, I can't remember, and you probably said somewhere but how old are your kids and... do you have full custody?

You said, "i informed her it was a choice i made, and the reason i made it was because i was devoted, and committed to my family. That i have no regrets, i was comfortable with my choice."

That's good Stephen. I also kinda/sorta offered some words of love to my husband today... not a ton and not too direct... he does not want to hear them and I don't feel wise saying them at this time, but I was able to hold on to God's promises and to speak with faith vs. fear. Last night I read this Proverb: "Let love and faithfulness never leave you. Bind them around your neck. Then you will win favor with God and man." I held on to that all day today, saying it to myself and reminding myself of it. It does not matter that it is not returned... I still bind it around me and love and remain faithful... believing that God will find favor with me and perhaps have mercy and that my husband will also find favor.

You said, "Regarding to manipulating me, truly i wished i wouldn't allow such thoughts!?"

Yah, I know. I had some pretty awful thoughts when my husband and I were separating/divorcing. So did he. I think it was his thoughts though that have given me insight into the mind of someone divorcing. There were things he thought that were very far from true, but there was much fear and of course, Satan right there... accusing me saying, "She's this and that." I was able to better understand what was going on.

YOu said," they are subjected to having to witness their mommy hugging another guy."

I'm so sorry, but I can't remember. Is your wife seeing someone?

YOu said, "My 5 Y D was talking about this again this evening. She proceeded to tell me she looked right at (name) in his face, telled him you not my mommy's boyfriend or husband."

God can use children. I pray He will use yours to speak to your wife (and the boyfriend).

You said, "even my little three year old comes home, still telling me *mommy nean, hers ugly!* then starts crying. Some times i want to just ask her,, are *you* happy now!?"

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> Pray for your children. God can help them through this. Pray this: that God will give your wife a "heart of flesh." There is a verse about how he changes a "heart of stone" to a "heart of flesh." When that happens, when she repents, she will grieve of her sins and choices and what she is doing. Right now, her heart is hardened and she really can't see. Or maybe she can, but she tells herself it's okay (or Satan tells her it's okay). Pray for her and allow God to fill your heart with compassion for her and let him take care of discipling her. You are her husband. He is her Father. Fathers discipline. And right now, her heart is hard against you.

CONTINUED..... Did I say I wasn't going to write much?? haha

You said, "i just don't think she should subject them to this, they should not have to witness this."

No, they shouldn't, but they probably will continue to and there is not much you can do. BUT God can help them through this and it is not too much for Him to work with either.

You said, "i also don't think that she should take them over to his house!?"

I guess this answers my quest. about her having a boyfriend.

You said, " Is this quality time, time they really need for and with their mommy? I just don't undersatnd."

I know, and you won't understand. Remember that her mind is... well, not right, right now. I do not at all mean that she's mentally ill or anything like that, but that she's deceived (and when I say that, I say it with compassion for her and with hate for Satan). She does not know what she does. She does things that she doensn't realize are bad.

Okay, my husband told me that he doesn't want me writing because he doesn't want Satan dividing him and his girlfriend... and I thought, it's not Satan, is it? I mean.... according to God's Word, he is really basically still my husband. He said she is "godly" but I thought... but then doesn't she know the verse that says, "Whoever divorces his wife [my husband!] and marries another woman commits adultery against her." (Mark 10:11) Or Mark 19:9 "Whoever divorces his wife except for immorality, and marries another woamn commits adultery." There is also a verse about how a woman marrying a divorced man is an adulteress. And I felt that today... I felt like saying, "He's MY husband, not yours!" But wouldn't a truly "godly" woman know that, and how would it be "Satan" pulling apart two people committing adultery?? But that's how it works. Satan blinds like that and decieves so that what is wrong is called right and what is bad called good or good called bad. Like he did with Eve. I have seen that with my husband for awhile... since the separation when alot of fear began to grip him. I simply can only pray and be rightous knowing that God makes our righteousness known and He delievers us and makes the truth known to, so I look to Him to defend me right now and to reveal the truth. That is also why I'm fasting. I have to be absolutely so earnest and serious right now.

Anyways, that story of my husband, whom I continue to love, is an example of how a "deceived" mind is thinking. I was once there too. I remember telling my husband he was "controlling" when really, he was only trying to be loving and caring. I remember doing things I thought were okay and good, but now look back and grieve over my stupidity!

Anyways... you said, "so many times do i ever try to figure her motives!?"

Yes, I know, but you might have more peace if you don't. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> She is confused in her spirit.

you said, "So often i think i'm really needed to force her back,,"

I think it is only now that I don't feel distraught like I once did where I feel I have to stop my husband from remarrying. I think I have actually grown to the point of truly being able to leave this in God's hands and trusting Him. This has only come after 10 mos. of much repentence, seeking God, forgiving my husband, pain, pain, pain. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> But, don't get me wrong, the sorrow remains. The sorrow, I expect, might never go away. Perhaps in that sense, I can identify with Christ.

You said, "At times i'm still Mr. Angryman"

It has taken me months to get to where I now feel no anger and have grown to be able to control angry outbursts. I can truly say that I truly love him but months ago, I wasn't so sure. I was angry off and on many, many times. It is normal I think, but something for you to have self-control over because many a forest has been burned to the ground because of the fire spread from an angry tongue.

You said, "Mr. Confused Angryman Standing. Trying to find the humor!?" Heehee... yah... I hear ya! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

You said, "This morning i had an interview, it was almost next door to where this other person lives."

Uh. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> That must have not felt too good.

You said, "When i drove by i thought the red car in the drive was my W's. Oh boy, all thee emotions that ran through at the same time. I allowed myself to turn around, drove by again, only to realize it was not hers."

I can only imagine. You know, that is just like a story Erin (REstore Minstries) tells about driving by once and thinking she saw the OW in her husband's car but it turned out to be only her husband.

You said, "My real point is i allowed the emotions to settle in me, when i should have tried to be more stronger, and refused to acknowledge the hurt."

But you are learning and growing obviously, because you are able to see that. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I think it's okay to acknowledge hurt but not to act on it in a sinful way. Like crying is not sinful. But yelling or accusing is. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

YOu said, "Confused, i'm very confused. Especially after listening to my w sat how it hurt her, for me not saying the words, i love you. When actually i said these words on a daily basis, but more so with my actions, and less verbal"

Did she recently say this? She is confused too. My husband also went back and forth between love and then fear. You know love and fear cannot exist together. The Bible says that "perfect love casts out fear" and that there is "no fear in love." So that is why she is back and forth too. I was in my marriage. It probably is only the last few months when I just really determined to love no matter what... even if not returned... even from afar... that I think my fears about loving him were gone.

You said, "Yes i meant Conneticut"

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I thought so.

You said, "i just hope some how, some way, that here on earth, while still alive, the justice system can and will come up with a way to hold them accountable. Make it mandatory for lets say a six month jail term? Or longer!"

Wouldn't that be great? It's so sad because the laws of God are not all laws of the land. Adultery today also is soooooo less looked down upon like it used to be. Same of course with divorce, sex before marriage, etc. I think that is why when we Christians live according to God, we really stand out as a light in a dark world!

You said, "Look at the permanent scars that can be automatically installed into some innocent children? Think about it, if i can go to jail for *communicating* with my wife, than i think the individual involved with any adultrous affair, should be held accountable, for the damage that has been installed in the innocent children."

It's pretty backwards, isn't it? You going to jail vs. the other man.

You said, "Does all of this make sense?"

yes.

You said, "Because my W is now in the arms of the person she is,(her first sons dad) i'm wondering if my marriage is, and was a mistake???"

Was she married to the first son's dad? If so, how long and how long were you two married? That is a hard one because you know, if she was married, then really you two shouldn't have married but she should have reconciled with him. However, it's done... you two married and God forgives. It sounds like you've been married long enough to have a couple of kids. Divorce is truly just a very vicious cycle. But, anyways, God does forgive. Was this your first marriage?

I don't know if your marriage was a mistake, but I don't believe it is as of the day you said, "I do." Okay, I thought I made a mistake the day after marrying. Well, by the time of the divorce, my husband was convinced it was a mistake and there was no changing his mind. It is very sad because he did not think that in the beginning and I was very foolish to ever say such a thing. But, well, it might have been a mistake. He and I did not date long. HOWEVER, we made vows and God redeems mistakes and oh boy... now I'm thinking of his girlfriend and if they marry... will it be a mistake? I really, truly pray they don't marry.

CONTINUED......

You said, "Yes i did sign up for Charlyne Cares."

Oh good. I guarantee you that God will speak to you through them. That woman is annointed! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> Really, her devotions have at times gotten me through the day.

You said, "When i start working again, i have the intentions to send them the requested fee."

Do you mean Restore Ministries because I don't think Rejoice Ministries devotional costs? Do you have any job prospects? What happened to your job?

You said, "My children has some needs, you know, school is about to start real soon."

What needs? I am a teacher... well, not currently... currently going to school f/t but I have a whole lot of teacher supply stuff leftover! I would be more than happy to send what I can that you might need.

You said, "Granted, maybe i 'am looking at it in the wrong order,, cuz if marriage was saved, well thats more important than a pencil, or a pair of pants."

Well, yes, that is true <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> but a need is a need. And unfortunately it all adds up (money that is).

You said, "When i do join, i will set up for a prayer partner. I wished it could be with a fenale though, personaly, it seems like it would be easier,,,"

Heehee... well, maybe you will be surprised and maybe you and your male prayer partner will really become a blessing and encouragement to each other. I hope so! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

You said, "Yes the Gary Smalley helped, but i still penalize my ownself. Draw several flagsm still. I go back and read it from time to tine. My opinion is you probably should keep it for your reference, only cuz more people will benefit that way. "

Well, okay, but I do wish I could have finished posting more from it but it took too long! But I'm glad it helped.

Okay, I have your email. Is "caley" your wife's name? How old are you and your wife? I think you might be around my age, or younger, because I think your kids are young (5 and 3?). Well, when you get my email, look for a female name 'cause my address is my name and it's aol.

You said, "I read the Family life article, thank you!! And noppers, i haven't yet listened to the radio show,,,"

Oh good, I'm glad you read. I am very fortunate- 2 very good Chrisitan stations here that play Family Life Today. I think you can listen to them online. I think the more you fill yourself with godly sermons/etc. about marriage, love, the role of a husband, etc., the better. You need to fill yourself with 1st God's Word and 2nd God's Word delivered through other people! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Well, I better go to bed. I think I am about to have an aneurysm! Sorry, I should not joke like that, but I have such a headache. It must be caffeine withdrawals! And too much crying!

Hang in there! Will talk to you again soon.

p.s. Here is Gary Smalley's website: http://smalley.gospelcom.net/

Also, a couple other good sites that are very pro-marriage:

www.focus.org (Focus on the Family)

http://www.troubledwith.com/ (a new ministry site by Focus on Family. Read the articles on divorce)

Hi LoveMyEx,,
I just finished reading your post here, and i think i deleted your email. Will you email me again please? I have the habit of just celeting, especially if i don't know the email address. Too much junk mail! For awhile every thing was about viagra, then to adding 3. My 14 Y D has a web site, so i do the same in her account. If you want to see her, http://www.afastpitchaffair.com

LoveMyEx, i truly have compassion for you! Yes as a person. Maybe i shouldn't say that, but i did. Especially after reading your post this eve. At times i wished I could just reach in, and give you a hug. I really feel for you.

Our children together are D 5, and son 3. Yes i have full custody. My W wants me to agree to joint.
This is my first marriage, and my W's second. In her first, they were divorced just over their first year. In fact they didn't stay together for a full year, married that is. They had no children. My W was with her first daughters dad, for just over a year. She was with her first sons dad,(never married) under a year. While i was packing months ago. I found a journal from my W. She has been involved in over twelve relationships, none lasting more than a year. In maybe as long as ten years. I have two older children, ages 14 Y D, and 12 Y S. This is the story, After about seven months this lady kept coming over to where i was staying ( i just moved to Mich. fron Montana) banging on the door at any hour. I always told her take her drunk a$$ home. Finally i gave her what she wanted. A month later she came back said she was pregnant. And she was married!!! I was informed that this person wanted to go out, so i thought ok. I took her to a restraunt, the whole time she spoke about the bar. Finally we went to this bar. Anyhow, i was asked if i would be her boyfriend, my reply was lets just take it one day at a time. Anyhow, i tried to do what i thought was right. ASked her to marry me,,,remember, she was already married!? ( i think her idea was in her drunken stupor daily was to bang on the door lol)

My wife is 38, i'am 44. You mentioned close to your age, well,,, how far up on you am I?
We dated for a short time as well.
I had my first two childrens mom move out, i was ever so tired of her not coming home, all the booze and drugs. So i took her to court for full custody. I needed a day care provider, so thats how i met my W. She had a guy living with her. Months later she said she realized it was me,she started saying i was her best friend, she was in love with me,,, so she asked him to move out. Eventually we started dating, and along came our (now) little 5 year old. Her name is Veronica. Vee is my miracle child. They all are, but with Vee its a lot different. Vee had just turned 3, she was diagnosed with a brain tumor. Larger than a golf ball, and it was in her brain stem as well. I know doctors paint the worse possibales. Anyhow, the surgeon was convinced that she would not wake up, and if she did, she would be a vegetable. He proceeded to say that now we look at death as a whole new perspective,,,, i just could not accept this, for the mere fact two days prior, her and i went shopping, walking and hiking!!! For about a week maybe, Vee would wake up screaming *MY EAR HURTS* so when we brought her in, we were expecting to hear an ear infection. They sent her and my W up to a bigger hospital.When i came home from work, read the note to get there quick,,, On the way there, Vee's legs turned black, and they stiffened up,,, Vee is my miracle child!! Praise God!!!

I had quite an interesting talk with my wife two times today. I brought the children to her while i had an interview ( i was fired from my job a few months ago) I spoke briefly to my W about her request of an agreement about joint custody.
I also mentioned to her about Vee and brother being upset, seeing mommy hug this guy. (her first sons dad) My W stated that they are not involved,,, i do know my W visits him,,My W also said that he stops over every night making sure the son was disciplined if needed, W stated she is never there when he stops,,, last week he picked my W and children up, to go to a B-day party.
After i was home my W phoned me, while we were talking she called me honey. I said i liked hearing that, but i'll take it as slip, on her behalf. Not really knowing for sure if it was me she was calling honey????
She asked again about an agreement, so i said again there is no part of me that wants a divorce. I spoke of the custody issue, her reply was that they are two seperate issues. Maybe so, but like i said, custody has that big ugly D with it. I also told my W i needed, and wanted her to honor and accept our marriage. I eventually asked her to reconcile. I also told her that i never wanted to ask her that cuz i felt it should have been her decision,,,
I came up with a few ideas, she came up with why it wasn't a good idea. Like counseling, she asked how, you work first, i work second.My reply was that it really starts with an open mind. She is concerned about her mother, saying she doesn't want to live alone anymore,, ok, we'll get a bigger house,move to that city. i was asked if i had the court papers yet? I wasn't sure what she meant, so i asked now what am i being served with, . She was referring to the new court date from when she cancelled. So my comment was fine, if thats the way you want it, we'll have it out in court. So she changed her tune in a way. She still wants me to move my 12 Y S out. I reassured her thats nothing i ever would ask of her.
At one time she said *no, i just started a new job, i want to learn it* see, i get mixed messages. One time she wants to, next, no.
So i asked if i could leave her with one thought, before we hung up, something to just think about, *its newver too late.*

Can i ask you this, from every thing i just said, have i slandered my W? I apologized to her today for the slandering i have done.
( I just remembered) My wife also informed me that it would never work for us getting back together, cuz she knows my sister does not want it to happen. I tried reassuring her it only matters between us. ???????????

I will have to finish tomorrow, ttyl

God Bless you.
I think you are truly remarkable!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

<small>[ August 16, 2003, 07:35 AM: Message edited by: Stephan ]</small>