I guess most of the members/visitors on this site are those who got betrayed and are seeking help. I'm just curious from a betrayor's perspectives for their actions? Why?

Is it really worth it?

No one goes into a marraige w/ the notion of betraying his/her spouse. Does this mean a betrayed spouse has to take part of the blame for the betrayor's action?

I'll step up to the plate on this one. I am at MB because I was the BS, and am now DV. But many years ago I was a WS. It was never intended to end a marriage and was not the type of affair that my ex had where he left me for her (I had no motive--no intentions of betraying and no intentions of leaving my marriage--as stupid as it may sound, it all caught me by surprise).

It was a one-time P/A thing with a friend who had gotten too close with me. I ended it on my own--my H didn't have to plead and beg me to not leave him for the other guy because I knew I was done the moment it happened. I wasn't that far into any fog.

But I didn't know how dangerous it was to continue to talk to him on occasion, and several years after the first incident, we were both at very bad points in our lives (he lost his father, my H was drinking very heavily), and the same thing happened again. My husband never found out because I didn't have the heart to tell him and break his heart. But that WAS the big wake up for me!! And I have been very, very, VERY careful what I share with members of the opposite sex about my life now because I know from personal experience how things happen.

But the pain it caused both my husband and me is something that never completely goes away. My H would bring up years after it happened, that I was the one who started the whole ball rolling with my infidelity. It was used to justify his first affair and came up several times during his current one.

It was NOT worth it. I wish like everything I could erase that part of my past. I did something that I would have never believed I'd do, and it's a memory I'm forever stuck with (though time, or maybe God, has faded the specifics, thankfully).

Does the BS need to take some of the blame?

Mixed feelings here: The WS (me) is TOTALLY the one who screwed up. No one forced me to do it. No one held a gun to my head. I walked right into the situation.

But...I might not have been vulnerable to walk into the situation if the marriage would have been on stronger footing in the first place, and in our case a lot of the issues were with an alcoholic spouse who was frequently gone until the wee hours with his friends.

In my opinion, one of the most important things a couple can do is spend QUALITY time with each other (sleeping or just being in the same residence doesn't count). When you don't do this, you grow apart, and that's a prescription for disaster.

LL

<small>[ December 19, 2004, 09:06 PM: Message edited by: lordslady ]</small>

CA,

I am a FWW who is currently in D proceedings with my H - but only b/c he didn't want to save our M.

From my POV, the motives of the WS are typically selfish - they are thinking of themselves, and how they can get their ENs met.

And, NO - the BS DOES NOT take responsibility for the A. The WS takes 100% responsibility for that choice.

However, the BS and the WS, IMVHO, are both responsible for the condition of the M that left the M vulnerable to an A. My M was vulnerable b/c H chose not to address problems in the M which I brought up. Also b/c it was a somewhat emotionally abusive M where H treated me worse than he would treat a stranger. My part in the degradation of the M was not standing up for what I wanted, and not setting boundaries. In other words, I put up with his emotional abuse, and allowed it.

OTOH, the A was entirely my choice. And my personal weakness was that the OM met my needs, and it was 'easier' to have the A than to D my H (which at the time, was the only other option left to me). I chose the 'easier' path b/c I was so busy being a victim of his abuse and neglect - that I did not find enough inner strength to stand up for myself, and realize that I am worthy of love and respect.

Shortly before filing for the D, we were in a similar (if not worse) situation as before my A - and I was presented with the same choice again. I did not have an A - rather, D was the choice. Granted, he chose D, but only after I confronted him on his EA, and told him I would not live with him respecting, trusting, and loving another woman more than I. I could forgive him, but only if he did his portion of the work. His response was that his offense wasn't as bad as mine, and so he wanted a D ASAP. Hence, this is where we are now.

So - NO - the BS does not take responsibility for the A itself. That was the WS's choice - there is always another choice aside from the A. But the BS must take responsibility for their portion of what left the M vulnerable.

Hope this helps! Good luck! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

"From my POV, the motives of the WS are typically selfish - they are thinking of themselves, and how they can get their ENs met."

Indeed, it's a VERY selfish act. Like you, some will wake up from their mistakes and feel guilty. Nevertheless, the damange has already been done and can't ever be erased.

Here is my next question. How many do actually wake up from their mistakes and admitting them? few, some, many, all?

I wish the laws make it more difficult to get married! Couples need go go through various training/lessons before a marriage certificate can be issued.

I am a FWH and agree with both of the previous responses. Here is my story as I see it: SF is one of my top EN with recreational companionship and affection close behind. My wife's top EN are entirely different. We both were good at offering love to each other through meeting EN that matched our top needs but not the other's top needs. We also threw a lot of LBs at one another. My wife's main LB's were disrespect and raging verbal abuse. I was often discontent and complaining. It led to much frustration and resentment on both our parts. After over 13 years of fidelity in marriage, I found myself turning 40 and feeling very depressed that I might never experience passion again. I approached my wife asking her how I could be a better husband and, when she asked, letting her know that I desired more passion and companionship. Her responses were that women don't want sex as much as men and she was too busy with the kids for more companionship. I had a hard time buying those answers and got online to find out anonymously from other married women if they felt the same way. It was a very foolish move on my part. I found women who said exactly what I wanted to hear which gave me an instant connection with them and heighted my resentment toward my wife. There were many opportunities to turn back and do the right thing and I missed all of them and had an affair. I had no intention of leaving my family. When it seemed like the OW was expecting that, I backed off and the relationship gradually ended. But I was left with a load of guilt and shame and secrets which ripened preexisting dynamics inside myself into full-blown sexual addiction. Internet porn (always free) and several very brief (mostly one time) casual affairs and I found myself living a tortured double life. I stopped the physical acting out but was still very much ensnared and vulnerable. Several months later exposure of porn on my computer led to full disclosure of my activities and immense and intense pain for my wife, children, and myself. Was it worth it? NO WAY!

Should my wife take part of the blame for my actions? Nope, it was all my choosing. I WISH I had the humility to go for counseling instead. But I only saw my wife's issues and not my own and felt powerless to change her (as I am). If only I had seen my own issues and set about seeking help to change myself! At the same time, as the previous posters assert, my wife does share in the blame for our marriage being vulnerable to A's.

I found MB shortly after my D-day and I got into 12 Step recovery about the same time. MB gave me some immediate tools which contributed to our marriage surving the initial trauma. Over the last 3+ years 12 Step recovery in S-groups has done so much more than simply help me deal with my addiction. It exposed many other areas of my life where there has been much unhealthiness and it is giving me the tools and fellowship to deal with those things. Unfortunately my wife has not stayed with counseling or entered recovery. Over the last 3 years we've had some of the best and worst times in our relationship. At this point she has filed for divorce and, barring a miracle, that will probably happen sometime in 2005. That is NOT what I want though I see that there are still patterns in our marriage that need to change (and patterns in ME that need to change.) We are separated with me still in the house (sleeping in the basement) and I am working hard to try and win back my wife's love. It's looking pretty dismal at this point but it is providing me much painful incentive for growth.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">It was NOT worth it. I wish like everything I could erase that part of my past. I did something that I would have never believed I'd do, and it's a memory I'm forever stuck with (though time, or maybe God, has faded the specifics, thankfully). </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I totally relate to that.

CAConfused, I assume that you are BS. I share my sad story in hope that it might add some of the light you are seeking in your own darkness. I read here about so many hurting spouses abandoned by ws and I'm thankful that my a never led to that. But it seems that my a will cost me my marriage any way. My wife continues to be tortured by the specifics of things I told her about what I did. I hate seeing that and want her to get some relief. She thinks dv is the way to that relief. But what a cost! May you find healing for your wounds.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Here is my next question. How many do actually wake up from their mistakes and admitting them? few, some, many, all? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I don't know how many but I'm curious too. I have a new friend in S-recovery who I took to his first meeting about a month ago. He was recently exposed for infidelities in his current marriage. This is his 3rd marriage and both his second and third marriages were to OW. I share this because, although he has left a trail of devastation in his path, he is now owning up to that and seeking to change his ways and, as best he can, make right his wrongs.

Actually my guess would be that probably few actually 'wake up'. Many may admit they did wrong but it is just way too easy to blame our actions on others and see ourselves as the victims. I know this is a pessimistic view but it coincides with what seems to be prevalent in the human condition and all the more so for WS who engage in the very self-centered acts they do.

Merry Christmas-just passing by to say I hope the holidays brings some comfort though the times are so painful, and senseless!

Sharing my comfort e-cards and may you feel for a moment today. God's love for you! Hope today is a brigher day, filled with His comfort for you. Turn up your speakers and feel His concern. You are precious to HIM!

http://www.angelhugs.com/angelkisses.html

Christ Love
my love
Sky