through this whole thing i have had little or no outside support. I have 2 close friends, one is in another state, the other had a mental breakdown just after i found out. The only other friend that was close was the OW. <BR>Anyway, i do have some friends in a small bible study and i feel i can trust most of them. A few weeks ago i decided to talk to one of the ladies that is older and wiser and (i thought) less judgemental.<BR>I told her everything that has been going on and all she could focus on was my H and the OC. I don't need any more people to be mad at my H, i need people to let me vent about everything. She basically said that i need to focus on what is best for the OC and that he is innocent. She also said that if i am going to stay that i need to be willing to sacrifice for the OC. as in move closer, give up time with my H, etc. I am not willing to do any of this. Yes, we will be paying CS. My H wants no contact with the child and neither do i. However, after talking to my "friend" i feel guilty. <BR>She also said that my H needs to give up the work he does with the youth at our church. (he is the only youth leader at our church and we do alot with them) i don't mind the idea of him taking a sabbatical for a few months but she seems to think he should never work with them again. she thinks it is a temptation for him. (he is a jerk not a child molester) anyway i don't know how to face her. i hate feeling like i have to defend him. i am trying to get past my anger towards him and heal but it seems like when i confide in someone they want me to feel all the just found out anger and pain again. i am so glad to have you all to talk to.<BR>i also feel like people blame me when they find out. i do not believe that there was anything i could have done to stop this.<BR>i was pregnant and still grieving a miscarriage that happened just before i got pregnant. i thought we were doing well, weekly dates, lots of time together physically and emotionally. i know i wasn't being very nice to him for a couple of months, but i was not myself. <BR>sorry this has rambled so much, i just need to get so much out.<BR>

1Fool,<BR>The only mistake you made is in talking to this woman, who is most definitely judgemental and is not helping the situation. Just chalk it up as a misjudgement and move on. Something I definitely learned is that everyone and their mother has an opinion but no one can tell you how to act toward H or OC, you do what is comfortable for you and your marriage. You know better than to blame yourself or to feel blame for this fiasco, your husband is a grown man who made some stupid choices. Stay strong! God Bless<BR>

1fool,<P>i agree with leelee. some people just don't know when to be quiet. it is scary sometimes because you don't know how someone will react. i didn't tell either of my 2 close friend for awhile because i didn't know how they would react. i didn't need them bashing my H, i wouldn't be with him if i thought he was a bad person. he made a bad judgment but he is not a bad person. sometimes it is best to have us anonymous friends. plus we are all in the same boat. but a human voice and a hug is so different and much needed. consider yourself hugged, from me, across cyberspace, okay? <P> i agree with the decision you have made. your marriage was first and the OW made the choice for her child not to have a father. she could have put it up for adoption, or better yet, married a man and had her child in a family. i have said this before but a priest told me that my H has an obligation to pay child support but no obligation to have an emotional relationship with child.<P>take care and sorry you had to put up with someone who has a pretty closed mind. take care and you are in my prayers!<P><BR><P>------------------<BR>happy_girl

I agree with the others. It is REALLY hard to predict who will be supportive of you and who will not, so don't be too hard on yourself. I am still surprised at who is or isn't supportive of my H and I staying together after this OC. I'm sorry this woman was not more helpful. You really need more allies.<P>Unfortunately, you now have the added problem of this woman's opinion of where your H should or should not be active in your church. Perhaps she is concerned that the OC will become a public issue and your H's adultery sets a poor example for the youth. I'm certainly not proud of what a poor example my H has set for OUR children, but there are ways of putting a positive spin on it. Our counselor gave us some tips for explaining it to the children when they are older.<P>As for the guilt for the OC... some will argue that the OC deserves a father just as much as a legitimate child; the difference with adultery, however, is that such a relationship CANNOT be at the expense of the legitimate wife and children. If visitation can happen with joint agreement and no contact with XOW, so be it, but that is too difficult for most couples and XOW to arrange. <P>So sorry for your pain. Hope this helps,<BR>Jenny

The lady at your church has a problem with a holier than thou attitude. Your husband is giving more to those youth than I am sure a lot of other folks in the church are doing. His leadership is up to him, you & the minister of the church. I am sure this lady will tell someone & start issues. I am very sorry for that. Maybe I am just too judgemental based on my experience with church. <P>There is no reason to feel guilty for not wanting contact with the OC. I personnaly think that is the very best thing for the child. The OW should be concerned about finding that child a full-time dad. Your H cannot be a fulltime dad to OC unless he is part-time to your children, or part-time to both yours & OC. That is wrong in my opinion. The OW should either take responsibility for raising child by herself or find herself a husband & father for the OC. All this stuff of baing a partial father is damaging to all the children involved (once again in my opinion). <P>I know lots of folks think that even a little contact is better than none, but I just don't see that point as being true. A full-time father is the best option & with your H out of the picture, maybe the OW will get busy & find that porr child a father & not settle on having him in the picture a few hours a month. <P>As I said, I am not shy of opinion! Ha! <P>Take care... Carolyn

Thanks for your support. the woman i told about the OC/OW doesn't go to the same church as we do, so her opinion of what should be done in this situation is not revelant to the church it just hurt me.<BR>

I've been just where you are, 1fool, being confused and doubting my every step, and allowing the opinions of non-involved parties to create yet more confusion. This woman seemed to express no concern for YOU or YOUR children at all, only for the OC and H. Obviously she has never been in this position in her own marriage. People who have not are so quick to advise us to sacrifice our marriages and welfare of our kids up in order to protect the innocent OC. Forget her, because if this happened to her today, I'll so bet that she would not be willing to take a fall for OC. <P>Yes, people do seem to blame the wives, as if we are the ones forcing H not to interract with OC. There are many, many cases of single men who do not have relationships with their children born out of wedlock. Who does society scapegoat then? Don't accept this blame. You didn't ask for this at all. <P>You've learned the lesson, the hard way, not to confide in those who have no idea of what you speak, even those that appear to be rational. Ignore her.

1fool,<P>I understand how you feel. I have told my closest friends, some are supportive, and some want to kill my H, and think I should leave. I have found that this is the only area and forum where you can speak you mind and vent. Before this forum was set up, we had to do discussions in the General Questions area. Let me tell you it got hot and heavy over there with most people saying how there had to be contact with the OC, and how the OW was most likely lied to. And these are people who are recovering from a betrayal, but when it came to this subject they didn't leave much room for forgiveness. Your feelings are normal. You will never know for sure how someone will react, it is a BIG deal, and most people don't know what to say. Just come here and let us help you, it will always make you feel better. Your in my thoughts and prayers.<P>babstr.

Again thank you. Things are going very well right now, my H has decided to take some time off from the church and work on us.<BR>That is a very good thing for me. I have always felt like i have to compete with the church stuff when it comes to my H's time.<BR>On the surface the healing seems to be going well, but i'm just waiting for the next bomb to drop. I think we have the CS stuff taken care of, so we can now adjust our lives to paying for this kid until he is 18.<BR>

1FOOL:<BR>I am so glad you are not listening to that lady. Obvoiusly that lady has never gone through 1% of what we have. I have never confided in anybody, expect somebody else who is inour same spot, because they do not understand and they are so easy to judge. My opinion in this issue is that the OWand OC should live as far away as possible to you and your family, there should be no contact and that OW should try to re-do her life and find herself her own family!<BR>You are not suppose to have to deal withthis OC in any way shape or form and your H was never asked an opinion about this child being born so why should he be part of it? My H wants NO PART in it, it was his choice I never told him the opposite but he is aware on how I feel and I am so sorry but I would never let the OC in my house, sorry that is the way I feel!<BR>fambis

1Fool,<BR> <BR>I don't care for your name bec you are not a fool. We all did what we are suppose to do - trust our husbands to be totally committed to us. I agree with the others here. You never know what an outsider will say.<P>I've been away for awhile, but I'm curious bec my H was also active in the church at D time. Was there any advice about the OC? I didn't get the same advice as Happy_girl. We were - not we- H was told he has both a financial and an emotional obligation to the OC. I think the bottom line is, can H really live with his decision to not be involved? <BR>During the pregnancy my H said he wanted no involvement, but I knew in the back of my head that he couldn't do that. That led to secret visits after birth of OC. As for me, I can live with the OC involvement. I just can't live with secrets. God really opened my heart to the OC. H has partial custody.

I'm not involved in this type of situation, but I have to weigh in on this.<P>People are idiots, especially when you're involved in a crisis. We as humans like to live inside little boxes where we think we know all the answers, and it's when someone we know has a crisis that we either realize we don't, or show how dumb we are.<P>Your friend has shown how dumb she is.<P>The beauty of the Internet is that it allows you to make "situational friends" -- friends like the people here who are there for you in your crisis in a way "real world" friends can't. It's human nature to want to back away from someone else's crisis, for fear it's "catching" -- whether it's divorce, infidelity, illness in the family, whatever. I see it in my own H now that my stepdad is gravely ill. <P>I have a small army of friends that I know only through E-mail, and they have been more supportive than any real-world friends could be...not because they're "better", but just because distance provides perspective.<P>Keep coming here for your support, 1fool. And change your screen name.

BRAVO!! <P>Well said dazed and confused! I too have made several friends over the internet and it has made a world of difference.<P>And I agree about the name change, you are not a fool! Get yourself a new name, something positive! Just don't forget to let us know what it is!!!! <BR><P>------------------<BR>happy_girl

Everyone here is right on the money! Hon, you don't have anything to feel badly about. I have off and on (so I know where you are coming from), however, this was your H's choice and he didn't ask you if it was okay to sleep with OW and not use protection(?) now did he? See how silly that sounds - putting any blame on you about the situation you find yourself in is ludicrous (especially from this "friend's" prospective) How dare she be anything but supportive of you. SHE is the reason many people shy away from churches, etc. Having no empathy for someone's pain - and putting down the person that is crying for help - it makes me so sick. And then the gall of telling you what your H should do, etc. (and then she doesn't even go your church?) Man - she takes the cake. You just needed someone to talk to and you thought you could get support from her - like someone else mentioned - she simply disappointed you in who you thought she really was. Hold your head high and know that we are all here (in spirit) should you need anything.<P>------------------<BR>

I to have to agree with everyone on this post. That church woman was not a real church-goer, because if she was she would have prayed for you and your family. She would have help you to deal with your crisis.<P>As far as the blaming goes, I too felt that people blamed me, but then I realize that it was not my fault. I did nothing wrong. My fault was trusting (putting my H above everyone and everything). Thinking that he would not/could not do something like this. My minister told me that my H is human and being human we err.<P>Work on restoring your relationship with your H.<P>I pour my situation to two good friends. Both understand, but one I stop telling all to, because my situation brought up her problems.<P>My H has had bonded with the other child and wants to continue, I have no problem. The OW has a problem, which is her problem, that she has to overcome.<P>Take care. ITS <P>For happy-girl What type of tips were given to you on how to tell your children. If things go the way with the DNA testing---if the OC is my H, we will need to tell our girls (12&15).

in the south,<P>i think you mixed me up with someone else. we don't have children yet. i wish i knew what to tell our kids someday. as one day we will have children and you can't keep secrets forever. if you find out any good advice, let me know. we have thought of getting divorced then remarried, since we have yet to get married thru the church. then we would have a different anniversary. ahh, the things we think of sometimes. i can't help but worry what my kids will think... any ideas??<P>------------------<BR>happy_girl

Hmmmph. Snort. Groan.<P>NO Fool: (You are no one's Fool, Dear One)<P>I bet you are as a$$ tired of those self-righteous prigs as I am, aren't you?<P>Well, some people, like that "Church Lady"...(isn't that special???) haven't walked a mile in your shoes and is clueless on the horrendous impact your husband's actions visited upon your family with his involvement with the OW that resulted in an OC. <P>Until Church Lady has experienced this horror first-hand, she will be unable to give appropriate advice, empathy or understanding, compassion and thoughtful dialogue.<P>This is an opportunity to learn when someone comes to you for advice about something that you have not experienced, you will know to listen with quiet patience, kindness, love and understanding...do the opposite for someone else that this woman did to you. She's an idiot, too.<P>I never could have survived the past two years without finding this forum a year ago. We were all brought here to give each other comfort and strength through our common bond. Bring your questions and feelings here...we are all here for you.<P>You know, it's funny. She probably meant well, and thought she was being all altruistic, mewling about the needs of the OC as if the OC was the only person who warranted any kind of compassion or consideration. <P>While I feel compassion for my husband's OC, I want nothing to do with her, and neither does he...nor does the OW want anything to do with us..."just keep the dollars coming", is her mantra.<P>Look, the best thing for the OC, since everyone is so dang concerned for it's welfare, would have been to have been given up for ADOPTION to a loving, two-parent household where the people were capable of providing the advantages and the love that a little one requires. <BR>These selfish OW's come off like The Madonna (not the material girl...well, on second thought, um, maybe...) and everyone falls over each other to show all this empathy and concern for them when they have committed the most despicable and most devastating, life-altering adultery by knowingly bedding a married man and in most cases deliberately got themselves pregnant, IMHO.<P>It is misplaced compassion. The compassion should go to the devoted, loyal wife and original children whose lives have been changed forever. Ugh. The ignorance and self-righteousness gives me heartburn. Tums, anyone?<P>Catnip =^^= <p>[This message has been edited by catnip (edited July 18, 2000).]

Great post Catnip! I'm going to print this one out and keep it for inspiration. <P>As far as Church Ladies go, our OW *still* proclaims herself to be a devoted servant of God. Can anyone say HYPOCRISY? I don't put much stock in Church Ladies anymore.