Since it has been two years since it was set, I *can* ask Friend of the Court to modify the support order. This would likely result in my ex paying more child support, as I made considerably less than when it was established.

However, given his history, he will likely blow up about it, and even though I am no longer afraid of his rants and rages, he has been paying for things he is not required to (helping with back to school clothes, winter coats, etc.) and I don't want to look like a money hungry b**** ex.

What would you do? I will be buying a house soon and money will be extra tight. I have to consider that. So far, I haven't 'needed' the CS money and it has all gone into savings, but that will soon change.

Hi Buttercup!!

Its been a long time since I posted.
I asked the court back in May for additional child support since it has been 3 yrs since the divorce and the child support I receive is based on what my X earned working part time back in 1998.

I received a increase of about $200 per month( now upto to $600 per month for the 2 kids).

Well my x filed with the court claiming she has the kids 50% of the time for the past 2 yrs. In reality it has been for the past year, basically since she got divorced from mr right.

Any how, my lawyer says since I make more money than her and if its trues she does take the kids about 50% of the time, I may have to PAY HER child support.

What really frosts me is that I call her place tonite about 9:00 and there was no answer. I went out and when I got back a little while ago, my son had returned my message and I noted that my x had called too. Only she had called from work. She is supposed to be off and instead they call for work and she went in. She normally works 12 shifts so the kids will be on there own all night.

My son wanted me to get a release form for him for something he is doing at church. She could have done this but instead is working. I am pissed.

She claims to have the kids 50% of the time but has no responsibility for them other to have them there.

So to answer to answer your question, I would have to say no don't request additional support. The x will do what ever it takes not to pay that.

As far as I can tell the courts only look at time and monies earned. They don't look at the responsibilities the resident parent has.

I was going to offer my x a "deal" tommorrow so I don't have to pay her child support. That is just unacceptable to me. Now I amnot so sure. I will call my laywer and maybe the children's advocate.

I have the same dilema that I could get more child support from my ex. BUT if I ask him to help me with something he will help. My 13yr is on a trip with her school for 3 days and it was $90 and we split the cost, school pictures we also split the cost and there are a few other things that he has helped with.
So that is why I haven't gone after more CS.

if you feel he will continue to help you with clothes, school supplies, etc then I might wait on going for more

Ok, you bring up some interesting questions.
I have no answers for you.
But shouldn't the PAR (parent of alternate residence) pay for school items and clothes when they have the children, as the PPR does (parent of primary residence)?
My X refused to pay for any school items claiming child support covered it. I don't feel that way. I think everything should be split based on the income (i make more). Particularly extracurricular activities. If the children want to attend, both parents should share the cost. Am I in Oz here? What really happens?

First off, Princess, if the arrangement is working and he is "voluntarily" picking up "extras" I wouldn't rock the boat. I know in my situation if my X tried to get mine raised it would send me through the roof, and I would probably HAVE to cut back on some of the extras. But in my case, it should actually be lower than what I'm paying since we settled out of court and I still pick up as many of the incidentals as I can. I bought all their school supplies and bought them all some school clothes. So my recommendation is that if it ain't broke don't fix it.

Newly, What child support is is a mystery. When I was going through my divorce I only found one reference in a Kansas Supreme Court case that defined what child support is intended for. Basically it said food, utilities, clothing, transportation, and any activity that a normal child of that age could participate in.

If you are banking the CS, then WTF are you asking for an increase for?

don't be greedy and just because you are entitled, doesn't mean that you have to get it. . .

if Xs are banking child support, then why is it so high in the first place??

stupid court system

wiftty

WIFFTY,
I'm surprised by the tone of your answer.
I too plan to bank CS, primarily because I believe in the future that my X will play a game and either not pay or decrease and I feel like I need to build up a bank.

However, as he's still screwing around with the financials of the divorce, I'll probably actually need the CS.

And secondly, while married with two incomes, there is always a backup plan. As a single parent, additional cushion is needed, when its most likely that no financial safety net is available.

My H was the spender in the family and I scrimped. I believe that I'll be fine monetarily, but I think he'll be crying poor to the kids and really want to decrease it later. It's less than $500/month, and I pay all the insurance. Go figure.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by WhenIfindthetime:
<strong>don't be greedy and just because you are entitled, doesn't mean that you have to get it...</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">wiftty- I bank it because right now I can afford to. I would rather not depend on that money being there because if my ex loses his job (a pretty common occurance) then I won't see anything for a long time. Can I ask if you think $75 a week for two young kids is high? Westley pays over $90 for one.

However, when I start having mortgage payments every cent is going to count. The house is just as much our kids' residence as mine. Child support is for putting a roof over their head, no?

For now, I'm going to let things ride. He doesn't offer to help out with stuff, he just buys certain things without asking what they need, and sends them home with a big huffy "look at me" attitude. I try not to look a gift horse in the mouth...

do you think its because an X of mine i know WOULD NOT AGREE to a CS reduction, even after being unemployed for 9 months, at $1500 per month, and the court system made me wait another 6 months to prove i couldn't find a job, still paying at that rate. . . and 6 months later, I still don't have a job. . . but I have to start paying as soon as i get a job, but she doesn't stop getting as soon as i get laid off??

while she works, has a house with no payments because its given to her by her employer, has no heat or light bills, and 1/2 her food paid, and didn't want a reduction, because it paid for her NEW LUXURY SUV, not a child support item. . . .

and the courts don't recognize that in the formula? she loves to collect items that she can get reimbursed from me . . . and she wanted a divorce because i was too rich?

think about it. . .

wiftty

I just this week have had a few not so pleasent conversations with my EX. I have asked him repeatedly to help pay the kids health insurance(which by the divorce decree he was suppose to provide)and to pay some money to our daughter who is in collage. He never retuned my calls regarding this or letters so I got child support services involved again. He got the papers and he is mad. He is begging me to stop it because he can't afford it. Well he wasn't concerned about if I could afford it the past few years.

My middle child who is 17 lives with him and I send him money and clothes all of the time. He never sends the two up here anything but 20.00 for their birthdays.

Jill

wiftty, I can see things from both side since Westley is in the situation of working about 8 months a year, some times he barely squeaks in his truck payment during the winter lay-off, and sometimes he works overtime at upwards of $30/hr.

Wouldn't you know his ex got them to refigure his CS payment when he was raking it in last summer. So he still has to give her $100 a week even when he makes $200 a week during layoff. If CS is supposed to be based on how much you make, it should vary with how much you make... right?

However it's not the kids' fault if you have to take a pay cut or get laid off... and I know some moms need it to show up every week. Some moms do use the money for what it's meant for, and some don't; there's just not a system of checks and balances in place to make that right.

Sorry you have one of those ex's. Westley's ex keeps letting the phone get turned off so sometimes he can't even call his daughter to just talk, or to set up his pick-up time (it changes weekly due to his unpredictable work schedule). It's aggravating. My ex accused me of spending his child support money on my horse. He doesn't know that every check he's given me has gone into the money market account and we live off my own money. He's just bitter over things he can't control.

Wifty,

I live in the same state you do, and the magistrate allowed my H to reduce the child support by 2/3 the minute he got laid off - and the court never made him prove that he had made any effort to find another job, much less a comparable one.

exPB,

"This would likely result in my ex paying more child support, as I made considerably less than when it was established."

This sentence confuses me. Why would your ex have to pay more if YOUR income has gone up?

If you don't "need" the money and he's paying for things above and beyond what he has to, why are you even considering asking for more? Honsetly, if I were him and I knew your income has gone up and you were socking CS away in a bank account, I'd take you back to court.
If it aint broke, don't fix it.

CS is a very touchy subject. Every state is different, every situation is different. There is no black or white, right or wrong answer. I'm in the middle of trying to settle this very issue with my STBXW.

We have been separated since 7/02 and have shared custody of our daughter. She lives with each of us half the time. We each incur half the day-to-day costs of raising her and we've split all other costs (daycare, clothes, dance class, etc.). We both make a comfortable living, we both own our own homes and all of our daughter's needs are being provided for.

We've set a precadent that works and I want to maintain the status quo. She wants us to continue to share all expenses as we have (which is fine with me) but in addition she wanted me to pay her $800/mth for CS. For what? She doesn't need it, our daughter's very well provided for and I don't believe it's warranted. She has since lowered her demands to $500/mth, claiming she spends $1000/mth on clothes and extracurricular activities. The facts simply to don't support that and I won't agree to it. We were supposed to go to court last Tuesday to present the facts to a judge, but her lawyer asked for a continuance the day before.

I will always provide for my daughter, I always have, but I have to protect myself too. I hope to get married again someday and God willing have more children. I want to be able to provide for them that same as I provide for my daughter. What would you do?

sad dad

I see... "made" should be "make"... I make about half what I was making before.

However, I don't have a car payment. That is going to change soon as I have 150K miles on my little car and it's making lots of noises.

I don't have a mortgage payment. That is going to change soon because I can't stay in the housing that I'm in now. My goal is to be out by January and I'm not sure that will happen.

I don't have to pay for groceries right now. I'm not on welfare, before anyone gets up in arms; I have privately funded help with groceries. That's $90 a week alone. When I move out, that will end.

I sock it away right now because I can, and because when I left him, I didn't have a place to live, a car to drive, a job, or $100 to my name. When CS was set, I had to estimate my income, and I used the pay rate for the job that I was going to interview for the next day. Didn't get that job. Later, I found a job for less money and took it. At that time, my rent was higher than our land contract payment had been. I was always living check to check and trying to pay off the marital debts that were all in my name. I had no emergency funds. It's not just nice to have savings now, it is dangerous not to.

Ah ha, now it makes sense. Sounded like you were saying you make more now and want more CS. Obviously you need to have a dependable car and a nice place for your kid(s) to live. Whether your exH bears any financial obligation to you in that regard is for a judge to decide. I think it's worth pursuing. I realize you want to put some money away as a safety net, we all do, but that's not the purpose of child support. I'm sure he would like to use that money for his own safety net. He has no obligation to help provide yours. Unless you're entitled to alimony, his only obligation is to your children. I don't mean to sound like I'm coming down on you, I'm drawing my conclusions from what little I know of your situation. Get whatever you're entitled to (alimony, more CS, etc.), no more, no less.

sad dad

xPB, its all in how you present the case and the $$ and the issues. . .

to say that you bank the CS is really not 100% correct. . You can also make the case that you are spending his monthly, and your monthly money, and the combined BALANCE of what is left over is saved for the future. . . however, it would be very appropriate to make a dedicated education fund so that you dodge the assumption that you are just saving it to better yourself. . . remember, you can live in the house AFTER the child leaves, therefore should he get a rebate for providing the house where she does not live after she lives on her own if CS is used to buy a house?

now, its called Child Support but what is considered in that bucket is debatable, especially when there are shared items such as a home, a car, food, etc. so really you want to present the financial case as a lump of expenses to raise the child, and then a lump of cash left over, as the money if fungible, meaning, if you put $ in a bank, when they come back out, there is no way to determine the source of that $ as it was put in. . . you combine your $$ with xH $$ to pay for the living expenses, and then you bank the rest, assigning the source is not really as precise as one thinks. That is why the presentation of the topic is so very important. . .

My X used 1/2 of her settlement to buy a new car. . . she had a 4 year old, fully paid for, top of the line grand voyager, and the excuse was that the electric door locks worked intermittently. . . 70K miles.. . and she needed a new car, a $40K eddie bauer limited edition expedition. . . full of luxuries. . . to keep up with her friends. . .

that was after i suggested looking at buying her a suburban at $30 K and i was told in no uncertain terms that the only reason i wanted a surburban is to keep up with my rich friends in town. . .

there are alot of issues wrapped up in $$ so you need to really make the issue less specific, and one of good financial management. . . for the child or children?

wiftty

I Googled for child support use guidelines and found very little. Here's some of the stuff I did find:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">from frascona.com:
Myth: Child support money has to be spent directly on the children.
Reality: There is no law which states that the money has to be used directly for the children. Child support can be used by the receiving party in almost any manner as long as it is not detrimental for the children. For example, the money can be put into a checking account and checks can be written for food, rent, mortgage payments, vacations for the receiving party (as long as the children are not suffering), toys, car insurance, and other expenses. If the paying party feels the money is not benefitting the children, the court can order the parents to mediate the dispute.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">from family-law.freeadvice.com
WHAT IS CHILD SUPPORT USED FOR?
Child support covers everything a child needs, "and even more", during the growth and formative years. Keep the following in mind:
A parent's first and principal obligation is to support his or her minor children according to the parent's circumstances and station in life; and
Children should share in the standard of living of both parents. Thus, the amount of a child support award is more than a question of "bare necessities."
If the child has a wealthy parent, that child is entitled to, and therefore ?needs? something more than the bare necessities of life. Where the supporting parent enjoys a lifestyle that far exceeds the custodial parent's living standard, child support must "to some degree" reflect that more "opulent lifestyle." This is so even though, as a practical matter, the child support payments will incidentally benefit others in the custodial household whom the payor parent has no obligation to support (e.g., custodial parent owed no spousal support, adult children, or children from custodial parent's other relationships).
Children should share in the standard of living of both parents. Child support may therefore appropriately improve the standard of living of the custodial household to improve the lives of the children. Children are entitled to share in non-custodial parent's "elevated standard of living" despite custodial parent's substantially lower income. Awarding supported children a percentage of a non-custodial parent's future bonuses ensures they will share in his standard of living.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">from lawforkids.org:
Family
Question 74: Is it legal for a parent receiving child support to spend it all on bills and not set up any kind of account for the child?
Answer: Child support is an award to a custodial parent, not to a child. It is designed to allow the custodial parent to maintain the child in the home. Given that, the custodial parent may use support money in any way. That includes the ability to use the support money to pay household bills. The money can be used for rent payments, for example, as that provides the child a place to live. The money can be used for groceries, medical bills, and any other expenses incurred by the custodial parent, even expenses not necessarily related to support of the child. No account need be set up for the child, as the money does not belong to the child.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">And finally, a child support calculator (formula varies from state)

And I had hoped for some clarification here.

I think I'll always have a problem with X paying anything. His toys were far more important than the children's necessities. Thank God I have a good job and can support us sufficiently.

XPB, do what your heart tells you in this case.
Try to negotiate outside of court. Show your children you can communicate and compromise with their father - that will be worth the aggravation.

notice that all the examples are stand alone current expenses. . . whereas a mortgage is not. . .

here is where your values come into play. . . and somewhat your personality:

given a finite resource of $$, how would you allocate the resource in %% between:

1) your lifestyle, and lets represent that with the size of your mortgage bill

2) the future potential of your child, and lets represent that with the size of your education bill.

how would you allocate it in percent of your fixed $$ resources. . .

wiftty

I was able to avoid going to court tommorrow and have avoided having to pay my x child support.

My lawyer called today and asked me what I wanted to do, that if I went to court I could very well lose and have to pay x child support.

So I looked at what I was paying for the kids health/dental insurance and compared it to what I was receiving in child support($400/month total).

Giving her the benefit of the doubt she does have them 50% of the time and she has been willing to pay extra I offered to take half the support and she agreed.

My lawyer said he would write it up and get it approved by the court.

I still plan on not counting on her for anything, and that way avoid the disappointment, but she seems to be coming out of the fog. Its only been 4 years!