Sorry to seem as if I am obsessing on this oc thing. But the last few days a couple of posts have gotten under my skin. I would just like to thank all that have been so supportive and loving and encouraging in their posts to me on this issue. I have posted in my topic dealing with the oc and family members and I feel my last two posts should be read by anyone struggling with oc issues of acceptance. And anyone who has strong feelings that the oc should always be accepted by the bs should read my last two posts in the topic dealing w/ family members and oc .I do not think that anyone should force let alone even suggest that a bs accept the oc unless he or she is ready. Many individuals in this forun have accepted, and others are in the process of, while still others are struggling with the idea of it. Others are not even ready to think about it and I feel that all are right and all are just in whatever stage or road they are now traveling in or on. I hope that my point has been made and I hope that all here will see that you all should be accepted and supported no matter what decision you make. As I have said in other posts there are no right or wrong answers and there are no good or bad guys. We must all simply take the path we feel best helps us and our marriage and our family grow and stay healthy. Please know that my prayers and support are with all of you no matter what path you chosen. I just can not stress enough how important I think the rebuilding of our marriages first, before any of us choose how to handle the others issues of this tragic and life altering situation we are in. And really how would a child grow in a environment where a marriage is not healthy. So in just that asspect, we all can see how important it is to first repair the damage that the whole situation has caused before we can deal with all the secondary issues and I am sorry to offend anyone but I feel that the oc are a secondary issue to me and my family. Yes they are children and should not be hurt but unless me, my H and family are healed how can i expect do anything with the oc. Well I am rambling so let me go and let me just say thanks and hope you all know how much I appreciate all the support you all have given in your nonthreatening, non lecturing manner. Lets all stay happy, healthy and think peace and love. GABI1116<p>[This message has been edited by gabi1116 (edited March 25, 2001).]

Gabi,<BR>Well said one thing thou dont feel you have to say your sorry for anything you have to say. There is no way we could help each other if we have to worry about what we say. As you have said everyones lives are diffrent and our children are diffrent we know in our hearts what each of our familys can handle and what they cannot dont let what the hair brains have to say get to you they come and they go. What really scares me is what kind of humans are the ow raiseing and turning lose on this world in 18 yrs and most I dont think are fit to even have children .If the state were to keep an eye on these wanna be family distroyers I think most would lose there kids. Thank God for women like you! with love flowerseed

and for woman like you also flowerseed!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!GAbi

gabi1116, and everyone else, I think we are all doing the best we can, given the awful circumstances that we find we share here.For me, I am in the camp that right now, and doubt in future, will be able to accept any contact with OC.. It so hurts me from thinking of contact, and injuring my children, that I am prepared to divorce h for it. I really feel for me now, that continued contact with Oc is continued affirmation of a life he created with affair with OW, and it feels for me something I cannot support. I cannot feel as if me or our kids get second billing. I think if I had been the one to have the affair, I would not be so accepting of the other child, and know I would have given up the child, most likely had an abortion.The loss of the child may have been devastating, but not more so than ruining the life I would have had with my H. Because my H did not have the ability to stop the OW from having the child, he (and I ) are paying the price of huge monthly child support payments . . It is the price one must pay to heal others-and truly make amends. I also think it may free the OW to look elsewhere for a true father for child, not a hidden father like my H would be for child. <p>[This message has been edited by lsb (edited July 16, 2001).]

The oc will never have a place in our family. I can say that now with no guilt. It does sadden me thou what will become of most of these kids. Gem said something in one of her replies about it almost seems like a form of child abuse that is how I feel also. To bad these ow couldnt see the damage there are doing to a life they choose to bring into this world and raise alone. I think it takes quit a special person to be willing to except this into there lives, but as far as us we never wanted another child ow made her choices she can live with them. I am not going to be raped into step parenthood (I think that was catnips words) Together we will all make it. with love flowerseed

Flowerseed, I wanted to reply to a couple of things you mentioned...You are right I should not be sorry for anything I have said...It was just in my opening thread of this post I wanted to make it clear how I felt about the pushing of some to accept oc when the bs was not ready. Actually I was merely trying to be polite, but I really am not sorry for the way I felt in that first post in this topic. It was just that I was trying to make it clear and I thought I might have been rude so I ended it with I'm sorry but.... It is just kind of a personality thing I have, that I say sorry but ...get it. One other thing I wanted to comment on is yes you are right about how sad it is to bring some of these children in the world that are not going to have the right up bringing. The oc in our life may have a few problems, my h is just noticing now in the last two weeks he has been alone with him, some things he feels seem odd. We will just have to wait and see how this all turns out as we get to know him. My h says he seems like a happy and healthy boy, but he is curious about some of his inmature and very childish actions for his age. We have a 6 year old and the oc is 5. My h says he is a real mommas boy and not very strong willed, he has a weak and timid personality, could this have come from only having a mom for the past 5 years. Well I will keep you all posted on how this all progresses as we get to know th oc more. Peace to all, Gabi1116

gabi,<BR>Its hard to say who knows what has been said to this little guy about your family. I think you should be prepared for about anything. Some people can say awful things to little ones not thinking of what it can do to there little minds.He has got to be quit confused to all of this. I dont see why the courts think that your h has to meet with him so many times without the family involved to me the sooner he is brought into the family the better it would be for him. When we take our kids to daycare we go meet the family take the children there a few times and they are fine. I just dont get what the reason for courts to think they need it done this way. I wonder if this was the ow way she wanted it done and that is why they are doing it this way. If it is that right there tells ya she most likely has put a lot of insecuritys in little ones head toward you guys. Kids are so good at accepting strange people. I think in no time at all he will be playing and having fun. I have had kids come here that dont even know me that I have took care of and there fine an hour after you meet them.I wonder if you could tell your son that a little boy is going to start coming over that has no daddy in his life and you guys are going to see if you can help him with that. I read my post from yesterday about oc in our lives and gees it sounds like I'm some kind of cold b*****. The biggest reason we have for no involvement is our 5 yr old dauther she is the type of child that this would distroy if we were to involve oc in our lives right now. Our family is so important to her thats what has keep me hanging on for so long. She is so funny if we are to go to something and her dad isnt planning on going she will say you have to or we are not a family. Thats all it takes and he is right there with us. I am so glad my h realized this even before I did. When I first found out I thought we will take this child from this b**** and raise him ourself she can pay us child support but then reality set in. My first thoughts were like we could just take the child and never have to deal with ow or see her again, I was in laa laa land. You guys dont have to much longer to wait is it 1 more month. I wish the best for your family together we all will make it. with love flowerseed

Dear flowerseed,<BR>I've been thinking along the same lines you are, I guess, about just not giving my oldest son a full explanation. We are good friends with a mennonite couple who take in all kinds of foster children, and my son sees them get a new child every couple of months, so I don't think he would even think it was strange for us to have a child come and stay with us now and then. the pastor we are counseling with doesn't think that is a good idea - he thinks that we should be totally open and honest with our son. Explain to him about the affair, that daddy made a mistake, all that stuff. But my son is only eight years old, and he is already supersensitive about our family, just like your daughter is. My son is old enough that he has faint memories of when the affair was happening. he doesn't know about the affair itself, but he knows that there was a terrible time in his life when daddy left us and wasn't in his life anymore. So everytime h and I even have an argument, he gets upset and worries that his dad will leave, even though we have spent the last four years reassuring him that it will never happen again, but I am afraid that coming right out and telling him about his half-sister's parentage would be detrimental. I don't know - I guess that I am from the "old school" of parenting in that I don't think that parents should tell their kids everything all the time. I don't mean that parents should be deceptive - just protective of their children and selective in what they explose their children to. So I don't know what we will end up doing about it when oc comes to visit and/or live with us. Right now I have a "cross that bridge when I come to it" attitude, because we haven't even found out how much contact we will get with oc, or when we will get it. I do of course realize that SOMEDAY we'll have to tell him, but I'm not sure what possible benefits would come from telling him right now. Any thoughts on this from anybody would be appreciated.

Cd, and Flowerseed, I do have thoughts on both of your last posts, I am pressed for time now and I have an appointment to get to. I will post as soon as I am done with it. FLowerseed I have some interesting news on the oc and what he has been told about us. We found out some stuff over last weekend, and I will explain the visitation regulations also. Cd, I do have some thoughts on your son and what the pastor feels, I will let you know in a couple of hours. Bye guys, be back soon, Peace, Gabi1116

c.d.<BR>I think anybody that thinks you should tell an eight yr old child about dad having sex with another woman is not thinking of the end results. I sure wouldnt have wanted to know something like that at that age. I know what you mean about children not forgetting that bad time in there lifes. We never seperated but our little girl has not forgot when dad wasnt being the dad he had always been. I think thats why she is so set in her ways about us doing things as a family. She was only 4 yrs old and it affected her. He was in la la land for about 6 months. I think what p***** me off most with ow is she thought by getting knocked up my h would just dump us and run to be with her. What a brain dead pig to use a child in this way. I think you are doing great c.d. do what you know is right in your heart with your son dont let people that go by what a book says to tell you how you should do things. Alot of people read a book and say this is how it should be done not ever really knowing. with love flowerseed<p>[This message has been edited by flowerseed (edited March 27, 2001).]

This past sunday my h had his 3 hour unsupervised visit with the oc. Since our family can not be there he picks him up at his house and they go out for three hours. Which can run into spending a good amount of money. Flowerseed, actually it was the social worker who conducted the mediation, and made the order for the oc not to meet his siblings and extended family until 60 days had passed since he first met his father. The mother of the oc was persistant in how all the meetings should be non-threaening and how she was worried and how sensitive he was. So I think the social worker threw that order in at the end, because it is the last point on the court order and she called my h to tell him she had added it,I think she did it, just to pacify the stupid ow. Well it is going quickly so I am dealing. Anyway when my h picked him up this past sunday he was out in his front yard waiting for my h, he was playing with two little girls. When my h drove anyway he asked the oc who the girls were the oc said my cousins, my h asked who is their daddy, and oc said a name and my h said isn't he your mommy's boyfriend, oc said no, then he looked confused. Oc then asked my h , he called my h by his first name and then said how long have you been my dad? Well now we now that his mother told him who my h is. This boy is still confused though he is not sure who is mother's boyfriend is and then he looks at my h with confusion, but admits he knows he is his dad. It all seems so sad to me, I know things will change once he meets all of us. As for CD and her son, and me and mine, I am still not sure how we are going to handle this I am probably going to consult with a therapist we have gone to, who knows our son. I have to say one thing, all the crying the mother of the oc did about how sensitive and how afraid she was for the boy to know, he is very excited to see my h when he comes and he runs up and also does not want to be dropped off when it is time , so that part is going good. Well as Cd said we will cross each bridge when we get to them. GAbi1116

I have been thinking about it and I think the idea Flowerseed had to introduc oc as a child that has no daddy and needs one may be a good idea. I am going to run it by my H and see what he thinks. So what do you all think about the oc and how confused he is, how can we help him in the months to come and not screw my own son's head up in the process. I want this to all work, but I tend to obsess and worry for a couple of days at a time and then it will pass and I will be fine again for a few days or week or so and then the worrying returns oh boy, and we are getting closer to meeting him, just about a month. Any thoughts? Gabi1116

gabi,<BR>I dont know I think we are all learning as you are. Just remember kids can say the darnest things so be prepared for questions from your son when oc and him start playing and talking you might want to make sure someone is always in hearing range so you can answer any questions that may pop up from your son as to things the oc may say to him. with love flowerseed

Well, both my h and my sister do not think it is a good idea to make up a story about the oc to my son. As you said Flowerseed you never know what the oc and my son may start talking about as they are playing. Well I am not going to stress over it, I will just relax awhile longer, and give it a week or two. In a couple of weeks, however I am not going to be able to avoid it much longer. I do not want to stress out but I just feel like no matter how I look at it I am just putting off what I eventually am going to have to do. Oh by the way we figured out that the mother of the oc did finally tell him that my h is his father. The oc asked my h last week when they were out how long have you been my dad, since I was a baby? We just are trying to figure out what she actually told him, so my h is going to discuss it with the oc this weekend. Maybe this will give us some ideas about relating all this to our son. It is sad the oc seems so confused he was not sure how to explain to my h who his mother's boydfriend's kids were, he said they were his cousins, so my h asked if their father was his uncle , saying he thought he was his mom's boyfriend. The oc said no he is not my mom's boyfriend, then he said I think she loves him , then he asked my h how long have you been my Dad? He seems very confused I can not imagine what his mom has told him about us. Well my h is not really much help either, he does not want to hurt the oc and make him feel uncomfortable with him since he is alone with him for another month. So most of the facts of the relationships have many blank spots in them. I guess once we all get to met and things become more relaxed we can start working on details. It is so sad that grown adults can cause events which can alter and change so many lives. And how not only do the adults suffer but children get caught up and confused. I am just hoping in a few months may family can settle down and we can start enjoying things. Well spring is coming and the flowers will be blooming. I always feel every year that things do get better this time of the year. And then the warm weather and we can go out more, and the sunshine and fresh air can make bad things get better. Gabi1116