"NO!" <P>I called ow for my H and ask if we can see the baby for a few hours. She acts nice and says she's at her brothers pool and will call within an hour. So we went back outside to our pool and the bunch of usual friends and family.<P>In 5 minutes our son yelled out "Mom the phone!" H and I run inside to get it, (she called on our new ow hotline).<BR>I said hello and she said "not to be rude" (which usually follows with a rude answer, right?) "but I never want to deal with you again, you are not baby's mother, I am and H is the father. If H wants to see baby so bad HE can call and come to my mom's, or I will be the one to bring him to your house, not you." She was in her brothers house where no one else knew what she was doing.<P>Very politely I said I understand and have a great day....not saying H will not call...if it's important H sees baby, it shouldn't matter who does the calls, right?<P>Then we hung up. H called her lots of bad words.....says why is she doing this?.....says I hate her Deb. Then thanks me over and over and kisses and hugs me till I almost couldn't breathe. What a wonderful close feeling.<P>Now we are done. Dna due this Fri. Courts to follow I'm sure. ugh.... I almost wish it weren't H's just to let all of this die down. I'm sure it is his. I don't mind the baby anymore it's all the bull she's doing to H. Games at the cost of the child.<P>I will pray God touches her and softens her to the baby's needs and not her own. I pray God shows US the path to walk.<P>Love<BR>Debi<P>------------------<BR>Imagine....

It still amazes me that these creatures(ow) have the audacity to make any demands. When they decided to have these oc, they took the chance of having the wives become step-mothers to their children. I f they don't agree with this ,then they can crawl back under their rocks and leave our h's and us alone. THEY CAN'T HAVE IT BOTH WAYS. <P><BR>

Gem...<P>You have evolved at time warp speed from where you were just a few short months ago to where you are today...I don't think I have ever seen such a speedy metamorphosis. Your grace, class and style bowl me over. I am really, really proud of you. Like my Grandma always said, "Class will tell".<P>Impressed<P>Catnip >^..^<

Hi Gem,<BR>What you have just described is typical ow M.O. They don't want the wife to be part of the baby's life. Well, guess what! She is going to learn a thing or two when you all go to court. You are oc's step-mother, and you have every right to be part of his life. So she better enjoy the feeling of power now, because it isn't going to last long. Plus, the fact that you and h have already had contact together with the baby will carry a lot of weight in the judge's eyes. <P>Keep up the good work, Gem.<BR>with love,<BR>cd

Me too, me too! Our xOW doesn't want visitation now because she can't stand having to see me, although (her words) I am a very, very nice person.<P>Once she told me that when she was growing up and picturing having children there was never me involved. I told her, believe me, my plans for the future never included and OW and an OC. <P>I guess what bothers me is that we have gotten over this to the point of being able to accept OC in our lives, what on earth is wrong with our xOW?<P>MJ

Ladies,<P>One of the best things for me in coming to this board is realizing that what I am feeling and what OW is doing are sooooo typical. I find a measure of comfort in knowing that I am not irrational in feeling as I do and that OW is a textbook example of a "woman scorned" whose actions are selfish, childish, and just plain mean.<P>I am 2 1/2 years+ past DDay, and OW is STILL pulling this kind of nonsense when she gets an opportunity. What we try to do is simply limit her opportunities, even though continued contact because of visitation with OC makes it impossible to avoid her entirely.<P>As you may know is you have read any of my posts, I am still in turmoil about a lot of the issues involved in our complicated situation, and I'm not even sure of what I really do want anymore. But one thing I AM sure of is that I intend to remove entirely the OW's stranglehold on my life. I don't care what it takes, I will NOT permit her to dictate what happens in my life anymore. Having said that, I should add that I am certainly not "there" yet. In all honesty, OW's actions still intrude far too much in my thoughts and still upset me way too much. But I'm working on it. (At least I don't spend hours planning every tiny detail of how I could carry out her murder and not get caught.)<P>Oh dear, oh dear. What has this horrible ordeal done to us?<BR>Had I known 27 years ago when I met my H that my life would turn out like this after 26 years of marriage to him, I never would have agreed to go out with him in the first place. But, I guess that good old hindsight.<P>Take care, dear.<P>love, anniem<P>

Debi,<P>I can relate to what your OW is saying/doing. When I found myself pregnant with Jonas, I too felt that it was HIS responsibility and that HE should be the one to concern himself about his son. It really angered me that he would put his W in the position of dealing with such an awful situation. I also felt…and this is brutally honest….that when he and I had laid in that bed, his W was not there with us and this was not HER child. I was angry and I was hurting. I knew, deep-down, that it was a process for her, but I was too caught up in my own emotions to be sincerely concerned about anyone but me.<P>I think that the tell all about the OW is when she makes the conscious decision to put her child's needs first. When/if that eye-opening moment occurs, she will realize that her selfish needs don't hold a candle to what she needs to do for her baby. It appears that this revelation doesn't appear very often in the run-of-the-mill OW. I'm praying for you that this does happen. If that woman truly loves her child, she will realize that her baby would be much better off if she tries to work as a team instead fighting against you all the time. I can't imagine denying my son a wonderful opportunity just because of my own fear and insecurity. And that, Debi, is what it comes down to. She can act anyway she likes, but the bottom line is that she is afraid and insecure. The baby is her only "safety-line" where your H is concerned. If she loses that due to your gracious attempts to be involved in a positive manner, then for her "all is lost". Your H would be irrevocably out of her reach.<P>Just my thoughts.<BR>

<BR>Debi,<P>I am so happy for you and your H. (a little jealous too)<BR>I am so glad you two have a united front and have been brought even closer together. I hope my H comes around!!<P>Praying for OW says a lot about you, I think I will try that ...The one thing I seem to pray about the most is for forgiveness, because I have thoughts about wishing OW would have a misscarriage, I then I feel horrible about it. Thank you for showing me a different approach!!<P>Love,<BR>MoJo

Dear Blue,Catnip,cdcollins,Mrs.Job,anniem(how are you?),Ohbratti1,and Mojo7,<P>Thanks for your been there done that answers! Ohbratti1 I eapecially thank you for another prospective on all of this.<P>I feel like screaming again as she dropped off a note not in an envelope to H's office saying how I mean nothing to her. She cares deeply for H's feelings no matter what he's done to her. If the old carefree guy she knew reappears please call her. Sorry H chooses to be locked in a cage. He has to live by my rules but SHE doesn't. Then she quoted "Do onto others as you would want done to you". Again she asked why I thought she was such a threat.<P>She doesn't get it. She's not an exwife! I do not feel threatened. I want her out of my marriage! For good! I accept the child but cannot accept her as H's "friend" or mine for that matter.<P>I hope the judge does view our visit favorably.<P>Thanks to you all again.<P>love<BR>debi<P>------------------<BR>Imagine....

Amen, and amen.<P>An ex-wife you know about before you marry a man. This is not an ex-wife situation and will never be. This was the most intimate betrayl a person can suffer (well, besides a rape).<P>Why do you see her as a threat?! Well.....duh! can she possibly be that stupid or be in denial that deep?<P>They really hate having to deal with us because we are concrete proof that H is not going back to them. You wouldn't involve your wife in visitation if you had any hopes of reuiniting with OW. I know that this must be very hard for them and I am not trying to make too much fun of their situation, but 'cmon! Wake up and smell the dirty diapers for Pete's sake. I also think that they are so hurt and so needy that any private contact with our Hs gives them hope that they might someday be back together; it creates the illusion that there is still a "them." That is exactly why we are so opposed to that private contact.<P>MJ<P>PS I pray for our xOW almost every day. We are told to pray for our enemies, even though that isn't what I now consider her. I see her as another very hurt person in this huge mess. I am sorry that she is hurt. I hope she finds happiness, genuine hapiness with a man who can love her full time and be a good daily influence on OC. Somehow with her past history, I don't think that this is too possible, but I pray that it is. <p>[This message has been edited by Mrs. Job (edited June 18, 2001).]

I totally agree with anniem. Our OW is exactly the same. When it dawned on her that H would not come running back, she sent an "anonymous" letter talking about how she didnt want H in her or OC's life anymore, but then turned around and went to social services for cs, which H had been paying all along. <BR>I prayed for God to soften her heart and then saw a televangelist as I was flipping through the channels reminding me to expect miracles everyday. And, whammo, she calls that day out of the blue and says she wants to meet and work things out. Definitely keep praying.<BR>We are on to the next battle, but I will continue to pray for her so that the OC's best interests are in OW's heart at all times. <BR>Good luck. Prayer works.<BR>

You are so right Mrs. Job. I too pray for ow. I feel sorry that she has such a messed up life.<P>Tryin I agree. Someday we will share peace with this. I do pray everyday for that. Not a miracle just peace on earth. Good will toward man, every day.<P>Love<BR>Debi<P>------------------<BR>Imagine....

Ladies, Hello and how are you all? I have been as usual lurking and reading, but never the time to post. You are all in my thougths and prayers everyday. Gemini, I have been wondering how things have been going for you over the last few days, and there was your post tonight when I logged in. I have to say it is funny but I too have experienced the same if not worse bull from our ow. These last few weeks it has been really tough and things look as if they are going to get worse before they get better. I do think that they will get better though, my h is going to be giving our lawyer the go ahead to file a motion of modification of visitation this week. It is really going to be another expense, but I think it will be money well spent. At this point we have no choice. The ow is really using this poor, sweet, little boy to screw with my h and try to hurt him. She refused to allow extra time yesterday on fathers day, she has told the oc he is not allowed to call my h Dad, he has told my son this many times over the last few weeks, she screams at my h on the phone every chance she gets, she told the oc my h ran away from him when he was a baby and that he did not want him, she told the oc her parents, his grandparents, hate my h. Do I need to go on? Someone has to step in, she is ruining any chance my h has of building a relationship, with the oc. He has a great time each week with us and I think this gets her even more mad. We decided enough is enough if spending $ to have a judge order her to give us more time and stop making it so hard for my h it will be money well spent. I hate to see this behavior cause damage to the child, and my son is starting to ask questions and wonder why things are so difficult if he is my brother why can't we see him. I think it is good that you have decided to get a handle on things now when the oc is a baby and hopefully these type of problems will have less of a chance to get out of hand. I am really happy for you <BR>GEm, that things with your h are going so well, and I think as long as you both stay strong and as a team you will be able to conquer whatever crap the ow trys to pull. We, my h and I are doing as well as we are because we are a team in love and life and refuse to let this ow get the best of us, lately she has really been testing us, but hopefully the courts will see the damage she is causing and love will win. Peace, Gabi1116

Gem, BTW, my h is the one that has the contact with the ow and that is okay with me, only because the 2timesthe two of them had relations was close to seven years ago and it was when we were separated. The ow pulls crap on him, as far as when he can and can not see oc and I am not even involved in the arrangements, so don't feel bad. She is just using this as an excuse to be difficult with the two of you and I think if you were not being involved she would still find reasons to cause problems, our ow does, GAbi1116

Immature people (XOP) do immature ugly things... using OC to play games is UGLY! <P>I'm very impressed by you ladies who keep standing firm with your H's and have contact with these immature women... all of you pat yourselves on the back!! The OCs are lucky to have you involved!<P>Mrs. Job I'm really impressed that you can pray for XOW regularly. I still rarely do it even though I think it's the "right" thing. The fact I knew XOW closely still gets in my way. God help these twisted people and their unfortunate kids!

Gabbi I wanted to be the one to call her so I would no longer "fear" her. I don't anymore. H had a recent relationship. Who know's how I'll feel in 7 years?<P>For now I will not call. Courts will settle that I guess. The fact that she doesn't want me coming w/H to get baby makes me angry. I want to go. We are, as you said , a team.<P>Jenny it's not hard to pray for ow. I need to so I can feel peace. I do not wish evil on her. I hope God touches her heart and let's her see we can help raise this baby. You know?<P>Things have calmed down for now. I'll let you know what's up soon.<P>Love<BR>Debi<P>------------------<BR>Imagine....

Jenny,<P>I too do it so I can have peace. I don't want to carry around any more anger and hatred than I absolutely have to.<P>Also, I did not know the OW; she wasn't a friend and I did not suffer a double betrayl. I think that that would have to be much harder. <P>MJ

Hey Gem,<P>I'm sorry that your OW is such a stupid idiot! Hopefully, like CD, you will have some luck come your way. You had mentioned something about the DNA being due this Fri, is that for OW to get the baby's stuff done, or is that for the results? I will be praying for you.<P>Love,<P>Tigger

tigger4jdt it'll be the results. Remember H not wanting to rock the boat till she went? Drove me insane but he had already PAID close to 650. for test and she threatened not to go. As soon as she went...... POW! we got atty to write letter of no contact. <P>Then we quit caving in to her demands.<P>And Mrs. Job....ow WAS our friend. It did take me longer to pray. I'm just sick of her actions and want to see the baby... It's like she was the queen of deceit along w/H. I NEVER would have guessed those two!<P>love<BR>Debi<P>------------------<BR>Imagine....

FOUND THE OB1 POST!!!!!YIPEE!!!! she answered me and it was like she was all I heard!<p>ENJOY! Gotta run.
love debi