Hi Still~

I just want to tell you, I think you are the most sincere person. You are so kind to me. I wish I knew you in person. I think you would be a great friend.
I appreciate your kind words!

I agree, this friend that I mentioned, I don't want to be like her. She is a good friend, but too friendly with the men. I'll never forget the first outing I had with her. We drove together,and she ended up hooking up with a guy from the bar, and left with him. I would never!
And there is a whole new spin on dancing these days. She was up on the bar! and it was suggestive! It's a whole new world for Karona!
So, no, I don't want to be like that, but I would like to be noticed for who I am.
Hopefully, the right person will think I'm great!

As for our X's. I think that lying was such a big part of their lives for so long with the affairs, that they don't even know how to be truthful. They had to become good at it. And now, it's second nature to them. Who knows.
It doesn't make it right though, no matter what.
I'm so glad that Guardian said that! I bet you loved that!!

So, how are things with your BF? Is there still talk of getting closer to one another?
It sounds like things are going great, and I'm happy for you.

This is a long shot, but let me ask. You don't happen to know any Jane's do you?
I have a friend that lives up there, and always wondered how she was. Like I said, long shot!

Take care, have a good day.
K.

Good morning Karona-

I too wish I could meet you and a couple others that I have met here. You have become great friends to me and represent a support system that no other can match because you all to some extent live what I live.

I know what you mean about the dancing stuff. I don't like to dance anyway. I am far to inhibited, but the stuff I see these days is way too much.

I also know what you mean about the lying. It is scarey when you see someone so totally consumed with lies that they don't even recognize the truth. I do believe that the Guardian saw through my husband the other day, it would have been incredibly hard not to. He reminded me of a guilty suspect in a t.v. cop show during interogation. He was lock lipped in denial, but his body language was all over the place - GUILTY!!!!!!!!!

What ticks me off is that he knows what a lying scum bag he can be and then he acts like nothing happens or worse comes to me all timid worrying that I am going to start fighting him on his own turf. Last night when he picked up the kids things were pretty quiet. I informed them of some trivial things that they needed to know and then turned my attention directly to him and said that there were some things the two of us needed to discuss as our oldest is entering middle school and there will be some changes because of it. He was like okay, when?, but she glared daggers. Then he told them all to go to the car and I knew something was coming. He has a hunting trip planned with our son this fall. He asked me in light of the things that were happening if I was still going to let him go. I told him that of course I was still going to let him go because I am a woman of my word and his present actions and lies aren't going to change me. He just stood there. He is so spineless, I have to keep the faith that his day is coming, but it is not for me to judge or determine when that day is. I tell you I could strangle him though. Maybe I can get him to volunteer to take some truth serum or something!

I have been tossing around alternative schedules, but it is so hard with his shift work. I can't wait to see what he will propose, I'm sure it will be nuts. He couldn't care less about consistency or stability for the kids as long as he gets enough days- UGH!

Are your girls ready for school tomorrow? Mine are starting to get that dreaded end of the summer feeling. I feel sorry for them as my summer ends three days before theirs' so they kind of miss the last three days being shuffled around to Grandma's and the sitter's. I myself am far from ready. I am a procrastinator by nature and keep finding excuses to put off getting my room ready. I've been out their multiple times, but I'm not nearly as ready as I want to be.

Well, the kids slept in, but are waking up so I better go. I will talk to you later.

Have a great day!

Take care and God bless!
K

Hi Karona-

I hadn't heard back from you, but just thought I'd check in to see how you are surviving your first day with the girls back in school.

I had a nice evening with my oldest daughter last night. Just the two of us and we had some interesting conversations.

I have to run now, so I will elaborate later. I just wanted to touch base with you.

Take care and God bless!
K

Your so kind Still for thinking of us!

We did the open house thing yesterday. My day was pretty much taken up running around.

Got the girls off today, they were both happy, and pretty!

My older one is in middle school, last year. She really struggles with the friend thing.
It pains me, as I know all to well the whole girl thing in those years.
It's all about being popular, and if your not the ideal, life is so hard.
She doesn't have one best friend, someone that she can count on. I never had that either, and remember the loneliness of that. I survived, and I know she will too, but it sucks living it.

In your other post, I was thinking you and I are so much alike it's spooky!
I'm not much of a dancer. I would like to be, but my body simply doesn't relax and cut loose.
Sounds like we were cut out the same, interesting!
I knew I liked you!

I read your other thread, thought about chiming in to Numb. I agree, there are dads out there that deserve to be dads. BUT, there are at least 2 others that have not shown a lot of responsibility. I think yours gets the bigger prize then mine on that one.

Now that school is resuming, mine, (who by the way set up the mid week schedule)is trying to slide out of the overnight stay. He has for the last two school years.
I told him, I thought we should stick to the original arrangement that was agreed to, and that he asked for. If it seems to not be working, we can rethink it.
I did also mention (per your suggestion)how he and the girls need their time together. I do believe that too, but it would be easy to say fine, they can stay with me.
He's a gem! but not the rarest!!

Thanks for checking in, I will talk to you soon.
K.

An afterthought~~

Wouldn't it be a blast, if a few of us ever did get to meet one another.
It would be great to meet, but not tell who we are.
You can only imagine how fun it would be, to figure out who each was.

I'm almost getting the visual! It would be fun!!

K.

Some people on line have met. And it's great to keep in touch off the site.

I emailed the harley's to ask if they'd consider holding an MB party during their seminars so the website friends could meet. I didn't hear anything back. I know quite a few of us live within 2 hours of the next seminar site.

Hope you all are doing well.

And Hello to you Newly--

I wasn't trying to be rude. I never saw your post on here.
You have good advice for Still, and you seem to have it together!

Yes, I do find myself checking the guy thing.
I do the finger check mainly.
I do try to make it a point to make some eye contact, as I have said, I'm not good with the men thing.
I never appreciated women in what seemed to be too friendly with my X, so I made it a point not to engage in conversation with men.
I never wanted anyone to feel I was eyeing their man!

Ashamed to say, but I don't know. Where is the next Harley meeting at?
I have not heard of people on here meeting.
There do seem to be some great people on here.

I enjoy talking with you guys.

Thank you for your conversation!
K~

Sometimes people post a gettogether. Greengables and I met some people back in November, and tried again this May, but we were the only ones to show up.
That's Ok. It's nice to meet someone from the site. GG and I have DD's near the same ages so it's good to talk to someone who knows the MB concepts.

Life is good and it is our own. We will continue to experience frustrations with the X's as they will never be what we wanted them to be (or what they pretended to be for a short time).
I try to use the MB principles to help me in my everyday life - avoiding disrespectful judgements, etc.
And someday, I hope to be able to use them to develop the relationship I know is possible, when I meet that someone special.
Good luck to you.

Hi you two-

newly, I am sorry too as I missed your first entry. Keep in mind that I am a blonde, natural at that although it has gotten progressively darker over time, oops is that a clue to what I look like should we ever all get to meet? I personally would love to meet you two and quite a few others, but I feel like I am up here in WI so far removed from everybody. I think everyone is from the east.

The whole relationship thing is a scarey thing. How do we learn to trust again when our first choices in husbands turned out so badly? I have grown to trust immensely over the course of the last two years with my BF, but there are still things I am working on. Thank God for me, that I didn't fall into the pattern of finding someone just like my XH.

The other day sitting with the Guardian he brought up some things the XH did and how my XH needs to accept them and apologize. Of course my XH denied them at first and then over the course of a few minutes with the Guardian interjecting things changed from denial to stating that he has no recollection of the events, but that they may have happened since he spent our entire marriage in a drunken blur. Whatever, for the record, he is an alcoholic, but he has never been the constantly drunk and blacked out person that he would now like to blame all the sins of his past on. Anyway, although I am rational enough to know never to expect an admission of wrong doing or an apology, the hurt side of me still longs for that. I do know that it is not healthy to expect anything from him so I usually don't, but going through this brings up old wounds and I guess the scars are as healed over as I thought.

However, on the other hand, life without my XH is so awesome. I really love most of my situation. I have great kids, a super job, and fabulous friends and family. To top that I do have a wonderful BF, but as you know we have the distance thing. Who knows, although I hate the distance I sometimes think it allows me the best of everything. I have someone to love, I have my kids, and I have my own time. Overall life is good!

Last night when I when I did the girls' night with my oldest she started talking about her stepmother. She said she feels like sometimes her stepmom really doesn't like the fact that her dad has them. She said she's very controlling and that the stepmom's parents have told her a lot this summer that she needs to lighten up and take it easier on the kids. I asked my daughter what her dad does when her stepmom gets upset at them, says stuff, or whatever, and she said he usually does nothing and acts like nothing has happened. Funny, but this summer we have had 70/30 custody, if they're getting to her now how can she handle 50/50? How do I get my XH to intervene? Furthermore, how do I present these concerns to the Guardian? Granted I know my daughter is probably playing on my sympathy to a point, but I don't think her concerns are totally unfounded. I explained to my daughter that raising kids is a tricky job. I told her that there are many times I get upset with things they do or things that happen, but I will always love them because I am their mom. I also told her that I have had the advantage of watching them grow and ease into things, where their stepmom has been more or less thrown into it
because she married their dad. I told her that she can't compare us because we are different people, but she needs to respect both of us. I told her to give her stepmom some more time and she said she would.

The whole time I felt like a hypocrite because the fact of the matter is that the OW lived with their dad for a year before she married him. If she had her doubts she should have done something about it. If anything she seems to be getting worse as time goes on, not better. How do I deal with this?


Karona-

I'm glad the school send off went well. My kids start a week from today. So now you've got some extra time on your hands, what do you plan to do with it?

Talk to you both soon.

Take care and God bless!

K

PS- Maybe we need to try to organize another MB get together.

I'm also thinking of setting up an e-mail to talk aside from here. My current one uses my name so I don't want to post it here.

Hi again Still and Newly~~

Well Still, you gave yourself away! Now if/when we all ever meet, we will know exactly who you are! LOL!!

Hey Still, very interesting chat with your D.
I'm sure, there is truth in what was told.
I know my oldest feels like OW doesn't care for either of my girls.
Face it, it breaks down their world. (Meaning X and OW) they have to share them, and they were used to having them all to themselves, in their sick secret world!
I'm sure it's hard to share the wonderful men they have won, and what prizes they have been awarded!!!

I too have thought about setting up an account to use. I know Yahoo is free, I may try that. I do have IM capabilities there, but not sure how the email part works. I will need to check into that.

School went pretty well today. My 4th grader is all disturbed. Seems like there are too many rules to follow. She hates it!!
In reality, she worries about messing up. It kills her to get in trouble.

I don't think I ever responded to The Wedding.
Wasn't it wonderful? Can you even imagine a man, your man, doing something that incredible for you!
Ahhhh, Romance!
It was a great book, loved it!
I'm still reading Message In A Bottle. I saw the movie, so I'm really dragging my feet reading the book.

Talk to you soon.
K

Hi Karona-

That's the part that I don't get. My XH and the OW lived together for a year before they got married. If she didn't like it then she should have bailed out. Nothing has changed in the year she has been there. She reminds me of a woman whom I used to work with. She had met her husband while he was going through a divorce. When I knew her she was the most bitter and unhappy person. She was constantly complaining about her H's XW, the demands of parenting his kids, both his and the government's lack of respect for her input in the kids' lives, etc. I was going through my divorce at the time and one day after hearing enough I looked at her and told her she was my worst nightmare. I told her I hoped that if my STBXH ever remarried that his new wife wouldn't feel the way she did. I then reminded her that she knew what she had gotten herself into and asked why she had married him. Her response was that she thought things would be different once they were actually married. Maybe I am off base, but my XH's new wife is so young and insecure I can see her being the same way and it really bothers me.

Rules at school stink. I forgot your daughter was in 4th grade. So is my son and his teacher this year is really strict and gives out tons of work so he is a bit nervous. I on the other hand am pretty laid back. I have high expectations, but I believe in getting the kids responsible for themselves.

The Wedding was great. I too am a romantic. I guess the only thing I would change was that if it was my husband I would hope he would realize the problem and set out to fix it before our 30th anniversary!

My XH handed me his proposal for time with the kids. As expected it is 50/50 and ignores specific directions of the Guardian. I was hoping to have to do less work to meet in the middle, but I am sending back an equally unequitable counter proposal tomorrow. I am willing to give more, but I am not offering it right away as I know he will push for as much as he can get. Hopefully we will be able to meet somewhere in the middle.

Have a good night!

Take care and God bless!
K

SR, remember, the GAL will be looking for flexibility and coparenting skills. Each time X disregards GAL's comments/directions, it factors into the end result. So consider your counter offer in that vein.

And remember the OW/W still has rose colored glasses on, and also believes they are united against the evil X - you. Let them live in their delusion.

I used to get to WI once a year for business, and typically get to Chicago too. Both are close to you. There are some MB oldtimers in Chicago. Someday I'll meet more of the people on the boards. And I'll certainly need the advice if and when X remarries. (I pity the poor woman who marries him though).

Hi newly-

I want to clarify that when I say unequitable I am speaking in terms of my XH's opinion. My counter offer sticks to the Guardians guidelines and allows more time. It isn't all that I am willing to give, but I know my XH will reject whatever I give him so I feel like I have to offer him less than I am actually willing to give. Does that make sense or should I approach it another way?

My XH's offer simply ignores what he was told to do. He was told that 50/50 was out of the question and that he needed to work specifically with the shift where he would actually be home with them. At this he told the Guardian that he had to shifts to work with, but the Guardian said he only had one. When my XH was told this he then said he wanted the kids that whole week then to be fair and the Guardian said it would be too disruptive. So now he has offered me a proposal for 13 days a month, this is more than I'll budge for starters, but more specifically he asks for time during his week in which he works overnights. On this shift he generally lays down to take a nap before work by 7:00. He then goes to work at 10:30 and gets home around 7:15 in the morning. This means that he would be sleeping while they were there, gone when they were sleeping, and returning home just in time for them to leave for school. He has already been told this won't work.

He also has requested the kids for three nights in a row on both his day and overnight shift. I feel this is way to much as they aren't used to it at all. It would mean that during those weeks I wouldn't have the kids from Tuesday morning until Friday after school. To make matters worse the two middle kids go to school where I teach so they would see little bits of me, I feel like it's torture. He has also requested to add a night which is our church night which he has no intention of bringing the kids to so that is out too.

I amnot trying to be vindictive, but his work schedule makes this very difficult. Because of it our original mediator opted for increased summer visitation so it would be less disruptive to the kids during the school year. Seeing his schedule proposal on paper I definately see where she was coming from. How do I come up with something that is fair when he is only available for overnights one out of every three weeks and I don't think loading that week with overnights is in the kids' best interests?

Another concern I have is that I am worried that they won't keep up with the kids' present activities. I need to get that in writing as well. An example of this is this coming week our oldest has middle school orientation. It is during her dad's time, but I am going as there are new rules, etc, and I want to know them. Her father is going as well and I am glad for that. Here's the problem, his new wife says she needs to go to so they will have to find a sitter for the other three. When I mentioned that our son has soccer practice at the same time they said he'll just have to skip it. That's not right. They already had him miss one this week as they were going to dinner at a friend's house. He can't keep skipping because they can't handle juggling routines. This also lends itself to the new wifes insecurity. She simply won't let my XH near me alone. I'd bet a million dollars that if I said I wasn't going she wouldn't either. In my book she needs to let my XH take the daughter and since she is so out to prove herself stepmom of the year she needs to get our son to practice and take care of the other two kids to boot. If the kids were with me that night I'd have it covered.

You are right though about the rose colored glasses. They are very thick by the way. They portray me as the evil, vindictive Betrayed XW who hasn't moved on and is out to get them. It's like it keeps their whole fantasy alive. Part of me would love to give them their every whim just to smack them in the face with reality, but my kids are too important to use as pawns.

Chicago is only a little over a half hour away from my BF's house so I can get there easily. I'd love to meet.

I'll wait for your reply because I need some help.

Take care and God bless!

K

The shift work really does through a wrench into things. I'll check my books over the weekend. Mom'House/Dad's house usually has great ideas on this stuff. I know the extra time in summer is a good solution, just hard on mom's and kids.

And about activities, I don't think you can force them to do anything. My X won't take them anywhere on "his" time, so sports and stuff is out. Last year, I found a ballet studio who would let us attend every other week (and pay half price). Not so easy to find.

A friend recently summed up the fact that she needed to get to know the New wife on a friendly basis because this is the person with whom she'd coparent - not the X. It sounds similar in your case.

Hang in there. Keep showing the GAL that you are open to effective coparenting, that you are flexible and willing to work with X in the best interest of your children. I agree that time with SM is not the same as time with dad.

Hi again newly-

I'd really appreciate you checking that book. I haven't been able to find it at the library or bookstores in town (small town you know) and have never really needed it.

I have gone over the schedules he gave me time and time again. I have come up with a counter offer that gives him 30 to 35 percent depending on the month due to his shift work. It also factors in some time on his overnight shift as I don't know how else to accomodate him on a schedule that won't totally disrupt the kids schedules.

As for the kids' activities, she seems to be the one balking on those, not him. The problem is that he doesn't get his license back until next summer. Seeing we live only about seven minutes apart I have always offered to take the kids if they can't. So far this has resulted most of the time in them making things work. I guess I will work this one to him specifically as he seems to see the importance more than she. The ages of the kids have to be factored in as well. We have a 12 and 91/2 year old. Where it might be acceptable to withold things from the younger kids, the older two are entering the ages where they are naturally involved, it's part of being a parent.

As for getting along with her, I really try and I have always said that because of my XH's lack of paternal instincts and incapability to remember anything I am almost forced to deal with her. However, I draw the line at him letting her make the decisions.

I know I sound angry and vengeful at times, but that is not who I really am, I just get tired of getting screwed. I genuinely want us to find some common ground here. I just don't know that it is possible with him.

Thanks again for the advice. I really appreciate it.

Take care and God bless!

K

Oh Still,
Everytime I think there is light for you, it gets crazier!
I reeeelly don't think I like your X too much. What is he thinking? Why in the world would he even suggest time, when he is not even there, or awake?
If he is still trying to say, it's not about the money, he needs to step back and look at what he is proposing. The man is a fool! Plain and simple.
What gains are there for the kids to be with OW/W?

And she is ridiculous too! She can't take your child to practice, because she has to be with Honey at your others childs open house. That is obsurd! You are so right, if she really wants the prize, she should be busting A-- to take these kids wherever they need to go.

I'm sorry to say it, but I just don't see this lightening up for you anytime soon.
In my mind I'm thinking, so, they get the more time that they want. Then, it becomes a burden, because they kids interfere with their social life, soooo, it's time to disrupt again. I don't think so.

As far as becoming friends with OW/W, no offense Newly, but for me, I just don't know that I could.
I give your friend credit, but I don't think I could.

I hope Newly can shed some light for you here.
I'm sure you must be getting so tired of this whole deal.

Keep Smiling!
K.

Hi Karona-

This whole thing is nuts. I feel like my hands are tied. My XH seems to be blatantly proving that he couldn't care less what the best interests of the kids are. I guess I just have to keep the high ground and pray that the Guardian will see through the bull$%*@!!!!

I can honestly tell you that I can never see myself being friends with the OW. I have tried my best to be civil, but that is very hard with her insecurity and blatant agenda pushing.

As far as the activities go, they rarely do anything so it's not like the kids activities are infringing on anything, although that would change with increased time. Who knows, maybe a dose of reality is what they need.

On another note, I never responded to the fact that your XH is trying to get out of the school week visits. We really are at opposite extremes, although I hate to say it, but I was there once upon a time too. Maybe it's the fact that your XH's OW has a child and my XH's wife doesn't, who knows, I do know however that it is the wife pushing this agenda, but not wanting to do everything that is needed for the kids.
I would love to have my XH drop the week day visits, I am jealous, but of course I realize that your daughters are the ones that are being hurt and feeling second best.

I look forward to hearing newly's recommendations. I really don't know what I would do without you guys to sound off to.

Take care and God bless!
K

I'll look this up over the weekend. I have a few books to check.

I didn't mean friends with the NW, just civil. Yikes - what a thought.

Do you ever watch Reba's show? It's hilarious. New wife/ow tries really hard to be friends with Reba and even moved across the street. And one the the children on the show has the same name as mine.

Thanks for the help newly.

I hear what you're saying about being civil. Actually I read a magazine article this spring about a first wife who became friends with the OW second wife. I don't know, it seems a very far stretch for me, yet on the other hand a lot of people can't believe how well I treat the OWwife either so I guess it's just an individual comfort thing.

I've never watched Reba, but may have to check it out.

Take care and God bless!
K

Hi Still~~

Yes, it does appear that we are at opposite ends of our X's demands.
It's his weekend. It is in writing, that he is to pick the girls up at school on his days. Which by the way, would be 2X per week.
He emailed me, telling me the girls can walk home since I live close to both schools, (my oldest being 1/2 mi away, and younger 1 block) and he will get off at 3 pm because that would suit his work schedule better.
BUT, on days that they will be spending the night, which would be 1 for sure, sometimes 2X per week, he says he will pick them up at 4 pm.
So, it's his weekend, he just now picked them up at 4:45!
I asked him what his plan is for bad weather days? He said, if I would not be available to get them, make sure I tell him and he will get them.
I have kept copies of these emails. I hope I never have to use them.
Oh, for him and her, our girls are convenience kids.
If they have her D, then they want my youngest for sure, because she will entertain her.
Days that he has our kids, but hers is gone, he tries to change the days because hers won't be there.
It's all about the two of them, and not wanting to do much with the kids.
He's pitiful!

I'm proud of you that you even speak to this person that we call his W.
I have not yet spoke to my X's - W. I some strange way, I feel like to speak to her means validating their relationship, and it still makes me sick.
Not to say that I'm not over him, and I'm by far pining away for him. I just am not ready for either of them to think everything has turned out great, and everyone is happy!
On the other side, Her X and his live in GF and my X are all very close. They go to events together, sit together, carry on. One big happy family! Huh, hate to stereo type, but is that WV at its finest??? We were not from here originally, but they all are. And her, not kidding, straight from the trailer park!
Anyway, I guess I still have issues when it comes to them. I really am doing better though. LOL.

Well, for me, I have myself all set. I got Cosmo today, and a beverage! Big weekend!!
I'm getting so tired of this though.
It would be so nice to go out to dinner with someone, and have a good conversation. A little spark would be even better!!

Newly, I hope you took what I said the right way. I wasn't being sarcastic to you, I don't think you took it that way.

Enjoy your last weekend off!
Talk to you soon.
K~