As if sorting out the receipts that provide evidence of their trist weren't enough of a trigger, exOW called H on his cell on Saturday.<P>Normally he talks to Precious when she is at her grandmother's being babysat. For some reason, when he went out for take out for lunch (on my birthday, Saturday) he phoned to OW's house to speak to the baby. That is something that I thought wasn't going to happen.<P>Anway, right after we finish our lunch, exOW calls and she and H launch into a 10 minute conversation of trying to get <BR>Precious to make all the new animal sounds she has learned. Like "What does the cow say?" etc. <P>While I am glad the conversation took place in front of me, I can't tell you how painful it was to hear the two of them being parents together.<P>Thing is I need to tell him this but I don't know when and how. He is so vulnerable to criticism; see comments under Triggers, triggers, triggers. Anger and a scr*w-you attitude is his first reponse to any conversation about this situation. He later comes back and aplogizes and is much more open to negotiation and conversation, but I am sick of the inital first reaction. I think I might write this one down in a letter, after we come back from our visit with Precious (OC). That way if he needs to get angry he can get it out of the way before we talk. <P>However, why am I always the one in control, always forgiving, always bending, always the hurt one? OOOHHH, that was a big self-pity trip.<P>AAAARRRRRGGGGHHHHHH. Color me "tired-of-walking-on-egg-shells" (the newest Crayola Crayons color) or "betrayed-spouse-green-jealousy" or "I-don't-have-kids-and-he-does-with-another-woman-blues."<P>MJ<p>[This message has been edited by Mrs. Job (edited September 04, 2001).]

<BR>I also feel pain thinking of my H and his OW having a fourth child together..and being a parent with her (the last one while we were married). I hate the anger and pain. I've shared very little of the anger with him, and when I do, it is done very nicely.<P>Like you, I am tired (and it's only been 6 weeks since D-day!!!!!!!!)of being the one carefully thinking about what I say and how I say it. Sometimes I really want so desparately to say all the nasty, mean, spiteful, filthy words that pop into my head. Instead I say them to other people in hopes of lessening the pain.<P>I feel like the child that H and I have (3 years old today!)<BR>was a result of our love, and intimacy with each other and I am so angry that he ripped that from me to make another one with her!<P>I'd like to add a couple of new colors to that Crayola box...how about I-Had-to-plead-for-one-child-with-you-but you-gave-her-four-and-I'm-feeling-deeply-blue; or You-were-feeling-unloved-but acted-cowardly-yellow!<P>My Whine to follow....<P>I hope your day gets better.

MJ,<P>I don't have any advice for you since H doesn't have contact with OC. I just wanted you to know I feel you pain, anger and frustrations. My H went through a self pity stage. And after awhile I finally told him about himself and that was the best thing I could do. I went out drinking before I did it so I can't remember everything. But it worked he started moving forward and being the man I used to love and know. I'm totally aware every situation is different and you have to handle yours in a way that works. Just wanted you to know your in my thoughts and prayers.<P><BR>Unsure

Whew! a relief. H started quiet, serious talks last night and it was easy to just let it flow into how I felt about hearing them talk.<P>He said that exOW called him and left a message. It said that he wasn't meeting his obligation to call OC 2x a week so that when we come to visit OC would at least recognize his voice.<P>He felt guilty, called her back, she wasn't there and he told her to call back at home.<P>He says that he is glad that he talked to her in front of me as it used to be such a problem in our marriage when, although the PA had ended, they were still on the phone an hour or so a day.<P>I told him how I felt sitting there listening to the two of them laugh over OC's new accomplishments. He crigned. He says he felt so awful even while the conversation was going on.<P>I found out that he has not been calling Precious as we had all agreed on. When he does call he feels wracked by guilt all day. He says it reminds him of what he did, of never being able to make up the hurt to me, of never being able to be a good enough father to Precious and of not really wanting to be her father.<P>There is so much going on inside him that only seems to come out as anger. We have agreed that he is going to go to counseling 1x/week by himself and work on anger, guilt and self-esteem issues.<P>It was a good conversation. I was heard and understood. So was he. Now we just need some solutions to these perplexing issues.<P>MJ