I married my husband for 15+ years and we have two very wonderful daughters (12 and 4).<P>I have always think we have a good marriage and all our friends think so too, especially they think I am a good wife and he is a very lucky man in all aspects. We knew each other while in the same college, and we went to graduate school together too. We loved each other very much. Now we both work in the computer technology/IT field. I have always thought my husband was an honest and decent man. The idea of betrayal and lie has never occurred to me and I trusted him completely. His job requires him to travel a lot. And for the last two years, the travel has become very intense and frequent, as I joked that he is out of town 4 weeks out of every month. And indeed sometimes he stayed out of town several weeks in a roll. And gradually, I have virtually become a single parent, juggling between my job and all household responsibilities (grocery shopping, cooking, washing, kids school registrations and parent-teacher conferences, taking kids to doctors and piano lessons and other places, paying bills, file taxes, taking care of family financials, maintaining a large house, arrange family vacations and entertainment, etc), while his responsibilities at home has been reduced to changing light bulbs. But I never complaint about it at all, because I think his job is more demanding and bears more responsibilities, so I was happy to be able to off-set household responsibilities and be a good helper to him, it made me feel useful, and his intense travel has not made me suspicious of his affair at all, and Yes there were hints (strange phone calls), but I didn’t pay much attention. <P>But he has become more and more indifferent to me and virtually spend no time with me and kids, and when he did come home from trips, he didn’t show much affection to me, nor spend time with family, rather goes to office to "work", and miss family dinners. The kids and I missed him so much, my elder daughter’s first item for Christmas Wish has been Daddy spend the Christmas Day, a "whole" day at home, it’s such a luxurious to her, and yet he failed to meet that wish ! Again I was not suspicious, and instead I thought he maybe too busy and tired. It became worse and worse and I started to become more and more frustrated and unhappy. So maybe at that point, which was early last September, he feels he could not hide it anymore, so on one dark night, while I was sitting on a chair in the bedroom holding my sleeping younger daughter in my arms, he revealed his affair with a young woman to me, and he said that he loves her. But he refused to answer any more questions I asked, and acting very offended to my questions. I knew her, and I could figure out myself that the affair had lasted for about two years, when the affair started, she was only 19. Now she is 21 and my husband is nearly 40, she used to live in our city, but has moved to another state to attend college, although they are not in the same city, they see each other and live together when my husband went on business trips, that explained why my husband had such intense travel and didn’t come home for weekends, and indeed it explained everything that I had been so frustrated and unhappy about, in a strange way I was relieved because I found the root to my unbearable frustration and heart sinking sadness. I was very shocked, and angry when I heard about the affair, and my first response was to leave him, but then I asked him to reconcile and I was willing to forgive and forget if he promise not to see the woman again, but he said he couldn’t, and he wanted to leave me, and will (generously) leave the house and everything to me. So not only he had a long and intense affair, but he wanted to leave me and the children, that hurt me very deeply. I couldn’t make sense out of this and felt a terrible sense of betrayal and failure. <P>I went through hell since that dark night, I had to put up with that woman invasively and tirelessly calling my husband days and nights, anytime, anywhere, for as long as she wanted, and my husband made a few trips to see her (and have sex with her) either against my wills or secretly, and I had a scare she got pregnant which turned out to be a false alarm later, I cannot concentrate on work and feel very fatigue to handle all the responsibilities. My husband continues to travel a lot and recently is working in China for 4 months so we don’t have much time together to talk or do any recovery. I had many sleepless nights crying, I talked to him, and I said that I would kill him and her and myself if they get married. I felt all the talks were fruitless, and he blamed me for all the problems he feels in the marriage and yet never communicated to me, and he said that the affair is a result and not a cause for our marital problems, and he did not express remorse over what he did to me, and never asked for forgiveness, and indeed he does not seem to think what happened was that bad, but he did change his decision and said he would save our marriage for the sake of kids, although he may regret his decision and miss that young woman for the rest of his life. But he did not promise not to see her or talk to her, that has been the sticky point for the last 6 months since he revealed the affair. And I have become very desperate over this, and sometimes I think is this worth it ? A divorce may not be that terrible after all if not for kids, but I promised my daughter I will try everything and not give up, I cannot let her down. Deep down, I still love my husband, and sincerely think we can bring love back to the marriage at least from my side, I am willing and able to do anything to fix it if he tells me what he likes and doesn’t like. But I cannot stand he still loves that woman and continue talk with her regularly (perhaps more than I talk with him), and also see her if there is a chance which is very high since he still goes out of town often. <P>There has been a lot of back and forth and broken promises, and surprises over the issue of completely and permanently cut contact with that woman, so now, he does not want to promise that anymore, saying he does not want anything bad happen to her since she is quite unstable and has no one to talk to (or rather no one she is willing to talk to except my husband). I recently called that young woman, and she doesn’t think what happened was immoral or illegal and doesn’t feel sorry about it at all. She insulted and hurt me and expressed deep disrespect to marriage, saying it’s only a piece of paper that I have while she has my husband’s heart. She won’t let go of my husband and she does not intend to marry anyone else in the future except my husband, and even if she cannot marry my husband, she will still see him, but she was angry that my husband broke his promise to divorce me and marry her, and she hates him for that and her hatred is as deep as her love for him. And she also said she will do anything including suicide to make my husband see her whenever she feels like, and said she already had one attempted suicide and went to hospital as a result so it will continue to be an effective means for her. And additionally, she will continue to try to get pregnant with my husband …<P>So much for the story, it’s a relief for me to say it all in one piece (have tried to be as brief as possible without a lot of details, and still sorry for its length. I just found this site a couple of days ago and read a lot of posts and articles, and found it to be very supportive and informative). Now I have a few important questions that have been on my mind for a long time:<P>1. Do you think it’s a legitimate reason my husband cannot cut off all contacts with her due to her suicide threat ? Or he is just fooling me using that as an excuse ?<P>2. Do you think it is practically possible to stop my husband from talking to her which will sure leads to seeing her, since there are so many means of communication nowadays (cell phone, phone card, pager, voice messaging, emails) etc. I lost any idea and think only my husband can make the decision and stop all contacts. <P>3. Is it legal for that woman to use suicide to threaten my husband forcing him to go to see her (for the purpose of having sexual relationship) even if they had affair ? Is that considered blackmailing ? Will police interfere in some way if it happen again in the future since we don’t want her to hurt herself ? Can we put her into mental institution if she does that again ? Anything we can do about it ?<BR> <BR>4. It is sure immoral, and I also think it is illegal for a married man to have sexual relationship with other woman, do you think it’s illegal ? If so, will he be punished if caught ?<P>Any response, opinion, advice is greatly appreciated, and Thanks very much if you read this far !<P>

nobodysgirl,<BR>What an unstable situation. I don't know what to say. I hope you find someone who can help you.<BR>RR<p>[This message has been edited by runningrainbow (edited April 04, 2001).]

What an ugly situation, nobodysgirl.<P>It sounds like this juvenile delinquent OW is running rough shod on your husband with emotional blackmail and suicide threats and he is either falling for it or he is into the high drama of it all. <P>The OW is certainly a drama queen, too. Threatening to continue to try to get pregnant by your husband should be somehow accountable by a law of some kind, shouldn't it? Couldn't you hire a lawyer and get a restraining order on her? I don't know. Is there absolutely no way to prevent a completely heartless OW from having unprotected sex with your spouse if he is willing to contuinue the affair?<P>Your situation is impossible as long as your husband is playing these destructive and selfish games and is just asking for his world to be ripped to shreds by allowing this manipulative whoure to call the shots and control him with sex or whatever it is he finds so hard to let go of.<P>The best thing to do is to launch into the Harley plans: Plan A, Plan B and to study the principles he prescribes. At this point, all you can do is save yourself. And your children.<P>I am so sorry you are going through this. The OW in my case was nearly as brazen, evil, heartless and blatant. She did succeed in having my husband's child, willfully, intentionally and maliciously, knowing full well we were married, having received many phone calls and pleadings from me early in the affair and is now extracting huge income shares from our salary leaving us nothing to live on. This is why I am suing her for Personal Injury.<P>Don't let it get to this point, nobodysgirl, if you can help it at all. Begin to protect yourself, and I hope you husband has the good sense to protect himself, which will ultimately protect you from having to be a regular on this particular site.<P>Good luck and stay strong and work the Harley principles.<P>Catnip =^^=

ngirl,<BR>I'm sorry you and your children are going through this (bad things DO happen to good people!). I'm sorry you haven't gotten more support here yet; we're usually better at welcoming people. Is it harder to get through a long post, but we all need to vent sometimes...<P>As for your situation, suicidal people should be under professional care. Your H is allowing himself to be emotionally blackmailed, but adultery isn't illegal. You CAN bring it to (your county mental health?) that this woman is pregnant and threatening to kill herself. That MAY be grounds for temporarily committing her, at least for observation. <P>I have to go now but I'll be watching for your updates!<BR>Prayers and angels coming your way,<BR>J

Dear Nobodysgirl,<P>As the others have said, I feel for your horrible situation. In my situation, I am picking up the pieces from an affair that happened without my knowledge. It must be terrible to sit by watching the accident about to happen and being powerless to prevent it.<P>I agree with you wholeheartedly that the ball is completely in your H's court. He must know what this woman is all about and yet he may be in a fog so deep that he simply can't put his mind straight and get away from her.<P>If you read Dr. Harley's principles, you will find a wealth of information to help you decide which road is best for you at this point. You have a family to consider and it seems obvious that your H is not committing himself totally to you and your family.<P>There is very little you can do about suicide threats and except for a few very specific relationships (like the military, or a supervisor/supervisee relationship) there is not much that can be done when a married man is having an affair.<P>After you had the conversation with the OW and she told you that she was still planning to force your H to be with her, and even get pregnant, did you tell your H about this conversation? And what was his reaction? Didn't he feel that the woman is using him and manipulating him? <P>This is a horrible situation for you. I will keep you in my prayers along with everyone else. Please write back and let us know how you are doing and what your H has to say about the things this woman told you.<P>- heavenly

Nobodysgirl... What an ugly situation. Well, here is my toss on this.<P>1) only your H can control whether he sees & talks to her. This is in his control. If he is buying these silly suicide threats, well he is crazy. Why would a man want to be with a woman who is so unstable that she is threatening taking her own life? This is BS (in my opion). He wants to be where he is at. He has had two years to change it. He hasn't.<P>2) an affair is usually the result and not the cause of marital problems. But an affair is a totally inappropriate response to marital problems. At that point he is harming his children and lot's of other people over his inability to talk to you about your problems. I guess an affair is easier that working on a marriage and going into couseling. If we all took the easy way out in life... well I don't have to go there do I?<P>3) there is nothing illegal about what he is doing, unless sexual consent with under 21 is a law in your state. As my lawyer told me "you have every right to divorce him for his actions". That is the ONLY consequence and course of action available by law in my state. Do not look to the legal system for any possible releif in this area. There are no laws on the books for "assault on a family". Very family friendly system isn't it? Sorry to be so harsh on this one. <P>4) believe me... she WILL get pregnant. That is the way to secure the relationship. That is what OW in my case did. She had an agenda & she will go through with it. Once again, that is up to your H and her to control. I sure do not understand a man having unprotected sex with a woman who is trying to get pregnant, unless he wants a child also. Either that or he is dumb as rocks. You make that call.<P>5) make sure your H knows that you love him and want your marriage to work, but that you WILL protect your children and home. If it takes filing for divorce to make that point, so be it. Perhaps if he sees that you are diligent in your fight to protect your children he may start to see the fog lifting a little. <P>I have an OW with an agenda also. She wants my H. She wants him to be there for their child. She works with him and will cause problems at work to get him. Yes.. her crooked type of love includes doing damage to him to keep him. So I know where you are coming from with OW who are a little screwy in their process of "loving" someone. <P>I filed for D the week I found out about A. This has been a good thing for me. Not in all cases would this tactic work. I am not saying that i am out of the woods with my marriage, but my children and I are in better position than we would have been without that action. My H travels a lot also. He has been moved out for 2 mths now (at my request) and the kids still don't know he is gone! They just think it is business as usual with their dad. Unreal isn't it? So if it comes to a divorce for me, I am pretty sure that the negative impact will be less than in other marriages. <P>Please take care of YOU and you daughters. Someone has to put you first. Carolyn

3/12/01 Monday <BR>Dear friends,<P>I am so grateful to all of you out there who read my long message, give comfort and valuable advices, share your experiences, and most of all for your heartfelt sympathy and moral support. It means very much to me. <P>Some updates: <P>I did tell my husband about my conversation with her and what she said. I guess he knows her intention even if I did not tell him. But he views all of this as her "love" to him, and he falls for it, and Yes she even had an abortion last May and she regret about the abortion (my husband didn’t tell me about that), and then a false alarm of preganancy last October which is after I knew their affair. So obviously my husband did not learn the lesson, and whenever she found out which city my husband is in, she will fly to that city, and that’s why I am afraid of the possibility of OC. <P>I think my husband has a "double" standard, no matter what she say and do, how evil and insensible, it’s OK since it’s view by him as "love" and he also feels he loves her, and no matter what I do, what sacrifice I made for the family, and the good person I am, he takes it for granted and has very harsh standard for me. Maybe I have been too soft, as one close friend put it, my "fault" is I am too nice to him so he doesn’t appreciate it. <BR> <BR>Again, it is up to my husband now, I cannot make him do something (or rather not to do something) or promise me anything. <P>And I don’t feel like talk about the subject of the woman with my husband anymore since it only brings negative feelings since ME repeatly talk about the same thing (HER) over and over will not work. I will consider consuling session with Steve and hopefully he gives it a fresh feeling and new perspective, and after all, he is a professional. I hope he can convince him.<BR> <BR>I will focus on the positive subject of protecing family and kids, and for that matter if D is necessary, so be it. So that he not mistaken my effort as being afraid of D and as my weakness. And I will tell him that I still loves him deeply, and will never intentionally hurt him in any way, and that I want him to be happy, then I will tell him I will have patience, not to lose temper and give him disrespect remarks anymore, and that he respect my feelings too. I found it seems to be working, or at least if I don’t push on the issue of not to talk/see that woman again. <P>Since I found this site, I found it very helpful, the concept of affair proof marriage, complete honesty, why spouse should not be trusted, Plan A/B … are so new to me, some appear un-natural at first, but I found them make a lot of sense after 2nd thought. So I am determined to consistently work on Plan A now. Over the weekend when I talked to him on the phone, I mentioned about the concept of complete honesty, and communication and daily activity should be subject to open to spouse, he is completely pissed off by that idea, which tells me something important: he still have something to hide and want to hide, and I still have a long way to go. <P>Practical issue : he travels so much and we don’t have time to rebuild. I am thinking about have a talk with his boss for him to have a break after two years of intense travel. Don’t know how that’ll work. <P>So long for now, Thanks again ! I wish all of you the victim there the best and take care !<BR>-Patricia<P>