ow just called my H to tell him that if I bring any more stuff up to her job that she is going to throw it in my face. ????? What the hell? I mean every week my H and I spend 50 dollars or so on clothes, food, diapers, blankets, you name it... and I take it up to her job. Why the hell would she refuse it? We spend all this money on a child we arent even allowed to see!!!<BR>(Granted, in my case its for purely selfish reasons... I figure what we spend now will help with child support when it comes around)<P>But the point is, this is stuff for her child.. why in the world would she refuse it?<P>Because she is a spiteful ungrateful little ... well you can probably fill in the blanks... <P>However, this "girl" doesnt know who she is messing with.<BR>Leave my H to himself and he wouldnt do a whole lot about seeing the baby... cept maybe sneak around behind my back.<BR>However, now that I have become involved.. lil miss trailer trash is in for more then she can handle... thats guaranteed. <BR>I am most conceited about my brains... <BR>And I love to use them. <P>Mis thing is going to be really pissed when I come up there to pick HER child up for the weekend... I cant wait till Thursday to talk to that Lawyer<BR>Thanks for letting me vent!<P>I needed that!

Hey Littlebird.. have you kept recipts for the stuff yall have bought for the child? Has she written anything down refusing this stuff? Why is she so pissed off all of a sudden?<P>Broken_wings

LB,<BR>I know you're upset at her for good reasons but things occurred to me. Perhaps she doesn't want anything from you and your H for the same reason we don't want anything from the XOW: who wants reminders of such a painful situation? If that is the case, it is not too hard to understand. She might also feel like you (two) are trying to say she can't care for the kid adequately on her own--who knows what people think? Maybe she is ashamed of embarrassing questions at work. Who knows.<P>If you are only giving her things to look good at court later, it probably won't matter even if you have documentation. The ch-support is pretty much a percentage of income, varying by state, and I never heard of the support being allowed to be given in the form of goods (except health insurance or child care). <P>I hope neither party uses the child as a pawn for revenge.<BR>

Hi just wanted to clarify...my asking if there was documentation on the things they have done for oc was not to get out of cs or even to lower it (although some states will lower it if you are paying for certain things for the child outright). I am asking those questions for when ow wants to fight about visitation. I think (bc of my ow) ow are going to try and say that mm and wife cant care for oc bc wife might take out what happened on oc. If she trys that route then littlebird can say "hey, look what Ive tried to do for this child that is a reminder of my H's infidelity...see what kind of person I am. I will never hurt that child."<BR>Sraight out..it just shows the judge that they do care for the child and are trying to do right by it.

Jenny, I see your point, however this is things concerning her CHILD!! What mother in their right mind wouldnt want help caring for her child?? AND the whole reason we started doing this is because SHE demanded it! NOw all of a sudden, she doesnt want anything from us! It makes no sense. I honestly thing she is pissed because *I* Have been taking the stuff to her and not my H. <P>As far as the looking good for child support, my thinking is that maybe if we show that we have been doing things for the baby, the BACK child support wont kill us. She filed for it about a month ago, we havent gotten papers for it yet but I know that you have to pay child support from the date she FILED. That was what I was trying to say. <P>As far as making her miserable with picking the baby up, I have done everything in my power to be nice to this girl, I know she got the raw end of the deal. She is 19 alone and has a child with something whom she thought loved her. I FEEL for this girl. But she has done everything in her power to make ME miserable, to make sure that my H and I DONT work things out. <P>I had been talking to her on the phone about twice a week, about the baby, my kids, just things in general... I had to stop calling her because everytime I did she made a point of telling me things my H did for her, with her, too her... I couldnt stand it... I would get off the phone with her and fight with him about things she told me. I have tried everything in my power to be nice and make this a happy ending for eveyrone involved... I have even taken my children up to see her child at her house so he would know his brothers and my sons would know about the baby. <P>She is just being spiteful that my H isnt with her, I think she finally realizes that him and I are going to be together and it has finally sunk in. Now she is being a ***** about everything.<P>My point is, I can play that way too. It didnt have to be like this. Now it does.

Littlebird...I dont think it is such a great idea that you talk to her about things. I did the same thing and it drove me crazy bc hussy would do the same thing...ya know start comparing. And of course Id get angry at H. Hed get angry with ow, which at the time I was glad he was angry with her. Keep your friends close and your enemys even closer kind of thing. It totally backfired on me. Backfired on her too. Now I realize she was telling me the things she did, not to prove my H is a total liar and all, but to rub it in my face. She was trying to convince me (and herself, I think) that she meant something to my H. The fact is she didnt matter at all to him.<BR>I think weve already established these kind of people are selfish...why should we think theyd actually put their kids before themselves? Puke, puke, puke...these women make me sick!!!!!!!!!!<BR>Anyway let little girl go on with her bad self. Go to court, get it legal. Then dont worry about playing her stupid high school games anymore.<BR>Did i mention these people make me sick?<P>We are WIVES....Hear us RoaR!!!!!!!

My only advice to you would be to back off a bit. I can see this whole thing blowing up in your face in court. A Judge very well could feel that you are harassing this girl by going to her work to deliver things for the baby. In the Judge's eyes, this is your husband's child, not yours and your husband should be handling it. Being a step mom myself I can tell you that you have no rights in regards to this child. A Judge looks extremely negatively towards a step mom trying to "step on the bio mom's toes" and it doesn't matter who your husband is married too. Your in a tough situation and I don't know if I could stand by my husband if he fathered another child while being married to me but it also could be very likely that the Judge will see you as wanting visitation with this other child solely to hurt the other woman. Being a mother myself, having another woman mother my child would be extremely difficult and painful. Your a mom so you know this too. Gives you leverage to hurt her. Maybe she deserves it for what she's done but I think that in the majority of cases such as yours the man is better off fighting the battle of visitation on his own. I truly think a judge is going to see it as revenge on your part and an angry judge can make your life miserable. Your husband screwed up big time and now it's time for him to pay the piper. Sometimes I think the betrayed forget that their spouse deserves all of the anger and hurt and the ow/om does.

No offense intended and forgive me if I am wrong, but it doesnt sound as though BonnieSept is in this situation. IF your H has an affair and has a child I think it is extremely commendable of the Wife to allow H to have relationship with oc.<BR>Everytime you look in the eyes of the oc...regardless of how much YOU love oc or how innocent oc is, you will know that your wonderful H had sex with another woman and in some cases told this ow things he told you. Had a relationship with this person. Why would anyone hurt themselves like this just to have a little bit of "leverage". No one is worth that. Surely someone as wise as a judge would see that.

Broken wing: Bonnie Sept is NOT in our situation, but a long time member on the forum with excellent advice and a lot of compassion. We all 'cruise' different sites on the forum...I like to go over to Recovery and Divorced to hang around and lurk and sometimes post...even though I am not divorcing for the same reasons they are.<P>Little Bird: Regardless of what your true motives are, and despite what the OW is thinking, I can tell you from first hand experience that talking to the OW at all can be extremely problematic. Just because I sent a letter explaining my pain, it caused her to fabricate charges in order to obtain an OFP against me. No matter what the Betrayed Spouse says or does for the OW, even if it is to show compassion, it is better not to get involved with this person or try to 'bond' the kids and enmesh everyone into eachother's lives. Trust me...this is not a situation that will bring harmony to everyone's lives. Just a lot of unwanted "drama". <P>I hope we aren't going to start challenging each other and get combative because somehow we took someone's loving concern as a personal affront here on the forum. If you don't like the advice or the experienced information from other members, you can say so or ignore it without getting defensive or assuming things. Anyone cane come here...you do not to be in our horrible situation to see things clearly and offer empathy, good sound objective advice or support. Take what you like, leave the rest.<P>Catnip =^^= <p>[This message has been edited by catnip (edited September 13, 2000).]

I can see alot of points in BonnieSept reply.<BR>But I was under the impression that showing a united front and strong family unit would be BETTER for my H come time for court. Personally I think that have a family is HELPING him not hurting him. I do not plan to get involved in the actually court hearings. I dont want to have to talk at all so while I will be there with all the lawyers visit I will not go to the actual court proceedings unless our lawyers says otherwise. <P>Its not like we are trying to TAKE her child permanently, we just want weekends. <P>And your wrong about me, my H was with her (for a whole week before he came running back to me) and I didnt have a problem letting the two of them take the kids to the movies one Sunday. The way I figure, if he is going to be with this woman then my children might as well get to know her. <P>My H said the whole time my baby (He is two) was asking him , wheres mommy? wheres my mommy? LOL.... <P>Besides that... the court can not tell him that he cant see the baby just because she doesnt want him to or because she doesnt want the baby around me.. Thats ludicrous. Makes no sense whatsoever. I have NEVER done anything but be nice to her. Bought her child clothes. ( I love baby clothes and it was on sale)<P>I just dont see that this is going to be a problem.... <BR>She is a young single mother, who lives in a home with her parents, her mother has a boyfriend that she flaunts in front of her fathers face and goes to stay with ever weekend.. Her father is a drug addict that parties every weekend and gets high with her 15 year old brother. <P>We on the other hand a family, we both work, we have our own place, our two boys have their own room, we arent rich but we get by. <BR>We dont have parties, or anything like that.<BR>Why in the world would a judge NOT give us weekend visitation?

Oh I think your husband will get weekend visitations if that's what he wants I'm just trying to tell you to be extremely careful. I've been in the court system long enough to know that they think and care about the child only and the mother attached to the child, in your case the ow. Many times what seems to be crystal clear to you is a different story in the courts. I agree. A home with loving parents, a moderate income etc..is much better then a home filled with drugs and what ever else the ow subjects the child too. But, you go in the court room talking too much about the "nice" home you have and how you have extra money to buy little cute baby clothes for the child and your saying to the judge "Hey, sock that cs right on cuz we can support the poor little girl living with mommy and daddy". And, like it or not the judge will see you as wanting revenge rather then caring about your husband's relationship with the oc. Now (and this is JUST my opinion)I think your husband screwed up and he does need to take some financial responsiblity for this child and I think it's wonderful that he wants to participate in this childs life since this child doesn't have a father in the home. That's a good and decent way to make up for his mistake. But, you need to keep your distance for this fight. He screwed up and it's his battle to fight. Wait until it's done and he has visitation and then remember to love that child when it's in your home more then you hate the OW. Just back off so it doesn't back fire on you.

I realize that a good deal of what you say is true... IMO. Thats why I will not being going to court. I dont want the judge to look at me and say, "After all these two (H and OW) have done to you, what the hell are you doing here and what are your motives for wanting to participate in this childs life" I think you are right in the fact that they will think that I am doing it for the wrong reasons. Thats why I am not going. I dont want them to question me.<P>Gods honest truth. I cant hold it against my H that he met her and she got pregnant. I think that is what keeps me around and from going crazy. When he met her we were separated. I had kicked him out and told him I didnt love him, didnt want him blah blah blah. (We were having other problems, money, him not working at the time) We got back together about 2 months later but by then the damage was done. He didnt tell me he was seeing her because he didnt want to lose me, he didnt tell her about me because he didnt want to lose rights to the baby as she is trying to do now. <BR>I cant say anything about him getting her pregnant. We were officially separated when it happened.

Sorry...didnt mean to step on anyones toes. I was a little uptight earlier today.<BR>God Bless...