Buttercup, you must get son back in counseling.

Also, you might need to learn the lessons about consequences. There are natural and logical consequences. If a child leaves their coat at home, they will be cold at recess. Let him suffer more of the consequences of his actions. If he won't dress in the morning. Put his clothes in the car with him. If he doesn't dress in the car, carry the clothes into day care. He can choose when he puts them on. He will have to endure the looks he will get from his peers when he shows up in his pajamas.

Have I ever done this? Yes. All the time.

There are two things I go back home for after we leave in the mornings. Shoes and my driver's license.

No coat? I'm sorry.

No lunch? I will give you lunch money.

No science project? I will get it at lunch time but I must be on time for work.

No math book? I'm sorry. YOu can put it in your backpack tonight.

Oh, and Wednesday - nearly 10 years after doofus moved out - we discuss starting family counseling. All five of us: son, daughter, doofus, his wife, and me.

Because my daughter's emotional and mental health needs escalated dramatically in recent weeks.

And right now, I think it may be the best thing that has happened to our family in years.

Same conversation summarized above, where I was being civil and taking personal responsibility for my actions/mistakes, and he was doing the exact opposite, pretty much ended with him saying his attorney had all of this "ammo" on file ready to use should I decide to take the issue of his unpaid half of the children's medical bills to court. Didn't know what the heck he was talking about (complete disconnect from what we'd been talking about) but stayed pretty much level and smiled and dismissed him.

I am wondering if that "reads" to him as if I am submissive. Like I've got a "Hello My Name is DOORMAT" label on my jacket.

Underlying and later unleashed in private emotional response was more like, "YOUR THREATS DO NOT SCARE ME YOU &^%$#@* &^%$! If you've got something, BRING IT! If not, STFU!"

I'm assuming that would be wrong to reveal. But then again, he doesn't react to 'normal' well.

I am looking for a psychologist for DS. I hate having to find him yet another new counselor in such a short time span. How long before dad undermines his relationship with the new guy? XH has no use for counseling and won't cooperate much less attend.

XP:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I am looking for a psychologist for DS. I hate having to find him yet another new counselor in such a short time span. How long before dad undermines his relationship with the new guy? XH has no use for counseling and won't cooperate much less attend.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Why?

Why don't you and son continue with this one without XH? He cannot continue to undermine the relationship if you do not allow it.

I had a similar problem with my son's father where he undermined every attempt I made to co-parent with him. As a result, son took all his disappointments and frustrations out on me. I learned I could not co-parent, I had to parent on my own.

Your XH has no interest in coparenting the children with you. The time has really come for you to stop trying to encourage/force him to do so. Everything is a control issue with him and in order to control you he will attempt to undermine everything you do.

Continue counseling with your son. He will need to learn that he has a relationship with you and a relationship with his dad each with its own set of unique boundaries and consequences. While it sounds inconsistent, he will adapt. The point is you need to be consistent where your relationship with your son is concerned and yours alone. Leave XH out of it all together.

You need to have your own set of rules and XH will have his own set of rules. Let son learn that while with you, he must follow your rules and with XH he will follow his. Other than logistics of custody issues, leave your XH out of your relationship between you and son.

Peace.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Faith1960:
<strong>Why don't you and son continue with this one without XH? He cannot continue to undermine the relationship if you do not allow it.
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Because:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by xpButtercup:
<strong>My ex ... went on a long tirade against the counselor DS has been seeing since September, calling him a joke, a jerk, fake and stupid among other things. The only things I said had to do with redirecting the conversation and implicating that this does not need to be discussed in front of our son.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Our son believes everything his dad says. He has no respect for the last counselor.

I thought if XH picked the counselor this time, it might help. But he refuses. He believes our son doesn't need help, just me.

DS went with me once to my psychologist. He didn't warm up to him until it was almost over and DS found out he had been an Eagle Scout. Instant respect, but a little late. Unfortunately my psych does not specialize in child/family psychology.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by xpButtercup:
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Faith1960:
<strong>Why don't you and son continue with this one without XH? He cannot continue to undermine the relationship if you do not allow it.
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Because:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by xpButtercup:
<strong>My ex ... went on a long tirade against the counselor DS has been seeing since September, calling him a joke, a jerk, fake and stupid among other things. The only things I said had to do with redirecting the conversation and implicating that this does not need to be discussed in front of our son.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Our son believes everything his dad says. He has no respect for the last counselor.

I thought if XH picked the counselor this time, it might help. But he refuses. He believes our son doesn't need help, just me.

DS went with me once to my psychologist. He didn't warm up to him until it was almost over and DS found out he had been an Eagle Scout. Instant respect, but a little late. Unfortunately my psych does not specialize in child/family psychology. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">So what. Is it true? Do you believe it? If so, than by all means change counselors. If not, you would be sending an implied message that you agree with XH to your son.

If you must change counselors, suggest you continue with this one until he can recommend or you locate one. And it usually takes more than one or two visits awhile to establish a relationship/bond with a counselor.

Here are reasons why you should stay with this counselor:

- You have been seeing him for awhile and he is familiar with your family issues.
- He is familiar with H and his issues.
- He is familiar with son's issues.

I just don't see it's necessary that you change counselors. Continue to visit this one without XH. Build the relationship between you, son and counselor. Do not discuss your therapy sessions with XH. It's time to go dark where he is concerned since he will undermine everything you do including changing counselors.

Good Luck!