I was asked yesterday if I could start helping by sending some money.
I don't live beyond my means. I have a very nice condo but only because a friend is renting it out to me a a very cheap price. I have day care expenses and am also taking care of the 3 boys.
Empty has asked that I start paying him every month. I don't even know how much to give him.
NOt only that but he let me know that he cannot afford to meet me half way to see the boys.
I had them alone for the first time in 5 years.
I drove 4 hours there, 4 hours back had them for a day and drove another 4 there and 4 back on Sunday.
If I am to see them I am not allowed to pick them up late on Friday. I get off work and 530pm would have to leave and would not get there until around 11pm or so. Empty said that was to late. So I would have to leave on Saturday and return them the following day. Our time would be spent riding in the car. He could meet half way if I paid him gas money but that cuts into his social time with Lori.
I am so frustrated right now and have no idea how to work this one out.

<small>[ March 02, 2005, 09:13 AM: Message edited by: lucidity ]</small>

I do not know if I understood what you wrote correctly. If you have custody of the children you do not need to give him a penny and he should be giving you child support. When you meet each other you should mmet half way: you pay for your gas & he pays for his gas. Those are the legal and morally right ways to handle the situation.

There has never been a court order. Neither one of us have custody.

((Lucidity))

I'm a bit confused and by no means do I wish to open up a can of worms or cause you further hurt but I'm quite frankly lost on what y'all status is.

Just sticking to the facts here and not pointing any fingers. What is y'alls status? Are you divorced or married? Was there an extended time when for whatever reason you didn't see your sons?

PAS-Parental alienation syndrom
The insistence upon the negative aspects of the spouse's character and behaviour coupled with the inability to see existing or even potential positive traits in the spouse are manifestations of an alienating attitude. Such a client appears to objectify his spouse as an evil thing, no longer a person with at least a few redeeming qualities. There is a loss of the ambivalence which characterizes healthy human relationships. Indeed, such objectification of the spouse as "all bad" should be taken to be a sign of significant disorder in the client himself

I am also very confused. You can go to a child support office, determine child support arrangements, and determine custody regardless if you are just living together, just split up, married, seperated, divorced, etc. Until the terms have been set up you do not have to legally give your Husband any money. If he wants money that bad and also has legal rights to money from you (for whatever reason) then he needs to put you on child support. If he is providing the majority of the care at the present time then in my opinion you should get a second part time job and give him a fair and appropriate amount of financial support for the sake of your children.

I have read a little bit of your story so I sort of think I understand the arrangements.

This isn't probably what you want to hear and please be aware my opinion is definitely influenced by my being a BS and as a single father...

If he is providing day to day care for your children you should be paying him your share of child support. I'm sure there are rules in your state. Find out what they are, and pay what you are obligated.

Why should he spend his time shuttling your kids to you? If he is willing to meet you half way I think that is a very nice gesture but I don't think he is under any obligation if he doesn't want to.

Miker

I am a women, but I also agree with Miker. If they spend the majority ofthe time with him then you should give him child support. The kids deserve that. It is the right thing to do.

I could not help, but notice all 3 of your kids live with you. I think that is awesome that you are stepping up to the plate and beoing there for your kids. when my HUsband leaves me it is like pulling teeth toget him to call and talk to our kids. They adore him and even just a phone call saying Daddy loves you and misses you means so much to them. As a Dad do you have any advice on what I can do to encourage him to at least be there for the kids. It is not their fault that we have so many problems. They are innocent in all of this.

I think I am going to post the above question on a new thread. I really would like advice on this.
Thanks,
Stormy

((lucidity))

I have been reminded over and over that you have to "Live Life on Life's Terms" and deal with the reality of the situation.

With that all being said, why is there no orders? If you are not divorced, why aren't you?

But more importantly what is the right thing for you to do right now? Rather than focus on 'Empty', what are some things that you could do to positively influence the situation?

Unfortunalty I am not as well worded as Empty.
I believe that I should be paying something, I just don't know what and empty just tells me whatever eveyone else gets paid. When I try to discuss seeing the boys it is always I should be able to meet you. It is never and has never been a for sure on anything when it comes to seeing my boys. I have to guess with him.
A definate answer at this point would be nice.

<small>[ March 02, 2005, 12:54 PM: Message edited by: lucidity ]</small>

“””Unfortunalty I am not as well worded as Empty.”””

I have no idea what that means, but OK.

“””I believe that I should be paying something, I just don't know what and empty just tells me whatever everyone else gets paid.”””

OK, so why aren’t you? When will you start? As with about anything else, that information is pretty much at your fingertips. Some states do things with percentages and some with a formula, but the information is out there if you wish to find out.

“””A definite answer at this point would be nice.”””

Yes, I’m sure that it would be. And it sounds as if, for what ever reason, you are giving Empty that power whether it’s out of fear or guilt. This is obviously an extremely touchy subject matter and one that could consume you. As I see it you can either dwell in the problems or dwell in the solution. It’s pretty much that simple, I ain’t saying it’s easy, but it is simple.

I’m finding it hard to understand why there is no custody established, I’m presuming that’s because there is no legal separation or divorce, so what is the solution there?

Can't you just find your states divorce laws or child support guidelines, plug in the numbers and see who pays what?

Where I live, it's 20% of my after tax income, minus health insurance I pay on my YD. If I had two kids, it would be 25%, etc.

There have to be formulas or guidelines out there. Most are based on income

Lucidity,

I thing you guys need to get this squared away in court. Make a proposed visitation agreement and get it accepted by the court. If you are not divorced yet, it's probably time to go ahead and get divorced. I suspect you will get more time with your boys than your H (XH) would give you now.

Even filing (in our state) creates a temporary visitation order automatically. That may apply in TX also - and will certainly get you far more time with your boys than you have now. That will put the pressure on him. Either he complies until the D is final, or he is in contempt of court and risks losing custody.

Don't just let this ride. Start nailing it down. The ambiguity is worse for your boys, for you and (though you might not care) for your H. Having things settled and regular would be a huge improvement for your kids.

JMHO,

-AD

FYI - Found this at the 1st web-site I searched:

The Texas Family Code contains guidelines for the computation of child support. The guidelines are specifically designed to apply to situations in which the obligor's monthly net resources are $6,000.00 or less. In such cases, the court presumptively applies the following schedule:

1 child 20% of Obligor's Net Resources
2 children 25% of Obligor's Net Resources
3 children 30% of Obligor's Net Resources
4 children 35% of Obligor's Net Resources
5 children 40% of Obligor's Net Resources
6 or more children Not less than 40%

If the Obligor has children from another relationship(s), the percentages listed above may be reduced.

If the obligor's net resources exceed $6,000.00 per month, the Court shall presumptively apply the above percentages to the first $6,000.00 of net resources. Without further reference to the percentage, the court may order additional amounts of child support. The court may not order the obligor to pay more child support than the presumptive amount (as calculated by multiplying the above applicable percentage times $6,000.00) or an amount equal to 100% of the proven needs of the child, whichever is greater.

Net resources is defined very broadly, and income can also be imputed to a party.

In addition to monthly child support payments, the payor is required to maintain the children on the payor's employment health insurance policy. If insurance is not available through the payor's employment, but is available through the payee's employment, the payor will be ordered to pay the premium costs. If insurance is not available through either parties' employment, the payor will be ordered to provide insurance coverage to the extent available and affordable. Additionally, the Court usually makes orders regarding the payment of deductibles and other uninsured expenses. All Orders dealing with child support must now be accompanied by an Order of Withholding. Medical Support Orders are now commonplace. The Withholding order, after presented to the payor's employer, has the Court-ordered child support deducted directly from the payor's paychecks.

((((Lucidity))))

Please do not run-a-way from the boards, there are people here who want to help you, not your marriage but you as a person. I spent a moment and read through some of your old stuff and when you start getting feedback you leave…..Why?

Dear, there is another way of life. Within you is the ability to break free from this self-imposed sentence of misery and pain. Let someone help you find that. In my reading, I found basically the exact same questions 1.5 years ago, you are stuck. You and only you can get yourself unstuck but it doesn’t have to be a journey experienced alone.

I have no idea what your current friendships or relationships are like but if these boards are any indicator then it appears you have trouble letting people in. What are you afraid of? Yes, you’ve done bad things but most anyone who draws a breath has done bad things, just some of us to a higher degree. Let someone in. Find someone (not a romantic partner) and let them know you, the real you, all of you. You’d be surprised what a difference it makes. Not only because it helps you to get all your crap out to someone but they can also call “BullS(*&” when your going in a wrong direction.

Let me share something with you from my life experience. basically laying all our baggage on the table for someone else to view, admitting our faults to God and another human being, and asking for forgiveness. Like everyone else , this scared me to death. After I went through that experience, WOW, I was forever changed.

Until you get sick and tired of being sick and tired of this issue it is going to be what it is. You have to seek, find, and grasp what control you have in the matter and use it. You can do this. Today, for whatever reason, I believe in you even if you don’t believe in yourself. Lean on us or someone (again not a romantic partner) until you gain that belief in yourself. As I’ve read today, I also believe that the only person standing between you and happiness is yourself. Today, will you choose to get out of your way?

And if you don’t feel it or no one has told you today “I Care!”

Lucidity,
You have gotten some answers here. But it appears that many people don't understand PAS - which is hard to prove anyway.
If you want your children, and are unable to have parenting time with them due to PAS, then the courts can determine an interim CS while final custody is being reviewed. In many cases, the courts understand PAS and will work with the counselors & parents to reestablish relationships.

For MBers who don't know PAS, one parent badmouthes the other so much that the children refuse to see the parent or are even afraid of the parent, and custody can't be enforced.

So my guess is that your X has them 100% of the time, which means that he'd get CS from you. It all breaks down to a formula. If X's income is 60,000 and yours is 40,000, the total is 100,000. For two children, this is 25% or $25,000. Your share of the 25,000 is 40% based on your income, or $10,000. Since the children are in his care 100% of the time, you would need to pay him $10,000 per year.
If you had 50/50 custody, you'd contribute $12,500 toward their care, and he'd contribute the same, but he would owe you $2,500 per year (12,500 less 10,000 based on your salary differences).

Bump.........