I'm VERY new to this kind of stuff, so please be patient w/me if this is really long - I'm sorry! In July 2001 my H informed me that he'd had an affair and that the OW was pregnant. They work together, he'd only been at that job for 6 weeks when the affair started. Needless to say, the baby's been born, we've had such hard times, he's never wanted to leave me though. OW has ordered that I don't call her or have any contact, she filed a complaint w/police, H allowed that to happen. There have been so many incidents between the two of them or of things he's "neglected" to share with me. OW did not tell him when she went to hospital, he found out thru work. H picked me up at work to take me to hospital w/him, he said he needed me there for support! Imagine, I'm important to him now...huh! Sorry. Needless to say, I sat in the waiting room for 3 hours while he sat back in OW's room and visited w/his new daughter. He's always wanted children of his own but new before we were married (in 7/98) that I couldn't have anymore kids - he was ok with that (or so I thought). He has informed me that he will do anything for that little girl and see her regardless of what I say or how I feel. We've had very severe fights, etc. I feel neglected, ashamed, betrayed, angry, devastated and lost all self-worth. I can't get the "visions" of the two of them together. Supposedly he doesn't speak to her at work, but I feel very ashamed when we run into his co-workers 'cause they all know. I really do love him, but he's very selfish about his wants/needs, etc. and hasn't given much caring or giving to my needs and feelings that he's destroyed so bad. Please help!

I don't really have any advice but I wanted to let you know you came to the right place. I'm sorry you find yourself in this situation. Please remember all the things you are feelings are natural. But you have to put yourself first you didn't ask for this and you did nothing wrong. You'll get more responses with advice.<P>I'll keep you in my thoughts and prayers.<P>Unsure

mill,<BR>Do you have a counselor? Do you have any of the affair recovery books? I recommend you get some professional help in your recovery. This is a soul-shattering event. It hurts for years, even when you're BOTH doing everything you each can to recover the marriage, and it does not sound like your H is doing everything he can. <P>I'm very sorry for your immense pain. H and I went through this 3 years ago, but we are long distance from OC and he has NO solo contact with XOW. Contact between your H and XOW is NOT healthy for your marriage. It is possible for your H to have contact with OC without seeing the XOW, but your H's priorities are, in my opinion, screwed up. It is important for him to actively work on the damage he's caused your marriage for awhile, and worry about OC later, even if that means changing jobs. There is much more he could be doing.<P>Prayers for you,<BR>J

I am sorry you have to join our ranks. I also suggest a counselor. Your H seems to be unrealistic about what you should continue to take. Dr. Harley recommends no contact with exOW, but that is next to impossible in these situations. However, your H could consider looking for another job where SHE is not. My H is changing jobs also. This will help our marriage tremendously. <BR>Again, I am sorry we meet under these circumstances, but you have come to the right place.

Thanks for the responses to my post yesterday. I have no idea what my future holds. I've recently moved out because I couldn't deal with the whole 'situation' any longer. Watching him walk out the door each morning knowing he's going to work w/her, waiting for him to come home from his nightly visits w/OC twice a week. We could never plan things on Saturdays because he has to go visit OC from noon-3:00 every saturday - so that always screws up the day. He never wanted to go to counseling before when I would suggest it. Now that I've moved out he says that maybe I was right and counseling will help because apparently we can't do it ourselves. But regardless whether there's a counselor involved or not, if my H isn't willing to stand up to OW and fight for OC like he has rights to do....she won't allow the OC to come to our house until she "inspects it to be sure it has all the adequate furniture and necessary items" that are needed....hello, I'm a mother, have been for 14 years I know and so does H what is needed. But she had already informed him before the baby was even born that she wouldn't allow the child at his home as long as I was around because she didn't like me (isn't that too bad). But he never stood up to her, he's always so polite and kind and said it wouldn't do any good to fight w/her because then she wouldn't allow him to see his child! But yet he can yell & scream at me, treat me like a piece of dirt and tell me to just shut up he doesn't want to talk about it. I couldn't live like that anymore. If he's not willing to put me first and give me back the rights I have as a wife instead of allowing another woman to take over - I won't be moving back and there won't be a marriage! Thanks for the support and caring. I'm so greatful I found a new group of friends!

I've read so many of these topics and I feel like this is happening all over the world. Don't men believe in their marriage vows anymore? My H & I had another huge fight last night. He blames me for not accepting OC in his life. He says if I can't accept OC and the fact that he loves her very much, then there's no way we can be together. The Holidays are coming up and he told me that he will be asking OW if he can have OC for Thanksgiving w/him & his family. I asked where does that leave me....he said he didn't know. Since we're now living apart, he had no idea what I would be doing that day. He would like me to be there with him, but we both know that OW will not allow the OC around me. So then a part of me feels bad because he can't be with his daughter on a special day. But why should I care, my feelings are being pushed aside. He just lets me cry, tells me he loves me but doesn't know what else to do...I'm so lost!

Heres my 2 cents for what it is worth. Ow has no right to dictate when and where oc is when with the "father" or who oc is around. If he is already paying child support then it needs to be thru the courts if it is not. This will secure him his visitation rights. You may have to fight for them, but how much control over your marriage and your feelings can she be allowed to have?<P>We didnt go thru this with ow, but we did with my H's x-wife. He was military and she was pissed bc he had been gone for so long. She was remarried and happy with the way her life was and wanted to dictate how, when, why, where and even IF he would see his daughter. Yeah right. We started calling lawyers and told her we planned to hold her in contempt of court unless she followed thru with the divorce decree. It ended up not coming to that bc she saw basically there was not a whole lot she could do. Take her butt to court! And I do believe you should suggest he get another job. That is unfair undue stress on you. You will never heal with that going on. And visits alone at her house?? I dont think so. Take control of your marriage again. She has it in the palm of her little dirty hands, where she wants it.

She has in the palm of her "dirty little hands" right where your H put it. Do you want to be in OC's life? If so, there is no way she can dictate that you cannot be around. Clearly, your H wants to be a part of OC's life and a big part at that. If you still want him, you're going to have to embrace it. You can't make him choose between you and the child because it looks as if you'd lose. If you want to stay married to this man, I suggest going thru the courts, doing everything legally, telling him you want the marriage AND the OC in your life and then getting into therapy asap.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Bonniebb:<BR><STRONG>She has in the palm of her "dirty little hands" right where your H put it. Clearly, your H wants to be a part of OC's life and a big part at that. If you still want him, you're going to have to embrace it. You can't make him choose between you and the child because it looks as if you'd lose. </STRONG><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>And I see how well You have "embraced" it! If you are a wife a think your just pissed that apparrently H Forced you to have contact and all this BIG talk about how you MUST accept oc is a huge facade. You are so very angry. It shows how well you have adjusted. If you arent here to stir up trouble why do you start on this "must accept oc" bs? You already know how well it is recieved....If you were a wife and we are all soooooo very horrible to you<P> [img]images/icons/frown.gif" border="0[/img] then why dont you go where YOU are "embraced"?

Broken Wings<BR>Read your own post. You make NO sense. You should call yourself Broken Record instead. I have somewhat ebraced the Ochildren. However the difference is, my H doesn't treat me like crap anymore. Want to know why? Because he knows I won't put up with it. I'm a changed woman since all this and our marriage is beginning to change too. I never held anything against the children. Sure, I hated OW, she still isn't my favorite. But I see that he lied to her, he lied to me etc. But, children are here now. You know I'd never respect him if HE didn't embrace them, but he never has forced me to. He has hoped I would and little by little I am, but my H is understanding and we work TOGETHER through all this. If some of these women would change the way THEy are dealing with their H, I guarantee they'd see a change in return. What you find sooooo offesnive about that is beyond me, but then again, I am talking to a woman who dwells on how the mail is sent to her husband regarding adoption! I shoud not be the least bit suprised! Carry on and leave me alone. I have no interest in your banter.

Broken_Record is right! You have been told time and time again and again what the problem is with your posts. Granted, there have been a few where you didnt badger people or try to shove your opinion down someone else's throat or trivialize what someone else is dealing with. This is a safe haven and you take that away. I have never said anything but nice stuff to you until today. Do you recall the last time we all went thru this. I responed to you in a kindly manner each time and I got tired of never hearing back from you except to dog on someone who wasnt trusting what you had to say. I gave you the benefit of the doubt several times. As a matter of fact, my last nice post to you I all but dared you to respond to it, since I was exceedingly nice...again. And nothing. So therefore I must assume that what everyone else had said was truth. There isnt a whole lot going on here right now and I will not allow you to bully the newbies. That is crap and you know it. Go away.

It was wrong to suggest to these women that they are not being respected and suggest they they focus on themseleves so that they settle for NO less then total respect? It was wrong to suggest that perhaps in changing what they are doing they may well see a change in what they get in return? It was wrong to suggest that trying to compete with a husband's decision to be in the OC's life is a losing, uphill battle? It was wrong to suggest that if they want to keep these men they embrace the big picture since that is what he has already chosen to do?<BR>I think you just can't stand to see someone make sense. There wasn't a darn thing wrong with what I said so don't put that on me. If you have a problem with me, don't post to me. But you aren't going to swoop in and bash me to other posters when I have done nothing wrong. I'll take it to the admin if you do. It's one thing if I am doing something wrong but I am not. You on the other hand couldn't HELP but to start trouble.

And as to my never responding to you...believe it or not I have a life. I don't hang out here all day. In fact I haven't been here in weeks. Things with me are going quite well in fact. So I can't remember what you are talking about but I am talking about today and today only. Let's stick to the present why don't we, since afterall you are only telling one side of the story. ALl I know is I posted advice that for some UNKNOWN reason you took offense to, so YOU swept in, bashed me to other posters and started trouble. Don't try to recreate what happened.

this is to broken_wings.<BR>I don't understand what you're talking about. I'm very troubled here and upset about my situation, I thought this was a forum where we could share our pain and receive comfort and advice. What have I said wrong that bothers you? Maybe it's just because I'm new and don't understand how these forums really work. But to everyone else that has responded to me, thank you I've received great comfort in finally being able to "talk to someone that understands"! I look forward to hearing from you all. thanks!

Dear Mill,<P>I am sorry if I have hurt or confused you in any way. Really, I am sorry sincerely. I was refering to what you said about being hurt when H goes to see oc there. Because ow will not allow you to be around oc. I was saying she can not legally tell you or your H how, when, why, where you see oc. And if she persists I would take it to the courts so I am my H would not have to go thru her to deal with oc anymore. I am really sorry. I am not sure what I said that hurt you. If it is my posts to BonnieBB that bother you I will stop them also. I just let the fact that she popped up again get to me. So no more posts to you Bonnie from me.

Bonnie,<p>This is my opinion and it is a biblical one. And if I may be so bold in saying so, I feel that many people here seek God's will for their lives and for this trial (common bond) that we all share.<p>We, as wives, do not have the liberty to demand respect from our husbands. Sure, we'd like respect, but sometimes in this fallen world we live in, respect is a distant concept. We, as wives are the weaker vessel. We are the helpmates to our husbands. They are the head of the home as Christ is head of the church. So putting boldly, God gave man (husbands) that role of leading us, our husbands are responsible to God for us, for our spiritual growth. <p>When H's don't fulfill that responsibility, we don't have the right to demand it from them, but we have the right to go to our Heavenly Father and ask Him to change them. That is why prayer is so powerful because God does hear us and he will answer, but in his timing and in his ways, we just have to trust. <p>I have heard many success stories about women just like millsc1 and myself who had husbands that really treated them poorly, but put their husbands in God's hands and in God's time, he transformed them, their hearts. Praise God.

If that works for you, that's wonderful. For me, asking God to keep me strong and demand respect and no less, is what helped my marriage turn and my husband to wake up. When I began to respect myself, he took a new respect for me.

Wow! I just re-read your post and MUST comment. As a wife, I am a PARTNER, not a weaker vessle. Ia m a PARTNER to my husband, not a helpmate. He is not the HEAD of the household, WE are the heads of the household. We both have responsibilities to hold up. He does not LEAD me and yes, when he is not doing his function properly I DO have the right to demand it and if I don't get it, I have the right to LEAVE.
Quite frankly, you sound like a victim and I cannot imagine this may of thinking. I also sincerely doubt that this point of view is held by many women. Do you have daughters?

Okay bonnie, I'll try to explain:<p>I am of EQUAL IMPORTANCE in my marriage. <p>I am trying to be a "surrendered wife"... and although there are books about the subject (one with the title Surrendered Wife, in fact) the description I like to follow is found in Proverbs 31, in the Holy Bible.<p>I have tried to control men, and in fact, I mucked up my past marriage but good -- and one of the ways I did that was to take the leadership role away from my ex-H. Once done, it was nearly impossible to give it back. I tried, but we'd both come to believe that he couldn't "do it" and so I kept snatching it back.<p>With my new H, he is the person who leads this household. Do I have a voice? Of COURSE. He asks me, I tell him what I think, and he makes the final decision. I like it this way, and I hope (and pray) that we are blessed by God for our choices.<p>I am not a fanatical Christian. I am a struggling Christian who knows that I did everything all backasswards in my past marriage, and wants to get it right this time. <p>I have been told that I am throwing women's rights back 100 years. I don't think so. I do not sit around here in gingham (sp?) dresses with lace collars making banana bread all day (although a good banana bread is always a plus! LOL)... I have plenty of problems in my life... some self-created. I don't want one of those problems to be my marriage.<p>I hope this makes sense. One wonders about me...<p>By the way, I don't post in this section often, I'm usually over in the infidelity areas.

If it works for you that's great. But it doesn't make it the right way for everyone or everyone here. Just like MY way may not work. My post was about how I "whipped H into shape" People can take it or leave it. For me, it has worked wonders. It's hard to for me hear women talking about how poorly they are treated and the only thing they feel they can do is pray for somehow their H to stop. I don't look at life this way, I believe I am the one who can make it stop by being good to me. For me, THAT'S where God comes in. As for your technique, as long as you both agree and as you said you LIKE that he has the final say, then you both have your agendas and it works for you. But it's a choice you make to live this way. I don't in any way feel it's our "duty" as wives to take that role.