Hi everyone -- Heavenly here -- ready to tell my story for the first time to the world.<P>Ten years ago my H had an affair. At the time we had a wonderful marriage except for one major problem -- for five years I had been trying to get pregnant and when the problem was finally fixed, I lost four children through miscarriage. The last one was at five months and was more like a stillbirth. All my life I only wanted to be a mother -- to have five kids, a huge colonial and a big dog. Well, I had the house and the dog, but the house was empty. I sank deeper and deeper into depression and I even joined a support group. But, my H who had been previously been divorced had two kids of his own. I wanted to share parenting with him and it became an obsession.<P>Later I realized that I had driven away the very things that he loved about me -- we never had fun any more, I was crying all the time, showers and christenings were unbearable. And yet he continued to tell me he loved me and that it did not matter if we never had children of our own.<P>Against this background, you can imagine my shock when he told me that he had been involved with another woman and that she was pregnant. The pain was so unbearable that my H watched me day and night -- I couldn't scream at him or cry -- he thought I would commit suicide. I just sank deeper and deeper inside myself.<P>I couldn't tell anyone. I was so embarrassed. This was not the way I had been brought up. In my world, husbands did not have children with women who were not their wives. To friends I had to keep up the facade of being the perfect couple. My H's family knew the whole ugly story because the OW was a friend of my H's sister and I refused to have any contact with them because I knew they were all laughing at me. (I never got along with my H's family)<P>OC was born and when she was 3 months old my H brought her to see me. I was so desperate to "mother" something that I actually enjoyed the visit. We saw her regularly until she was one year old. Then, the OW found out that the three of us were spending time together. She went ballistic and told my H that she thought that if she had the child they would eventually marry! My H made it clear that would never happen and so the OW refused to let him see the OC. Well, it was like losing a fifth child. My H and I decided that, rather than let the OW have such emotional control, we would sever all ties and he would only send monthly financial support.<P>I found out about 18 months ago that the OW contacted my H at work when the OC was 6 years old and that he had been secretly seeing the child under the guise of working on the weekend. When I confronted him, my H told me that it was driving him crazy that he had a child "out there" and he just wanted to make sure that she was raised properly. He was afraid that if he told me I would leave him.<P>And so I am back to worrying about the OW. I know that she still has hope that she can win my H back. I feel that since she stole him once, she can do it again. The past 18 months have not been easy for us. We started quarreling over the time spent with the OC, what he and the OW talked about, extra money that he gives her whenever she says the OC needs something. We now have two children of our own and I resent every dime that is spent and every minute that is used on the OC.<P>But, the bickering led to an unexpected side effect five months ago. I discovered some e-mails on the computer that showed my H was having a very explicit internet affair. That came from out of left field. I confronted him and he admitted that he had been writing to a woman he met on the computer but it was to vent his frustration about our home situation. My H agreed to go to counselling immediately and we seemed to work that problem out quickly and we're back on the straight road (I hope).<P>But, the internet cheating has revived all those old feelings from the affair. I always thought that my marriage was worth saving. This second challenge, although a much weaker one than the OC, has still made me question whether I made the right decisions. <P>Right now I have refused to have anything to do with the OC and I know that has hurt my H. But, she is a reminder of a horrible and painful experience that I fight to keep under control. Has anyone made the decision to welcome the OC into their family? How has that worked -- the good points and the drawbacks? <P>Thanks for listening. Just from reading your posts I know that I will find the answers I am looking for through your support and I believe in my heart that God will bless us all.<P>- Heavenly

HB,<BR> You are an incredibly strong person to have gone through all this for so long. Not only the first OW and OC, but now the internet thing. You are in good company here. I know others here have had similar problems. I have the OW and OC, but no internet OW. Keep your head up. We are glad you are here.

I am so sorry that you are in this situation. I do hope that you find a comfort here there is help in numbers. I am working on my marriage, and we have no contact with the OC. I too could not accept the OC. I know you are feeling conflicted over your personal feelings and your husbands. You have lived with this for so long. Do your children know anything? Do they wonder where daddy is when he is visiting with the OC? Does your H plan to include the OC along with your children? Sorry to ask so many questions. I was just wondering how far you are being pulled, and if it includes your personal children. I know it is difficult. You sound like the rest of us who are just now going through it. I don't know how I would handle it if my H slipped even if it was on the internet. How is the counseling going? I can understand your feelings when twice your h has gone to discuss your life with a stranger. I am praying for you.<P>babstr.

hb26,<BR> I am glad you found your way here. The people on this site have helped me a great deal. Nothing helps like that of caring people who understand. I wanted to ask you, 10 years ago when your H had a affair did you 2 get counseling? My H also had a affair 10 years ago, but we both burried it and swept it under the carpet. I now believe had we delt with his issues back then, and relearned how to communicate apporpriatly, and just stayed friends with each other it wouldnt have happened again. We are now counseling, talking, dating and constantly talking about our dreams and the future. I am glad you 2 are in counseling. I firmly believe anything can be over come if both (especially the betrayer) work at it. I Believe affairs happen for a reason. Mostly on the part of the betrayer. For us there is so much pain we have to deal with before we can get to the issues. So it is a long process. I am sorry for all your losses, and am very happy for you that you were able to have 2 children. It is hard like you said you cant talk about it to people. I am sorry his family has made you feel bad. To bad they cant be supportive to you in the admirable thing you are doing in trying to hold your family together. You are in a tuff spot. These OW's can be relentless. I too believe most any OW who gets PG by a MM it is a best making sure of a life long tie to him. But more likely it is in hopes the Wife will leave since he wont leave the wife. Its late I am rambeling. I just wanted to say hi, and see about the counseling after the 1st affair. 2Hurt

hb26,<P>thanks for posting your story. i hope that here you will find support and friendship, as i definitely have. i don't know what i did before i found MB, but i am glad i did. i too read all the previous stories before i posted, it helped me feel at ease posting such a personal "horror story" (as you so appropriately titled your post). i find i constantly learn something new and also it gives me a place to vent if i need to. i hope that you and your H can get thru this most recent affair. you'll be in my prayers and again, welcome.<P>happy_girl

Hi Heavenly,<P>Welcome? My H and I see OC every other weekend bec H has partial custody. There are pros and cons.<BR>Will have to write about them later. Have to run.<BR>God Bless You!<P> CD<P>

Hey sweetie. Welcome (so sad). My H has OC and I was adamant against him seeing him - w have 3 yr. old D - and the OW was our daycare caregiver (19 yrs. old). I finally agreed for the sake of our marriage and after I found out my H was "sneaking" to see OC that I would agree to include him in our lives - however OW was not keen on that - it seems that they get involved with someone married and then miracuously do not want their child around the married "unit." They are unbelievable. The sneaking around part is the part that hurts - when your H is seeing her behind your back. To me that is a double betrayal to you - and he is putting the OW's and his feelings before your own. If it is indeed his child (have you had DNA?) and if he is paying child support he is entitled by law to certain visitation - and she cannot say "without you around". Good grief - these OW really take the cake. I'm furious today - at just how far they push the envelope. I'm so happy for you that you have 2 children - find your solace with them until you sort through your feelings. My H won't go to counseling - so therefore we are getting nowhere - He basically has his cake and eat it too. He sees OW with OC (behind my back still) and he has me and D at home to come home too. I'm trying to work on my self esteem and get control - so that I can leave him - I feel so much for you and your strength. This is a wonderful place to come to - especially when "no one" friends, family, etc. could ever understand the pain and the upheavel you're going through. Although I don't have any words of wisdom- do know that you're not alone.<P>------------------<BR>

HB26,<BR>Thank you for sharing your story and welcome to the forum. As Catnip said in the other thread, I'm not sure how you have managed this for the last several years without the support we all share here. Catnip and I are the same timeline. Our OC's are coming up on their first birthdays (how you holding up on that front, Catnip?) My H and I had some contact with the OC in the beginning but it got to be too much for me. We have been in counseling for the last 18 months and we are still working on our issues. My H, whose father died when we was 4-1/2 years old, wants to include the OC in his/our lives. I feel that our marriage needs to be healthy before we can do that. We have 3 children of our own. Sometimes I feel like I can handle having the OC in our lives, sometimes I feel like I can't. Our children don't know anything about the affair/OC. I want to protect them as much as we can. There are no easy answers.<P>Take care,<BR>Audrey

Welcome! You will find here al the support and a lot of answers to your questions. In my case we do not have contact with OC I cannot deal with it. But i do know that there are some members here that they do.<BR>Hang in there you came to the right place.<BR>fambis

Heavenly,<P>As I was saying before, there are pros and cons. At first my H told me he would not have contact with OC, but I knew in my heart that he could not do that. Of course you know what happened - secret visits. Like DD said, that was like a double betrayal.<BR>Sometime during counseling we went to a marriage retreat. Apparently, we weren't the only ones in our situation bec the pastor said if a H messed up and had a baby by an OW, he has no business visiting child at OW's house. He said H needs to get the right papers to pick up OC at the door and drop communication with OW. By that time I had already insisted he get partial custody. Anyway, it erased the need for "secret visits". <BR>It was very difficult at first, looking at the evidence. But it became easier and easier. Our boys know OC. They interact with him although there is an age difference. The OC is 3 now. It took a while for my older son to accept him (he's now 18) but he has come around.<BR>The down side - The down side for me is that I'm not allowed to go with H to pick up or drop off OC. That alone really bothers me. I don't even know if I want to go, but not being allowed to go hits a nerve inside me everytime H leaves for pick up or drop off. That is one issue that has not been resolved for us.

Thank you to everyone -- your welcome and sharing made it easy for me to tell my story. I will try to answer the many questions I was asked.<P>Babstr, I am constantly walking a tightrope. My kids don't know about OC, they think my H is working overtime when he visits. Surprisingly my H does not want the kids to know about the OC! My H had a terrible family life as a child - father was alcoholic and abused him and siblings. H feels embarrassed and upset by OC - he says he never wanted to have kids outside of marriage. OW said she was on birth control and he tried to talk her out of having/keeping OC. But, because of his awful family history he does not want to have an abandoned child in the world and that is why he was sneaking around to see OC.<P>When this all happened ten years ago, we did not seek counselling and I believe that was a huge mistake. Now with the internet affair, we have learned so much through counselling and we are communicating on a level we never did before. <P>2Hurt -- I believe both affairs (10 yrs ago and now) happened for a reason. I do not and will not take responsibility for "driving" him into the arms of OW, but I know that it must have been hard on him to live with me while I was constantly depressed, crying all the time, starting arguments over minor things. He says that he was feeling unloved and he wanted his wife back the way I used to be. When he couldn't have that he was vulnerable to someone else who offered "comfort".<P>While I can never condone what he did, I can understand that we are all human and we are all looking for our personal version of love and concern. If H and I had been able to communicate better than maybe we both would have satisfied our needs better and avoided this whole mess.<P>DD -- I cannot imagine anything more terrible than being betrayed with the woman you entrusted the care of your own children to. OW do take the cake! What I resent most of all is that they seem to call all the shots - our H's have to be concerned about their needs and their feelings because they have the power to legally harass our families - emotionally and financially. <P>Audrey - you made so much sense about the need for the marriage to be on sound ground if we are to see the OC. For now I am comfortable with not seeing the OC, but I worry about my own 2 kids. They are growing up in a very loving household - regardless of his faults, my H is a wonderful and devoted father. OC knows about them - she knows their names and their ages. I worry that sometime in the future someone, even the OC herself, may tell my kids and that they will resent their father for lying to them for all these years. <P>What my H does not seem to understand is that this whole OW/OC situation destroys so many peripheral lives. I don't want my kids living with the type of doubts and betrayal that I live with. So, right now I am leaning towards telling them while they are young so that they can grow into understanding the situation. But I am not sure that is right either -- I don't want to make them insecure and have them believe that their father was trying to find a replacement child.<P>CD - I think you hit my feeling square on the head. The OC represents so many things -- physical sex between our H and OW, emotional feelings (whether love or desire) that our H had for OW, and a real relationship that the man of our dreams had with someone else -- while they were committed to us. Some of those pictures I still have in my head and they pop up from time to time to torment me. <P>Even with the pain and the sadness, I tell my H that I took my vows seriously and I want my marriage to work. There have still been many wonderful times during these past ten years when we have been able to push the OW/OC out of our minds and enjoy each other and our family. I guess I am saying it was worth the struggle and I don't intend to give up.<P>I am so glad to know all of you and I will do my part to help us all keep rising above that struggle.<P>Take good care all,<BR>Heavenly

Heavenly,<BR>I can see many similarities between our situations. Our H's sound alike in their need to be involved with the OC. I don't feel my H wants to be involved with the OC out of feelings of love and longing but more out of his feeling of responsibility. But I don't believe that my H has fully thought about or realized the effect that this will have on his family and close friends. My biggest concern, as it sounds like yours is also, is the effect on our children and their relationship with their father. One difference with us is that my H was not a very good father before the affair so he is having to learn how to improve in that area (and he's doing a great job). That has made it harder to accept the OC.<P>I also struggle with what and when we will tell our children. Jenny has given some good suggestions on that in the past. The issue for me is that I don't want to lie to my children if the OC is involved in their lives. But, at the same time, I don't want to tell them and expect them to keep it a secret. I think that is one more of the effects that our H's may not realize. I don't want my children to have to deal with some of the feelings of shame and embarrassment that I feel. <P>I don't think that I could deal with my H taking time away from our family to spend time with the OC. But that is mostly because of issues that we have with the kind of father that he was in the past. <P>It would be so much easier to recover in our marriage without the ongoing issue of what to do about the OC. I want that issue to just go away!<P>Take care,<BR>Audrey

You will see my topic entry above you, and as you will see I am not sure what I am in store for.<P>I don't see me getting through the OC possibility at all as you have. I just feel that I can't possibly live through that as great as the potential of our marriage being better than ever I just could not deal with that. I can not share, I am not suppose to have to share, I married him, no one else. In order to survive this I just may have to quit. I can't stand the pain even though we don't know for sure, imagine what will happen to me if we do find out it is his.<P><P>------------------<BR>Carrie