What a welcome! I came home today, went to dinner with kids and W and had a good evening overall. Then..after the kids were asleep, we started talking and after about an hour she told me that she didn't think it was worth trying anymore. Let me back up...I had asked her to read "Surviving an Affair" and she read most of it while I was gone. I asked her what she thought and she said it "sounded good in theory". She said that she didn't think she could try it because she couldn't be honest. She said that she has never been honest and didn't know how to change that to make our situation better. I asked her if she had talked to OM while I was gone and she said "once". I asked if that was the truth and she started crying and said she had talked to him a lot and he had gone with her to her last doctor's visit. She even said that she lied about talking to OM when she was supposedly in withdrawal. How nice! So, now she doesn't think that OM is influencing her decision to call it quits with me. I tried to tell her that it was like an addiction and she just laughed. I made it clear that I didn't want to quit and made it clear to her that she was the one that was giving up..not me. She said that she accepted that and will do whatever she needs to for that kids to stay with me and will pay child support. She agrees that the kids are better off with me. It is so sad to me that a mother could agree that her kids are better off with their father and practically abandons them for her fantasy OM. I didn't feel anything, just a weird sense of relief. I told her that I wished she would reconsider and she said that she wished she could, but that she couldn't. I don't know what to do now. Do I go ahead and follow through with the divorce or what? She doesn't seem to give me much hope or options. It really makes your day when she says, "you know, it is his baby.."

She may as well have ripped your heart out...it would have hurt less.<P>I can't remember your time line, however, some say around six months of a good Plan A, of you can hack it, is a fair amount of time to show your wife how committed you are and plenty of time for the OM to screw up, start making demands or withdraw from her himself. After Plan A, then comes the risky Plan B where you extricate yourself entirely from your wife and have no communication to let her see how much she misses you and sees what life is like without you in the picture at all, not for phone calls, conversation, support of any kind. Sometimes Plan B really shakes them inot reality, sometimes it just widens the gap. It's a crap shoot. <P>It's apparent that your wife is too immersed in the affair to see the realities and she will eventually rue the day she replaced you with OM...she will see he is not what he appears to be. The guilt she'll endure because of your kids will be crushing, not to mention what she did to you and the marriage.<P>I wish I had some sage advice, Floored. you're in God's hands now and facing an impossible situation. Prayer and lot's of it, may give you the guidance you need to make some difficult decisions.<P>It's little comfort to tell you your wife will one day wake up and be sorry when so many lives are effected by her actions and the toll it will take on you and your kids, but, that day will come.<P>Plan A as long as you can untol it is time to Plan B. You're in my thoughts and prayers. Stay strong and keep coming here. We're here for you and will try to help you get through these terrible times. When a spouse says these things to the BS, and awful things like this are revealed, it is difficult to know what to do or what to say to change the outcome. I often wonder what the purpose is and what it is we are supposed to learn.<P>Stay close to your kids, friends and family and do what you need to do to protect your self. Remember she isn't herself and she is dealing with major hormonal changes as well. <P>Catnip =^^=

Ditto catnip.<P>floored, I'm so sorry for you and your kids. Maybe K or someone who has succeeded in Plan A in your situation will advise soon.<BR>God bless,<BR>J

Floored,<P>I am so sorry for what has happened with your wife. I wish that I had some advise, being the W pregnant with OM child. My heart really goes out to you, and what your W is putting you through. She obviously doesn't see how much you love her, or she wouldn't be doing this, even with the hormones all screwed up. Believe me, I'm in that screwed up phase myself. There are still times that I do think about the OM, but it isn't with love, but fear. I just wish that there was some way for you to get her to realize what she has, and what she is going to give up by leaving you and the kids!!!! I have to admit that on D-day, I told my H that I would leave, because I knew how wrong I was. This was also before we found out that I was pregnant. Luckily for both of us, we realized that we had too much together to not try to make it work. And not just the kids. We've been together half our lives, and shared way too much to just throw it away for some guy that was a very smooth talker at a time that I needed it. I don't think that you should just give up, but if she chooses to leave, then maybe the Plan B will work as she sees what she is really missing. I like how a lot of the people who post put it, he is just a sperm donor. What does he have to compare to the love you have for her?!? I don't think that she is doing all the thinking for herself. She hasn't removed all the hooks he has in her, and until she does, she can't see what he is really like. You are in my prayers. As is your W, that she will see what the right decision is, for everyone involved. If there is anything else I can give you perspective on, don't hesitate to ask, you won't offend me with any questions you may ask. I am here to help in any way I can.<P>Tigger

Thank you all for the encouragement. A good night sleep really helps to clear your head. Don't get me wrong, the fog is still there, I just feel like I can handle it better in the daylight!! I think that I took the news so well last night because I feel like I had prepared myself for this possibility. The A was a lie, so why shouldn't the circumstances after the A not follow the same rules? Catnip, it's been 3 mos. since D-day and I can continue to do plan A, but what should I do when my W says she wants to end it all? Stall? Do nothing? I feel like I should choose my next step very carefully, but I sure don't want to screw something up.<BR>

floored:<P>Your situation is by no means easy, but as I see it, your priorities seem to be:<P>1. Save the marriage<P>2. Keep your children should you divorce.<P>Having said that, it seems as though she's going to make #2 possible for you. I would agree with catnip at this juncture: you want to continue with Plan A for as long as you can. It does seem as though you're having a positive effect right now. So I'd call your plan A "successful", even though your wife hasn't yet ended the affair.<P>If you can continue to execute Plan A without lovebusting, I would suggest that if your wife wants to end the marriage, that you respond:<P>"I still believe in our marriage, and that we can recreate our love. I'll work hard to do this with you, and do anything you want (if this is true) short of divorcing you. If you feel the need to divorce or separate, I understand---but I won't participate."<P>Make this be her decision. Make her do the work. She wants a separation, have HER be the one that leaves. This will also help you in a custody case down the road---should that happen.<P>I would think she's got to make a decision soon. It's unlikely that she'll have the baby and bring him/her home---still while she's having the affair. Possible---but unlikely. And if she's going to try that, I'd suggest that you prepare for a plan B separation (again, trying to get her to move out) shortly after the baby is born. Don't make it an abandonment issue, but let her know that she will need to make a decision. I wouldn't spring this strategy on her until after the birth, however.<P>I still think that your marriage has a chance to be saved---mainly because mine was. But your wife hasn't hit rock bottom yet, and she's going to need to deal with that. If you can hang out with a Plan A strategy, that's what I'd recommend. But if you're having a hard time handling your emotions, I'd begin to prepare for Plan B. And I highly recommend the MB counseling (888-639-1639) to help with that, even if it's just a session or two.<P>

Thanks K. I was hoping you would reply. I'm not sure I understand why my Plan A is "successful". I don't feel successful! I am ok as far as emotions and I can continue to Plan A. My wife is already gone, living with her brother since Sept. 1 about an hour away. You said that she needs to make a decision soon, but..she did..she wants to end our marriage. I'm not sure what else I can do. If she hasn't hit rock bottom, what in the world can bring her to that point? I know this is the worst thing that has ever happened to me. She feels like she can make a good decision about our marriage while she is still seeing OM. How can I convince her that that is not true?

floored,<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>She feels like she can make a good decision about our marriage while she is still seeing OM. How can I convince her that that is not true?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>You can't. What you can do is let her make her own bad decisions without punishing or belittling her. When she realizes how badly she's behaving, she'll naturally think about returning to the marriage. It's your recent behaviors that will either encourage her to come back, or discourage her and help her move on.<P>You seem to be doing a good job at setting yourself up for success. I had a "successful" plan A period with my wife---although I didn't have a clue about it being successful at the time. I tried to measure my successes on my wife's behaviors. It's the wrong measuring stick to use. After my wife crashed (while I was in Plan B), and AFTER withdrawal had subsided---that's when I found out how effective my Plan A efforts were.<P>You're going to have to wait this out. And my apologies for forgetting that you're already separated. I think that's not a bad thing. I would just refuse to go along with the divorce at this point: most states have a one year separation clause (and it should be a LEGAL separation) before a no-fault divorce is granted. I don't think that your wife's fantasy relationship with the OM will remain so nice and cheery as this due-date approaches.

I don't have a problem with dragging my feet on the divorce. I think she wants me to get the lawyer and do all the work, and I just won't do it. Can you tell me what brings about "rock bottom"? I know that it might be different for different people, but is there any way that I can help bring the bottom up faster! All the lies while I thought she was telling me the truth have really confused me. Thanks for your help.

Rock-bottom for your wife will come if and when she discovers:<P>1. The OM isn't what he's all cracked up to be. The fantasy of the affair will be shattered. This often happens when they move in together and "real-life" intrudes on the relationship. There's nothing more real than a pregnancy.<P>2. She'll then realize what she's doing to her kids. And what stupid, selfish decisions she's been making have led her to a tremendous amount of UNHAPPINESS.<P>At that point, she'll reassess your past together. And if you've been doing a good job with Plan A (changing your behavior to eliminate lovebusters and meet needs that she'll allow you to meet), she may decide that the marriage is worth the effort to return to.

If it takes her moving in with OM to hit rock bottom, I don't think I could survive that. I realize I am not first priority right now, but at least the affair was in private and not in my face. If she moved in with him, I think that would be curtains for me. If I am wrong in that assumption, please tell me how I would be able to get over that. As far as the kids are concerned, I don't know what else they can do to make her realize how much they miss her. She sees them often, but night-time is the worst and she just shrugs that off when I tell her they cry for her and wake up in the night wondering where she is. Lastly, I know that there are general EN's that all women have, but without asking her, how can I narrow down the EN's that I need to meet with my W? <p>[This message has been edited by floored (edited November 29, 2000).]