I talked to my kids last night on the phone. I could tell something was bothering DS1, age 10, and when I asked he started crying. He said that his mother is making him take golf lessons- starting tomorrow. He is a pretty good athlete, he has made the all stars team in baseball the last 3 years. He will usually play any team sport offered. WxW met OM1 on the local golf course, his dad owned it. DS1 knows that story and he says current OM plays golf and that is why she is making him take lessons. He really does not want to play golf. All I could say to him was that I am sorry his mother is making him do that and that he has the most wonderful mother in the world. GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR...................

Poor kid. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> Once again, DJ, don't you think he feels patronized and not really listened to when you respond like that though? I mean, he knows his mother is not the best mother in the world, and he knows you know that. Therefore, he knows that basically you are lying to him.

I see what you're trying to do, but is it really necessary to add that little statement onto the end of every single conversation you have about her? If I were a kid, that would really frustrate me and confuse me.

Good morning fhl04,
Once again? Have you told me that before? He knows whats up and why. Its a game we play. Not absolutely neccesary but no frustration or confusion.

“””All I could say to him was that I am sorry his mother is making him do that and that he has the most wonderful mother in the world.”””

No Jeff, that’s what you chose to say. There were many things that you could have said that wouldn’t have been disrespectful, demeaning, or resentful. Buddy I’ve got to warn you that you are standing at the top of a slippery slope that can take you and you kids places you don’t want to go. Your son does and will love his mother and your disrespectful statements will build resentments but I’m afraid that they will build the resentments towards you instead of towards mother because by making these statements in his presence he is basically hearing “your mom is wrong and your wrong for loving her”. I know that’s not what you’re saying but buddy he’s only 10 and he hears things totally different.

What would of happened if instead of dogging out his mom over her decision, you would of encouraged him to try golf because most top athletes enjoy the game. One of the reasons he doesn’t want to take the lessons has to be the tension between mom and dad and has nothing to do with the game what so ever. I’m going through a deal right now where one of my babies is made to feel like a pawn and I know it’s hard not to play the game but it’s the right thing to do.

Uh-oh, we're not ganging up on you DJ, I swear! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Oh good. I haven't stirred anybody up in a while.
FYI Bill, I did tell him he should try it, he might like it. But I KNOW my son. he has his mind made up and it will not be changed very easily, he gets that from his mother, and he isn't going to like golf. Probably ever. The reason he doesn't want to play golf is because of the way it was presented to him. When his mother told him current OM plays golf and he is going to take lessons, he dug in his heels. I don't blame him. He is unhappy with his mother but he detests OM. I tell both my kids they have the most wonderful mother in the world because I have been instructed by my attorney to do so, not my idea and I don't particularly like it it. There are legal things going on here and I'm gonna do what my attorney says. I am also taking care of my relationship with my kids.

“””The reason he doesn't want to play golf is because of the way it was presented to him.”””

Your preaching to the choir here. Jeff, I’m a member of the “been there done that club” only mine was with a somewhat larger issue of where my girls would go to school. I quietly tried all the legal moves I could and when I couldn’t get it changed I had two choices. Either encourage/support them or gripe. My oldest daughter especially thought her world came to an end but I kept pushing her until now she likes it there. It’s not ideal but we have to deal with what we can do. Had I chose to be derogatory not only would she not have liked school but our relationship would have suffered because she would of thought that I wasn’t supporting her. It’s all about attitude and how that will reveal your altitude.

“””He is unhappy with his mother but he detests OM.”””

Why?

“””I tell both my kids they have the most wonderful mother in the world because I have been instructed by my attorney to do so, not my idea and I don't particularly like it it.”””

There a whole story there Jeff and you probably don’t want to get into that on the site but I would have a hard time doing something like this knowing that it hurts my kids and their relationship with me.

LH,
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> It’s all about attitude and how that will reveal your altitude. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">The attitude is okay. My kids know what is going on, way more than they should, but that is their mothers choice.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Why? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Because he blames OM for the break-up of our family. We have talked about that a little, for now I think its okay to blame OM more than his mother or me. When he gets older we may have to have a talk about it. It may be miss-placed blame but I'll let it slide for now.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> There a whole story there Jeff and you probably don’t want to get into that on the site but I would have a hard time doing something like this knowing that it hurts my kids and their relationship with me. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Bingo. I don't feel the need to put it here. I would have a hard time doing something knowing that it hurts my kids and my relationship with them too. Since I'm not it isn't too difficult.

Check out the title of this thread. It says vent, not please try to fix me. So thanks anyway but I think I'm doing okay on this one. His mother is making a mistake and it is frustrating that I can't fix it for him but he and I are fine.

DeafJeff!!!

Oh I feel so sad for you and your son. My former SIL dumped her husband, he dumped her. They both had revenge affairs. Kids stuck in the middle. She sought revenge by shacking up with some well bleep, bleep. The whole golf world imposed&forced on my nephews.

Long story short my nephew was young-forced to accept someone who wasn' t dad, a sport that the family was given up for. Actually, once he hit sixteen he blew a gasket--- sadly to this day he hates golf with a passion, and his mother.

Your doing a wonderful job and letting your son pick and choose his own activities is a blessing that has it's own special rewards. Parents can get away with garbage for so long until the kids hit their teens, tower over their parents, can make CHOICES. LOOK OUT!!!

Huggs!!!

sky diver,
Thank you. Its good see someone can relate and maybe understands that I'm not playing some kind of BS (not betrayed spouse) game with my WxW and son. How old was your nephew when his ordeal started and how old is he now?

DeafJeff-- I do understand because my nephew was about 14 when it started to happen- He's now 25 and let me tell you! He's never gotten over his parents divorce!!!

My nephew, he's super intelligent, blew through college with honors, got an excellent career with a telecommuncation company. QUIT-- working now a department store as a security guard. Loves it.

He has the brains to be a brillant sciencist. Got a girlfriend, bought a house last year. Broke up with his girlfriend, got rid of the house. He's still hurting! The impact of the unresolved issues about his parents divorce plays on.

Not my words but his--He HATED living with the other man, watching his mother do this to him, his brother. He equally Hated his Mom for her weakness. His dad lived down the street. Caught between too sick worlds.

She tweaked out--bubble head. Her entire focus was her new man, who was TOTALLY jerk, her job, her status at country golf club which she couldn't afford. Sunk all her money and time playing golf, still does.

Not that I have issues about country clubs and such, since many people have the means to afford that lifestyle comfortably. No problem they have every right to enjoy what makes them happy.

Fsil- let the boys fend for themselves. Deserted the boys on the weekends. Her & om didn't have much money themselves here was another huge problem.

I couldn't be around her anymore. I took a silent stand with her, supported my nephews. They lived a block from me. I refused to go over and accept the couple especially when the kids were hurting so much, going without. She was angry with me, that I wouldn't play the game with her accept the om. No, I refused to live through her facade.

She couldn't care less about any of her kids pain. Therefore no connection between us just distant cordial relations.

My nephew would come over all the time in total agony of his pain--

At around 18 he snapped a got into a huge raging fistfight with the om-mom things got very violent! It was ugly.

Om was always a drunk, hang about if you know what I mean? The fact that om father was a judge meant status to her meant high society, even though om didn't have a job-our career. She was so hungry for status, and prestige. Never figured out why she just didn't earn it her self.

My nephew isn't a wild mean tempered kid--very peace loving, bright light, friendly, kind hearted, wonderfully sweet, compassionate, communicative, down to earth laid back guy! VERY Smart he could quite clearly see through the fog and bailed. He deplored the most was the family corruption!

Then when he moved in with his dad. Dad wasn't to focused either on him or his pain. Later the two of them got into violent raging, raging blows. His dad had violent temper with him when he was a little kid.

Dad tweaked out one day-smashed his head through a wall, up and left the family for months, to find himself, got a girlfriend, to busy for his kids.

Sooo pandora box flew open wide!!!! I understood everyone has their breaking points.

Another problem, my former Bil-Sil both were wanting their kids to be these super famous golf pro's and high society kids.

Reality the kids just wanted to be loved, for themselves, accepted for themselves. Not wanting to be " toys" to appease play their insecure, immature parents status game. They wanted their parents to be REAL. Kids get so annoyed being treated like TOYS...

This I know because I have held my newphew in my arms so many times in his pain. Plus my other niece with my x sister.

She prided her self of being a single parent but paraded scores of multiple lovers in her home all the time- doin the deed in front her my neice. Mom's response to her daughter was I pay the bills, get ear plugs, shut up, put up or shove off...

Getting the phone calls Auntie... help come and get me outta here. She is now 27-- ran away from home, school, had a baby at 15-looking no-one knew about.

My niece was just looking for some love, attention didn't matter from who, from an older guy. My former sil sure hid that info got rid of the baby so no one in the family would find out about. Truth is she would have had to look at her self and lifestyle of what she was doing to her daughter.

Since then, my niece, has gone from abusive boyfriends, to another. In drama college. Wants to be an actress. Now currently shacked up with a divorced man in his late 40 ties, who is a parapeligic, has a little girl.

My nephew got to a stage-- he had nothing to do with his mother at all. They today are very distance. Yeah, he has an anger problem. Kids have an breakin point.

Thing is if parents had a normal view of thier kids, golf as just a sport to enjoy, etc. He would have loved playing the sport.

My other nephew on the other hand loved his mom in spite of it all, lived with the situation to protect his mom. He especially was an awesome athelete. He's pretty smart too, he's 24 just got married in August to a really nice girl, with really nice parents.

All that matters-a good healthy functioning family does have value kids treasure deep down in their hearts.

The country club, for my fsil, has all amounted to a hill of beans. There are consequences when parents impose their unrealistic dreams, demands on their kids.

Kids are very clever have means of getting their revenge back at their parents.

Sorry if this is a bit long but wanted to let you know how much kids so suffer. Golf topic really stired up wounds for kids I loved alot!!!

I think how the kids are handled makes a huge difference in their recovery. So no your not being embittered and nasty.

If your son doesn't want to play the game-- he shouldn't be forced. Keep on lovin him as you are, let him be who is, accept him, and if he wants to play those sports, back him all the way. If not that's OK too. He's hurting!

Many boys, especially guys in their teens love basketball, shoot in hoops, street hockey means so much more than the golf.

My son and many other his friends that come from well to do families see golf as waste of money. They see homeless kids in their schools, kids in the street, hurting families. They perfer chillin.

What they Truly love is the down to earth, simple one& one, genguine contact and fun. Especially, when it's with thier dads and any dads for that matter. So few dads really miss this powerful connection point. To form tight, tight bonds.

If the kids are gifted in their sport--they just love their parents real support. Real is the word without ulterior motives, pressures! Of course as parents we have aspirations, but kids can smell when parents are trying to make points with thier lovers and use them as ponds in their twisted triangles.

Kids have interesting ways of digging their heals in, making well life very colorful and can certainly set off fireworks!!!

Now to come to think of it-- I have met more and more of my kids friends that ended up in blows with the om/step fathers. The boys just grow up-challenge these guys.Enough.

My girlfriend called my the other night with a young man on her door step in tears, after getting into a wild fist fight with his mother the OM...Can't take the pain, hurt.

Hope this situation helps you in some way to know your head space is in the right place. It's the love, time, attention, respect, acceptance. Getting and stayin on your kids level as you are!!!

sky diver,
Thanks for the info and the words of encouragement.


New vent. I didn't want to start a whole new vent thread sso I'll just tack it on here.WxW admitted A1 for the first time while under oath in July. She said it was 11 years ago and lasted a couple of months. I received reliable info yesterday that it did indeed start 11 years ago but lasted about 5 years. She knew she was caught and had to admit it while under oath in depositions but by keeping it over 10 years ago, she was able to keep it out of the Dv hearing. We are Dved now and I know this stuff isn't supposed to matter anymore. We were together 22 years and all I have asked of WxW is the truth. She can't give me that even under oath. Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr........................

DeafJeff--

High five--your most welcome& so way ahead-all your hard work now of digging in now-will pay off big in the yrs to come!

New vent? Vent away!

Apart from the actual adultery--it's the lying, deception part that produced the most hurt for me! Waste of energy,& time!

Marriage is really a two street, not a one way street meant only to serve the ws. Adultery ave doesn't satisfy me. So if spouses want to do what they do-- they can--- but let us off the nearest exit. Or let me get out, and find my own way back.

I belive that as spouses we do have the right to the truth, entitled to the truth, deserve accurate information.

Reason I wanted the truth was to determine if I wanted to continue or end the relationship. I believe this to be my right.

I unearthed so much to get to down to the core. Glad I did.

I see my divorce as divine act of intervention. Enough of my x saying one thing and doing another. Where ever he got that idea he was so important and superior-Not.

I so understand- my timeline of marriage has been 23yrs. I think that we don't have to experince all the useless drama, expense either.

Hope you can start equalizing process, of tuning her out and toning her down.

With the truth-- I faced reality-x was never my true friend. Pretty simple-end of story!

I never want my x back again. The multiple affairs makes for much bad blood and history. I have forgiven him many times.

X confused me as his personal savior, God. I am not- Guess that where the problem all exists between him and GOD.

Hope they get it right and straight someday. Leave me out it.

Grrr--back yes, it is rough, rough, rough!

Have a wonderful day today-- Jesus loves you so much!!!!

By the way--- I so love your sig line--So true! I laugh,laugh, laugh! Speaks volumes, makes perfect sense, puts everything into right spin disc for me. I really understand!

Takes the zinger out of stinger!

Make us laugh some more---don't stop...

Couple of thoughts for the day for u--

Marriage is made in heaven, but so is thunder& lightening!!!

Love is a fire, but whether it is going to warm your heart or burn down your house, you can never tell?

Those who play the game do not see it as clearly as those who watch!

I'm prayin for you! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />