STBX and I were supposed to have a mediator appointment tonight.

She called me this morning and said that she doesn't want to keep waisting money on this mediator without it going anywhere.

She asked me if I was willing to just come to a $$ agreement so we can get past the money issue and each of us would have to do what ever it took for that amount to work for us.

Well it turns out, her idea of an agreement was totally unrealistic if I'm supposed to survive. The mediator even told me over the phone that there was no way I could live on what she would be leaving me. Imagine that my WS leaving me too little of my pay for me to live on.


Appointment got cancelled. STBX is upset because I DIDN'T AGREE WITH HER!!!!

To top it off, she totaly distorted what the mediator told her about my conversation with her. I mentioned a few things to the mediator that I was looking into to try to increase my take home pay.

STBX tells me that the mediator cancelled our appointment because I wasn't willing to come to an agreement untill I consulted with someone about my pay.

Where the he11 did that come from. I have been trying to get this whole $$ mess settled for 8 Mo's and now she says that I'm not willing to come to an agreement.

What she meant to say was I am not willing to take her [censored] any more and give into what she wants.

Evertime this comes up she takes on an attitude like I'm trying to screw her over. I just don't get it.

What do I need to do to show her that life aint the way it used to be no more!!!!(I don't realy need an answer to that, I already know)

OK I feel a little better now that I got to yell a little.

And yes I was yelling! I may eaven have cracked a few keys on my keyboard. Especialy the S, T, B, and X XXXXXXXXXX.

WIWH

Good morning WIWH! Hope you had a good night. If your STBX is anything like my WxW, she is only thinking of her self and couldn't care less if you have enough $$ to live on or not. I thought you had primary custody of the kids or do I have you confused with someone else. If I'm not confused, why do you have to give her any $$? She should be paying you. Doesn't it feel good when you get to show her you aren't taking her [censored] anymore. I know it does for me. I caved to mine and let her have everything her way for years. Feels good to get my spine back and see the shock evrytime she realizes I'm not just going to roll over and die. Hang in there.

<small>[ September 24, 2004, 08:14 AM: Message edited by: deafjeff ]</small>

The mediator is intended to avoid one party pressuring the other. If you are comfortable with the mediator, keep setting appointments to try to resolve this issue. A mediator is far cheaper than two separate lawyers. Show that you are trying to move this forward as amicably as possible. If she continues to cancel appts. she will look bad.

And regarding custody, know that you can ask for additional parenting time in the summer. Even if you can't take off to be with the kids, you could see them more if you sent them to a day camp closer to your house, and better for your commute.
It's a negotiating point.

Talk later.

Jeff,

No I don't have primary custody. She is SAHM and gets Just about everything I have right now to take care of our kids in our house.

Newly, As of Jan 1 I have 3 weeks vacation. I can spend lots of time with my kids in the summer.

WIWH,

Sounds to me like she needs to get herself a JOB--
or is she disabled in some way that prevents that
from happening??

And most judges would tell her the same thing--as that is one of the realities of divorce--

How old are your kids? and how long were you married? Would she be intitled to spousal support?

Do you have a lawyer? if not, I would suggest you get one--but at the same time--you'll need to be realistic--and you can't ask that she be required to pay your legal fees knowing she's not working--(that is according to the law a form of abuse, and most judges frown on it and lawyers who try to use this tactic) but a lawyer would be able to determine, as most states have a Child support program they use, how much you would be required to pay based on your income--per the state--and that is for Child Support--not alimony
and alimony--she will have to claim as income and be required to claim it on her taxes--so it is for her benefit at this point to continue to put this off--

but most mediators have the same program--and it might be your stbx-w realizes this--and doesn't like that they will tell her she's going to have to get a job--

So if you can't get her to go to the mediator, I would seriously consider getting yourself a lawyer so that they can figure out what you'll be paying in child support and go from there---

Sorry WIWH, I don't know who I was thinking of.
I didn't have a clue there was a problem in my M until WxW came to my office and told me she had moved out. I met with my attorney the next day, he asked me how much I made and got out a chart. He ran one finger across and one up and said X#$$$ per week child support. I started paying that week, three weeks before it was ordered in the temporary order. After the Dv was final it went up $3 a week. WxW and I each had our own attorneys and fought over custody. Both my kids stated thet wanted to live with me and the judge gave them to their mother because she was a SAHM the first 4 years. Thats what you get for working your a$$ off so they can be SAHMs.
Just venting a little along with you.

Sorry WIWH,

The situation you are in is similar to mine. The court appointed a law guardian and after she interviewed both of us. She recommended that we have share physical custody without a primary designated custodial parent (I think it means that when they are with me, I'm their custodial parent and the same goes for when they are with her). STBXW can still contested it and I hope she doesn't. Anyway, back to the original thought, STBXW have a master degree in teaching and she is refusing to go back to work. My lawyer is fighting that and we have a court date on October 8th to go over all the financial stuff. I wish you luck, I know I was very happy when my lawyer told me about the law guardian recommendation.

deafjeff,

-- Both my kids stated thet wanted to live with me and the judge gave them to their mother because she was a SAHM the first 4 years.

TR--My kids told their dad they wanted to live with him too--and at the same time told me they wanted to live with me--the point being--they didn't want to choose--they wanted to live with BOTH of us--and didn't want to hurt either one of us by saying "I don't want to live you mom--I want to live with dad--or I don't want to live with you dad--I want to live with mom"

How do you think you would have felt inside to hear your kids say "Dad, I don't want to live you--I want to live with mom"?

So in order not to hurt either parent--they tell them what they know they want to hear--

Over the past year my son has asked me how I would feel if he said he wanted to live with his dad when he turns 13, my response has always been honest--that yes, it would hurt, BUT I would accept it--because I love him so much and want him to be happy--and I don't ever want him to feel or think that by his being honest with me about it, that I think it means he loves his dad more than he loves me--because I know he loves us BOTH--and that he would *prefer* to live with BOTH of us at the same time--

My son has even been telling me he'd like to go live with his dad for a summer before he turns 13
so that he could see what it would be like living with him all the time--but because his dad travels so much with his job and works so many hours--it hasn't been possible to this point--

But even the one weekend a month they are with their dad--they call me at least 4 times a day--
and it's been like that since he left in Sept. 2000--and they are only gone from Friday night to Sunday afternoon--He could get them more often than the one weekend a month--but again, because of his job--he doesn't--if he takes a weeks vacation he will get them for the week--even if it's during the school year and they have to miss a week of school--I let their teachers know before hand and get their assignments to take with them so that they don't miss any school work--

I guess the most important thing to remember here--is kids don't want to be asked "Who do you want to live with--your mom OR your dad?? Because THEY want to live with BOTH parents--not one OR the other--and when parents ask their kids that question it puts the kids in a really bad place emotionally--thinking they have to choose who they love more--mom or dad, when in reality they love both parents--and no matter who they say, it's going to hurt the other parent--and then they are left feeling guilty--that they hurt their mom or dad--

When going through my divorce and child custody hearings--I let the kids know the judge would be deciding--because their dad and I both loved them very much and want them to live with each of us--
and we know that they love both of us--and couldn't choose who they wanted to live with more
so we were leaving it up to the courts to decide--and that no matter what the courts said
we would both continue to love them--

--Thats what you get for working your a$$ off so they can be SAHMs.--

TR--I was a SAHM all but the first year of our marriage--and a majority of that time--we really couldn't afford for me to stay home financially
but it's what HE wanted--and if I even mentioned going back to work he would get angry--it didn't matter to him that bill's weren't getting paid--
why? because it didn't 'effect' him personally because he wasn't here--he was on the road--his company paid his expenses--and if he needed more money because he spent all of what they gave him to live on--he would just call me and tell me to send him his paycheck--and since it was HIS MONEY
because HE WORKED FOR IT--I had better send it to him--

Needless to say--I was the one with the problem--
by allowing him that much control over MY life--
it took me a year of counseling to get to the point where I began to take control over my own life--and no longer sent him money just because he demanded I do--and he began to suffer the consquences--of his habits and not having money--instead of me and the kids suffering--and he didn't like it--and things in our marriage got worse--again because it was HIS MONEY--and I was keeping it from him--

When my mother died--she left me an inheritance--
part of which I put into a CD, the rest of which I used to pay off some major debt--which I told him I was doing--but according to HIM that was HIS money too--and I was keeping it from HIM by putting it into a CD and paying off bills--

So whose decision was it that your wife be a SAHM? Hers, yours or a mutual decision??

In my case it was HIS choice--something he had his own issues with--as his first wife left him for someone she worked with--and he wasn't going to lose another WIFE to someone they worked with--it was so bad, that he didn't even want me going to church because he was so afraid I'd meet someone else and leave him--and when I started back to college his insecurities got even worse--
but he didn't want to be here all the time--
he wanted to do as he pleased and wanted to know I was at home with the kids--and if I wasn't home when he called--he got angry--but like I said--
that was MY ISSUE--because I put up with it--and didn't hang up when he started his verbal rages--
but after some counseling--that changed--and the marriage ended--

So ask yourself--who decided your wife would be a SAHM? And if it was more your desire that she stay home--did she understand she ultimately had a say in the matter?? Or was she living in fear of how you would react if she went to work??

I do know that for many here it was the wifes choice to stay home--but did they really believe it was ultimately their choice?? I know for me--
it wasn't my choice to stay home--heck even working part time would have helped me emotionally--

Great post Thorned Rose.

TR,

I agree, she does need to get a job. It is still a little tough for her because we do still have a 4yo at home.

Kids at 11, 9, 6, and 4.We've been M'ed 13 years so she is "entitled" to SS.

I don't expect her to pay anything for me related to leagal fees. I am doing my best to make sure that she is going to be able to get by.

Mediator has already told her that she needs to generate income if we are going to get anywhere. Figuring out the CS is not a problem. We are trying to come to an agreement on what we can both survive on. I'm not looking to get all that I can. I do want to make sure that her and the kids are ok, but I do need to be able to live. Unfortunately, anything I need to live is taking from what she needs right now also.

W has been a SAHM for over 11 years. We both agreed that it was best. We didn't want to have some one at a day care raising our children and all the income she made would probably go to daycare anyway. So this decission was a no brainer for us.

However, deciding that she wanted to be independant and didn't want to be married to me anymore, I feel is giving up her option to be a SAHM anymore.

W and I don't expect to ever go through any problems with "Who lives with who" The kids have been with her all day everyday for their entire lives. I would never take that from them. I can deal with the alternate weekends and the occasional other days of them being with me alot better than they will be able to deal with not being home with their mother.

I have never said anything to W about my pay being MY money, but she does give me the impression that anytime I need money, I am taking HER money.

James,

Although the kids will stay with W most of the time. We both understand that they are OUR kids and so far neither of us are looking for anything other than equal rights when it comes to them. Any big decissisions regarding them, we always discuss and agree on. Fortunately W is a great mother and I usually agree with what she feels is best for them.

WIWH, everyone knows you'd never say "My Money."

And why are you here? Shouldn't you be getting ready for a party????

GG
Party doesn't start till 8. What time should I pick you up <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Isn't that so like a man? Tells me to be ready for an 8:00 party, and low and behold, I'm ready and it's 8:42 and he's no where to be found.

Stood up by a Jersey dude.

Ah, woe is me. Such is the life of a 37 year old matron.

WishI WereHome,

--I agree, she does need to get a job. It is still a little tough for her because we do still have a 4yo at home.

TR--If she's wanting the divorce--that is something SHE is going to have to accept--she can no longer *expect* to be a SAHM--and if she's so concerned about having to go back to work--maybe she should consider actually working on the marriage--

Thorned Rose,
I think WIWH has been trying to tell his wife that for about 8 months now.Up until fairly recently, the wife who kicked him out of his home, got all his paycheck and then let him have whatever was left over.

So, I think WIWH's wife isn't quite on the same page as teh rest of us.

greengables,

Then in some ways that is HIS issue--if he continued to have his paycheck direct deposited into a joint account--

After he moved out--he should have immediately changed that--talked to a lawyer to see what CS would be--and then send her that--and she would have felt the consequences of her choice sooner--

I know when my ex-h moved out--I had to go back to work--sure he continued to send his paycheck to the joint account--but I also knew that should change--because for me--it wasn't about the money--it was about how he treated me--and no amount of money was worth that--

he would continually tell me he would have to stop sending his paycheck to me so that HE could live--I said that was fine--do what you think you need to do--and the more he said that it made me feel like he was trying to buy me--and buy my love--like there is a dollar amount on love--I don't think so--

The price of loving someone is not money--it is giving of yourself emotionally to another person--giving your time and your attention--
putting the person you say you love before everything and everyone else--showing by your actions and not just words that you love the person--

I mean--if you really love someone--you WANT to spend time with them--you want to do things with them--even if it's staying up all night talking and playing board games--and you don't spend time with them for money or even sex--heck you can give money and sex to some lady on a street corner--so it's all about WANTING to spend time and give yourself to the other person--not about needing too--

I've found that when we get out of the desperation mode of thinking we "need" to be in a relationship--relationships are so much easier--

Oh, I agree that in a lot of ways the money is WIWH's issue. And from what I know here and offboard, he's making progress.

And you are sooo soooooo right about relationships being easier once you know you don't need to be in one. I find relationships are simple. Of course, I'm not in one! LOL.

Along the way, I've learned many of the same lessons you did. the only difference was I worked outside the home, so my paycheck was to support the family. Money my STBX made belonged to his business.

In all fairness, he did cover the difference between my income and the standard of living we'd agreed to. But as my pay went up, his contribution went ... down.

And every month I had to ask him for money to pay the bills. I tried an experiment and for 2.5 months I didn't ask him for a dime. What did I get? Nothing.

Meanwhile inventory kept piling up, and up and up.

Oh, well. different values.

Sorry to thread jack, WIWH.

Thorned Rose,
I understand what you are saying about the kids not wanting to choose and will tell either parent what they think they want to hear. That is not the case with my children. My youngest sat in his mothers lap and told the attorney ad litem that he wants to live with me. My oldest took the stand and told the judge he wants to live with me. They both tell their mother they want to live with me. She says it is because I turned them against her. She did that herself and continues to do it today by constantly lying to them and they know she is lying. I defended her to the children when this ordeal started. I am not going to jeopardize my relationship with my children to cover for their mother any more. They are not happy with her. I don't think she really even wants them, she just wanted custody for the sake of appearances and the child support. Because of the way labor day fell, last weekend was her first weekend to have them in 4 weeks. She left them with a friend so she could go spend the weekend w/ OM. I don't ask, they tell me.
It was her decision to be a SAHM with my support. Just as I have supported whatever she wanted to do as far as her career is concerned. She wanted to go back to schoola nd get her masters. I supported that and helped her. When the job she got with her masters wasn't what she wanted and she talked about going back to teaching I supported that. Whatever she has wanted to do I have stood behind her. I think that is part of the reason she is having a hard time now. For the first time in 22 years, I'm not supporting her decisions.

TR&GG

Why don't you guys get your own thread <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> Just kidding.

When I moved out, if I had done what you say TR, My children would have felt the consequences as well. Not just STBX.

As far as I'm concerned, It's only money and if she needs it to take care of are kids, I'm gonna do my best to make sure that she has it regardless of how she contributes.

Jeff,

It's too bad that your kids have to go through not liking one of there parents. I hope my kids never find themselve in a situation like yours.

WIWH

WishI WereHome,

--When I moved out, if I had done what you say TR, My children would have felt the consequences as well. Not just STBX.

TR--yes, they would have--BUT--she would have been forced to face the consequences of her choices--and would have seen the effects of those choices on your kids--and probably would have decided it wasn't worth it--