First of all I want to thank those who responded to my post my post yesteday: http://www.marriagebuilders.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=34;t=009830

Stephen, I have question, because I know you are a strong stander... If you knew the right thing to say to your X to get her back, but you also knew that thing was a lie and you really didn't believe it... would you say it? would you just say it and hope that you could work things out later?

I know STBX wants me to say his affair(s) were MY fault. He wants me to say that he had no other choice.

Actually that question is for ANYONE... not just Stephen. I just thought about him because he's often responded to my posts.

Before i respond with my reply,,,
I'd like to ask you a question or so.
Can and or do you in any way, feel responsible?
We're not in any way responsible for the actions or decisions of any other person, other than ourself. We may be responsible, for what led up to the affair.
Why do you think/feel that your not responsible?
Can you accept, or do you know, and or understand as to what may have led up to the affair?

Are you familiar with any of the several reasons, as to why affairs happen?

If he was to ask you, why it was your fault, what could/would you say?
What could you have done different to help prevent this affair?

Sohurt, I'm no expert here, and i'm no counselor. I'm going to share my true thoughts regards to affairs. I strongly believe, that it takes two.
Maybe I'll get some eyebrows raised now, but yes, its as much his/her fault, as it is her/his fault. The saying, the pancake is always flat on both sides, really applies.
There is NO excuse for such behavior, but its both spouses fault.
Yes, there are circumstances, that its only one spouses error/fault. There are exceptions.

Again, this is only my opinion.
If i fail to take care of my W, somebody else will!?

Yes, i would say to my W, i *feel* i can/will accept my portion of responsibility. (only difference, i didn't go drop anything) I'm sorry that i managed to leave you with this impression of not caring, and for me not being there for you. Then I'd ask, what can i do, and what do you need from me,,,to move on in a forward motion? So in hopes, you never *feel* the need/desire, or have the thoughts, to do this again.

Regards to honesty, I'm a firm believer, honesty is always the best policy.
Would i lie to her. There is a chance i would. It all depends,,, whats, or who is at risk? What, and who are the rewards/for.

Yes, there can/will come a day later, ,,,

How do you know your H wants you to say, and or agree to this? Has he said this?
If so, have you asked him why he thinks/feels its your fault?

*CHOICE* the choices we make dictate the life we lead.

<small>[ September 11, 2003, 09:32 PM: Message edited by: Stephan ]</small>

Before i respond with my reply,,,
I'd like to ask you a question or so.
Can and or do you in any way, feel responsible?
We're not in any way responsible for the actions or decisions of any other person, other than ourself. We may be responsible, for what led up to the affair.
Why do you think/feel that your not responsible?
Can you accept, or do you know, and or understand as to what may have led up to the affair?

Are you familiar with any of the several reasons, as to why affairs happen?

If he was to ask you, why it was your fault, what could/would you say?
What could you have done different to help prevent this affair?

Sohurt, I'm no expert here, and i'm no counselor. I'm going to share my true thoughts regards to affairs. I strongly believe, that it takes two.
Maybe I'll get some eyebrows raised now, but yes, its as much his/her fault, as it is her/his fault. The saying, the pancake is always flat on both sides, really applies.
There is NO excuse for such behavior, but its both spouses fault. This is my opinion. there are exceptions,,
If i fail to take care of my W, somebody else will!?

Yes, i would say to my W, i *feel* its just as much my fault, as yours. I'm sorry that i managed to leave you with this impression of not caring, and for me not being there, for you. Then I'd ask, what can i do, and what do you need from me,,,to move on in a forward motion?

Regards to honesty, I'm a firm believer, honesty is always the best policy.
Would i lie to her. There is a chance i would. It all depends,,, whats, or who is at risk? What, and who are the rewards/for.

Yes, there can/will come a day later, ,,,

How do you know your H wants you to say, and or agree to this? Has he said this?
If so, have you asked him why he thinks/feels its your fault?

I as well believe in the *Open Heart Policy!*

I'AM A STANDER!!!
http://www.rejoiceministries.org

*CHOICE* the choices we make dictate the life we lead.

Thanks again for the replies:

So I wrote to STBX yesterday

I guess my point yesterday was to ask if divorce feels right to you - regardless of all the issues - does it feel like the right thing to do? I never got an answer from you.

I know you love your family.

I know things are screwed up. I know you WEREN'T happy, because of my actions. I know your job didn't help either. I think you need a tranquil happy home life. I think you need a retreat from the pressures of life. that's what your family should be to you. I have done a lot of introspection and know that my coping techniques sucked. I did everything but create what you needed. but I always loved you.

I wasn't happy either. Reaching out to other people was exactly what created our first set of mistakes. It was awful to see it happen again before my very eyes. I can forgive, if you can learn. You resorted to the same coping techniques that caused our initial problems. I felt like a fool.

We got no where in two years - but I can say the main thing that all of this has taught me is that my family is important to me.

Do I know how to fix things? NO. Do I think we should get divorced. I don't know. I don't want to. If you want to, then I have no choice. All I can say is it doesn't feel right to me.

When we divorce, do you know what you are working towards? Creating a new family with someone else? What about J and T? Do you really want to be a father to someone else's kids, while someone else is a father to yours? That doesn't seem right.

I know you so well. You know me. We ARE compatible, or we never would have gotten married in the first place. We haven't grown apart. Even now, when we let our guard down, we always "click", and I know you feel it too.

Anyway, M... that's it. I'm always willing to talk to you.

So, back to my question. Does it feel right to you?

He read it, but never answered.
I called him around 9:30pm. I told him I just wanted to see how he was doing. He said ok. I said I know today was probably hard on him to (the anniversary) and that just wanted to say hi. We talked a little about the kids, all friendly. then I said I emailed you eariler today. He said he got it. HE then said his work is so busy, his finances are such a mess,(remember, he's about to be fired, he's considering bankruptcy, he's close to being evicted from his apartment).. that he doesn't know what to say to my email. then he said again I just have nothing to say right now. I said Ok, well I don't want to keep you. Hope you have a good night. He said alright, talk to you later.

When I get the divorce papers, I will sign them... I will do this. As much as I never wanted to be divorced. He really has very little to offer these days. He's so close to being fired. If (when) he gets fired, he'll no longer have a car (company car). He's already been late with his rent at his apt several times, he'll probably be evicted. he says he'll then file bankruptcy. He's constantly getting collection calls (he went through a big spending spree for a while, part of the reason I had to kick him out).

Siiigggghhhhh.

Boy, life isn't fair is it.

Sohurt, you know, there actually could be several reasons for him not having anything to say.


Sohurt, if it doesn't feel right, then why do it??? there's a reason for feeling this way. Because maybe, there is that HUGE possibility, that its not right. Because its not right!!!
Is it possible to have the divorce papers in limbo, placed on hold? There are sooo many marriages that end with divorce, that really shouldn't have! It was either 98, or 90%!
Also, if you have stones left unturned, then its not right.
If the both of you can't look each other in the eye, and agree that its time for a divorce, then its not right. Nobody should stay married just for the children, but at the same time, we owe it to our innocent children, to fix our marital problem. Too many people think that once its gone, its gone. This isn't true. Even when one hates the other spouse,, *its never too late!*
Have you tried to let him know whats in it for him? Maybe this is your first step?? Don't mention too much about you, or your self benefits. Talk about some of his fears, point out his resistance. Convince, or reassure him there are immediate % meaningful benefits for him. Often times when he/she can see whats in it fir him/her, the resistance will lessen. (reconnection steps)

Ask your husband what would he say if you suggested to him to get his a$$ home, where he belongs!? Tell him you have a surprise for him,,,
have the candles lit, and let your hair down??? No talkling about the past problems, just have an *open* mind.

As crazy as this may sound, but too often, when one thinks and feels the pressure is off, they actually change. When they no longer feel like they're being pursued.(not in all cases) If he thinks he has your good-bye,,,(reverse phycology(sp) this has such the potential, to turn things around. You always have to remember, there are never no absolute guarantees.

Five days ago, i gave my wife this good-bye letter,, explaining a paticular few things, she actually called me, the next day!!! The only thing is, stupid me, i already blew it,, we spoke for over an hour. The next day i emailed her, gave her a big portion of my heart,,, too soon!!! Now, i haven't heard from her for a few days, again.

Every time i discussed any of my feelings,,, for and or to her, i only pushed her further away, time after time.

Weeks ago, she beagn thinking i had a girlfriend,, the phone calls started, she would im me. Too son i'd begin discussing our marriage, too soon again. I pushed her away, again!!!
I'll post a sample letter tomorrow, if your interested??

I truly wish you the best??? and keep praying!!!

<small>[ September 12, 2003, 10:02 PM: Message edited by: Stephan ]</small>

Well i don't want to be divorced. I've made it painfully clear. I agree with dr phil, you should have to EARN your way out. it's the STBX that just wants to call it quits, doesn't want to try anymore, doesn't want to talk.

Even tonight when he dropped off the kids he said "I don't want to talk about us" I said "I can respect that". and let him go. Oh well.

I'm pretty sure I'll get the divorce papers next week. SIGH.