I wish to get your side of the story. And to explain, as the family of the OM, our side. My H's lover was a married woman who, in the middle of the pregnancy moved to another state & reconsilled w/ her H. Her H has said he will raise the child as his own. When the OC was born 1 month ago she was given their last name & her H was listed as the father on the birth certificate. When the pregnancy was first discovered, before I knew about the A, my H told OW he didnt want to be a father again & asked her to give the baby up for adoption. She wouldnt. After I found out, we decided to stay together & work on our marriage. When my H knew I was willing to accept the OC, he changed his mind, and told OW that if OC was his, he DID want to be part of its life. She agreed to a DNA test, and we will get the results this week, hopefully. She has asked for us to handle it between ourselves and not to get the law involved. So legally, as it stands today, her H is the father of the OC and we dont have a leg to stand on, but she sounds agreeable to us working things out amicably. She also claims she wants no child support from us. But all of this isnt about money, its about family, and a child who is a part of my H's blood. OW will not tell us if she has discussed all of this w/ her H and what he wants. We dont know if she has explained she has kept in touch w/ my H and that he wants to be a part of the OC's life. I wrote her a letter and asked her what her H knows. (she told me its none of my business!!) I said we did not want to interfere w/ their life. We knew (especially since they have other kids) that it would be easier for the OC to call her H "daddy" like the other kids do, and we would find another name for my H like "papa" or something. We are not asking for joint custody. They can raise the child as they see fit. But we do want regular visitation,(which will be hard since they live 1,500 miles away, so its not like we would have the child every other weekend, maybe only a few times a year.) We are willing & wanting to share in the financial support of the child if its his because we believe it is the right thing to do. To be a part of this childs life seems especially important to us since we view the OW and her family as disfunctional & troubled, and we worry alot about the OC. We see the best scenario as being similar to an agreeable step-parenting arangement. Where the child is made to feel special because she has 2 daddies. If this is my H's child, our children have a half-sister that they should know, and grandparents, aunts, uncles & cousins. We will all love her & want her to know us. We would never usurp the authority of the parents raising her, but we could contribute something to her happiness & security in this often scary world, and she could bring a lot of joy to us. Children often have adults other than their parents...be it grandparents, teachers, good friends of parents...that contribute in significant ways through out their life...My H just wants to be one of those people in his own childs life. So, my question to you is: If the OM in your life was a stable, "normal" guy who only wanted to be a part of his own childs life, and was willing to financially and in every other way do what was right for the child, and would take into account your wishes, could you be agreeable to this? Can a child have too many people who love them and want whats best for them? Shouldnt this be a plus for the child? In this day and age, step-families are not uncommon or looked down on, so there would be no shame or embarrasement for the child. And even if this is not really the way you want it, if the OM would not be a detrement to the child, shouldnt he be, not only allowed to, but encouraged in his efforts to be a good dad to the OC? In some of these cases I understand the OM to be violent or a negative or dangerous influence in some way, and that is different. Are you afraid of the continued contact between your wife and the OM? I am, about my H and his OW, but I also want whats best for the OC. I understand that a 3rd party can handle all communications between them & I have a question out asking if this has worked for anyone. I am also willing to have OW deal w/ me (which she has said she wont) or to have her H deal with me. I think there are options to make it all work. I would like to hear your point of view.

heart of hope:<P>Ugh, what a headache...<P>Being in this position (to a point---we happen to be a stable family), I would find it simpler to have the OM and family to have no involvement. Could I agree to involvement by them??? Maybe---but it's unclear to me that it would really be much of a benefit to the child. I think it's presumptious of you to think that there may not be repercussions for the child.<P>My wife's OM wasn't a violent or negative influence (with the exception of when he discovered HIS wife having an affair). But I'm not sure why he should be encouraged to be a good dad to the OC. Because he's not "dad". He's the guy who had an immoral relationship with the OC's mother, and created a child who could feel like they were a "mistake". <P>In addition, there would be a real issue with allowing contact to resume between the two "affairees". While I don't lose sleep over my wife having any feelings for her OM now, I certainly wouldn't want them in constant contact. And I would prefer to act as an intermediary (as you would).<P>The only issue that would convince me that you're worried about the child is this:<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>To be a part of this childs life seems especially important to us since we view the OW and her family as disfunctional & troubled, and we worry alot about the OC.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>I'm not sure of the history of the families involved, but I could easily look at your situation (or mine) and say the same thing. And even if it is dysfunctional, it is unlikely that you would be able to impart much stability in the role of "step-parents". Even if this couple end up divorcing, you would only have a limited ability to influence this child.<P>It's a difficult call, but I believe that the scenario that you've laid out is more likely to cause some harm to the child than to do any good. Could it work? Yes. But based on the friction and mixed messages that I see from the wife, I would guess that it's more likely to cause problems. I would concentrate more on making your marriage a success, and not worry too much about this child.

Dear Heart of Hope,<P>I don't have a very good feeling about the situation you described. I am a father raising a child who is not, biologically, my own. It is a long story, and you can search on my name to find it in old letters.<P>At any rate, my youngest is an integral part of our family. My wife and I have renewed and deepened our relationship, and our family is thriving in a way it had not thrived for many years.<P>But the emotional pain involved in this process was, for me, greater than anything I had ever imagined possible. The other man had been a good friend of mine, and his children and my other children often played together. My son looks almost like a twin of one of those children, and so every time I look at my son, I have a reminder of the betrayal.<P>Because of that physical reminder, and because of the turmoil and uncertainty caused by the affair, I have not yet felt the sense of security and absolute 'belongingness' I associate with a father/child relationship, the sense that I know my role in a deep and eternal way. We share love, play, laughter, tantrums, games, everything, and in most respects I feel as close or closer to my son than I have ever felt with any of my other children. But still, inside, there is always a little pain mixed in for me. Perhaps this is caused by memories of the many months when I did not know if I would lose either him or my wife or both.<P>We have had no contact at all with the other man. Had we set up the kind of contact you describe early on, I feel fairly confident that my wife would have divorced me and never ended her emotional relationship with the other man. No contact is essential to help the wayward spouse end, permanently, the affair. And it is essential to allow the betrayed partner to feel safe in his marriage. In my case, it played a third role - it let me develop my own relationship with my new child, without outside interference or harm. A child can only have one father, and I do not think that I could have managed, emotionally, having to co-parent with an active 'step-dad' who had entered my life through a devestating act of betrayal.<P>Fortunately, the law protects fathers like me from the interference of people like your husband. Although you and your husband both sound well-meaning, I think that your plan will almost certainly harm the true father of this child (the father who has been there for her so far), and is likely to permanently damage the other couple's marriage, and the way the child relates to her siblings. Unless the husband of the other woman repeatedly asks you to be involved, please stay out of his life.<P>And you yourself raised the most suspicious part of this arrangement - your husband is making it with his former lover, not with her husband. Something is deeply wrong here.<P>I can't tell you the best course, since all options here are fraught with pain and uncertainty. But these are my own recommendations, based on my own life experience. I hope some of them prove useful.<P>(1) Your husband should end all contact with the other woman, forever.<P>(2) Your husband should prepare a sincere apology to offer to the spouse of the other woman. If he works on this with you, he might get it right, since you understand the depth of the betrayal too. He should then contact the spouse of the other woman, and apologize. And he should not expect a loving, gracious response (though that would be nice).<P>(3) Your husband should offer child support payments, if wanted. He should indicate his interest in the child, but state that he would only want a relationship if the father felt completely comfortable with it, and state that he knows this might never be the case. GIVEN THAT THE BABY IS SO YOUNG, HE SHOULD INDICATE HE WILL STAY COMPLETELY OUT OF THE PICTURE FOR A FEW YEARS, TO GIVE THEIR FAMILY A CHANCE TO HEAL. <P>(4) He should ask to be informed if the parents tell their child about her biological origin, and indicate that he would be happy to meet her if she ever requests to do so.<P>(5) He could discuss with you whether or not to set up a trust fund for this little girl, or to add her to his will. Those actions need not involve the other family.<P>Please remember that, at this point, the father of this baby girl is the man who was there at her birth, and who (under incredibly painful circumstances) has pledged to be there for her always.<P>What your husband is requesting is emotionally for HIS BENEFIT ONLY. It is unlikely to be good for anyone else. Not that he is asking for something ugly; a relationship with a child is a beautiful thing. But it is guaranteed to hurt most of the people involved.<P>I wish you well,<P>StillTrying

Well for me I think the thing I am most worried about is contact between W and OM. I know that can be limited by various means but there will still be some involvement. I am also concerned how this will affect me. It will be difficult enough learning to love the OC while it is a constant reminder of the A, then to throw the OM on top of all that, it seems nearly impossible to get past. <P>I also agree with StillTrying and K. I mean if my W and I can raise the OC ourselves as a "normal" family how would having the OM involved be a benefit? The friction caused by his involvement would be detrimental to healing our marraiage and in turn create a less stable and loving atmosphere for the C. Amidst all that it could lead to divorce and then the C would be left with two Ds that would have to contend for visitation. Also how do you explain who that guy is that shows up every so often to visit? <P>The OM is in the military so he won't really be close to us at any given time. If he had any visitation it would be occasionally when he could get leave a couple of times a year. I know it wouldn't really matter to the child when it is so young but after a few years it will start to realize something isn't quite normal and have questions. <P>I think the down side of the OMs involvement outweigh the benefits (if any). It's just that the possibility of the OM wanting to be a part of the Cs life is making it more difficult to decide to stay together.

There is absolutely nothing more essential to a child's development than a stable, two-parent environment. I know that it's not PC to say that two-parent homes are more beneficial to children than single-parent homes, but the statistics speak for themselves. A child raised in a stable two-parent home is less likely than a child raised in a single-parent home to be promiscuous, drop out of school, do drugs, etc. etc. If there is any chance of an oc having that stability, I feel that it is the responsibility of the adults involved to sacrifice to make it happen. This is the primary reason my h and I agreed two years ago to allow ow's fiancee to adopt oc - in the hopes that she would be provided a better chance at a good future. However, as you all know, this ended up not being the case for us - the whole "adoption" plan was a lie manufactured by ow to try to terminate h's rights and freely extort child support from him without having to give him access to the child.<P>At this point, ow has lost custody of oc due to blatant neglect (although she will soon regain custody due to shoddy C&Y work), her fiancee has committed suicide, and ow does not have a job or a home of her own. I don't think the stable two-parent home scenario is likely to happen here any time soon (insert sarcastic tone here) so h and I feel an obligation to have contact with oc. Especially since we are likely to be oc's only positive influences in life.<P>However, in cases where the ow is married and her husband is dedicated to raising oc as his own, I do not believe that it is fair to the child to insist on contact. I'm sure those who disagreed have wonderful intentions, but I cannot see how it would benefit the child in any way.<BR>respectfully,<BR>-cd

H of H, I agree with the others. I think they said it all.<P>ember

Thanks to you all for honest, real responses. Im so glad I asked. You all have given me so much to think about. I really thought we were doing the right thing and being responsible and mature about this terrible situation. , I cant imagine having a child "out there" and not knowing about it or being a part of its life, and so I have tried to be supportive of my husband. Quite frankly he is quite up and down about the whole thing, and maybe because of my opinion, I have put more emphasis on his being a part of the babys life than was necessary or called for. To K. and StillTrying: I see all of your points and I will seriously rethink things. I do want you to know though that my thinking was based on what I know of these people. I predict that our situation will turn out ugly just as cdcollins did. The OW was seperated and in divorce proceedings during her A with my H. She left her H because he had an A w/ her best friend. He is so dysfunctional that when he left town he shut off all the utilities to their home, knowing his own children lived there. He is one of those guys who maxed out several new credit cards before leaving letting her deal w/ all the bills, and the OW had to file bankruptsy. Their house was being repossesed when she left. After one and only one 2 min. conversation w/ me, she told my H she couldnt deal w/ me, and in three days packed up her house, moved to where her H was, & asked to be taken back. Only because she had no where else to go, she didnt know what else to do. It had nothing to do with love or committment. Seeing her 5 mo.s pregnant he agreed to take her in & to accept the baby. They barely like each other let alone love each other. I question whether they will provide a loving home. After 2 weeks of being with her H, she told my H, things werent going well with him...he was a jerk, and she didnt love him. I know lots of other things that would be too numerous to go into. How much of what she says is true, I dont know. I do know she is a liar, and very manipulative. I dont expect the OW and her H to stay together. I imagine the next guy that comes around, and shows her some interest, she'll be gone. I do not believe her H will be a loving and good father, or even that he will be in the picture very long. For that reason I thought my H could be a good father figure to OC. But maybe that isnt even a good solution. Maybe if they are left alone, their family will get stronger, and that will be better for them all. Maybe even if the little girl never does have a father, that is the price they will pay (My H, & the Ow)for what they did. But unfortunately the OC will too, and my heart breaks to think of a child living a desperate life. I wanted a happy ending for all this. A happy ending for us and for the kid, not necessarily for the OW. But I can see what youre saying about how things effecting the parents will also effect the OC and if there is a chance for them to be a "normal" family w/out outside interference that would be best. I might want the same thing if I were in your shoes. Probably I would. Your insite means so much to me...thank you! P.S. Yes I guess we all are a little dysfunctional. Some more than others though. Some are able to have productive lives, others never will.

Bonniebb, are you looking in a mirror, or what?<P>ember

HoH,<P>Since you are new you probably don't know that I am not only the BS and now step-mother to my H's OC (I only call myself that because we believe that we will have visitation with her for the rest of her life), but I am also the child born of an affair.<P>My mother was pregnant when she married my dad. She was pregnant by him, but they lost the child. She hadn't loved him and married because she was pregnant. When she lost the baby, she and my dad separated. She got back together with her old boyfriend and became pregnant by him.<P>She relized that the boyfriend was going nowhere in life and was already establishing what turned out to be a life long relationship with the bottle.<P>My dad still loved her and wanted to reconcile. He didn't care that she was pregnant. He wanted children and he fully accepted me as his own. He went on to have 7 daughters: me, three sisters he had with my mother and three that he has had with my stepmother. No, their marriage didn't last. My mom, as good a woman as she is, didn't truly ever love him and there was no marriage counseling or marriage builders in those days. She regrets the divorce and thinks that they could have built a satisfying marriage for both of them if they had had some help at the appropriate time. She calls the day of the divorce "the day she lost her best friend." (My dad, God bless him, says no she didn't. My stepmother, God bless her, knows that my dad holds a special place in his heart for my mom and will for the rest of his life.)<P>Anway, of my dad's 7 daughters, I know that I am his favorite. Being the fantastic dad that he is, he would never admit to having a favorite.<P>I am glad that I didn't have to deal with my birth father growing up. I had a great dad, all the dad a girl could need. I adore my dad and he adores me. I said to him "You love me like I am your own." It was one of the few times I have ever seen him angry. "You are my own. I have been there for every important moment in your life except the least important, your conception." (Mom and Dad were reuinted before my birth and since there had never been a divorce, I was legally his child.<P>Our exOW is not married (and with her personality may be terminally single, oh yeah with her propensity for dating married men, she is not likely to catch a good one either). We see OC because there is no dad in her life. If exOW, by some miracle, should find a *very* good man who wants to adopt OC, and it is relatively early in OC's life, Mr. Job says he will sign away his parental rights. <P>However, what would be the advantage to exOW and her new <BR>(vapor) husband? They would lose nearly $2,000 a month in CS payments.<P>I have seen my birth father once and don't want anything further to do with him. He is a man ravaged by alcohol. (He doesn't know about me. My parents never told him. Unfortunatley, they never told me until I was 35 and the family was going through genetic testing. They thought the jig was up and they had better told me. I am glad I know; I always sensed that there were family secrets about me. My mother treated me as if I were much more fragile than my sisters.<P>MJ

Mrs. Job:<P>Wow! What a story. Very encouraging to know things have a way of working out. But what if your mother had serious emotional problems, and the dad you grew up with was seriously maladjusted? Would you have appreciated a more stable force in your life, or do you think it would have caused more problems for you than it would have been worth? <P>I dont care if dealing w/ the OW and OW's H is hard for us, but I dont want trouble for the little one. Since my H is the WS you probably all see him as maladjusted also, but hes really a very nice normal guy who made a serious mistake due to unusually tremendous pressures he was under. Its not an excuse for him, but it is a fact. I dont understand how or why he would hurt me the way he did when I was trying to deal with the same things as him, but I do understand what he feels drove him to it. We have a nice family, 2 kids, and we are all productive people and well liked & respected in our community (...well, not H any more:{ ) I really feel we could be a good influence to this child in what may otherwise be a life full of problems, & insecurity. Everything I know @ OW and her family tells me this is true.<P> I wish it could work. But I have heard nothing from anyone here that leads me to believe it really would. It is definately the opposite. And Im beginning to see the pitfalls associated with H insisting on being in the OC's life. I wish the test results would get here, but in my heart I feel it will be positive anyway so I told H last night we really need to figure out what he wants to do. I printed everyones response for him to read, and I told him Im backing off from giving my opinion anymore. What ever he decides Ill support to the best of my ability.<P>I never thought I would be up against such life changing decisions, decisions you have to live with and think about for the rest of your life. Something that has a way of just taking a chuck of peace out of your existance. <P>This stinks so much, and to think it all could have been avoided with just some thoughtful consideration, and open communication. H never realized to what lengths I would go to to make positive changes in our marriage, and the realization now, makes him realize the foolishness of what he did even more. Wish I could turn back the hands of time!<P>Thanks for talking, for insite and for letting me unload:}<BR>

heart of hope, I can see what you are saying and also what everyone has said. I just dont know what to say, gees there is always something that comes up that seems to add even more pain. Just wanted to say I'm sorry you have been put into this heart wrenching mess and hope everything works out o.k. for you and your family. <BR> with love flowerseed<BR>

Heart of Hope,<BR> I am very sorry for what you are going through and know that this is a tough to know what is the "right" thing to do. Some people here make good points that maybe it is best for you to stay out of the OC life and in some cases I agree with them. But yet, I also tend to feel from your posts that this OC could benefit from having you in their life because you seem like a very caring person. A child can never have to many people that care about them! <BR> I could give you a long story about life growing up but I won't because I know each situation is different. But I will say that I know for a fact in my life another person has been there and meant more to me than my biological mother. What I do think you need to do is sit and have a long discussion with your husband. Find out what is best for the both of you. If you both agree that you want to be a part of the OC's life, then I say do it and be there for that child. If your husband is just doing this for another reason, than maybe you should not be involved in the OC's life.<BR> People here have given you good advice and the good thing about message boards, you get a different points of views. In the end, you and your husband both need to do what is right for both of you!<BR>

To Flowerseed & SES:<P>Flowerseed, thank you for your concern & good wishes.<P>SES: Thanks for a balancing viewpoint. It is good that we know all sides of the story to make the best decision we can. Personally, we keep coming back to wanting to try to see the child, if its his. After all if it doesnt work we can always stop. But until we know how OW & her H feel @ it, how can we really decided for sure what to do? She wont tell us anything. She wont talk w/ me. Only today she text messaged my H and said "Its so hard not talking w/ you, do you feel the same?" When I see stuff like that it makes me feel that no matter how much my H loves me & wants to stay w/ our family, no matter how many times he tells her he doesnt want to talk w/ her, shes going to keep pulling his heart strings and trying to find a way to keep some kind of relationship w/ him. Any kind of a relationship, even if it is just text messages, is too much for me. So I wonder how we could possible have the child in our life and not her? Its alot to figure out & is a problem for greater minds than mine! Thanks for warm respones. It made me feel better:}

Dear Heart of Hope,<P>I read all this with great interest. The op in our case<BR>is also married and raising the child with her H.<BR>That didnt stop her from coming to my H business 3 times<BR>wanting money. When he said first we take a dna test, she<BR>decided to disappear for 6 mos. When she came back she <BR>informed my H that she had her H tested and it was Neg.<BR>She thought my H would accept that as the truth and hand<BR>over cash. My H still insisted on dna test. <BR>Once I was aware of her...I handed her papers myself.<BR>Funny how all of the sudden, it wasnt worth it anymore.<P>We would pay the required cs if there was a pos test.<BR>I hate this limbo of not knowing...I feel like I am wasting<BR>so much precious time. <P>I understand your good intentions towards the oc.<BR>It took me a full year to come to grips with what I feel.<BR>I hope it all works out for you. <BR>It is a heartbreaking situation no matter how you look at<BR>it. <P>You're in my thoughts. Thanks for bringing this topic up.<BR>I have been too shy to do so myself. I've printed out<BR>your responses to show my H. As far as he is concerned,<BR>he feels the oc (and more importantly to him, our children)<BR>is better off not knowing of the deceitful way he came into<BR>this world. In our minds the oc was put up for adoption.<BR>Only we know what is in our hearts. <P>I hope you come to a peaceful decision for yourselves.<BR>Take care, fluke