Lordslady,

The last chapter in "Safe People" talks about this exact issue. The authors have encouraging things to say about it and I think you would benefit from reading this chapter. Actually the whole book is very good - one of the most enlightening reads I've had lately that is helping me understand the last 20 years of MY life! But, at least go into a bookstore somewhere and read that last chapter!

I think you have more options than you think. Good luck!

He is wrongly justifying his negative behaviors...

You confessed, repented, and it is gone. You did not continue as he has done, nor was that your intent.

He is malicious and wrong. My guess is that the jerk is having a hard time looking in the mirror at his own reflection and is doing anything he can do to justify how he did this to his family, his wife, and his child. It is a way to find peace for his fogged out conscience.

And it is malicious he do that to your child. I think because your child knows and is wise to his leaving, shacking up with OW, etc., that this is a last ditch effort to regain her respect and get her over to "his side of thinking".

Lord Have Mercy LL....

You ARE allowed to remarry. Your H was having an ongoing ACTIVE ADULTEROUS affair when you chose to file for divorce.

The logistics of this is going to drive you nuts. What if it came to light that he had an affair...or a ONS long before you ever did what you did? Would that change things for you? Who did what first does NOT matter. What matters is that he was in an active ADULTEROUS affair when you filed for divorce.

He is trying to absolve himself.

He has earned that guilt...don't try and take it from him by going along with his demented comments.

STOP looking for things to stress about...let that go.

The thing that concerns me most about this entire thing is the PRIVATE and PERSONAL stuff that he shared with your daughter. It's just not right.

Tell her that her Father was wrong to share those things with her. Tell her that she should cut him off at the pass when he attempts to share those things...tell her to tell him that she does not want to hear it.

JMHO
committed

LL, I'm really concerned about some of the things you say. </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> but the copays are also higher, so I'll have to limit my therapy to make sure there is always $ for my daughter's. Her situation is more important.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">One of the pages in one of the Al-Anon books talks about the message given during the flight attendants' safety message to PUT ON YOUR OWN OXYGEN MASK FIRST BEFORE TRYING TO HELP YOUR CHILD. The concept is the same here. If you don't think YOU are important, how is she ever going to learn that SHE is important? Children learn by example. Learning from your mistakes is one good example you've already tried to show her. Do you want to teach her to beat herself almost to death over mistakes she's made?

Do you hear the concern of all the people who've posted to you? Do you hear that not one of us agrees with your interpretation of God's will for you? You gotten tons of suggestions and some excellent advice that you keep overlooking and refocusing on what a horrible person you are. Do you think you're the only one who's ever sinned, made mistakes, hurt others? Hardly.

BTW, do you know you could be the Al-Anon poster child? Everyone comes into Al-Anon feeling more or less the way you do. Al-Anon was founded on Christian principles and while the words "Higher Power" are often substituted for "God", the goal is to present universal Christian principles without Christian doctrine that might alienate some people - not only atheists and agnostics, Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, etc, but Christians of different denominations. Al-Anon is FREE, it focuses on the here and now, and it would be a great place to find the friends you need so badly - people who've lived through similar experiences and are trying to grow spiritually.

What disturbed me most, though, is when you said </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I am very angry with myself today. Sometimes if it weren't for my belief that somehow Jesus is still here for me and desires that I continue on on this earth, I could entertain thoughts that I shouldn't. It's selfish to think that way--wrong method of escape. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You minimize your own need for help, yet you admit here to feeling suicidal. How much worse does it have to get? I wish you could see, as I said earlier, that the only person condemning you is YOU. We've all heard your confession and none of us are condemning you. And GOD IS NOT CONDEMNING YOU. I believe God is trying to speak to you through the concerned people here at MB. Please LISTEN. You want people to care about you yet you're not hearing the caring in all the posts to you!

LL, your H couldn't make you happy. Only YOU can make you happy. The focus now needs to be on you, not on your marriage or future relationships.

Finally, you ask </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">So you say "This guy told me he'd stay and talk with me about things IF I did such-and-such."

And then you tell them that you did what he asked because you were so afraid of being abandoned by not only your husband but by the one person who has been guiding you and helping you try to keep your head on straight (or so you think) and you were so afraid of losing everything that you gave in, in hopes it would make the pain go away???

Where was faith in all that???? And what I was going through then was SO much less than what I went through over the last year. It was so stupid.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">LL, What you did was totally HUMAN. People go to counselling when they are in the kind of pain you were in and therefore vulnerable. That's why the ethical codes for all licensed counselors strictly forbid the kind of predatory behavior exhibited by your pastor. I don't know if he had any formal counselling training, but if he had, this issue is addressed in detail because counselors, too, are human and vulnerable to a "damsel (or guy) in distress" as you were.

What is it you expect of yourself and your faith? If we had perfect faith, we'd probably all be out walking on water and moving mountains. Faith means belief, not knowing for certain. No one of us has perfect faith. Accept your HUMANNESS, LL. Join the rest of us.

<small>[ February 27, 2005, 02:18 PM: Message edited by: LetSTry ]</small>

Dear LL,
Please don't beat yourself up so much......you're even harder on yourself than God is; he forgives and forgets.

I can somewhat understand where you're coming from; I was also in an abusive relationship. At the very end, I wanted to be thought of as attractive so bad....my then H hadn't had sex with me in over 7 years....and I had a ONS with a guy I hardly knew. He thought I was attractive and great in bed! But I knew it was wrong, and when my then H found out about it he threatened that if I left him he would tell everyone we knew and especially our children. How abusive is that? So, I left, he told everyone, I confessed and repented.

I knew I couldn't stay single and celibate and I really prayed about it and God showed me that He forgives. He also showed me how my then H had left the marriage emotionally long before I left it physically, and how his abusive behaviour was very unGodly despite how he quoted verses constantly to "keep me in line".

I have since remarried a Godly man who also has been through divorce, and has been forgiven. I don't know if his divorce was "justified".....but that's between him and God and is over and done with. He's raising my children as a Godly father and loves me as a husband should, making me alot more effective mom and Christian.....and isn't that what God wants?

I'm sorry you don't feel you have any friends you can call. If you email me at annavon431@earthlink.net, I'll tell you my phone number. I think we both live in Iowa and maybe we could even get together and talk!

((Hugs))

LL,

I have a totally different perspective of what happened with the Pastor/Counselor, and I certainly wouldn't call it an affair. I would however call it sexual abuse.

1. He held a position of authority over you as your Spiritual Leader. Which actually falls under the Dependancy/relationship to the abuser heading


2. He held intimidation over you because of his position, if you told, it would look worse on you-
when in reality--it looks worse on him as a Pastor

3. Even though you were an adult, you were in an emotionally vunerable position and he took advantage of that.

Think about an elderly person in a nursing home, they are adults, they know it's wrong, but they are still vunerable physically and emotionally.

So in that, I don't see what happened w/ the Pastor/Counselor under those circumstances as an affair, but as Sexual Abuse, and some places they would consider it rape.

just be honest with your daughter about what happened, I believe she's smart enough to understand what really happened.

Honestly, the man should have been charged with a crime.

lordslady,


--and I was very, very, very, very bad and very, very, very, very, very stupid...

TR--What happened was VERY VERY VERY BAD, and what happened was very stupid on his part, but you were not to blame.

You are not the action, and you are not stupid.

And apparently this man took advantage of others in the church as well, you were just one of his many victims.

LL, I was going to chime in, but everyone else said what I was going to say, or what I wish I had thought to say.

So, hugs to you. Be strong and recognize STBX's actions for what they were, a blatant attempt to manipulate you and your daughter.

How are you doing LL?

What your ex said to you DD was just plain mean.

You do know that you will never be perfect don't you? You do know that you are still going to make mistakes in this life, regardless of your best intensions or how close you try to follow scripture?

Life is messy LL. Put on some old clothes and get into the dirt. Play a little. Pray a lot. Socialize. I think you really need to get out in the company of other adults. If you don't want to be around men right now, fine. Join a gardening club, the type of men there probably won't be that interested in you anyway (a little humor here folks. . . I'm an avid gardener and straight).

Remind your kids that you are not perfect, that you have made mistakes and you will continue to make them. Just like them.

I wish someone would smack you ex upside the head; adult issues should stay with adults. He isn't playing fair. He must be getting a kick out of "tarnishing your halo" . . . I think he still hates himself for what he has done. I still hate what I did, I'm beginning not to hate myself so much and that is huge progress for me.

Finally, knock off the self-hurting talk. That isn't an option for you and you know it. What would happen to your kids? Do you want them around your ex's loveshack every day?

I'm not a Christian anymore but I much respect for Christ's teaching. I remember a t-shirt that one kid wore a lot when I worked at a summer camp. It said somethng like "I know I special because God dosen't make junk". That memory always makes me smile. The kid that wore the shirt smiled a lot too, he was a little strange but a nice kid. Later I found out that he was an orphan . . . both parents died when he was pretty young. Anyway, sometimes when I'm really down my mind goes back there and my burden is lightend a bit. If this kid, who has lost everything, can still manage to smile: well I must be the worlds biggest wussy.

Cheers,

CN

The blood of Jesus covers all sin. If you have truly repented and know that you will never, ever cheat again in any relationship then you ask God for forgiveness , you tell your X-Husband (even if it is just mailing him a letter telling him you are sorry and you wish there were words to express how sorry you are and that you wish him the very best, you might also want to send him a book by James Dobson about Tough Love with the letter). If he reads it he would see that you are not the only person who has made the horrible mistake of having an affair. It would also show him even though you respect his decision to end the marriage there are many Christians both male and female that have shown the forgivenss that Christ showed during an affair. After you have made yyour apology You may move on with your life if God brings a good Christian man in to your life. Our God is a forgiving, loving God. He wants you to forgive yourself and have a peaceful life with joy in it.

Also, this may sound crazy to you and I may be way off track, but the fact that he says he misses you makes me wonder if there is a chance for you two to remarry. I definiely would recommend reading that book on Tough Love by James Dobson and I would do some serious praying about your situation.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by lordslady:
...that makes him the innocent party, and makes HIM not me able to remarry in God's eyes...
How to live the next 50 years as a single, celibate woman.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

Is the pastor married?
Is he happy (married or not)?
Does he live in celibacy?
I'm sure God forgave him <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> You may not agree, but before you go concluding that a loving and merciful God intends to doom you to a life of misery, I hope you will at least consider looking into the matter a bit more carefully. I am concerned that deep down you want to accept your presumed fate, because in your self-hatred you believe it is what you deserve.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Ding, ding, ding, yes, yes, YES!!!

I have kept up with your story periodically and amazed you are still having the same internal battle. I have mentioned this before and you have COMPLETELY ignored me.

You are living with fear and dread and shame and blaming God or saying it is God's will. And what have your prayers told you? What is God speaking in your heart? And are you listening, or looking for excuses?

Sorry...haven't had a chance to respond in a couple days, so this will be long...

L.I.T.-- Did respond on your other thread so won't go into detail here. True--I didn't feel safe disclosing the info to my H. But had he not have had the A and moved in with OW, I would have been content to stay M. Sure, there were points in my M where his drinking was really bad and things were ugly and I felt trapped because I had no grounds to leave. But all in all, I'd still rather we'd have stayed married, than have him leave me for another woman.

IsIt2Late-- My XH didn't know about the issue with the pastor when he left with OW. He found out late last spring. But yes, he seems, at least based on what he told our daughter, to be using it now as grounds to justify what he is doing. And I've told my daughter that I am very sorry, and told her that no matter who a person is or what position they hold, it doesn't necessarily make them trustworthy, so always be aware and be careful.

AD-- I know that "divorce" in biblical times may not have been exactly the same as it is now, but I still use the same interpretation. I don't want to get into defining terms. Makes it too easy to say "that was THEN, but it doesn't apply now". I do believe God's word is just as applicable today as it was back then. Don't take that in a negative way. This just how I feel about it.

DejaVu-- I need to log that book idea in my list of books I need to read or at least skim. I have quite a list already. Thanks for your suggestion. I'll see if I can find it if I go to the library here sometime.

JustPeachy-- I agree with both your statements. My XH has never been good at accepting responsibility for anything (nor is our daughter, or our son, for that matter--though he tends to get in less trouble). I think I've always done well accepting everyone's responsibility (a BAD thing, I know). But yes, if he can make me look bad, then he looks good to his daughter (or so he thinks).

Committed-- The reason I felt justified at the time I filed DV was because he was in an unrepentent affair. It wasn't until AFTER I filed that I started dwelling on my past, because something triggered it. But you are correct, I am analytical to a flaw, and I dwell on things and try to figure them out. And it does drive me nearly nuts. And I agree, it was VERY wrong and I am VERY upset that he shared this info with his daughter. He and the OW have shared other very private info with her on other occasions (not about me, but about them, or about what he has done in the past). I don't understand it. I think they're trying to treat her like an adult, but there are just some things that don't need shared. But then again, XH shared with our son that was infatuated with OW, before they slept together. WHY would you tell your child that? He said he wanted to have a "man to man" talk with him and thought he'd understand. Hello??!! You expect your son to understand and accept the fact that you are seeing someone behind his mother's back??

Bad judgement, that's all I can say. But I told my daughter that she shouldn't have to hear that stuff and she says, "But mom, I want to know what's going on, too". So there is no way she will stop them from telling her things. Ugh! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

LetsTry-- you said:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> If you don't think YOU are important, how is she ever going to learn that SHE is important? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">That statement about her therapy and mine was maybe misinterpreted. We both need help, but my opinion is that her issues are more critical right now. I've dealt with my issue for almost a decade. I'm still alive. I can deal a little longer. On the other hand, she is 2 years away from being an adult and I'm fast running out of time to help her become prepared for being on her own someday. Her issues, in my eyes, are the fire that needs dealt with first, if money and time constraints force me to make the choice.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> You minimize your own need for help, yet you admit here to feeling suicidal. How much worse does it have to get? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Truly, it could still be a lot worse. Yes, I've entertained thoughts. But they were just thoughts. Other than a few times when I jumped in my car in years past and drove 90mp and tried to roll it because I was so angry I couldn't see straight, I have not actually attempted anything nor would I. I believe suicide is a sin, and I'm also not selfish enough to leave my kids.

I will admit something I hadn't yet on here--I have cut my arms in past years out of anger at myself (not suicidal cuts). It's odd, because my daughter has not seen me do this nor seen the cuts, yet this is something she now does and to a far greater degree than I ever did. She has permanent scars. I have wondered if I was to blame, but it's not like it's a genetic thing.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> LL, your H couldn't make you happy. Only YOU can make you happy. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Actually, that's only partly true. He did make me happy. But I was so focused on him that he became my life. I had no life independent of him. And so when he left, I've had a very hard time trying to figure out who I am.

annasnewlife-- When my XH found out I was unfaithful back in 1990 (he found out immediately on that one and I only tried to deny for about a day), I remember him sitting with the kids in our living room saying, "Mommy's going to burn in Hell." I know he was very angry and very hurt. But that was so hard for me to hear! Fortunately, the kids were 4 and 1, so it didn't mean much to them. It just took a long time for me to get past.

If I have to, I will stay single and celibate. I don't like it, but it is fairly likely that I may be this way for a LOOONG time, simply because most guys today aren't willing to marry someone without "trying them out" first. But as long as there is still hope, I carry on. It's when I start thinking that God does not allow me to marry again that I start to panic, because that means I would have to let go of the hope of maybe finding the right person someday. That's scary!

TR-- My then-pastor never told me I couldn't tell (though I'm sure he knew I would be afraid to). But he basically said "lets do such and such, and THEN we can talk". I wanted someone to help me so bad, I did what he asked first. It wasn't sex in the truest sense of the word (so rape it wasn't, but sexual abuse, maybe), but it was infidelity nonetheless and weighs heavily on me. Yes, I was very emotionally vulnerable--but I had my full mental faculties. I should have been able to say "Get the H*** out!" I did not.

CN-- I believe you are right, that my XH hates himself for what he did, or what he's doing. But he keeps doing it. As for keeping adult things with the adults, this is one of the problems I have with him and our kids. He wants to involve them in all the adult issues and things whether they should be or not. Our son is 18, but there are still things he doesn't need to know. Our daughter is 15--she had no business knowing this. I think he feels like if he tells her things (or offers her cigarettes or occasionally booze--yes, he's done that, too), that she'll love him and respect him because he's treating her like a grown-up. Unhealthy logic.

stormydakota-- I have repented, and I've asked more than once for Jesus to forgive me and to help me get past it. Can I say I will never cheat again? I truly have ZERO intentions of ever doing it, the thought sickens me, I haven't done it in nearly a decade (through some very tought times in my M), I have protections in place, and I'm much closer to the Lord. But being a FWS who before it happened believed I would never, ever in a million years ever cheat, I can say NO ONE IS IMMUNE and we should always be on our guard!!

Can't mail my X a letter--the OW intercepts all letters, phone messages, emails, etc. Nothing gets through to him. I did send a txt message the night it happened just saying "I am SO sorry!" and told him I wished I'd known that was the reason he let the DV go through before it happened. He has never responded back, so I don't know if he got the txt or if she did.

Can't send him a book because he won't read them. He knows I'm not the only one who has ever made the mistake of an affair, because he's on his second one.

As for the decision to end the M, it was actually ME who filed DV (and I kick myself for that sometimes, too, because I think maybe I should have waited longer than a year from the time his A started), but I sort of hoped he would change his ways before it was final. Instead, he let it go through, and then proposed to the OW about a week later. They have no date set yet (because as far as I know, her DV isn't even final yet though they've lived together for almost a year). I know nothing is impossible with God, but if they do end up marrying, that will be the end of any hope held out for him because I would not remarry him after he marries someone else, if their M didn't work out.

BelongingToNowhere-- The pastor was married at that time. Happy? Didn't sound like it. Where he is now, if he's married, etc., I have no idea. He had actually left our church for another church shortly before the issue happened (but at the time, we were still without a pastor, so I was still counseling with him). He left the state for a church in NC, and from there I'm not sure where he ever ended up. I heard rumors once that he had left the ministry. I don't know, and I don't care.

SHMI-- I don't ignore you. I can go for days, even weeks sometimes and do really well and feel really good and hopeful. And then something will trigger something bad from my past and I spiral downward.

I don't know what God is saying! I've told people (and God, actually) that I need a billboard sometimes. I feel like because I don't have any single friends, I don't have any opportunities to meet people to date, and no one has shown any interest, that he may be saying loud and clear, "LL you WILL be single! This is the way it should be. How can it be any clearer?"

But if He is saying that, I'm looking for reasons not to hear it because it's not what I want. I need to reconcile what I want with what HE wants for me.

------------------------------------------------
My daughter has said nothing more about the incident since last weekend. I've been trying to think of a polite but clear way to tell both XH and OW to stop telling her about private things, whether they involve me or them. But right now we're on relatively good terms and I hate to rock the boat and have them get angry and just do more to make me look bad.

I've calmed down and focused on my daughter and my dogs and my house and my new job this week. I'm feeling a bit better right now, as long as I don't think about the future, or dating, or things of that nature.

LL

<small>[ March 02, 2005, 11:56 PM: Message edited by: lordslady ]</small>

I talked to the minister of a minsty that I am involved in and I also talked to the pastor of my Church. All three of them confirmed that jesus forgave you the first time you asked for forgiveness. God, Jesus , and the Holy Spirit no longer remember it. It is forgiven and forgotten. If a murder, child abuser, sexual predator, prostitue, etc. truly repents and changes their ways they are forgiven. so why, do you believe that God will not forgive you? I will say by not forgiving yourself you are sining. It hurts Jesus when we will not forgive wether it is not forgiving another or not forgiving yourself. The verse in the Bible does not apply to you because Jesus no longer even remembers that you commited that act. He is not refering to you. I recommend reading your Best Life Now by Joel Olsteen of Lakewood Church. You can buy it almost anywhere. It is not focused on marriage or adultry , but can be applied to life in general. It addresses forgiveness and focusing on the positive. Life is a precious gift it is not right to continually suffer and wallow in self regret, self hatred, or self pity. Learn from your mistake. Believe me we all make huge mistakes even though they may be different than the one you made. If you are divorced then you are free to date a Godly man (just remember to wait for marriage before you are intimate). Join a Christian singles group or ask Christian friends to set you up on dates when you are ready to do so. Choose to live your best life now. If one of your children amde ths same exact mistakes you made what advice would you give them? Wouldn't you want theem to forgive themselfs and begin to enjoy their life again? Of course you would. Well you are Good's child and he wants that for you. When one of your children are hurt or too hard on yourself it hurst the parent. Stop hurting your Godly Father and start truly loving yourself again.

Hey there,

I've just read the same arguments over and over again.

I am a serial monogamist, I have a short string of long-term BF, and now H. Since I was 18 I have only been single for about 3 months. During that 3 months was a very enlightneing time for me...I learned not to depend on someone else, to be more self-sufficient, and it was a period of real growth.

Perhaps you are not meant to be single, but to hold off on jumping into an R right now...

What is it you would like to change, or grow about yourself? Deepen your R with God? With your DD? With yourself?

When you are ready...

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by lordslady:
<strong> AD-- I know that "divorce" in biblical times may not have been exactly the same as it is now, but I still use the same interpretation. I don't want to get into defining terms. Makes it too easy to say "that was THEN, but it doesn't apply now". I do believe God's word is just as applicable today as it was back then. Don't take that in a negative way. This just how I feel about it.
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Well, I don't claim that one should say "that was then and this is now". Also I agree that God's word is always applicable. What I claim is that the Bible (as God's word) says absolutely nothing about "divorce" as it is currently practiced in the western world.

But I understand and respect your POV. It is a matter about which reasonable Christians can disagree.

-AD

<small>[ March 08, 2005, 11:02 AM: Message edited by: AD ]</small>

I read through all of this and was a little surprised that no one commented on one part that jumped out at me.

It seemed like, in the very first thread, that your logic went something like this:

- A pastor abused me
- I blame myself for that situation and for my other affairs
- My exH found out about it
- My exH told our daughter
- Our daughter told me
- So now he's innocent and it's all my fault
- I can never get married again

It seems to me that there are a few problems with that thought process.

The first thing that bothers me is why you're allowing your exH's decisions and actions to affect how you plan to act for the rest of your life. All in all? I'm thinking that whether you remain single and celibate or not, it's really NOT a decision that your exH should influence.

The second thing that bothers me is that you're blaming yourself for more than you are actually responsible for. It's absolutely true that in every abusive situation there is an abuser and there is someone who cannot or does not defend their boundaries. That does NOT mean that it's the victim's fault, though!

It seems to me that you sometimes want to make it your fault. Maybe it's a form of self-punishment? Or maybe it's how you try to exert a certain amount of control over situations where you were not in control. If it's your fault, after all, then you can do something about it!

When I read everything you say about it, it seems to me that you recognize that RIGHT NOW the last thing you want to do is inflict your poor, battered spirit and psyche on someone else in a romantic relationship.

Honestly? That's the sanest, healthiest thing that's coming through here. I dunno what God'll have to say next year or the year after. I find that when I try to figure out what God wants for me, I get things all tangled up.

Instead, I just do my darndest to live as ethically as I possibly can, and try really hard not to worry about what's in store for me. What I want and what God has planned? Not the same. Not even in the same ballpark, near as I can figure.

So I'm wondering if all this worry about the Biblical question of remarriage isn't masking something much simpler -- your personal ambivalence toward it. You know you're in no shape for it and not ready for it, even as your entire body is yelling "Get me someone RIGHT NOW!"

Been there, done that, got the t-shirt, the coffee mug, the toaster oven, AND the oven mitts. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

So why not lay this question aside for awhile and instead focus on getting healthy and right with God in all the other ways? Then you'll be in a much better spot to ask the question and hear the answer that God intends for you to hear.

LL,

I read on one of your other posts that you grew up in the Church of Christ. I have been a member of this denomination my entire life. This kind of explains your feelings. In general, we can teach Catholics a thing or two about guilt. Luckily, many Churches of Christ have learned what the Bible really says.

Please hang in there, and, as JustJ says, get to a point where you are comfortable with yourself before you get into a relationship with someone else.

It's been a while since I've posted on this one, though I've been reading. I went from feeling that I can't remarry, to GQII and found a thread that hit very close to my heart where it comes to my concern over my XH's salvation. Went from there to analyzing a lot of things and started to question for the first time in years whether in fact I may have lost MY salvation by being a Christian and then going directly against God's wishes and being unfaithful.

Anxiety is a great way to lose a couple pounds. I'm feeling better mentally about that now and doing my best not to let Satan throw me off the path and to hold tight to God's promises in the Bible.

Stormy-- I do believe you're right that I need to forgive myself. I know I can't change the past, but I get really angry at myself because of that. I don't intend to date for quite a while. No singles groups around here that I know of, not intending to be intimate before M (which really knocks down my chances of serious relationships), and am not convinced I could actually make someone happy long term, so have no business dating right now anyway. I see a therapist, but I'm not really sure we're getting anywhere--she and I don't really see eye to eye on values/morals.

SHMI--

My DD and I are actually doing much better right now. I am almost afraid to say that because seems each time I do, things fall apart. She still is a pig, still doesn't help much, and still stays out one night per weekend without really clearing it with me. But she's done great with her weekday curfew, she stays in touch, she calls just to talk to me, we've stayed home a few evenings together and watched movies, she tells me she loves me when she calls me....and I grounded her last Friday for skipping school, and SHE STAYED HOME while I was at work! (That was a FIRST!) And we enjoyed a movie together that night.

As for growing myself, not doing so hot there. I stay at work until 7-8pm just because there are things I can do and it's what I'm used to doing. Better than coming home and sitting here alone. And I'm tired and it's dark out and I don't have any ambition to try and find some club to join.

Just J--

In answer to your statement: yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes--to the first part, and yes.

The reason I let the X's influence affect my decision is because my fear that if HE divorced ME because of MY infidelity, then HE is the one who can remarry and I don't believe I will be blessed if I do. The question is, did he really have hardness of heart because of what he found out about me when he let the DV go through, or was it just a convenient excuse that could have been worked through had we still been together.

And I do have issues every now and then with self-punishment. I wonder if I disagree or avoid them and decline invitations because it just proves in my mind that I'm not lovable and people don't enjoy my company.

I know, seems strange, but X and I used to go places together on occasion and then we'd leave and he'd mention something stupid I said, or tell me I talk to much. My kids have also told me something I said sounded stupid (i.e., "Mom, the lady at the checkout counter just wants to take your money. She doesn't care what you think about something.") So it's easier to just prove that people don't care to be around me than to wonder.

Okay, that was off on a strange tangent, but it sort of addresses the issues I'm aware I have with my self-confidence.

IsIt2Late--

Never thought about the Church of Christ thing until you mentioned it. Mine was very small (as in about 2 dozen people). Very conservative. I think the one my mom and dad attend now is better, but they do tend to be a works-based church. I struggle sometimes to mesh my Church of Christ upbringing with my current Southern Baptist church teaching.

And it doesn't help that my mom has a terrible time with guilt. I'm not even sure what it's from sometimes, but she about drives herself crazy. She's on Paxil now, but it's been an issue since I was little. I doubt that helped me (both growing up in the environment AND inheriting her genes).

Moral of my ramblings tonight: When I table my thoughts of any relationship, I don't stress out so much. But it was tough Tuesday because it was my X's 40th birthday, and I found myself thinking of him frequently, and missing US.

And it gets old to come home at night, clean up my daughter's daily mess in the kitchen, throw something quick together, feed the animals, read on here, read the news, read my bible (when I have my priorities right), and snuggle into bed with my puppies. That's my weekday.

Weekends consist of the above plus grocery shopping, running errands for my daughter, doing a bit more cleaning, church, and bi-weekly driving my son back to college (a 240-mile round trip). It's peaceful...but I have no life. And I have no energy to go out and have a life. I'm a homebody. I don't really care to go out and be social and out on the town. Just one more thing that is going to make it really hard to find someone even if it isn't against God's will.

The more I analyze all this, the more it sounds SO clear that I'm destined to be alone. But sometimes I really miss being in a relationship.
I want to feel like someone thinks I'm special.

LL