Hey Guys,<BR>I saw Fr. Bliss for a while yesterday.(In the beginning he said to call whenever I needed to talk)<P>He helped a lot in saying to me that there is an unconditional love (?) between my h and me. He saw that in our very first "alone" sessions where each one of us when asked if we loved the other answered a strong "yes" without hesitation.<P>In his psychiatrist practice he said if he didn't see that,he would tell couples not to waste their money by trying to "fix" their marriage. <P>Without being able to tell me everything,he said my h showed remorse at his first session, he showed so much sorrow for the pain he caused me, and at that time I wouldn't even answer his phone calls.<P>He said he prayed with FR. that I would at least talk to him!<P>He asked me for now,to let oc issue alone. No one of us is guaranteed another day on earth.Why argue over something that isn't here yet? What if we did all this and she lied and it's not his?(fat chance she told her whole family and her h it is my H)<P>My H has said he doesn't know how he will feel by then.He has said that but the other things he's said lead me to believe otherwise.(What will kid think if I never at least meet him/her?)<P>Anyway he said to take it an hour at a time. Show our love in lovemaking again.(ok we have and it's so emotional and passionate,that I do "forget" and know it's a gift)<BR>Spend leisure time together.(we have)<P>We are to have one evening a week to talk about my feelings and questions without getting angry at each other followed by something we enjoy doing together,ie movie, out to eat,lovemaking,and NO questions during that time.<BR>We will continue our together sessions to work out our problems and alone sessions.<P>I agreed to keep trying....<BR>I really will try hard to focus on us and our happiness together.My comfort I feel just to have him here.His comfort and answered prayers that I had the grace to<BR> speak to him again and allowed us to resume sharing our lives together. He feels I am a GIFT FROM GOD!<P>I hope I can do this......<P>I hope I can lay the issue of oc to rest until spring.....<P>By the way....I started my period too yesterday,now I know why I was having such a dark sad day! Damn hormones!!!!!<P>Anyone think it's good advice I received?<P>I'll check back, please let me know if YOU think it's the right take on everything.<P>------------------<BR>Imagine....

Oh gemini Iam so relieved you went to that session. I was really worried about you. I think it sounds like a good plan. 1 hour at a time is what you go thru than a day than a few more and on on on and than someday that magical day will come when its all behind you. You will find as terrible as all this has been things really do get better. Have to go for now got to get some shopping done for Christmas. with love flowerseed<P>------------------<BR>Carol Ann

Flowerseed, I pray it's the right thing. It seems to be.....<P>Hey, remind me of your ow/oc story or point me to a thread so I can read and remember. It seems like I only remember Catnips story as in the beginning it was my hope that if things worked out for HER the exact thing would happen to me.(no oc intrference).<BR> Debi<P>------------------<BR>Imagine....

G,<BR>It must be hard not to think about OC when it seems to be the obvious kink in the works, but I do know the book we used said you should "pretend" and do the right thing for awhile in recovery and let your feelings catch up as mutual needs are met, trust rebuilt, etc. Anyway, Yes, I for one like the sound of this advice... (except that I think after some rebuilding, you have a right to vent some feelings about this OC ONCE in awhile, at least in counseling or SOMEthing! I couldn't hold everything in for MONTHS!)<P>I had to LOL about getting your period! I just got mine too. You know how women cycle together when they spend time together... do you suppose that works for message boards? Hahaha <P>J

Jenny,<BR>Ha! Ha! Ha! Yes I do know how women come together when they spend time together..lol<P>Oh! The oc issue will surface again I'm sure..not now. I will vent in my single counsel sessions for now...until 28 days from now....lol<P>I broke all the love buster rules Mon. night.. All of a sudden I started saying mean ugly things about ow and he just looked at me and calmly said"you have every right to say and feel that"<P>I called her a dark(Italian)(me too 1/2It.1/2 Irish,I'm blonde though)FAT,spandex wearing(to hold it up and in),lying,cheating,F*****G whore! Did he get hit with the FAT when she slid off her signature spandex pantihose? How could he be with such an opposite of me? I bet her fat ugly PU**Y smelled like rotton eggs! She makes me sick and you do too for putting me in the situation of believing she was my friend when the whole time he was F*****G her and they both F'd me! I hate what you did to me. I've LOVED you since we were 18 and YOU DID THIS TO ME!!!!! How dare you? How could you? She's a F****** whore and right now I hate you both!<P>Well I said a lot more but that's most of it.<BR>He remained quiet and looked scared.<P>Yesterday morning I told him I started my period. He said thank God,I know you have a perfect right to feel those things but now I know why you were extra wild.... I then told him I had been so consumed w/oc that I couldn't deal with A. When I did think of it I went a lot crazy. I said I would be careful NOT TO YELL in the future....but I'm not perfect.(like when he said he's sorry,but nobody's perfect)lol<P>Ok I've said enough for now c.u. all later....It's a new day....Another day in paradise.....<P> Debi<P>------------------<BR>Imagine....

[quote<BR> Dear happy_girl<P> I agree that you have misplaced guilt. A member once posted the story of Hagar. I went<BR> to a seminar a couple of days ago and the same issue came up, and I will relate them<BR> here.<P> Children concieved in a marriage is the legitimate heir to God's kingdom and have<BR> dominion over the devil. Children conceived out of wedlock are illegitimate and the devil<BR> has every legal status to things that joined together and not made under God's umbrella.<BR> So the devil would want more children born out of wedlock and through fornication and<BR> adultery than through the legal marriage. Hence, you have all sorts of sexual traps and<BR> enticement in this world to tell people that it is fine to not be married, etc..<P> In Genesis, Hagar is the maidservant who conceived Ismael after Sarah, her mistress,<BR> asked her to sleep with Abraham, the master, so that Abraham can have children<BR> because Sarah has been barren. ALthough Sarah was the one who was wrong in getting<BR> her husband to sleep with the maid, God eventually allowed Hagar to be driven away so<BR> that Sarah and Abraham can be together. He also blessed Sarah with Issac. God also<BR> sent an angel to Hagar when she was driven out and said that her son will have many<BR> descendants and asked Hagar to name him Ishmael and said that the son will be a wild<BR> donkey of a man; his hand will be against everyone, and everyone's hand against him,<BR> and he will live in hostility toward all his brothers. If you know the biblical and current<BR> history and geography, you will know which nations are spawned by Ishmael because<BR> they are always warring despite being wealthy.<P> Happy_girl,<BR> In your case, you did not ask your H to go and bear a child with some OW but he was<BR> unfaithful and committed that sin and the child was born out of wedlock through no fault<BR> of yours. It will be best if you both take your marriage as sacred and heal it till it is<BR> throbbing with health and love and life.<P> A marriage would take a miracle just to be happy without adultery, and what more an<BR> OC? You owe yourself the 'breastbeating to God' and crying and sobbing out to Him to<BR> heal you, make your WHOLE again, rebuild your marriage, cleanse you of your anger,<BR> uncertainties, and ask "WHY ME. LORD, help me God".<P> God loves you<BR> take care<BR> weep/quote]<P><BR>Dear Gemini,<P>I read Catnip's reply to you about looking for quotes and saw my name up in neon lights. Here is something I wrote to Happy-girl about.<P>I think in your case it is really quite straightforward given that your H is remorseful (Fully repentant?) and is a Christian, so reading the bible to understand God's stand on this can be reassuring to him. God clearly instructed Abraham to listen to his wife Sarah in the case of OC and OW, even though Sarah was wrong. God also opened Sarah's womb so you can understand how God wants to protect the institution of marriage - Sarah the wife was given the rights to her H and it is HER Son who was blessed.<P>As for your son, Michael, I believe that he is still young and speaking from a general humane feeling. You can commit this in God's hands that your son begins to understand your feelings about this matter which is not trivial but one that has hurt you so much because it was about shattered vows and betrayal. Perhaps after you have prayed for some time, you can ask God for a perfect time to speak to your son about your true feelings about the situation and how 'flippant' remarks that downgrade your real feelings have hurt you even more, etc..<P>There are two books that my family have bought that I think you will find useful. They are by Stormie Omartian - Power of a Praying Parent and Power of a Praying Wife.<P>God bless you,<P>from weep

gemini, My whole life has been a story. I feel like a cat with 19 lives. Maybe someday Ill write a book. If you go to the post heavenly how you can find a quickie on OC. If you go to the top of page and go back 60 days page 2 or 3 youll find a topic backgrounds please started by catnip youll find everyones stories.I wanted to tell you that I think its great that you have been married to the same man since you where 18. You probly dont think so right now ! But it is something special you dont see that enough in this world anymore. I cant say that Ive spent alot years screwing up. I guess God figured since I wasnt getting it he would throw some extra affects in to get my attention. If I would not have already know the damage done to children of divorce I would have called it quits again. That is one thing I said I will not do to another child. Iam glad now that I stuck it out. Things are better between us now than they have ever been. Got to run again time for kidigarden. with love flowerseed<P>------------------<BR>Carol Ann

Weep, I greatly appreciate your book and bible references! I say psalm 143 every morning as I cry during saying it out loud. I am begging God to teach me or show me the path He wants me to take.<P>My H says he doesn't know HOW he will react if it's his. I'm just scared he'll expect me to accept it as a cute little puppy,you know?<P>I know I will not continue w/him if he chooses to "visit" so it will know it's "bio" dad. I just couldn't....<P><BR>Flowerseed you sure have your hands full.<BR>I'm happy for you working things out and am grateful for all the compassion you and the others here have shown me.<P>Gonna try to look up threads.<P> Debi<P>------------------<BR>Imagine....

Gemini:<P>I am so glad you got so much out of your counselling session. Weep certainly offers a lot of spiritual and biblical guidance for us to reference and for comfort. However, we should charter a bus so all of us can get to anger management. <P>Catnip =^^=

Catnip,<BR>I know you hear this all the time but YOU KNOW EXACTLY how I feel. When you do charter that bus.....I'll be the first one to buy a ticket!<P>About prayers....I let a lot of emotion out when I pray,I cry,I get sooooo angry....I ask why?....cry again....then find peace for the moment.<P> Debi<P>------------------<BR>Imagine....

catnip,<BR>Grin: charter a bus! I love it! A cyber-bus? <P>Gemini, speaking 2+ years down this road, I want to support you in sticking to your limits. You have a good idea what you can live with, though you've probably already lived through worse than you imagined. (I know I have!) I went into this with the idea that I can keep OC and XOW "separate" to some extent... (We send OC cards/gifts, but keep contact absolutely minimum, which isn't hard long-distance; we do everything re:OC jointly too) Anyway, we just got a big package of pictures and stuff from XOW, and I think H and I BOTH saw them through a heavy haze of PAIN. I'm not sure we've done the right thing to maintain ANY contact, though we won't change from the path we've taken. I might add I really feel healed in my marriage. Having known the XOW, as I know you knew yours, it is the double betrayal that adds to this sickness.<P>Just my 2cents,<BR>Godbless,<BR>Jenny

You're right Jenny....triple hurt bcuz she's pregnant.<P> Debi<P>------------------<BR>Imagine....

Gemini1,<P>I cannot add anything to the wonderful comments and support you have already received.<P>But, I wanted to say that I loved your "lovebusters"! Every once in a while, even though H and I are doing very well, some trigger will set me off and I deliver a well-placed barrage of insults about the XOW in my life. My H watches me in amazement and like you said, it is as if he's afraid to say anthing, to move or to breathe!<P>I feel really guilty later but I must admit it feels great when it is happening!<P>I really have to work on that ...<P>Merry Christmas.<BR>- Heavenly

Heavenly.....heh,...heh,...heh,...Ha! Ha!...lol<P>He did say a few days later....Deb you have to stop that crazy wild anger or it will make me want to leave.<P>My reply...I'm sorry but I can't control my mouth sometimes. Whatever, if you leave cuz of THAT and I stayed after what you did? GO!!!<P>I SAID it was HORMONES!(period) he said.....Oh good 28 more days will at least get me through the super bowl in peace!lol<P>And that was it!<P><BR> Debi<P>------------------<BR>Imagine....