Hi MB-ers,

I just wanted to share with the group that I'm feeling somewhat sad today, because I found out yesterday that my exH is up to his old tricks again. It was my son's birthday and we all went over to have steak in his honor, and after the meal, my exH wanted my son to watch Howard Stern's Show (which is basically just exploiting women for ratings AND his way of making it as if his SA is okay). Then I started to notice around the ex's house things like posters of women with big boobs, and his web cam set up, and stuff that was marked "private" on top of his desk, and well, you all know...things that aren't obtrusive but that you notice when they are back in their SA illness. I don't know why he tries to "hide" things or mark them "private" because it's not like anyone lives with him anymore, and he is completely free to do whatever--we are divorced after all, so he doesn't need to hide it anymore.

Anyway, I'm sorta sad, because my exH refuses to admit he has a problem...or that the way he views women as sex objects is inappropriate...or seek any help or recovery. In his own words, "Those sex-addicts are sick! I'm not that bad! I don't need any help!"

On the other hand, I am very grateful that he is my EX, and that I no longer need to be involved in or wrapped up in the lies and drama of that kind of existence. I'm happy to say that I now have the freedom to keep working on me and my side of the road, and I'm pleased with the progress I've made and proud of myself for not mentioning what I saw or getting into things I can not control. It's just...well, I'm sad because of course at one point I loved my ex and wished that he wanted to get well. It's sad to see that same old denial and those same old secrets and stuff--you know.

That's it.


CJ

<small>[ January 31, 2004, 04:55 PM: Message edited by: FaithfulWife ]</small>

Hi CJ,

I can understand your sorrow.It is hard to watch loved ones,past and present,continue on a destructive path even though we see things so clearly as they do not.

I watched my mom go throguh a period of alcoholism in my teens and it was very hard to see her like that.I knew what she was doing was wrong but I felt powerless to help her.No matter how much I tried to help her,she just had to hit bottom herself to ultimately get into any kind of recovery.But I was there for her when she was ready.The statements such as "I don't need any help" or "I'm not sick", "I'm not that bad" sound SO familiar when my mom was deep into her alcoholism.Just like Dr.Harley says,it's an addiction that these WS go through.

It's similar to watching my WH now.He doesn't get any help and he continues to hurt his family,especially me,the woman he used to love so much and cared for.I don't know that he'll ever know the depths of pain and suffering he has caused.My children are mercifully unaware of just how bad things are because I made a choice not to tell them that it is adultery that their father and mother are dealing with.That is too much for them to know right now.I also don't know if WH will ever be able to break free from the clutches of the homewrecker.He is so brainwashed.

So,I too carry this sadness around with me knowing that WH is making poor choices for himself and family, still.It is a total bummer man. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Anyway,just wanted to commiserate with you.Misery loves company right? Ugh.

O

P.S. I hope you are able to instill in your son some proper ideals of how to treat women respectfully since he may not get that from your xH's inappropriate behavior.

(((CJ)))


It is sad to watch them and see that they won't help themselves. I, too, hope you are teaching your son better lessons than he is learning from his dad. I'm certain you are.

Tell us, were you and your daughter invited to watch television too? If not, you might want to have a discussion with son about why does he think you weren't invited and if the programming was appropriate for a mixed audience and if he feels it isn't does he think it was appropriate for anyone. (DId you follow that convoluted sentence?) Not to mention the rudeness factor of inviting only a portion of your dinner guests to participate in an activity while excluding the rest.

<small>[ January 31, 2004, 10:05 PM: Message edited by: cinderella ]</small>

Dear CJ,

Yes, it's a sad realization when you see the same old habits and addictions creeping back in. Kind of a reminder of why they were so unhealthy for us (and to themselves).

I hope it's okay, but I really dropped in to MB to write a note to you... to tell you that you have mail.

I wasn't expecting that you'd have started your own thread, and I'm sad that you are hurting right now. Remember though that YOU have done SO MUCH work for YOURSELF and are healing and growing every day - in SPITE of your ex's antics.

(((((CJ)))))

<small>[ January 31, 2004, 10:25 PM: Message edited by: new_beginning ]</small>

Hi CJ,

I noticed that you have attended SA meetings for codependency issues. I think that may be good for me too. Do you recommend this? Please read my posts under Pariskev2003 tell me if you see any similarities.

Thanks

I hope today was a better day for you.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Octobergirl:
<strong> Hi CJ,

I can understand your sorrow.It is hard to watch loved ones,past and present,continue on a destructive path even though we see things so clearly as they do not.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yep, Octobergirl, you hit it right on the head. It is hard to watch him go down a destructive path, because I can see it and he just WON'T!! Right now, he is starting up on his sexual acting out again, and he is in the middle of some kind of bipolar moment--hypermanic maybe?? All I know is, he is UNBEARABLE right now, and he's beginnning to yell at my son rather than deal with his own issues. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>P.S. I hope you are able to instill in your son some proper ideals of how to treat women respectfully since he may not get that from your xH's inappropriate behavior. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Oh, my son MOST DEFINATELY is not getting lessons from my ex about how to treat women respectfully, personally or sexually!! However, luckily my son and I have a good relationship and ever since that night we've been talking about it. At first my son was doing the snickering, locker-room style "All Guys Do It Mom" thing, but over a couple of days, I've gotten him to really think about it and think about his attitude--especially toward a "hot" woman. Until we talked about it, I don't think he realized that his attitude toward a "hot" woman was pretty much that she was a piece of meat...now I think he is starting to see that.

My son, naturally, has a HUGE defense mechanism when it comes to his dad, so if I say anything that might tend to indicate that what his dad is doing is wrong, I have to walk quite a tightrope--somehow I have to communicate that treating women that way is in fact wrong, and yet not make it too "condemning" of his father. I let him draw that conclusion on his own. But I think when he starts to put two and two together, my son tends to not want believe his dad is treating someone so poorly--you know?

Shoot, I guess I'm kind of the same way, aren't I? Sometimes, reality hurts--but at least it's reality and not denial.

Thanks for your reply, Octobergirl. Oh, and BTW, it seems to me that they never do see the emotional damage that they've done. My exH never did believe it when I told him that the kids cried and asked "Why did daddy move away? Doesn't he love us anymore?" He thought I made it up to guilt him! OY! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />


CJ

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by cinderella:
<strong> Tell us, were you and your daughter invited to watch television too? If not, you might want to have a discussion with son about why does he think you weren't invited and if the programming was appropriate for a mixed audience and if he feels it isn't does he think it was appropriate for anyone. ... Not to mention the rudeness factor of inviting only a portion of your dinner guests to participate in an activity while excluding the rest. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Well, Your Royal Highness, my daughter and I were not "excluded" per se, but when we both expressed that this was disgusting and we didn't appreciate it, we were both summarily dismissed and told to shut up.

HRMPH!!

I would say that for my exH, this is very consistent, actually. Since women are nothing more than pieces of meat to be used to make him look better, if the meat were to object to being viewed as meat, it would be thrown away! There's nothing wrong with HIM--it's the meat's problem! Heehee (devil horns protruding).

Yep, actually this is exactly how I got the discussion started..."Why do you think D and I felt disturbed by this show? You know I'm not a prude, so what was it that was concerning?"

What can I say? It's just very, very consistent with the past pattern--exH is into deviant stuff, and rather than face his behavior, he'll bring others into it so that he feels "it's okay" so he can feel good about himself. It's SAD, I tell ya, Princess!! It's just so...pathetic, I guess.

Sigh.


CJ

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by new_beginning:
<strong> Yes, it's a sad realization when you see the same old habits and addictions creeping back in. Kind of a reminder of why they were so unhealthy for us (and to themselves).</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yes ma'am!! It really is hard to see someone you once cared for just continue in their same old self-destructive ways. I wish it WAS only himself that he was destructive to, but he'll never see it. The one sort of good thing I take out of this is that this is God's way of reminding me why I'm not involved in that marriage anymore. In many ways, I am safe now and don't have to be harmed by the behavior. It's like a reminder to say, "See why I got you out of there?? It's not stopping."

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>I hope it's okay, but I really dropped in to MB to write a note to you... to tell you that you have mail. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Well what do you know...I stopped by the post office today and GOT my mail! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>I wasn't expecting that you'd have started your own thread, and I'm sad that you are hurting right now. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Just so you know, my lovely one, this is not really hurting. It's more like a general, underlying sadness. I think part of me had hoped that by divorcing me, he would have time to work on himself and get well--but it would appear that he is not making that choice. In fact, I have heard through the grapevine that he is no longer going to any kind of therapy or group or recovery or anything. SAD!!

In a really strange way, though, I'm also a little bit happy to be away from it and be OUTTA THERE!! He may be making bad choices, but it no longer traumatizes and terrorizes me, and he no longer can throw me onto his rollercoaster of madness and blame me. I think the most he does anymore is make me feel so sorry for him. It must be hard!! Well...it would be hard for me to be that way, anyway. Maybe it's easy for him.


CJ

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by pariskev2003:
<strong> Hi CJ,

I noticed that you have attended SA meetings for codependency issues. I think that may be good for me too. Do you recommend this? Please read my posts under Pariskev2003 tell me if you see any similarities.

Thanks </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Okay, I'll take a peek, but in general, YES!! I highly recommend it!!

I'd like to be perfectly clear on something though...I attend online and face-to-face S-Anon meetings, not SA. My exH was a sexual addict and had 13 affairs that I caught him at--probably many more. They ranged from full-blown physical affairs to cybersex to email sex-pals with very little "emotional" attachment, so I wouldn't call them emotional affairs.

Keeping things on my side of the street, though, I stayed with a partner who treated me like that! OUCH! I thought if I "caught" him I could get him to stop. I thought if I was pretty enough or if I did what he wanted sexually of if I "forgave" him that I would be able to MAKE him love me enough to stop. I think this is where I got the most help from S-Anon...to see my own contributions and to see that if he was ever going to recover, it had to come from within him and his heart. Until then, I had to recover my own self and stop enabling and stop allowing myself to live like that.

So, yep, I recommend any "_-Anon" group for codependency.


CJ