<p>[ February 14, 2002: Message edited by: mnca6713julia3 ]</p>

Unfortunately that was not the case for my H, in fact OW managed to successfully carry out both pregnancies (5 year involvement). You don't sound harsh, believe me it is nothing that I didn't wish for myself after being told of the A and the 2nd delivery that took place a couple months back.<BR>Tina<BR>

Dear Tina71,<BR> Wow, I don't know how you guys are so strong to endure so much. I know that I am right along with you in your boat, per say because my h will have a child in less than 7 months, but I guess i see myself as lucky because i can walk away from this and try and start over without his baggage - because we don't have our own children. I just wish that I could fast forward about 3 years, and who's to say that God will bless me with a descent husband in the future. I hope that is God's will for me. This pain is too much for words to describe. <p>[This message has been edited by mnca6713julia3 (edited September 24, 2001).]

I find it stunning that these OW's have the physical strength of field workers, and often resemble them in courseness and crassness as well.(meow) They seem to be able to not only carry the child to term, but have a healthy child that will be subjected to a life without a father and face the disadvantages that come with that kind of life.<P>They rarely miscarry. But, women who are in legitimate, valid and blessed marriages seem to spend a lot of time desperate to conceive, camped out in fertility clinics, sterile and burning the midnight oil searching for a child to adopt, filling out a blizzard of paperwork (ask Mrs. job) and finding they are often met with bureaucracy and red tape.<P>There was an instance here on this site where the OW was lying about being pregnant but managed to extort huge sums of money during her 'faux' pregnancy before she was found out to be a fraud. I don't know if the MB Member ever followed through with pressing charges against her because after we all received the happy news that one of us was spared the nightmare of an OC, she vanished from the site to move on with her life.<P>We ALL wish for a miscarriage when we first hear the news and if anyone here says they didn't or act horrified by my statement, they are probably either lying to us or to themselves. In fact, if we are not wishing for a miscarraige, we pray they will give up the child for adoption. These are normal feelings that eventually lessen with time for most, not all, but for most. Don't feel or think you are evil for wishing for something that never should have been. You are the only person on this planet entitled to carry your own husband's child.<P>Keep a clear head and pray for God's will. He understands your devastation and won't hold these feelings against you for He is all merciful.<P>catnip =^^=

julia,<BR> There was a lady on her not to long ago that ow did miscarry or she was never preg in the first place. <BR> There also was a lady named mycross the the ow extorted over 70,000 dollars out of her h before they had dna test done. The child was not his. <BR> There is the chance that this child isnt your h. <BR> with love flowerseed

MNCA,<P>I know my husband used to hope for a miscarriage. <P>I didn't find out until after OC was 4 months old so I never had to face what you are facing. I think that the wait would be nearly unbearable.<P>I have known other MB members who came here in your situation and the advice was to take this time to try and decide what you want in your life. Try to figure out i fyou want to keep your marriage and, if so, to try and work on it.<P>If you decide that you would like to stay in your marriage, there are plenty of great articles on the site by the Harleys about their method of restoring marriages.<P>(I personally always found it hard that the betrayed spouse winds up doing most of the work to save a marriage. It was true in my case and, I think, in most of the marriages on the pregnancy/child forum.<P>I wish you the best.<P>Mrs. Job

Catnip -LOL field workers!<P>Julia- I think everybody wished OW had a miscarriage. It was hard for me to wish it because my D was only around 6 mths old when I found out. And at that time I could only put myself in her shoes. I believe if you wish or do harm to someone it will come back and see you.(No offense to anyone) But, I still secretly wished she lost the baby just never said it to anyone.<P><BR>Unsure<p>[This message has been edited by UNSure919400 (edited September 24, 2001).]

(I personally always found it hard that the betrayed spouse winds up doing most of the work to save a marriage. It was true in my case and, I think, in most of the marriages on the pregnancy/child forum.<P>Mrs. Job,<BR> You are so right about that! Since my husband has been home and has brought with him this awful news, I have scheduled the mtg to meet with out pastor, I found out what time this REBUILDERS mtg was, I called my pastor and asked for guidance, it has been all me me me. He is back into the same routines, like playing Zombie -killing games on the computer for up to 3 hours at a time and telling me that he is going fishing on Thurs, and it so rude and insensitive on his part. We could be having a normal conversation regarding all this and he just walks away and acts normal and says, "what's for dinner?. <P>And Catnip, you are on to something, they are like field workers. This OW is a TOUGHIE, let me tell you. When I spoke to her on the phone, she used the F word, and the Lord's name in vain a lot so I told her, "you have a really vile mouth, you sound like a man with the words you choose to use", and she said, "well i work w/ all men!". (I guess that makes her a man, then). She called my h lastnight at work and was very mad that he hasn't called her in the last week, she had been sick (how sad...). My h told me that she had e -coli something in her blood. That actually gave me peace for the day, sorry. Anyway, i wish more of these women would miscarry and be taught a hard lesson. They are carrying these children to term out of spite and to always have a hold on our husbands. And the sad thing is, if any of you have a h like mine, he cares more about her well-being right now than to make efforts to save our marriage. <P>His efforts to save our marriage have included saying "i love you" and "you know i don't want you to go".<P>Love you all, God bless.

MNCA,<P>Please be careful how out of control you allow the anger to get. It really does only hurt you. I am not saying deny the very, very real anger towards OW, but recognize that:<P>a) it is much easier to hate OW than it is to hate our spouses<BR>b) OW probably doesn't care one bit what you think about her. The level of anger we feel is like taking poison and waiting for the other person to die. It doesn't affect them and it nearly destroys us. Cognitive/behavioral therapies do help diminish this kind of anger (that we all feel at the beginning of this).<BR>c) Biblically, we are forgiven in measure of our ability to forgive. We can forgive those who have not even asked for our forgiveness. If you hold this out as your goal, you may not achieve it (after all we are only humand and we have suffered a huge, huge hurt), but you will almost certainly find that you can diminish some of your pain by not hanging onto the hatred. It is something that we have to do for ourselves, for our children, and for the future of our marriages.<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><B>They are carrying these children to term out of spite and to always have a hold on our husbands. </B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>I know I sound like a broken record but try some cognitive therapy here. There are tons of books on it on the market. It teaches you that it is impossible know what anyone else's motives are and that when we "mind read" we often get ourselves much more upset than we already are.<P>You may have summed up her motives exactly or she may be keeping the child because she believes that abortion is wrong. (Yes, I know that sleeping with a married man is wrong, but she may truly feel abortion is the biggest wrong a person can commit.) <P>Anyway, no matter what her motives are, she can't hold onto someone who doesn't want to be held on to. As you and your husband begin to work out your problems, and your marriage improves, he is likely to feel closer and closer to you and not understand what he ever saw in foul-mouthed-field-worker woman. Plan A means that you work on yourself and present the future new you to your spouse. (Worry about fixing his faults a little bit later.)<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><B>And the sad thing is, if any of you have a h like mine, he cares more about her well-being right now than to make efforts to save our marriage.</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Our spouses are some of the most hurting souls on the planet. They are so conflicted with guilt and with feeling torn in two directions. The honest, ugly truth of all of this is that two women love him and he has a choice of where he is going to spend his life. They have created an intolerable situation in which they have some actual obligations to two women. As he begins to bond closer to you, you can help him see just exactly what his obligations to her are--financial. You and he <B>may</B> decide together that he has an emotional obligation to the child, but that is a marriage decision and is a separate issue from what he owes OW. Actually even child support is owed to OC, not to OW. <P>No matter what our vows might say, the reality of life in our culture is that people don't have to stay married and 50% in this country don't. Many, many practicing Christians (Catholic and Protestant) wind up divorced. <P>Looking back on your old posts I see now that you and your H don't have children. Yes, you are right that you have the greatest level of freedom possible in this awful situation. You can decide to walk away and make a clean break, but are you sure that is what you want? I would recommend that you think about dedicating at least 6 months to working on your marriage and seeing if it can be salvaged. (I know that I decided on a year; we just passed the one-year anniversary of Dday this weekend.) It takes at least 6 months to see if there is something to salvage. If you give it your best effort, you can decide to divorce knowing that you gave your marriage everything you could. You can walk away with a clear conscience.<P>You are very brave to say here what I know that many, many women in your situation have thought. Just don't let the thoughts take over your life and blind you to what you want. <P>Just a thought--instead of praying for a miscarriage, you might just try letting God hear your groans of pain--no words. That way you have nothing to feel guilty about because you aren't praying for another to experience pain.<P>BTW, how long ago was Dday?<P>Shalom,<BR>MJ<p>[This message has been edited by Mrs. Job (edited September 24, 2001).]

Hi MJ,<BR> What is D day? is it the day i found out about oc? if so, I found out sunday sept 9. <BR> I think you are right, I am getting a bit out of control regarding my anger, and it feels good, but then I realize I am greiving my Lord, and that's not without cost. <BR> The ow does not recognize the sanctity of life because when she was threatening my husband with getting an abortion last week (and him telling her not to do that), she said that her friend Amber owes her a return favor because she drove her friend to the clinic just a few months ago. <BR> I have been upset lately too because my lawyer who is a christian told me that NOW he will in essence have 2 wives, me being the covenant wife and her being an obligation type wife. I stayed quiet but I wanted to tell him to never tell me that again. How dare he say that! 2 wives!<BR> Anyway, the 6 mo. wait seems reasonable, but I think that if things continue to go the way they are (him still calling her out of concern, him being nonchalant regarding getting help and continuing to make wisecracks)I will leave before the snowfalls here in MN.<BR>Thanks for your encouragement

<BR> <p>[This message has been edited by flowerseed (edited September 24, 2001).]

mnca...<P>Our ow supposedly miscarried...what a circus...I'm sending an excerp from my last post...<P>As you know from my last post I have been on pins & needles waiting for this "Nut" to finally deliver. Well yesterday, after much hemming & hawing My H informed me that our OW had a car accident almost 2 weeks ago and lost the 2 remaining babies. He said he just couldn't find the courage to tell me because he was embarrassed...but he couldn't stand to see me continue to suffer (how kind of him!!) We had gone out of town for that weekend and when we returned she called him telling him that she needed to see him and explained it all. Her & a couple of relatives were in a terrible accident on her due date (how ironic). They had to do an emergencey C-section & One of the children was deceased upon delivery...the other supposedly lived for a little while (I have no idea how long) and then died...she had a picture of the one that lived for a bit. She supposedly delivered by C-section...he said he saw the incision...and he said she was scarred up as though she had possibly been in an accident. I asked him if he believed all of this...he said no...but he's very glad that there are no babies. He said she was definately pregnant...he's felt the babies (or baby) move. He thinks she may have delivered and put them up for adoption. She had been saying that she didn't think she wanted them....& he told her that he would take them. I think if she did opt for adoption...she only did it because she knew there was no way in hell they could have been my spouses children. If she thought there was any possible chance of them being his...she would have held on for dear life. You know he had recently agreed to have a paternity test done....her attitude seemed to change after that. H says he is completely through with her and finally admits that she has proven to be "MENTALLY CHALLENGED"!! <P>Even though things are over...(I think)...I have no trust for spouse..and really lack respect for his sense of judgement. I don't know that things will ever be right with us again. I just don't feel the same. The whole crazy mess took a lot out of me...but at the same time allowed me to reach a part of myself I didn't really know existed!! Spouse says things will be better than ever...and maybe they will be...I just hope I can hang in there till then.<P>This forum is a wonderful resource...Lord knows it was a blessing to me....I don't know what I would have done without it!! The women here are wise beyond words & super nurturing!! I will be forever grateful for them. I still hang out & lurk from time to time...and even cry at many of the posts...(Mina's post broke my heart)!! So between this site...and staying connected to God you will be able to stand in the face of adversity with dignity and grace!!<P>Much Love To U....<P>Broke-Down

Broke Down,<BR> Thank you for sharing your story. Wow, that is some story! I think that was noble of that ow to give those babies up for adoption, if that is what happened and not the tragic accident. <BR> <BR> Yea, what is happening in my life right now is just unbearable. I wonder how I am still sane, or even if I am. I am just so blessed that I have God. Even though I have been angry, I know that God is right there providing comfort and love.<BR> <BR> I am right there with you when you talk about trusting your h. When I look at my h I just get so sad and mad and yet i love him. I still don't know what I am going to do, I will more than likely move back to CA where my family is and if he moves with me, I will attempt to make the marriage work then. <P> I agree, this site has been my refuge and am so thankful for it. Imagine those who were going through this 20 years ago when the internet wasn't accessible to all. God has been good to us to give us eachother (our mb sisters - family). <BR> <BR> God Bless You <BR>

Oh my goodness! You are so new at all of this. No wonder your anger is so huge. I can't tell you the awful things I was thinking at a couple of weeks after learning of H's affair and child.<P>(Dday is the day you find out about the affair. Some have multiple Ddays if they learned of multiple affairs or if they learned of one affair on one day and a child on another, or if the same affair continues and the spouse learns again that the affair is still going on.)<P>You have my thoughts and prayers.<P>MJ