Hi.<P>We received the judgment from Nassau County Family Court.<P>The judge believes we "cooked our books", said we lacked credibility. Implied we have been disingenuous and have hidden crucial financial documents. We gave them EVERYTHING they asked for, everything we had. <BR>It showed all the losses and debt our company has incurred. All our income sources were revealed...they have all the data yet they are convinced that we have far more than what has been submitted.<P>I wish I did have something socked away somewhere. The IRS sent us a letter the day before yesterday with their intent to levy.<P>The final judgment is for eighty five dollars MORE than what my husband's gross salary is for a month. In other words, OVER 100% of his salary. Legally, David is supposed to pay 17% of his gross salary, not OVER 100%.<P>I am in shock, I am stunned and I cannot believe that we will have to incur even more legal debt to appeal this blatant travesty of justice.<P>Right now nothing matters to me anymore.<P>You should have heard all the vicious, cruel, terrible things I said to David. I was insane today and something inside me clicked "off".<P>Catnip Rockerfeller =^^=<P><p>[This message has been edited by catnip (edited June 08, 2000).]

catnip,<BR>I don't even know what to say but to extend a cyberhug in sympathy. Good gosh...what a sad mess. <P>Please hang in there...<BR>Angels,<BR>Jenny

catnip,<P>I am so sorry to hear this. It is truly appaling. I will never understand how many rights are taken away from the fathers, especially in these situations. It's as if the OW and the choice to bring an illegitimate child in this world should be rewarded and the father should be raked over the coals. <P>I will pray for you and your family. I will also pray that the judge who hears your appeal will come to his/her senses!<BR>

That is terrible. I have no faith in the "justice" system at all. Everytime I have been involved in any type of court drama, I have always felt raped after it was all over.<P>How did they decide on the dollar figure? Did they just pick it out of thin air? I am sure there are situations of real "dead beat dads", but it seems that the ones who want to pay and be responsible are treated so unfairly. Women have all the power. It's disgusting. And for those of us in situations where it's an OC, it just adds insult to injury. As if the child itself weren't enough, now it's going to impact our comfort and lifestyle FOREVER.

Catnip, I am really sorry for what YOU have to go through. It is not fair at all. I get so fed up w/ my H, because he's like well as long as we have each other we will be OK. Well, we need money to live and my children are not going to suffer because you were stupid. I am a teacher and you know we don't make a lot of money. H is an engineer, but he is on the low end of salary scale. I refuse to work daily at a job and have nothing show for it, that is insane. I can do bad by myself, I don't need him to help me do bad. <BR>So my question to you is, how are you going to live now? I don't mean to be insensitive. I am just curious.<P>Stefanie

<BR>catnip,<P>My God, I'm shocked.<P>Bystander

Thank you all for your responses.<P>Apparently it was an arbitrary number, an average of what we made over the past four years, before the financial destruction and damage that David caused...AND, YEARS and MONTHS before he ever met the whore.<P>For some reason, they believe the slut is entitled to monies we received before he met the ugly pig.<P>I have written a four page letter to the courts telling them that NY law requires 17% of the gross and medical insurance and we will comply with that. that is what they want, that is what we will send and not a farthing more. David is willing to go to jail for six months if that isn't good enough. Pox on the pig and the corrupt NY court system.<P>I know. Catnip, tell us how you really feel...don't hold back! LOL<P>Love to all of you for your understanding and support.<P>Catnip =^^=

I am shocked and scared. How could this have ever happened?! I can't believe how this system works. Like getting the standard amount wouldn't be enough. I am sure that child is not suffering. How do they expect you to live? I guess they don't care. I mentioned in the other thread how I can see how people run. There should be some limits to what these OW get. And the bottom line is it is the OWs getting the money. She could spend it on spas and clothes, and just give the minimum to the child, there is no law against that. That is what I hate! I am so sorry for you. I can feel your pain and anger. I can easily imagine and feel your situation, I am of course still waiting for our bomb to drop on appeal. You have my prayers and thoughts today. All you can do is fight. Had you already been sending payments? Or do you now have to pay back support also? Just curious how deep this cut runs. Try to keep your head up. We are here for you. I am sorry I am so angry today, but I am ticked off for you. But I am sending you hugs for moral support. <P>babstr.<P>

Thanks, babstr. I'm glad you posted. You're going through your own particular hell yourself. I will say prayers that your outcome is fair. But, it probably won't be.<P>We do owe back support because the courts have dragged THEIR feet so long in determining a judgment. We haven't had any money, either, because of our company's current situation. A distributor is assembling the product and selling it for us. They then pay us a miniscule royalty that is far less than what it would be if we did it ourselves, like we once did.<P>When our divorce is final, we will take back the product line and sell directly to our endusers, which will be significantly more than what we are getting now. we still have $350,000 corporate debt that has to be satisfied along with a chunk to the IRS, so the money will be used to take care of these obligations. Bankruptcy would provide some relief, however, the IRS forgives no one, Child Support forgives no one and the bank has a lien on our house anyway fo the business loan, so all in all, it would only protect us from about 150,000 in vendor debt.<P>The moral crisis I am facing is that I don't want these wonderful vendors to get stuck holding our financial bag. Yet, I am up against the wall, incurring more and more legal debt as each day rolls by with corporate attorney, bankruptcy attorney, business advisr, child support lawyer in NY and a few scattered attorneys thrown in the mix for other brush fires.<P>The divorce will be around $500 because we are in agreement and this is a strategy move to protect me...and David. We will file seperate income taxes, of course, so when there comes a day when I may get a refund (HA HA HA!), the female impersonator (she looks like a guy in drag!--meow, hiss) in NY won't get my money.<P>Here I am 51 years old, and I am far, far from set. I could essentailly end up a bag lady living under a bridge for what has happened. What is such a bitter pill to swallow, is that I had absolutely nothing to do with any of the destruction on any level AND I know without a doubt that I met each and every ohne of my husband's needs on every level and that there was absolutely no excuse for what he did. That is why I cling to the notion of his mental illness. I could not do this if it were otherwise.<P>I've gotten off the subject as usual and got long wionded (again). sorry, guys. But, thank you all for your support.<P>Catnip =^^=<p>[This message has been edited by catnip (edited June 09, 2000).]

Catnip,<BR>I am so very, very sorry to hear your news. It is so unfair. I will be sending positive vibes your way. I can hardly believe that it comes down to getting a divorce to protect yourself financially. <P>Take care,<BR>Audrey<p>[This message has been edited by Audrey (edited June 09, 2000).]

Hi Audrey:<P>Thanks for your support. How you holding up these days?<P>Jenny: Thanks for the cyberhug and empathy, Old Friend. I'm so glad you're around.<P>Tryingtomoveforward: It makes me psychotic to look at the illogical reward system in our country giving what is often a deceptive and manipulating person big bucks for making and arbitrary decision that impacts the lives of so many---without even consulting them! (long tangent sentence!)<P>Bystander: Buddy, buddy. Aren't shocking revelations really just becoming the 'norm'?<P>Catnip =^^=

How hideously unfair! I can see my H being in your situation (as if I should care about his self induced problem). He has no idea what his assets, debts, or income is. Now that I am no longer working for him, his business is going down the drain. This being the case, I can see the OW taking him to court and using past tax returns to establish income. <P>I hope your plans to divorce bring you some relief.<P>I feel the same as you. What did I do to deserve this? When will I see some justice? It never seems to end.<P>What to do about your debtors? That is a tough one. I am in business too and would hate to be in that position- on either side. Can you explain your hardship and let them know you are on the verge of bankrupcy and see if they will accept a payment plan? Something is better than nothing. Necessity will dictate. <P>So sorry.

Catnip, I can't believe what has happened. We live in NY and the amount is indeed 17% of the salaray plus health care and 1/2 daycare. Do you have to pay more because you are entreprenuers? What a load of hogwash!<P>Your'e right, you can't squeeze blood from a stone. Hopefully, you will get a sane judge for your appeal, one who will take into account your liabilities. <P>I'm so sorry that you are going through this. You don't deserve it. Good luck has to come back around to you soon. You are so in my prayers.

That's definitely adding insult to injury! I'm really sorry you're in this position. Can you make an agreement with your vendors and then file bankruptcy?<P>Your post just gave me a horrible sinking feeling in my stomach. Child support is the thing I fear the worst about my situation. I'm afraid I'm going to have to pay financially also for my H's mistake. Hopefully, by Sunday we'll know what OW is expecting monetarily, then we can work it out. We're not well off financially now, either (thanks to H!). But H is looking for other employment, I'm working on refinancing the mortgage (in *my* name only), and I just got a promotion. Thank goodness the baby isn't due until November. <P>Have you checked into legal aid? Seems like your situation would warrant it. <P>Sometimes I think life would be so much easier without men! <P>childless - Sue

I am going to fight this or die trying. I am so enraged, I intend to make a lot of noise about this. <P>

Catnip,<BR> <BR>I am so sorry about what you are going through. I will certainly be praying that God will intervene on your behalf in the appeal.

Okay - now what the H&^$# is going on? I am so pissed - since I am part of the legal system - (I'm a legal secr. and office manager for a lawfirm) I see the injustices all the time of the legal system - and since my H is self-employed and has had to use the Court System to battle for collection, etc. I KNOW FIRST HAND how unfair Judges can be - they are human and have their own baggage of stuff that they feel "strongly" about; prejudices, whatever.<P>Cat - How in this world is this happening? What other nightmare stuff can happen to you? Geez - did the Judge not even address the issue of this woman's vile attempt to get pregnant or the fact that these "women" (if you can call them that) can get away with getting $$$$$ to use as they see fit! Good grief - I've always thought that men don't get a fair shake when it comes to divorcing and children - and the woman almost always getting custody no matter what - and the men having to pay through the nose, etc. etc. I have never had to personally deal with it - so even though I think it stinks - I haven't really put much thought into it being changed. Obviously "our" situations - make you REALLY do some thinking. Good grief - if you have freaking tax returns that you file with the IRS and you give them everything they have asked for - what basis do the Courts have in saying you are "withholding" information? How in the world is 100% of his salary - a fair amount to pay? How do you two live? Good grief - (are your H's children all over 18?) I couldn't remember. <P>It's ironic that my H and I actually talked about the child support issue - because my stupid stupid H just gives OW $$$ for OC - in cash with no receipt or anything - just like he paid for his daycare last week and then he just give her $50 here $100 there and he is so very very very stupid to not think that she can get "pissed" and go to the court system and get "back child support" and the whole 9 yards and hurt me, my child and himself - just because he thinks if he "pacifies" her - she won't make him pay so much!! You guys are here trying to do the right thing and this is the crap you get - - I'm gonna try to do some case research on NY child support cases and see if I can find ANYTHING useful for your appeal. What about your attorney - is he/she competent - are they fighting for you or just "appearing" in court? Please - Cat - my prayers and thoughts are with you.<P>I was so devestated when I saw your post about divorcing - I know it for financial reasons - but nonetheless - it is so sad that you have to go through with such extreme measures - to endure this mess.<P>------------------<BR>

Hi DD: I appreciate your outrage on my behalf...I didn't know you were a legal beagle...if you can find anything, please let me know.<P>David and I are alone...all kids grown and gone. I was working for the sheriff's department but took a leave of absence due to my stress issues and general mental health. David is starting a new job on Monday the 26th, but, we are in a terrible financial predicament.<P>I was thinking about a way to start some kind of movement toward revamping current support laws to make them fair and just. the best way to start is to write our congressmen, I suppose. It is such a daunting effort and I am so overwhelmed...but, I have to start somewhere.<P>I'll be off the board for a couple days as I have to have oral surgery and I am in considerable pain right now. I will post Thursday or Friday.<P>I'll be thinking of all of you...<P>DD, are you doing Plan B now? We need an update.<P>Catnip =^^=

I am so sorry that this is happening to you this happened to us, in a different level, anyhow we had to cash our 410K in order to pay back because we had no money at the time.<BR>It is very unfair and yes I agree that the Legal system does not see the "whole" picture. They should have a law in which the OW MUST inform the Men about the pregnancy and it should be a joint agreement in deciding about it, if Men do not want it they should not be forced to pay just because the OW decided to have a child with a married man, sometimes it is so unfair I think these women have the children for punishment reasons and not for the right reasons and then the money is given tothem like they won the lottery or something! It is so unfair! hang in there! We are all praying for you, you and H will find the way!

I am terrified the OW in our life will do this. How do I find out what the % is in California or what the average is? Do I need a laywer?