Things here have been difficult, happy, upsetting, calming. If that makes sense? My H and I have been working through my betrayal. It gets tough at times, but I always reassure him that I want to be here with him and our family. <BR>I was wrong in not seeing all the things he has done for me and the kids. Everything he does is for us. I told him I am glad I didn't see it earlier b/c we would not have Hannah. <P>I haven't had any contact with OM. A couple of weeks ago I had to talk to OM's boss about the A and why it occured in the courthouse. It was uncomfortable for me to do, but I did it to set my H mind at ease that I wasn't going to protect OM. <BR>My H has his good days and bad. On Saturday he throw me a surprise b-day party! I had no clue he was planning this, just makes me feel like a loser for doing what I did. We are in counseling, it is going well. <BR>The only thing I am struggling with is do we ask OM and his W if they want contact with D. Now it is out in the open, I don't know if it is right to ask. I don't want to do anything that upsets my H, I just want to do what's best for Hannah. I know she will want to meet OM and his family when she is older, see where she came from. I have talked alot to adopted adults and most agree that it is right to give her a chance to make the choice. I am wanting to contact, having H do it, OM for medical information. I can only give a one sided report to the doctor. I know I need to know any information for the sake of my D life. I don't know if it would be right to ask if a medical situation came up and I need to have her biological parents test for a problem, asking him if he would be there to do whatever testing is need to save her life, a little drastic, I know, but I have to look at a worse case scene. God willing, it NEVER comes down to that. So other than that, my H and I are making it work. Thank goodness he gave me a second chance!!!!<P>------------------<BR>RY<BR>"This child was not created out of love, but was born into love, that is all that matters."

Dear RY,<P>How old is Hannah?<P>I think your idea of having H contact OM for medical information is a good start. Maybe that will open up some communication that can lead into whether OM and W want contact.<P>Good luck!

Hannah Banana is only five months old!! She is growing like a weed. I think it is a good idea too. If they choose not to have contact, that is alright by me, but I know she maybe hurt from it in the future. If they say no contact, maybe I can tell her sperm donor died, that way she won't have to look forward to being disappointed. I can't do that, that's not being honest, but it is a nice thought!<P>------------------<BR>RY<BR>"This child was not created out of love, but was born into love, that is all that matters."

RY,<P>You are a strong brave woman and you have a wonderful H and to think that you had such a rocky start on this board.<P>I agree with asking OM for medical information and seeing where that leads. He may not want contact now especially if he sees it as threatening to his W and family (don't know his home life situation). But respectful, considerate contact on your part now may set the stage so that later in life your D has the chance to know her birth father. She will already know and love her Dad, the man you are married to and the man who will help raise her.<P>I am born of a similar situation. I have seen my birth father at a party a few years ago for the first time in my life (well since I discovered I had a birthfather). I used to see him occasionally when I was a child. He was on the outer fringes of my parents social circle. When I saw him again, I didn't want any more to do with him. He has been ravaged by alcohol. I am lucky in that there has been some fringe contact with his family because I know my medical details w/o having to reveal to him that I am his bio child. Two of his 3 brothers are alcoholics like him; the other one is bipolar; my birth grandmother is still alive at nearly 90, somkes like a chimmney and used to drink too much, but now only moderately. She has been hospitalized many times for unipolar depression. Not the gene pool I wish my mom had gone swimming in. However, I consider myself lucky. She picked the best Dad in the world to raise me. I am his favorite of 7 daughters and I adore him. It is a mutual admiration society. The only fight we ever have is which one of us was more blessed by getting to share in the other's life.<P>A weepy Mrs. Job

My wonderful, adorable Dad called me from a pay phone on the road (he is a long-distance truck driver) almost as soon as I sent my last message. He just called to tell me he loves me and my H and that he is praying for us through this hard time. I knew I was blessed.<P>Mrs. Job

"I know she will want to meet OM and his family when she is older". <P>You are making an assumption. I'd say roughly half of the people who don't know one or both bioparents (for any reason) want to know. Some just don't care. Keep in mind also, what kind of person you have described XOM as being. Do you really want to subject your child to this person on a regular basis?? Would you want that if they were not biologically related? What is your motive? You think XOM should care and want contact, but you say he doesn't, and your H doesn't, so what is the point? You could ask the XOM and his W to keep you posted if they ever move, so that you/your D has access to his medical info. and the possibility to contact them when she turns 18... this seems like the best of both worlds. What kids want is STABILITY and LOVE with discipline. You can provide all that without the weirdness/complications of an extra family in her life.<P>You asked opinions--there's mine!<BR>Good luck and enjoy that baby! They grow up waaaaay to fast!<BR>J

RY,<P>So glad things are going so well with your family. Sounds like things are going fairly smooth so far. I would just play it by ear and see what H wants to do. Remember too you have plenty of time before Hannah Bannana is old enough to worry about it. Itll work out.<P>Love<BR>bw<BR>

Whoa, Jenny...now I remember why you are my hero...<P>Yeah, motive. RY, let's examine the motivation behind you wanting to contact OM. Is there some small part of you who desires that the OM wants or desires you or the child? Is it ego? Or is it medical? Or both? Hmmmm. Interesting question to ponder.<P>My cousin was adopted and he has absolutely no interest in finding out who his birth parents are. His only interest is if there is baldness in the family. He's so vain...I bet he thinks this post is about him.<P>Mrs. Job! My step dad is wonderful like yours is...I got misty reading what you wrote. I am suddenly inspired to call him.<P>Catnip =^^=<P>Hannah Banana is so cute!<p>[This message has been edited by catnip (edited May 30, 2001).]

Catnip, In regards to your ?, the answer would be nothing other than I need to know the medical history. It would not offend or bother me that he chooses what he does or will. I know my D is better off with my H and I to give her a home where she is wanted and honestly loved, unlike some of the statements I have read where families only deal with the child b/c OW sued for child support, so it's like a payback.We will sue for visitation b/c the b***h is stealing $$ from my kids. Not that the OP wants to know their child. I don't feel the need to subject my D to OM and his crazy W. As unstable as she is, she would prob. try to harm my D as she is a threat to OM W's sanity. I will however protect my D in whatever way I deem necessary. Fact is OM is her bio-counterpart, he help create her, he can give me nothing more than important info to keep her alive and healthy. Besides mental history is important too, if he and his W are as unstable as they appear to be, then I would like to offer my D all the resources to make sure she is well.<P>------------------<BR>RY<BR>"This child was not created out of love, but was born into love, that is all that matters."

RY,<P>Well, I have to say that you could probably do without getting the medical info from OM. I say this because we are never going to contact OM for Abbi's medical info because we don't want him involved in our lives ever again. Yes, we will tell Abbi how she came to be. But, I have a feeling that if she ever does want to meet OM, and does, her reaction will be the same as Mrs. Job's to her bio-father. If the OM is such a horrible person, he doesn't deserve to have that contact. Leave it up to Hannah when she comes of legal age. The only thing that would make us do that is if it was court ordered, which won't happen for at least another year, and hopefully not until after that "magical" 2 years is up, and OM couldn't do anything(we hope). I still feel in my heart that his money is too important to him, and we would make sure that he would have to pay for everything(dna tests, attorney fees, and CS). Yes, it is nice to have the medical history, but not all important. Just look at those who were adopted back when they didn't include that stuff in the adoption papers. Yes, it's nice to know if a certain disorder is possible, but which is better for your marriage? Continuing to heal your marriage as it stands right now, or have contact w/OM again, which could cause your H pain in some way? I know that if I contacted OM, even for the medical info, it would not go over well with my H. Of course, OM in our situation doesn't know about Abbi, and that would just be opening another can of worms. I guess what I am trying to say is, is it really THAT important to have the medical info, and have you REALLY discussed this with your H? I know that it is a hard decision to make, but I have been there, and have opted to leave it alone. Many people, including myself, have said that God won't give you more than you can handle. If you trust in Him, He will help you and your H through this trying time. Don't jump into anything before you have seriously prayed about it, and discussed it, openly, with your H.<P>I hope I didn't come across too harshly. I'm just offering my opinion.<P>Love,<P>Tigger<p>[This message has been edited by tigger4jdt (edited May 31, 2001).]

Let me ask you something, RY. If the father of your daughter does decide he wants visitation, would you then file for child support? <P>Curious. <P>

I guess I wasn't clear in my statement. I would not be the one who would make contact, it is my H who has any contact. Secondly, the medical information is important as I want to help my D in her health any way needed. If idiot wanted visitation. I say TOO BAD!! You should have thought about that before you were so quick to run from this situation. Knowing OM can't sue for visitation, let alone paternity, I have the one thing he more than likely wants, his D. So I would not bless his life anymore than he has blessed mine. Although I did get the world's most beauttiful baby from him, a baby my H loves with his whole heart. So no I wouldn't give him the pleasure of knowing her. That said those are my feeling and whatever Hannah decides to do in 18 years is up too her. So my H and I have talked about it and he feels this is important. My H is the one who will have any contact with OM if needed. Here in Michigan OM has NO RIGHTS, UNLESS WE START THEM FIRST. Which we are not going to do. I don't care about child support, giving him to oppurtunity to know and love my D isn't worth the money or my D's heart. She is worth a whole lot more to my H and I. To OM and his family she would be a credit card bill. A burden who is capable of loving, they do not deserve her love, comppasion or her being.<P>------------------<BR>RY<BR>"This child was not created out of love, but was born into love, that is all that matters."

Bravo, RY...I'm glad to hear that you are distancing yourself from this person...and be glad the crazy W isn't related to your D!<P>Catnip =^^=

I have been making a very good effort not to comment here, but I just have to now. (sorry, CoR, I did my best, but I have to say something!)<P>I don't think it is fair to bash om's wife, to label her crazy or unstable. Why? Because if she is indeed acting/feeling a little off balance right now, RY is 50% to blame for her condition. It is almost impossible to be hit with something like this without going a little bonkers. To our ow, I am sure I am the crazy wife. Catnip, I'm sure the ow in your life labels you crazy and unstable as well. <P>Catnip, I promise I won't mind a bit if you ever jump in to slap my fingers, so I hope you'll forgive me for criticizing your comment about how RY should be glad that her D isn't related to the crazy wife. Fact is, because RY chose to have a child with a married man, her daughter IS and forever will be related to that woman. As you so eloquently put it before, that woman has been raped into stepmotherhood. The ow may not like the fact that I am her daughter's stepmother, but she chose to have my husband's child. I certainly didn't choose for that to happen. And so I am not going to feel bad for poor ow now that she has to deal with me being in her daughter's life. <P>And I am sure that to our ow, my h is the biggest scumball that ever lived, just like RY's former partner is to her now. But my h was good enough for ow to sleep with. He was good enough for her to trick into being the father of his child. Just now, that h is not playing the game she would like him to play, he becomes a horrible person. I need to remind you, RY, that YOU chose this man to have a child with. YOU must have thought he was pretty great at one time or another.<P>RY, I don't want you to get the wrong idea. I think that what you and your h have decided to do is terrific. You are providing your daughter with the greatest gift you could ever give her - the chance to grow up in a stable, loving, two parent environment. But do you know what? Whether or not you can see it, om has indeed "blessed" you by agreeing not to participate in his daughter's life, to let you and your h alone to live your lives and concentrate on your marriage and your family without outside interference. Perhaps his motives for doing so are selfish, but it is a great gift, a great sacrifice nonetheless. I cannot comprehend why it is that you won't return the favor and let him and his wife get on with their lives as well. God bless Tigger, who has given her om's wife the greatest gift of all - the gift of never knowing about the affair.<P>RY, I am not trying to pick a fight here. But I take issue with your attitude towards those of us who choose, once the mother has decided to file for child support, to pursue custody of the oc. You probably weren't intending to single me out by making that comment, but as we are in those very circumstances, I feel the need to respond. Like so many ow, our ow decided that she wanted to raise oc without any assistance from my h. Wanted to marry her boyfriend and have him be oc's father. So, thinking that would be in the best interest of the oc, my h agreed. His motives were pure, I can tell you that. But then ow turns around and says, "I don't want you to be oc's daddy, but you are damn well going to PAY because you ARE her daddy." That is so hyprocritical. If my h is going to have the responsibilities of fathering this child, then he is going to assert his rights and BE a father to this child. Ow can't have it both ways. And neither can you. If you don't want om to be Hannah's daddy, and he agrees that he doesn't want to, that's great. But if you want him to take responsibility for his actions in creating her, then you have to expect that he will/should want to be a part of his daughter's life. What kills me is that you are content to let your h be Hannah's father now, but I would bet dollars to donuts that if you two ever break up, om would find himself on the hook for child support. I'll bet that all your self-righteousness and integrity would fly right out the window. Why do I think this? Because you can't stand the idea that om doesn't have to PAY for this. <P>What I don't understand is that om is doing EXACTLY what you want him to do. And you are STILL not happy with what he is doing. I just don't understand what you WANT from him now.<P>I probably took all of this way too personally. But I just don't think that ANY woman who finds herself in this horrible situation should be called crazy. <BR>-cd

Thank you c.d., You just put into words all that I wanted to but have not had the energy to do so. So if your over reacting so I am, must be because were the crazy wifes right. with love flowerseed

CD, first let me say I was not attacking or saying anything about your situation. I am not fimilar with your situation, I was basing my comment on suing for visitaion as a way of payback for OW suing for child support as what I have read in many posts. So if you were a writer of one of the posts I had read that in, I am sorry for offending, but that's what was said. I have said this before. I find it amazing that people cannot come here a state their opinion without being view as starting trouble. Apperently I am view as "ONE OF THE TROUBLE MAKERS" by your response to CoR for not wanting to respond but had to. I don't know why I can't, no, yes I can, I am the OW, that's how you view me so I must be scummy, gross, slutty,wicked, an STD carrying, nasty little tramp who slept with a MM knowing he was M'd. Well that MM also sleeped with a MW and I am labled as the bad one, let alone had a child by this man. B/C I loved my child regardless of biology and carried this child until her birth, loving this child regardless of biology and giving her a home where she can grow up to learn of values and morals, showing her that there are men out there willing to take responsibility for someone else's short comings.<BR>Yes, I don't want her bio-counterpart in her life and I am sure that if my H and I don't make it that he will be the one to raise and love Hannah as his own, he will be the one who took responsiblity for her, I am confident that he would continue to take care of her if we should not make it. She has nothing to do with what I did, other than that's how she came to be. He would not punish her by not loving her if we should not make it. My H is a good man, he loves our son and daughter, regardless of who her bio-counterpart is. So no, at this point I don't feel it necessary to sue for child support if we should not make it. I DON"T WANT OM IN MY LIFE OR MY DAUGHTER'S!!! My statement of OM W being crazy well, I wasn't the one who sent her into C a full two years before the A started. OM talked about how insane she was and blah,balh, so it wasn't me and I will not take a blame for that. She had her own problems before I came along. No I did not CHOOSE this man to have a child with, she was the product of what we did. I don't want anything from him now or ever. Talking w/ my C I am finding out OM was obessed with me. As my H had stated before, OM suffers from Narssistic Personality Disorder, being a C he has seen alot of this and it is quite clear OM is a prime contender is the NPD Awards. OM W is not and will never be our D stepmother, I wouldn't allow that to happen. She will never be a part of my D life. There for I will never prusue anything that would allow that to happen. I would not give them the priviledge to know her. Yes I slept with this man, but I was in the fog then, it bright and sunny now!!!! <P>------------------<BR>RY<BR>"This child was not created out of love, but was born into love, that is all that matters."

RY,<BR>Good you changed your thinking it wasnt that long ago you were bragging on how om would pay but not be able to have any rights to this child remember? if you and h didnt make it.

RY,<BR>In clarification:<P>first, I never said anything about you being a troublemaker or that you are not welcome to post here. I am more often intrigued by the posters who do not agree with my viewpoints. My comment to CoR was in regards to an email in which I asked her if I was wrong in thinking that some of the comments were directed at me. CoR advised me not to take them personally. That is what I was referring to. the fact that I couldn't help but take them personally.<P>Second, I did not make any disparaging comments about you being an ow. None. I am not sure where you got the "slutty, disease carrying, etc.etc", but it wasn't from me or my post. I wouldn't hold what you did against you any more than I hold it against my h for making that mistake. People make mistakes. What counts is that they make it right afterwards. <P>Third, I still don't think it is right for you to call om's wife crazy. People can be in counseling for a number of reasons. that doesn't mean they are crazy. I am sure you are truthful when you say that om told you his wife had problems, but that doesn't mean that she really has any more problems than the rest of us. Wandering spouses often make up stories that make the betrayed spouse look bad. I would guess that 9 times out of 10, though, the WS has far more mental problems than the BS. But is your om's wife crazy now? Probably a little, considering the circumstances. And you ARE partly responsible for causing her pain. OM did a terrible terrible thing to her. And YOU did a terrible terrible thing to her. Your actions will undoubtably cause her years of mental anguish. To say, "well, she was in counseling before the affair, so I am not responsible for her being nuts" is a cop-out. If you think that you bear no responsibility for her present turmoil, you are wrong. <P>Fourth, like it or not, om's wife IS your daughter's stepmother. Whether she or you chooses to pursue that relationship is another matter entirely. But I guarantee that she will never be able to forget or overlook the fact that your daughter is her husband's child. It will be something that haunts her until her dying day.<P>Two questions for you: <BR>1. Why do you still say "at this point" you are choosing not to pursue cs? What circumstances do you feel would cause you to change your mind? Would it be if om decided to pursue contact? And if that is the case, wouldn't it be just as immoral for you to pursue cs to "get back" at him as it is for the father to pursue visitation to get back at the woman for pursuing cs?<P>2. Why did you even feel the need for om and his wife to know about Hannah's conception? I do understand how important it was for your h to know, but I can't see how any good came of om or his wife knowing. (I am hoping that you don't use the good ol' "honesty" line, because I get really tired of BS who suddenly latch onto honesty as a motivating "excuse", when it obviously hasn't been that important to them before.) I am asking this as a serious question. What good did you think would come of it? <P>-cd<P>

Looking back, I find it did not good on letting OM know I was pregnate. OM W found out only b/c my H had me contact her due to her H saying he was going to commit suicide. Me personally would rather have not called his W, had my H hang up the phone from OM and let him do it. In regards to child support,I say at this point, talking with my H and becoming confident that he would not say to me if we did not make it that he was not going to take care of our D. I know he would. Therefore until I am 100% sure that he would want to stay in her life if that happened I say that. I am getting more than enough pleasure from knowing that I control who enters my D life for now and that he nor his family will not have anything to do with her. Once she gets older, that is up to her. I have my D, no one else and that's they way it is going to be.<BR>Maybe crazy is not the right word for OM W....I won't label her anything as I do not care about her or her family. I am sorry for offending!!!!<P>------------------<BR>RY<BR>"This child was not created out of love, but was born into love, that is all that matters."

Well.. <P>First and foremost, I can attest to what Cdcollins said about the email. However, I will also say your post not only offended her a great deal, but also myself as well. <P>Maybe your posts bother me because I don't understand how one can wish for something, get it and then still complain. You have consistently stated you do not want the father of your daughter involved in her life. He is not. Yet, you call him names, call his wife names, call his family garbage because he's doing exactly what you want. You can't have it both ones. It's one or the other. <P>Perhaps your posts bother me even more because I am a supporter of father's rights. I am awfully tired of women having children, either through marriage or otherwise, demanding things from fathers and then telling them they can't see their own kids. Fathers routinely have to beg, pay tons of money in attorney fees, and go through the torment of a bitter women who can't seperate herself from her children. I have heard horrible stories of women who leave the state or even country to keep children away from the fathers who desperately want to see them and be a part of their lives. This "feministic" attitude that women are the only good parents, that because we have a uterus we say what goes when it comes to children truly sickens me and makes me embarrassed of my gender. <P>Perhaps your posts bother me because even though you don't know his wife, you claim she is crazy. As CdCollins said, after going through what she just did, if she wasn't acting crazy, I would worry even more. Also, since your husband is a counselor and has deemed the father of your daughter as having NPD, then he must also know it is NOT the NPD person who goes in for counseling for he/she thinks they are perfect and the rest of the world is crazy. The people who DO seek help are those around them because they, having been brainswashed by an NPD, truly think they are crazy and need help. So, you're right. She had problems longed before you came along and they weren't marital problems. They were NPD problems. <P>As far as the wife now being a step-parent and you stating you won't allow it? Well, I hate to tell you but it's the law. Thankfully, there ARE step-parent rights now. There's also the possibility that she can one day sue for visitation on behalf of your daughter's half siblings. I don't know where you heard it's your right to deny visitation should the father of your daughter come around. Your state is a joint custody state and unless you can prove him and her extremely unfit, should they decide to fight for visitation, they'll get it. <P>Well, that's all I have to say. All I can do is ask that you take it easy diagnosing of a wife you don't even know. Trust me, if your married man is indeed a person with NPD, nothing he said was the truth. <P>CoR