I mention K because he has first hand knowledge, other do as well. Please all that have an opinion respond.<P>I have come to somewhat of a dilemma. I realize this may come across as cold or callous but I'm battling this within myself to no end. It would appear that as time goes on so does my hope. I feel myself sinking further into depression over my circumstances. I have all but given up hope of getting custody of the kids (after speaking to a dozen or so attorneys ). So enters the real problem, my fourth son is not biologically mine, and now I'm having feelings to the effect that once the marriage is dissolved should my "father ship" to him be also? When all this started I agreed to accept him as my son both because I loved my W and the Lord impressed me that way. Kind of like in accepting my W back I accepted OC as well. But know I'm lost. I do not feel anything from the Lord as far as he goes. I do not feel the Lord guiding me to right things with my W.<P>This is and has caused me much anguish. I feel at times as though it were a "package deal". With my W came OC and that was fine. She is leaving and part of me feels that my obligation to him is too. Part of me still feels I should still treat him no different. I do not treat him bad now and I'm sure I never would, but I can not help but fear that me losing her and the resentment it has caused will eventually affect him. Plus he is so young that if she remarries chances are he will take up with the new "guy" as his father because of the time spent with him verses me.<P>Of course there is also the plus and negatives that are outside of my feelings. One being that in not claiming him it decreases the financial strain that this will cause. Flip side to that is that in not claiming him I would have to name his real father. He would tracked down and forced to pay child support and may get visitation. This would devastate my W and judging by his character would not be good for my son.<P>I realize this may get flamed which is fine, but I need all the advice I can get right now. All responses are appreciated. This will cross-posted in the Divorcing for input as well. Thanks<P>------------------<BR>1Co:2:4: And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words of man's wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power:<BR>1Co:2:5: That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.<p>[This message has been edited by Paul Moyers (edited February 05, 2001).]

<BR>Paul,<P>I don't mean to sound heartless, but your W is the one ending this marriage. You should look out for yourself. Its bad enough that because you're male you don't stand a chance of getting custody. I don't see a reason why you should get hit any worse on the child support, especially for the OM's child. If your W dislikes the idea of the OM being tracked down and forced to pay, she'll have to weigh it forever in her mind for deciding to behave the way she did.<P>Bystander

Dear Paul,<BR>I can't claim to have any firsthand experience regarding your unique situation, but please bear with me as I offer my opinion. first, I think the questions you are asking yourself are probably pretty normal. I can imagine that I would ask the same questions too. But I find itsomewhat telling that you always refer to the child as "my son", not "her son" or the "other man's son." I guess that if it were me, I would ask myself whether or not I could stand the look on the child's face when every time I came to pick up the other boys for visitation, I left him behind. I think that if we had had the oc in my case from birth on, I would not be able to deny her as one of my "own". But that of course is coming from a mother's perspective. As far as the financial situation goes, couldn't you possibly make an agreement with your wife so that your child support is reduced accordingly? If she truly does not want contact with the om, she may be willing to cut you a break on this. I guess the real question in all of this is, do you really feel like the child's real father? Good luck and God bless.<BR>-Cdcollins

bystander, don't worry you are not the first person to say that, more have said that than any thing else. cdcollins I am battling this constantly, I don't know how I would feel leaving him behind. All I know is that my heart is broken about all this and I don't have a clue what to do.

Paul,<P>I'm sorry to hear of the issue with custody, although it's not very surprising at all.<P>How do you feel about your fourth child? You say that you don't treat him bad now. I wouldn't have expected you to apply a wuppin' to his rear nightly because of the circumstances at birth. If you love this child, then I would suggest at this time that you continue to love him. Perhaps your wife will remarry soon, and he'll have a "father" figure that he'll know for his childhood. I don't think it does any harm to you whatsoever to continue to show this child love.<P>On the financial side of things, what's the monetary difference between three and four children? Can your wife and you come to an agreement (that can't be screwed up by a judge) that would amount to you only paying for the three kids. Especially if she would be "devestated" by having the old OM involved in a paternity case, it seems as though she'd be able to reach a reasonable agreement on that.<P>Paul, if you still love this child, it would be my advice to raise him as he were your own. You need to separate your feelings for your wife from your feelings for this child---being able to raise a child is a tremendous responsibility and a terrific joy. If it were me making this decision, I'd try to work out a suitable compromise with my wife. But in the end, I would raise and retain the responsibility for being this child's father.<P>God bless.

Dear Paul,<P>I don't know what to say. Your grief must be so enormous. I don't think any of us can tell you or advise you about what to do.<P>You can probably dig up my story from back letters, but I will share with you briefly what I felt when I stood where you are standing now. I will try to tell you what I did, but that might not be relevent to you at all.<P>My youngest is also, biologically, the child of another man. Almost a year ago, after a long and bleak withdrawal period, my wife asked me for a divorce, and told me that she would name the other man as the child's father, and seek full custody of him. We agreed to share joint custody of the other children. The request for a divorce did not surprise me, but her proposal for my youngest son shocked me to the core.<P>At that point I talked to my therapist, to my family, and to a close friend. I also talked at great length to my wife, and listened and listened to her fears.<P>I told her that I wanted to remain my child's father, even in the case of a divorce. But I felt terribly confused. Was I doing this just to prove a point? Was I seeking to assert my fatherhood (terribly damaged by how my wife had viewed the other man)? I don't know. I tried to focus on facts:<P>(1) My other children viewed my youngest as their brother. They knew nothing about what had happened. They loved him. And he would always be their brother. By remaining his father I would give them all as much stability as I could.<P>(2) I loved my son. I love him now. I expected always to love him.<P>(3) I thought of what life would be like for my son. Someday, I knew, he would find out how he was conceived. He would be viewed differently by many people. He might feel rejected by his biological father. He might know little stability. And I imagined his life if I remained part of it, and treated him equally with my other children. Then I compared that to his life if I picked up my other children from my ex-wife, and always left him behind. If his own brothers and sisters viewed him as different. I did not want him to suffer that pain.<P>(4) Although the other man seemed willing to pick up child support, he did not offer to play any role in my son's life. So if I was not his father, it looked as if no one else would be either.<P>There are some things I did not consider:<P>(1) Money. We are not doing very well financially, and we would have been doing much worse if the divorce had happened. I guess I thought that there would always be a way to survive, if I was travelling the right course. That is probably pretty naive, but that is what I thought. I, personally, couldn't abandon my son for any amount of money.<P>(2) Problems with my wife. Strange to say, even at that time I trusted my wife a great deal. She had been struggling intensely to be honest, and to live with integrity, to come to grips with what the affair had meant for her. And I believed that if she acknowledged me as my son's permanent father, she would stick to that and not ever use him as a weapon. That even if we were divorced, we would be able to share our responsibilities as parents. She is a terrific mother. I realize that this might not apply at all in your situation, and I have no idea how I would have acted if I thought my son would end up as the nexus of a legal and emotional battle.<P>So we talked. All of this happened in the course of 24 hours. And halfway through my wife agreed that I should continue as his father. I think that she had insisted otherwise for two reasons - fear that I might try to take him from her because of what she had done, and compassion for my own position, being left a single dad, with little money, and a toddler. Our conversations helped end her fears, and convince her that this was what I truly wanted. By the end of the day we had also decided to scrap the divorce, and everything has been improving constantly since that moment. She put all of her emotional energy into our marriage, and we have rebuilt a beautiful family.<P>That is not your situation. It does not sound as if you can trust your wife the way that I trusted mine. But, as you consider your course, at least remember that others of us have shared the pain of your decision, even if we were spared the cost that you will have to pay.<P>I wish for you wisdom and strength and peace,<P>StillTrying

Paul,<P>i feel so sad for you. i wonder what makes these women tick sometimes. you accept this child as your own, try to save your marriage and now this. you will be in my prayers.<P>it is such a tough decision. i guess i would consult with a lawyer about how much more and extra child would be. or maybe talk to your wife and see if she could make a court agreement or something. i just don't know. you seem to be a wonderful man, that little boy is so lucky to have you as a father. i know you will be rewarded by god for your love and acceptance of this child. may god be with you in this difficult time. i wouldn't fault you though for not doing it. your wife has only learned she can do what she wants and it has no obvious consequences, she doesn't even seem to be thinking about her children. <P>happy_girl<p>[This message has been edited by happy_girl (edited February 05, 2001).]

K: On the financial side the difference is only 5%. We can and already have worked out an agreed amount that really doesn't include him. You're right that it wouldn't hurt me now to continue to be his father, but I'm sure it would in the future when she remarries and he starts calling the new person Dad. I don't know if I could handle that. As far as separating feelings, I'm trying, but it's easier said than done.<P>StillTrying: Striking similarities. Difference, there is slim to no chance of reconciliation. I have zero absolute zero trust in my W. The one thing I am sure of concerning her and that is she is probably lying at any given time, for no reason, just lying.<P>happy_girl: Lawyers have been retained the wheels are in motion, but this is still up in the air. I don't think she is thinking of anyone but herself right now. She says she wants what's best for the kids but I don't think she even knows right from wrong any more.<P>------------------<BR>1Co:2:4: And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words of man's wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power:<BR>1Co:2:5: That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.

Dear Paul:<P>There have been many, many posts on this sad board that have effected me deeply over the past two years, but none that made my heart squeeze inside my chest like yours did. I can't believe this is happening to you after all you have done for your wife and that child. I wonder what the 'message' is taht we are supposed to get at times like these. I wonder what it is we are supposed to learn through such debilitating pain and sorrow.<P>My first instinct is "save yourself"! Detach and run. Like Bystander, I worry about the financial ramifications and letting your wife feel the full force of her choices. But, I understand, not at the expense of your son.<P>As long as the two of you have come to a financial agreement about all this, I know you want to remain in your child's life and continue to be Dad. Regardless whether or not she marries again should have no impact on this child's view of who Dad is. Dad is you. He knows this now, he will know this always, as long as you are there for him and he knows it. You should not have to relinguish your relationship because on your wife's whim she 'decides' to be self serving and ignore the desires and needs of the kids and you.<P>She will come to regret what she has done in time. In the meantime, be Dad if that is your heart's desire. I have always loved my stepdad more than my real dad all my life, because he raised me, loved me, cared for me and looked out for me, never judging, always caring. He was always there when I needed him, he made sure I was happy and secure and included me in every facet of his life. <P>If the money is simply a 5% issue, and your wife is in agreement to have you extricated from the obligation, it's your call as to whether or not you want to risk it. If you see yourself as Dad and know in your heart you will always be Dad even if she marries and divorces a million times to a cast of thousands, then be this child's Dad and reap the blessings that will be yours.<P>I hate to say this because it sounds so glib in the magnitude of what you're enduring, but sometimes things and people are taken from us to replace them with something better; and when you have healed sufficiently, you will be blessed with something much better. I believe this.<P>Wishing you the blessing and comfort you deserve...prayers for you<P>Catnip =^^=

Paul, I cannot add much. But I do have to think about your other children and how they will feel about their brother. I guess this is one issue that bother me about my sons knowing about OC. I then worry about how to proceed in treatment of OC (vacations, etc.). They are sweet boys who will want this child with them.<P>God bless you in your decision. Carolyn

Catnip:<BR>"Dear Paul:<BR>There have been many, many posts on this sad board that have effected me deeply over the past two years, but none that made my heart squeeze inside my chest like yours did." Hearing you say that brings so much of it rushing back. Don't worry though, it's nice to know that you care. I can't believe this either, I've somewhat gone numb to it. I think that's why I'm trying to get everything "filed" before the anger and resentment wells up again. As far as finding "someone" else, my minister said something to the same effect. Kind of a God will provide type talk. As far as regrets goes I think she regrets it now but feels there's nothing she can do about it. One too many.<P>takingcare: I have wondered about the others. Along those lines though I don't necessarily see it as any more hurtful than this whole process already is. Would it be better to find out now or down the road? Now they would get "used" to it, down the road they will be more likely to actually understand. Still undecided.<P>------------------<BR>1Co:2:4: And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words of man's wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power:<BR>1Co:2:5: That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.

Paul,<P>I'm so sorry for everything that you and your family are going thru. I don't have much to add to what the others have said, but I would like to comment on one thing. It seems that one of your main concerns is bonding with this child only to lose him later to a new "Dad". This is very understandable! But, Paul, your wife has proven lately that she isn't capable (at least not right now or anytime soon) of being in a long-term committed relationship. Therefore, the chances of a new dad entering the picture are pretty slim. In fact, many men could potentially come in and out of your son's life in the future making it all the more important for him to have you (someone who is consistant and constantly there for him). <P>Just wanted to throw that out there as food for thought. I know that this must be incredibly hard for you...good luck in whatever you decide is best.

Angelface: Him having another "Dad" is a very big concern. I don't know that there is anything I can do to prevent that.<P>ALL: I just got back from speaking with my attorney. All in all very incouraging. She is very nice and very understanding of my "situation". She is of the mindset that what I "need" done in this divorce, in order to minimize resentment and hard feelings, can be done. My attorney has proposed that in the dissolution agreement that WE, W and I, acknowledge that youngest is not biologically mine but that I will retain all "Father rights", meaning visitation and upbringing. Supposedly this way will absolve me from the financial but allow me to be his father. Also if he ever looks back at this it will look as if I CHOSE to be his father, not as if the court forced me to. For some reason this makes me feel better.<P>Any thoughts?<BR><P>------------------<BR>1Co:2:4: And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words of man's wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power:<BR>1Co:2:5: That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.

Paul,<P>Your attorney's advise sounds ideal. Hopefully your W will take some time before starting a new relationship and by then you will be irreplacable to OC <P>Best of luck.