For those who would like to hear my story, untained by those who will no doubt eventually swoop in to trash me, I think I may be able to help you.<BR>First, I am in your boat. H and have been togehter for a long time. Have a family of our own. I found out about OW and OC and flipped. I HATED him, her and yes, I think I hated OC also though I had never even had contact at the time. I trashed OW, called her names etc. AND, I ranted about how H better never see them. To make a long story short, I qucikly came to my senses. I realized there was no possible way I could stay married to a man who created a child and then turned his back. Now that's ME. There are those here who are just the opposite, who WON'T stay if H is part of OC life. To me that's insane but whatever, that's not the issue here. <BR>Husband wanted contact all along but was afraid to tell me. Yes, I think they all say they were afraid to hurt us, tell us etc. It doesn't prevent them from cheating though does it? Anyway, I later learned there are TWINS. I flipped again because I was shocked.<BR>Anyway, I spoke with OW. In my case I am lucky, she isn't SO bad. Yes, I blame her too. She knew he was married. But he lied to her too. He basically used her.<BR>Anyway, the bottom line is this, we decided to give it a try. At first it was really hard. He saw OC alone as I knew I couldn't handle it. We began counselling and uncovered a LOT about the relationship. No, it is not MY fault he had an affair, but we BOTH let the marriage get to the point where there was even room for a third party. Therapy is great. It's really hard but in my mind totally ESSENTIAL to get thru something like this. Heck, we needed therapy regardless of this but the truth is, had it not been for this wake up call, we never would have gotten it and I'll bet the marriage would have eroded to the point where we had NO feelings and therapy would never work. <BR>Anyway, now H sees children often, i go when I want. ALL communication between OW and him goes thru ME. Had he not agreed to that or if she had a problem with it and he took her side, I'D BE GONE and he knew it. I already had an apartment lined up, had talked to an attorney etc.<BR>As far as the way he treats me, he treats me the way I treat myself - with total respect. When I am upset and need to cry, I do. I don't ask a million questions and yell and accuse, I just cry and he holds me. What else do I expect him to do? I KNOW what he did, I chose to stay...what am I gonna do? Beat him over the head with it constantly? All it would do is drive him away, probably to OW. I also treat the marriage with total respect now. He and I and our children, ALL of them come first. Sure, it's complicated but what's done is done. I had to accept what was and make the VERY best of it. We are doing WELL.<BR>My advice? First ask what he WANTS, really WANTS. Does he want to save the marriage? Then tell him when to be at the first session. If he makes noises, ACT don't REACT. Don't yell, don't cry, just ACT. Tell him that is not acceptable, that the ONLY way you will agree to stay is if the marriage is worked on indefinetly, if there is NO contact with OW without you. Start making arangemetns to leave. He'll wake up. In addition, take GOOD care of yourself, eat right, excercise, see your friends, show him you won't be broken. He will be drawn to your strength. Renew your faith in God and pray, pray for strength, to be strong enough to deal with whatever comes of this.<BR>I am telling you, if your H doesn't agree with your terms or if he breaks them - HE IS NOT COMMITTED to making the marriage work - GET RID OF HIM. He will drain the life out of you. If you still love him, if he still loves you, if you both agree on contact (or no contact which I can't see but as long as you BOTH agree) then commit to makeing it work, to BOTH of you making the necessary changes, to seek therapy, to work TOGETHER. Your marriage CAN survive, it can actually be BETTER then it was. This is a chance to come out on top either way - to have a better marriage or to get out of a situation that has no hope of changing. Be strong and be good to yourself.

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Bonniebb:
First ask what he WANTS, really WANTS. Does he want to save the marriage? Then tell him when to be at the first session. If he makes noises, ACT don't REACT. Don't yell, don't cry, just ACT. Tell him that is not acceptable, that the ONLY way you will agree to stay is if the marriage is worked on indefinetly, if there is NO contact with OW without you. Start making arangemetns to leave. He'll wake up. In addition, take GOOD care of yourself, eat right, excercise, see your friends, show him you won't be broken. He will be drawn to your strength. Renew your faith in God and pray, pray for strength, to be strong enough to deal with whatever comes of this.
I am telling you, if your H doesn't agree with your terms or if he breaks them - HE IS NOT COMMITTED to making the marriage work - GET RID OF HIM. He will drain the life out of you. If you still love him, if he still loves you, if you both agree on contact (or no contact) then commit to makeing it work, to BOTH of you making the necessary changes, to seek therapy, to work TOGETHER. Your marriage CAN survive, it can actually be BETTER then it was. This is a chance to come out on top either way - to have a better marriage or to get out of a situation that has no hope of changing. Be strong and be good to yourself.[/QB]<hr></blockquote><p>BBB<p>I don't agree with 99% of the things you post because of the tone of the post. (If you take this as an attack it's your choice, not what I'm trying to do) But I must admit this worked for me. It will not work in every situation because a lot of the H's are still in their fog. I put me first and my non-caring attitude towards H made him shape up because he was afraid of losing me. Also NOTE at the time I didn't want my marriage to work I filed for a divorce so if this back fired it didn't matter to me, I felt dirty being his wife and having his name. (To me it was all a sham) (No I didn't think the affair was my fault but H broke his vows to me) This advice may not work for those who truly want to save their marriage because it can back fire and push your H away. I'm sure this goes against the Harley principles too but it worked for me. Note I erased the no contact part it's every married couple choice to decide for or against having contact.<p>Unsure

Hey, I am glad it worked for you. The way I see it is...if it doesn't work and it backfired and drives him away, why would you want him anyway. Most of us were/are in a major fog after a blow like this, but after the fog clears I hope most would see there is no marriage when you are married to someone who doesn't respect you or put you first. None of this is easy and I slip, but the most important thing is that we are trying really hard to work together. We are and that is my only comfort. If he fought me and treated me badly, I don't see how it would worth it to stay. Glad you are doing well.

BBB,<p>I had this long reply typed but I didn't want to argue or debate with you. So I'll only say look at your words about anger and hate. Remember these newbies are in the beginning stages respect their feelings even if you don't agree with them.
Show some sympathy and compassion because you've been where they are at. <p>I am a very out spoken direct person who has learned to curb her sharp tounge so she didn't unintentionaly hurt people. I also learned I wasn't always right. I did that by listening to other people critisim it was hard but it made me a better person. You gave your advice here's mine. Again I won't debate or argue with you this was just a little friendly advice.<p>
Unsure<p>[ October 25, 2001: Message edited by: UNSure919400 ]</p>

BBB,<p>This will not be a mean post. I just wanted to point out that the "fog" Unsure was refering to isnt the initial stage for all of us. The denial, anger, hurt, shock that we all go thru. She was refering to the affair "fog". It is the little imaginary world that all affairs exist in. It sometimes takes a while for the people in the affairs to snap out of it, so to speak. It is a pretty common analogy of Harley's. I would really suggest you read Harley's principles for 2 reasons: 1) so you will know immediately what others are refering to and 2) no matter what state of affair, or recovery, or just looking for suggestions in the marriage it is extremely helpful.

BW,<p>Thanks for clarifying the fog issue. I just reread BBB post.<p>Unsure

Bonniebb,<p>I am still very new here myself. Everyone has there own way of dealing with this issue. You sound as if your way is sound proof. Me and my H didnt go to therapy but we did heal our wounds and our marriage, in the process we also became friends. Now this was without therapy. But the respect thing, you are right. We have to demand it, but in time. Everyone heals at his or her own pace in time. Whether they chose to deal with OC or not is up to them. Everyone has different tolerance levels than others. Who knows why men cheat, yeah it is disrespectful but women cheat too! Some dont care about spouse they are affecting and others do but just do because they are stupid. Men have lied to get what they want but everyone does. I guess my point being that everyone is different, marriages are different, having OC in life after DD is different for everyone. The one thing that is alike is that there was an affair, oc, and ow (period)! We have to show compassion to others in order to help them get through the ordeal. Military style such as yours may have worked for you but doesnt work for everyone. (no offense) I demanded respect, I demanded things be different, I demanded that he may have communication with me present only, I demanded that he picks up and drops off with me only. I am at that stage but it took me a long time to get to that stage. It has been since '97. We didnt see oc until '99 (when I was ready)! I went off on ow -she lied and h lied, but she knew he was married and went after me with everything she had. I didnt lie to her, h did. Anyway I am rambling on I just feel that everyone has there time and has there own way of healing and at this forum, its for healing, venting, and helping others in a compassionate way. Whether we chose to stay in our marriage is our choice no matter what, we should just be there for one another and down and trying times.<p>Unicorn

I didn't force my opinion down anyone's throat, I didn't tell anyone their way was wrong, I didn't use a sharp tongue. I even called the post "How I whipped my H into shape" Not, "How YOU should whip H into shape. I simply shared with you what worked for me. Plain and simple. Don't like it, don't agree with it? Don't follow it. I have read Harley's principles and agree with some of it, not all. This is what worked for ME. Personally, it's not my concern if you use it or not, just some advice from someone in your shoes!

I tried. [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>I am telling you, if your H doesn't agree with your terms or if he breaks them - HE IS NOT COMMITTED to making the marriage work - GET RID OF HIM. <hr></blockquote><p>Gosh Bonnie, I sometime don't think you realize what support really is. My God, think about what you just said in this quote. You basically told this woman... if your husband doesn't see exactly as you see, do exactly what you tell him, kick his a*s*s to the curb. <p>My God, I hope no one ever comes here and reads your post and no others and goes home to destroy a marriage that with nuture, couseling, healing time or other means could have flourished. <p>Maybe, God willing, you will someday understand that people are different. They heal, love, hate, recover, forgive, hurt different ways and at different paces.<p>That's all I have for you now. Get a grip lady.<p>ZebraBaby [img]images/icons/confused.gif" border="0[/img]

Posted this under another subject, but wanted to be sure that it was seen in other areas...<p>"The Power of a Praying Wife" by Stormy Omartian
Quote p. 13
"First of all, let me make it perfectly clear that the power of a praying wife is not a means of gaining control over your husband, so don't get your hopes up! In fact, it is quite the opposite. It's laying down all claim to power in and of yourself, and relying on GOD'S power to transform you, your husband, your circumstances, and your marriage. This power is not given to wield like a weapon in order to beat back an unruly beast. It's a gentle tool of restoration appropriated through the prayers of a wife who longs to DO right more than BE right, and to give LIFE more than GET EVEN. It's a way to invite God's power into your husband's life for his greatest blessing, which is ultimately yours, too"
I recommend this book to any woman who is looking for help, peace of mind, or to feel like they are doing something for their marriage. In my situation, it has been one of the few things I CAN control in this madness of a life. And, believe it or not, I am actually starting to see the results. <p>But, please don't misinterpret my words, I believe that I have changed more than my H. I do see changes in him, but they are sooooo slooowwww. The Lord tells me that He speaks to me because H is not listening. So women, I pray, I pray, I pray. But not for me and my wishes, but for the Lord's plan and guidance and direction to be clear so that I may fulfill my destiny and be at peace. <p>I am sorry if I have rambled. I am NOT a religious fanatic, but this experience has deepened my faith in Him and my spirituality as a human being. Oh and Jenny, if your reading this, I am beginning to see the light!!!!! <p>--------------------<p>The Lord is my strength and my shield;

as you may notice she talks about one OC here and in another post it is twins, ya sure who is Bonniebb