He will only drop off enough money to pay bills, Michael and I will have to work to eat. Is tired of all of this. If I want divorce let him know...it can be easy like selling the house etc....or he'll make it ugly!<P>God grant me peace.... and food......<P>Debi<P>------------------<BR>Imagine....

I don't know what state you live in but has he ever heard of ALIMONY.<P>Jtigger

jtigger I live in Ohio. I see attorney on Friday. She advised me not to contact him to let him know. <P>She's 4000. so I want to do the right thing. I guess I'll wait.<P>Geeze I'm paralyzed with fear.<P>Love, <BR>Debi<P>------------------<BR>Imagine....

Gem:<P>If he'll give you enough money for the bills then at least you'll have your house and utilities paid and you don't have to worry about that. But as far as groceries and other miscellaneous necessities, he'll need to provide those as well until you are able to make other arrangements. After all those years together and after what he did to destory your marraige and family, I think a hefty alimony is in order. You've probably been out of the work force forever taking care of him...and this is what you get in return?<P>It sounds like he's put on the 'cool and aloof' facade to cover up his feelings. I can't imagine what I would do if I were going through what you are going through. One rejection (affair) is tough enough to take, but being forced into accepting WS's terms and then have him violate the POJA cuts to the bone. He has turned you and your son into sacrificial lambs to attain his desires, Gem. I am so sorry. I'd give anything for thirty minutes with him in a locked room.<P>Catnip =^^=

Goodness Gem,<P>I dont know what to say except I will be praying for you and your son. I will also pray for God to work in your H's heart.<P>Love<P>bw

Gem,<P>I don't have much to add. I just want you to know I'm sory and I wish you the best out of this bad situation.<P>My thoughts and prayers are with you,<P>------------------<BR>Zebra Baby ...<P>Lord, give me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference.

Catnip - <P>Can I have him after you?<P>Debi, prayers for you. I really hate your H. <P>((hugs))<P>belldandy

oh gem, i don't know what to say, except what a jerk. my prayers for you, and a big hug across cyber space too.<P>happy_girl

Gosh Gem, and after all the work you guys had put into trying to hold it together! His head's in his *ss. So sorry for your pain.

Gem,<P>How long has it been since the lastest "discovery"? A couple weeks or so---right???<P>I'd see the attorney, and get your ducks in a row over the divorce. However, if you don't want to give up on the marriage, it sounded to me (in previous posts) like you were taking the exact right path in using a no-contact Plan B. I would suggest that if you still want your marriage, that you would insist that counseling with the Harley's be a manditory issue should he want to return to the marriage. As another point---I'd strongly urge you to move out of state (I hear Catnip has a couple of places picked out for you). I think that one issue with your husband is that the close proximity to the OC/OW is killing his chances to recover from the addiction of the affair. He would need to take extraordinary precautions to prevent a relapse, and a move would be a reasonable way to handle this.<P>

Hi Gemini,<P><BR>I'm so sorry you're going through all of this. I have been through the same situation as well, with two small children, and understand your fear and sadness. I am truly sorry. <P>Although time will heal some of your wounds, I do agree with the others that now may be a time when you start looking at the situation more objectively, becoming more proactive instead of reactive. It is very hard, I know, but I also know that it's a necessity. <P>What I suggest is for you to keep your appointment. Even if you don't hire this particular lawyer, you will be advise of your rights under the laws of Ohio. Before you go to your appointment, please go to these two sites to read some broad discussions of the law. <BR> <A HREF="http://www.divorcenet.com/oh/ohfaq02.html" TARGET=_blank>http://www.divorcenet.com/oh/ohfaq02.html</A> <A HREF="http://www.divorcenet.com/oh/ohfaq05.html" TARGET=_blank>http://www.divorcenet.com/oh/ohfaq05.html</A> <P>Whatever questions you may have, write them down and take them with you. It's easy to forget things at such an emotional time. Perhaps take someone with you to your appointment if you feel you cannot go alone. <P>Above all, Gemini, take care of yourself. Just because you are exploring the possibilities of divorce doesn't mean you have to file anytime soon. What it means is this: you're hoping for the best, but preparing for the worse. <P>Please.. take care.<P>Love,<BR>CoR <P><BR>

Gem,<P>I am so sorry. It really ticks me off after everything you were going to try and allow. You had tried to work with him. There is no way you should be playing by his terms. I also think it is rather "ballsy" for him to say he would play rough. Sorry to say I don't think any court is going to look kindly on his actions and reward him. I hope he really gets it with the lawyers. There is no way you won't get alimony. Sorry if I sound bitter, I am just hurt for you and that once again you feel the pain for his actions. I am sending you hugs and prayers. <P>babstr.

gemini, I feel for you and me. I think our situations are very parallel. I am beginning to think I will be filing for divorce soon as well. H says he is totally committed to me and our kids, but again on his terms. He says he bonded with OC at birth-as I told him, the fact he played at being daddy with OC after birth and continued affair after that made all this much worse for him and me.He agrees, but is stuck with his feelings for child.Doesn't see that every time he wants to discuss OC, he pushes me further away. Makes me realize he is still very much connected to the other life he created with OW and is still connected to her. I think my intuition is right,Gem. As you suggested before. He may not be seeing her, but he emotionally is still connected to her.As long as he stays connected, even in his mind's eye, what chance do we have? I am not sure I can do this anymore. I stay for my kids, but I really am not being a good mother to them now. Suicide was in my thoughts last night. I think about moving a lot-but H doesn't seem willing to support me on this. I think time and distance from OW is what I need to rebuild life with h.H will never do that for me or for us. he wants his life here. Well, if we separate and divorce, I will have to move. My job involves early hours and I could not do this alone. I would have to be close to some family for help-which would be thousands of miles away from where we are now. And H would be thousands of miles away from our kids whom he says he loves. I don't know how it is so easy for him to think of giving all this up to meet his need to parent OC. I tell him it is his need, OC is not being damaged by his absence in her life, but our kids will be damaged by his absence and knowledge of his OC. He doesn't get it. I do, and feel sad. It just doesn't matter enough to him how much he hurts me, he still wants what he wants. I think I am tired of being the doormat, tired of being hurt, tired of feeling dead inside. I can't heal under these terms. I am very tired of it all.

Dear Debi,<P>I guess we are all asking the same question -- what the h*ll happened to your H? A couple weeks ago he was wanting to work it out - didn't want a divorce - let's try third party and see how it works -- and somehow he has now evolved into - I don't care if you and my son eat, we can play it rough???<P>Oh, Deb, my heart is breaking for you. But at the same time, I can feel your fire at the nerve of this man. I really don't understand what your H believes Michael is? Is that not his son, also? And, from a legitimate marriage nonetheless. <P>So, do these guys think that children are like term life insurance, their value depreciates as they mature? If he wants to be a devoted father, he ought to start with the child right inside your home. I am usually the voice of reason saying "save the marriage at all costs", but this man is asking for you to put up with a lot of crap over this OC.<P>One of the others said something I truly agree with, it will help you to be more proactive. Take all the knowledge the lawyer has to give -- it doesn't mean you have to retain her. You should shop around and make sure you get a real shark -- one that cuts her eye teeth on husbands who believe their families are expendable for cheap tramps.<P>Debi, you have done nothing but show this man love, compassion and understanding, in the face of incredible stonewalling and waffling. You deserve better and your son deserves better. I hope your H knows what this will do to his relationship with your son.<P>Frankly, whatever repercussions he gets at this point, he deserves for being a jack*ss.<P>My prayers are for you now, that you will put this behind you and move forward until you reach the better place in your life and your mind that you were meant for.<P>love and hugs to you,<BR>heavenly

Gem,<P>As you know, I think there are many similarities in our situations. Our husbands seem to be operating in he same mentality, but yours wins the prize. I thought my H was the most self-centered, inconsiderate person on the planet, but your H certainly does give him some competition for that honor.<P>I am so very sorry that things have worked out this way for you. I can't help but think I'll probably be walking that path myself very soon, and if it's any consolation, I think that you are doing the only thing that will really make it possible for you to truly heal and find happiness and peace in your life. I believe that is true for my own situation as well, but I haven't quite reached the point of actually doing something yet. I have been trying to prepare myself emotionally and work out all the details of housing, personal possessions, debts, etc. in my mind first. (I think deep down I've also been hoping that some morning I'll wake up and he'll say he wants only me and our children in his life, except I know that won't happen.) <P>Unfortunately, you don't have any choice....your H is acting so horribly that you have to act right now, even though I don't think you're psychologically prepared. But act you must.....and remember that we'll all be here to help you through what lies ahead. What I always tell myself is "How much worse can it be than what you've already been through?"<P>take care<P><BR>love,<BR>anniem<BR> <p>[This message has been edited by anniem (edited May 08, 2001).]

Dear Debi,<P>You know that I think your h is a fool that will eventually regret his actions. That said, I would like to second K's suggestion about moving. Moving away from the situation was the one thing I credit most (aside from God) for saving our marriage. I know that moving would be difficult for you, but the benefits to you doing so would be innumerable. <P>Yes, a move means giving up a lot, but it can also mean gaining a lot, too.<P>And, a move doesn't necessarily have to be too expensive, if you are willing to live in a small town somewhere in Backwoods, USA. Houses (nice ones) where I live rent for $150-350 bucks a month. <P>Either way, I think you need to put some distance between yourself and this situation.<BR>with love,<BR>cd

cd- where in backwoods USA are you?? i want out of this big city, and with the child support and arrears, we will need to get out of here when i finish school... and is there a big town close by?<P>happy_girl

I read all of these w/great interest....now I want to see what you said about my NEWEST post....???????I'm so confused.....<P>Love you guys soooooo much<P>Debi<P>------------------<BR>Imagine....

Dear happygirl,<BR>we are in Tioga county, PA, right below the NY border. The reason the cost of living is so cheap here is because there just aren't too many people living here - a lot of the surrounding area is state forests. Despite the low population, it is nice - it's actually beautiful mountains and valleys - you should see it when the leaves turn in the fall- people drive from hundreds of miles away to look at them. We live about 20 minutes from Wellsboro, a town that looks just like Bedford Falls from the movie "It's A Wonderful Life". There are even old-fashioned gas streetlights there. We are about 45 minutes from Corning, NY and 1 hour from Elmira, NY, both decent sized cities with tons of job opportunities. This is a terrific location if you're willing to commute to work in one of those cities. To me this is heaven, primarily because there is NO crime here. Our town has one cop, and the worst he ever has to deal with is the occasional speeding ticket (I know- he's nailed me once already). It's the kind of place that you could leave your keys in your car and your doors unlocked at night, if you wanted to. Really, it is like traveling back in time 50 years, as far as neighborhood mentality goes. There is also plenty of work. My h and i moved here without jobs (he's a mechanic, I am a teacher) and both of us found employment within days. If you ever are interested in knowing more, email me and I'll give you my telephone number.<P>BTW, could you please send me the MB photo site info. again? I lost it accidently.<P>Thanks,<BR>cd